God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

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God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:07 pm

A poll for curiousity and a share of an article written in the National Review.

They found the “God particle.”

That was the headline splashed all over America’s news media. It turns out that the name actually derives from substituting “God particle” for “goddamn particle,” the original name some scientists had given the elusive particle. But the media adopted the former nomenclature.

Why?

Because otherwise the bulk of humanity would not pay attention.

Physicists went nuts. And no one can blame them. For decades, they have searched for the particle that may explain why there is any mass in the universe. And 10 billion dollars was spent on the machine that probably proved its existence.

Without any disrespect to the enormous intellectual achievement of these scientists, let me state that I identify with the mass of humanity that doesn’t really care about the existence of the Higgs boson.

Those scientists and science writers who have likened this discovery to the discovery of DNA are wrong. If significance means relevance to the human condition, the discovery of DNA merited a ten out of ten and the Higgs boson might merit a two.

This does not mean that the search was either a waste of time or money. Both the time and money invested were necessary because satiating our curiosity about the natural world is one of the noblest ambitions of the human race.

But scientific discovery and meaning are not necessarily related. As one of the leading physicists of our time, Steven Weinberg, has written, “The more the universe seems comprehensible, the more it also seems pointless.”

And pointlessness is the point. The discovery of the Higgs boson brings us no closer to understanding why there is a universe, not to mention whether life has meaning. In fact, no scientific discovery ever made will ever explain why there is existence. Nor will it render good and evil anything more than subjective opinion, or explain why human beings have consciousness or anything else that truly matters.

The only thing that can explain existence and answer these other questions is God or some other similar metaphysical belief. This angers those scientists and others who are emotionally as well as intellectually committed to atheism. But many honest atheists recognize that a godless world means a meaningless one, and they admit that science can explain only what, not why.

In a recent interview in the Wall Street Journal, Woody Allen, an honest atheist, made this point in his inimitable way. Allen told the interviewer that, being a big sports fan, and especially a New York Knicks fan, he is often asked whether it’s important if the Knicks beat the Celtics. His answer is, “Well, it’s just as important as human existence.” If there is no God, Mr. Allen is right.

One must have a great deal of respect for the atheist who recognizes the consequences of atheism: no meaning, no purpose, no good and evil beyond subjective opinion, and no recognition of the limits of what science can explain.

But the atheist — scientist, philosophy professor, or your brother-in-law who sells insurance — who denies the consequences of atheism is as worthy of the same intellectual respect atheists have for those who believe in a 6,000-year-old universe.

Not only is science incapable of discovering why there is existence; scientists also confront the equally frustrating fact that the more they discover about the universe, the more they realize they do not know.

I happen to think that this was God’s built-in way of limiting man’s hubris and compelling humans to acknowledge His existence. Admittedly, this doesn’t always have these effects on scientists and especially on those who believe that science will explain everything.

So, sincere congratulations to the physicists and other scientists who discovered the Higgs boson. We now think we have uncovered the force or the matter that gives us the 4 percent of the universe that we can observe (96 percent of the universe consists of “dark matter,” about which scientists know almost nothing).

However, ironic as it may seem to many of these physicists, only if there is a God does their discovery matter. Otherwise, it is no more important than whether the Knicks beat the Celtics.


http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/ ... nis-prager
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby GBU56 on Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:20 pm

Is this about the Higgs bosom particle or some rant against atheists? Perhaps you're bi-polar or suffering from Schizophrenia


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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Juan_Bottom on Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:21 pm

While not entirely accurate, my circle of internet friends have been talking about this for days. We all like to talk science, yet honestly none of us actually understand this.
I'm pretty sure Higgs didn't understand it either.

