Well-regulated militias

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Would you join the Troll Forest Bridge?

Yes
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I'm a conscientious objector.
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I object to kittens.
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Kittens are not an object.
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Total votes : 16

Well-regulated militias

Postby BigBallinStalin on Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:09 pm

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.



(1) What exactly is the criteria for "well-regulated"?

Brian T. Halonen wrote:The phrase "well-regulated" was in common use long before 1789, and remained so for a century thereafter. It referred to the property of something being in proper working order. Something that was well-regulated was calibrated correctly, functioning as expected. Establishing government oversight of the people's arms was not only not the intent in using the phrase in the 2nd amendment, it was precisely to render the government powerless to do so that the founders wrote it.

http://constitution.org/cons/wellregu.htm
(Brian Halonen is a PhD grad from the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee
Daniel J. Schultz J.D., agrees.


How does the Supreme Court interpret "well-regulated"?
" In District of Columbia v. Heller (2008), the U.S. Supreme Court stated that":
the adjective 'well-regulated' implies nothing more than the imposition of proper discipline and training.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/12/2 ... ed-militia



(2) If my friends and I are "well-regulated," does this mean that we can form a militia to promote the security of a free state?
    (If so, can we call it the Troll Forest Brigade?)

(3) Would you join the Troll Forest Bridge?
Last edited by BigBallinStalin on Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:42 pm, edited 7 times in total.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:16 pm

well regulated means armed to the teet, and ready to match whatever attack may be coming.

If they are attacking us with tanks, then yes, we have the right to own tanks. It means we stay on top of it, and constantly upgrade as the technology advances, in anyway that can make defense stronger.

REGULATORS!!!!!!!! MOUNT UP!
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Postby 2dimes on Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:23 pm

Write in for, "exploding kitten launcher"!

As well as yes.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby saxitoxin on Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:32 pm

BigBallinStalin wrote:(1) What exactly is the criteria for "well-regulated"?


a group that is (a) "properly armed and equipped," and (b) engages in military drills "once or twice" per year

    Federalist 29 - http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa29.htm
    "To oblige the great body of the yeomanry, and of the other classes of the citizens, to be under arms for the purpose of going through military exercises and evolutions, as often as might be necessary to acquire the degree of perfection which would entitle them to the character of a well-regulated militia, would be a real grievance to the people, and a serious public inconvenience and loss. To attempt a thing which would abridge the mass of labor and industry to so considerable an extent, would be unwise: and the experiment, if made, could not succeed, because it would not long be endured. Little more can reasonably be aimed at, with respect to the people at large, than to have them properly armed and equipped; and in order to see that this be not neglected, it will be necessary to assemble them once or twice in the course of a year."

BigBallinStalin wrote:(3) Would you join the Troll Forest Bridge?


No, but I will lay, scantily clad across the bar top of a local tavern, singing my favorite jazz ballad, in an effort to entertain the troops and keep their morale, and other things, up.
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Postby 2dimes on Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:36 pm

Can we get some flying machines?

http://hover-bike.com/index.html
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby Lootifer on Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:32 am

Yes but only 'cause of Saxis promise. Ill slog thru the trenches for a piece o dat ass.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby Symmetry on Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:35 am

Phatscotty wrote:well regulated means armed to the teet


Who knew?
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby thegreekdog on Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:32 am

saxitoxin wrote:No, but I will lay, scantily clad across the bar top of a local tavern, singing my favorite jazz ballad, in an effort to entertain the troops and keep their morale, and other things, up.


BBS - I'm in.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby ooge on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:17 pm

want to own a gun? join the national guard.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby AndyDufresne on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:29 pm

For those familiar with SPACED.




--Andy
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby PLAYER57832 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:32 pm

The real irony here is that we have essentially passed the point when an armed malitia, with guns, could really mount any kind of serious defense. Even terrorists tend to use other means.

The real protection we need today is protection of information, and the integrity to know that the information we see is real and verified. But.. sadly, too many people wanting to espouse freedom also want to proclaim that most facts are just not facts... because they would rather further their agendas than actually seek truth. Freedom is not freedom unless it is for ALL, and unless there is a real ability to verify facts and distinguish them from mere ideas, hopes or agendas.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby ooge on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:42 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:The real irony here is that we have essentially passed the point when an armed malitia, with guns, could really mount any kind of serious defense. Even terrorists tend to use other means.

The real protection we need today is protection of information, and the integrity to know that the information we see is real and verified. But.. sadly, too many people wanting to espouse freedom also want to proclaim that most facts are just not facts... because they would rather further their agendas than actually seek truth. Freedom is not freedom unless it is for ALL, and unless there is a real ability to verify facts and distinguish them from mere ideas, hopes or agendas.


Now those are words of wisdom! =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> any American who gets his information from only a few sources is asking to be lead astray.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:02 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:The real irony here is that we have essentially passed the point when an armed malitia, with guns, could really mount any kind of serious defense.


this doesn't seem to be a fact-based statement

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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby Lootifer on Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:57 pm

And thats not even beginning with the nastier side of survival instincts *cough* ammonium nitrate *cough*
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby PLAYER57832 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:56 pm

Lootifer wrote:And thats not even beginning with the nastier side of survival instincts *cough* ammonium nitrate *cough*

Yeah, most anyone with a College level or decent high school level chemistry class can find quite a few other examples. And, according to reports on the Boston incident, you can find bomb making stuff all over the internet.

Guns, however, are much better for hunting and target shooting. :)
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby PLAYER57832 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:01 pm

ooge wrote: any American who gets his information from only a few sources is asking to be lead astray.