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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:24 pm

GBU56 wrote:Is this about the Higgs bosom particle or some rant against atheists? Perhaps you're bi-polar or suffering from Schizophrenia


what is it that makes you think I wrote that? :-s

Let me guess, it's for sure not bi-polar or Schizophrenia....right? :P
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Lootifer on Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:27 pm

I care about any scientific advance. /shrug.
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby GBU56 on Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:31 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
GBU56 wrote:Is this about the Higgs bosom particle or some rant against atheists? Perhaps you're bi-polar or suffering from Schizophrenia


what is it that makes you think I wrote that? :-s

Let me guess, it's for sure not bi-polar or Schizophrenia....right? :P



I know you didn't write that drivel....but why copy/paste that nonsense?

Thank GOD! for the Higgs bosom, otherwise we wouldn't have beer!

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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Timminz on Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:09 pm

Phatscotty wrote:
In fact, no scientific discovery ever made will ever explain why there is existence. Nor will it render good and evil anything more than subjective opinion, or explain why human beings have consciousness or anything else that truly matters.


Be careful what you say about PERMANENT concepts and projects, because in the future someone may be quoting what YOU said on the record. What will your children and colleagues think in 2030 about what you said in 2002?

"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."

-- Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of Digital Equipment Corp. (DEC), maker of big business mainframe computers, arguing against the PC, 1977

"We don't like their sound, and guitar music is on the way out anyway."

-- President of Decca Records, rejecting The Beatles after an audition, 1962

"Transmission of documents via telephone wires is possible in principle, but the apparatus required is so expensive that it will never become
a practical proposition."

-- Dennis Gabor, British physicist and author of Inventing the Future, 1962

"There is practically no chance communications space satellites will be used to provide better telephone, telegraph, television, or radio service inside the United States."

-- T. Craven, FCC Commissioner, 1961
(the first commercial communications satellite went into service in 1965)

"The world potential market for copying machines is 5000 at most."

-- IBM , to the eventual founders of Xerox, saying the photocopier had no market large enough to justify production, 1959

"To place a man in a multi-stage rocket and project him into the controlling gravitational field of the moon where the passengers can make scientific observations, perhaps land alive, and then return to earth--all that constitutes a wild dream worthy of Jules Verne. I am bold enough to say that such a man-made voyage will never occur regardless of all future advances."

-- Lee deForest, American radio pioneer and inventor of the vacuum tube, 1957

"You ain't going nowhere, son. You ought to go back to driving a truck."

-- Jim Denny, manager of the Grand Ole Opry, in firing Elvis Presley after a performance, 1954

"Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons."

-- Popular Mechanics, "predicting" the relentless march of technology, 1949

"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."

-- Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

"Atomic energy might be as good as our present-day explosives, but it is unlikely to produce anything very much more dangerous."

-- Winston Churchill, British Prime Minister, 1939

"A rocket will never be able to leave the Earth's atmosphere."

-- New York Times, 1936

"There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will ever be obtainable. It would mean the atom would have to be shattered at will."

-- Albert Einstein, German-born American physicist, 1932

"Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?"

-- H.M. Warner, Warner Brothers, maker of silent movies, 1927

"Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible."

-- Lord Kelvin, British mathematician and physicist, president of the British Royal Society, 1895

"X-rays will prove to be a hoax."

-- Lord Kelvin, British mathematician and physicist, president of the British Royal Society, 1895(?)


What do you guys think?
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby HapSmo19 on Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:25 pm

I totally see the similarity between those things and an invisible particle.
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby HapSmo19 on Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:28 pm

wait...can we make bombs out of it?
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:32 pm

HapSmo19 wrote:wait...can we make bombs out of it?


"order a new laser gun asap" was honestly going to be one of the poll options....
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:34 pm

Timminz wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
In fact, no scientific discovery ever made will ever explain why there is existence. Nor will it render good and evil anything more than subjective opinion, or explain why human beings have consciousness or anything else that truly matters.


Be careful what you say about PERMANENT concepts and projects, because in the future someone may be quoting what YOU said on the record. What will your children and colleagues think in 2030 about what you said in 2002?
..........goes on to repeat the dumbest things ever said in history....