CC would, of course be the one exception... :lol: ;)
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby ooge on Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:20 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:The real irony here is that we have essentially passed the point when an armed malitia, with guns, could really mount any kind of serious defense. Even terrorists tend to use other means.

The real protection we need today is protection of information, and the integrity to know that the information we see is real and verified. But.. sadly, too many people wanting to espouse freedom also want to proclaim that most facts are just not facts... because they would rather further their agendas than actually seek truth. Freedom is not freedom unless it is for ALL, and unless there is a real ability to verify facts and distinguish them from mere ideas, hopes or agendas.


=D> =D> =D> honestly this paragraph is a thing to marvel!
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby tzor on Thu Apr 18, 2013 9:04 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:The real irony here is that we have essentially passed the point when an armed militia, with guns, could really mount any kind of serious defense.


Actually we passed that point in ... er ... 1812. Never the less, it can make things annoying. Neither Germany nor Japan planned a land invasion of the United States. Yes they could have but the cost would not have been worth it. The mindset back in 1776 was a lot like the mindset of modern gorilla warfare; especially when traditional armies were used to open field warfare. Actually it wasn't all that effective then either.

Never the less, it does complicate warfare, as traditional armies work on the notion of lines where the general population exists in an area. You can't really push back a general population as you can an army. You have to protect the entire area in order to ensure supply lines where with an army vs army scenario you just have to maintain a solid front line. We see this effect in places like Afghanistan.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby BigBallinStalin on Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:59 am

So moving past the irrelevant ooge and PLAYER comments,

what would the federal government's reaction be if a group of people took seriously the 2nd Amendment by forming their own well-regulated militia?
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby saxitoxin on Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:08 am

BigBallinStalin wrote:what would the federal government's reaction be if a group of people took seriously the 2nd Amendment by forming their own well-regulated militia?


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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby ooge on Sat Apr 20, 2013 1:20 am

BigBallinStalin wrote:So moving past the irrelevant ooge and PLAYER comments,

what would the federal government's reaction be if a group of people took seriously the 2nd Amendment by forming their own well-regulated militia?


Irrelevant? if we had well regulated and accurate information there would not be a discussion.You would only reach one logical solution.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby BigBallinStalin on Sat Apr 20, 2013 9:44 am

ooge wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:So moving past the irrelevant ooge and PLAYER comments,

what would the federal government's reaction be if a group of people took seriously the 2nd Amendment by forming their own well-regulated militia?


Irrelevant? if we had well regulated and accurate information there would not be a discussion.You would only reach one logical solution.


Join the Troll Forest Brigade?
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby ooge on Sat Apr 20, 2013 10:34 am

BigBallinStalin wrote:
ooge wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:So moving past the irrelevant ooge and PLAYER comments,

what would the federal government's reaction be if a group of people took seriously the 2nd Amendment by forming their own well-regulated militia?


Irrelevant? if we had well regulated and accurate information there would not be a discussion.You would only reach one logical solution.


Join the Troll Forest Brigade?


I do not understand the question.
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Postby 2dimes on Sat Apr 20, 2013 10:52 am

It was the "logical solution" the question mark was used because we are wondering if you knew it was.
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Re: Well-regulated militias

Postby fadedpsychosis on Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:25 am

Phatscotty wrote:well regulated means armed to the teet, and ready to match whatever attack may be coming.

If they are attacking us with tanks, then yes, we have the right to own tanks. It means we stay on top of it, and constantly upgrade as the technology advances, in anyway that can make defense stronger.

REGULATORS!!!!!!!! MOUNT UP!

doesn't mean we have to sell you tanks however...

ooge wrote:want to own a gun? join the national guard.

or better yet, active duty

PLAYER57832 wrote:The real irony here is that we have essentially passed the point when an armed malitia, with guns, could really mount any kind of serious defense. Even terrorists tend to use other means.

The real protection we need today is protection of information, and the integrity to know that the information we see is real and verified. But.. sadly, too many people wanting to espouse freedom also want to proclaim that most facts are just not facts... because they would rather further their agendas than actually seek truth. Freedom is not freedom unless it is for ALL, and unless there is a real ability to verify facts and distinguish them from mere ideas, hopes or agendas.

well said indeed

tzor wrote:
PLAYER57832 wrote:The real irony here is that we have essentially passed the point when an armed militia, with guns, could really mount any kind of serious defense.


Actually we passed that point in ... er ... 1812. Never the less, it can make things annoying. Neither Germany nor Japan planned a land invasion of the United States. Yes they could have but the cost would not have been worth it. The mindset back in 1776 was a lot like the mindset of modern gorilla warfare; especially when traditional armies were used to open field warfare. Actually it wasn't all that effective then either.

Never the less, it does complicate warfare, as traditional armies work on the notion of lines where the general population exists in an area. You can't really push back a general population as you can an army. You have to protect the entire area in order to ensure supply lines where with an army vs army scenario you just have to maintain a solid front line. We see this effect in places like Afghanistan.

there hasn't really been an "army vs army" scenario in truth since WW2... everything since then has had some form of guerilla warfare on one or both sides... besides, what most people in the US want is not to have a militia, it's to have a majority of people become "insurgents" should we ever be invaded

BigBallinStalin wrote:So moving past the irrelevant ooge and PLAYER comments,

what would the federal government's reaction be if a group of people took seriously the 2nd Amendment by forming their own well-regulated militia?

we already have that... it's called the national guard...
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