What do you guys think?


I think you would get busted for crappy editing, discredited, and then publicly flogged by the a super-majority of divine Tea-Bag rulers.
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Lootifer on Tue Jul 10, 2012 7:10 pm

wut?
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby Haggis_McMutton on Tue Jul 10, 2012 7:39 pm

Those scientists and science writers who have likened this discovery to the discovery of DNA are wrong. If significance means relevance to the human condition, the discovery of DNA merited a ten out of ten and the Higgs boson might merit a two.


I'm guessing his crystal ball gave him this information.

And pointlessness is the point. The discovery of the Higgs boson brings us no closer to understanding why there is a universe, not to mention whether life has meaning. In fact, no scientific discovery ever made will ever explain why there is existence. Nor will it render good and evil anything more than subjective opinion, or explain why human beings have consciousness or anything else that truly matters.


So, science can't answer philosophical questions? Wow, huge insight here.
You know what might matter though? GPS, which wouldn't be possible without the special and general theories of relativity.

One must have a great deal of respect for the atheist who recognizes the consequences of atheism: no meaning, no purpose, no good and evil beyond subjective opinion, and no recognition of the limits of what science can explain.

No absolute meaning is not equivalent to no meaning whatsoever. Looks like the author moves on from grossly misrepresenting science to grossly misrepresenting philosophy.

Not only is science incapable of discovering why there is existence; scientists also confront the equally frustrating fact that the more they discover about the universe, the more they realize they do not know.

If you know anything about scientists or science you'd realize that fact isn't frustrating but one of the major appeals.

Wheeler, John Archibald wrote:"We live on an island surrounded by a sea of ignorance. As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance."


In fact several physicists (including Hawkins) were somewhat dissapointed they found the Higgs, they had hoped the LHC would prove the Higgs doesn't exist and thus invalidate the standard model and make room for new and exciting research.

See, scientists revel in their ignorance and the pursuit of knowledge rather than being so afraid as to have to pretend they know what happened (i.e. "god did it")

I happen to think that this was God’s built-in way of limiting man’s hubris and compelling humans to acknowledge His existence. Admittedly, this doesn’t always have these effects on scientists and especially on those who believe that science will explain everything.


Oh yeah, THAT'S how god decided to convince us he exists. Uh huh.
His other approaches seem to be launching tornadoes and earthquakes our way and appearing on slices of toasts.

However, ironic as it may seem to many of these physicists, only if there is a God does their discovery matter. Otherwise, it is no more important than whether the Knicks beat the Celtics.


Well, I'm sorry that to this author all of science's advances leading to improving and saving billions of lives are of equal importance to some sport. Seems he's a bit of a sociopath.

---
Also, to anyone seriously claiming they know this discovery will not change anything, please explain how you would have know general/special relativity would be important as soon as it was published.

Keep in mind, I'm actually tossing you guys an easy one here. I could have asked about quantum mechanics.
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby BigBallinStalin on Tue Jul 10, 2012 8:49 pm

They found the “God particle.”

That was the headline splashed all over America’s news media. It turns out that the name actually derives from substituting “God particle” for “goddamn particle,” the original name some scientists had given the elusive particle. But the media adopted the former nomenclature.

Why?

Because otherwise the bulk of humanity would not pay attention.


Wouldn't it receive more attention if it was called the "Goddamn particle"? The religious nuts would freak out. Their screams would ripple across the zeitgeist of the US, and everyone else would be laughing and then talking about the Higg's boson. (Higgs' boson? not sure)
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Re: God Particle Found, But Does Anyone Care?

Postby nietzsche on Tue Jul 10, 2012 9:05 pm

Is this National Review respectable? Because the guy writing seems annoyed for some reason, zero objectivity. He sort of tries to imitate the mood with which I sometimes post.

Why would you say all those things?, some persons have so petty a mind.
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