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Postby HighlanderAttack on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:19 am

So I am tired of Night Strike and his dictatorship. Over the past year I have had four issues with Night Strike.

1. My medals being stripped for running AACM tourneys which although different in format were deemed the same format due to name only-after a few back and forth pm's I was eventually ignored and nothing happened.

2. Then the thread by Bones(Night Strikes Buddy) about there being too many tourneys to choose from. Instead of supporting tourneys he is about tourneys being his way or no way.

3. Then after being told I could not run speed tourneys the way I wanted to, and responding with my reasoning, I was never given a response.

4. And now with this pm I received. Basically eliminating at least 5 different styles of the tourneys I run. On top of that this was not sent to all tourney organizers. I don't know who it was sent to but I do know it was not sent to at least one tourney organizer who has run numerous tourneys.


I am basically putting this out there so everyone knows Night Strike is a dictator that is going to do things his way and if you don't like it oh well. Well I don't like it and I am over it and I am making my opinion known to everyone.

I have tried to make tourneys a fun thing over the past year. I have started over 130 tourneys and completed over 100. That I know if most everyone has enjoyed them. I do this with my time and get my own person reward for running tourneys out of it and nothing more. I didn't even know you received medals for running tourneys in the beginning. I just feel Night Strike is against tourney formats that don't fit his own personal criteria. I feel like no matter what response I give to him personally will have no effect anyway so I did not waste my time responding to him personally. I will pm this to the players that have been in my tourneys in the past. That is about it. Good Luck to all. I do not know what my future holds for CC, but it is time I make a stand against someone who I believe is bad for CC tourneys.


Night Strike wrote:Hello organizers and players,

I'm sending this PM to each of you to gather feedback on a soon-to-be-released tournament forum announcement. Our current minimum tournament requirements have been in place for 2 years now, so in order to catch up to the many changes on CC and specifically in the tournament area, we Directors have written a new set of requirements for all new tournaments. Because of the scope of changes in the requirements, we've decided to allow a select group of tournament contributors to review the new rules before they go live. Most of the ideas incorporated in these requirements were developed from things that have been mentioned from time to time over the past year, including from the contentious threads in General Info this January. They are meant to strike a balance between the ease of organizing tournaments as well as the equity among every tournament in regards to medals. They are not meant to target any individual organizer, so I hope no one feels that way, but rather they are meant to improve everyone's experiences in our tournament forums.

Each of you have the opportunity to provide me and the other Directors with feedback regarding these changes (you will reply to me and I will post them in a thread in our Director forum, anonymously if you specify that desire). You may voice your support, rejection, critique, clarification, or other requirements you think need to be included. It's up to you on how you respond to this feedback request, but there are two things that I ask of you:
  1. These requirements are private until they are announced by me to the whole forum.
  2. You only get to send me ONE reply to this PM.
This second rule is to keep my inbox from overflowing (it'll already get full if everyone replies) as well as to make sure you take the time to ponder the new requirements to formulate a well-reasoned and objective response. I may reply directly to some of your comments/concerns, but this is designed more as a feedback opportunity rather than a dialogue. Your input is very much appreciated, so I hope you can come up with some beneficial suggestions.

All responses are due by Friday at 2:00 PM EST (7:00 PM GMT) to guarantee consideration.

So without further ado, here are the proposed requirements (the current requirements are in the Tournament Handbook: How to Host a Tournament if you are unfamiliar with them):
Updated Proposal
  • 1v1 bracket tournaments must have at least 32 players OR can have 16 players with at least best of 3 games every round
  • Singles (3-8 player games) tournaments must have 16 players
  • Doubles tournaments must have 16 teams (32 players)
  • Triples & Quads tournaments must have 8 teams (24 or 32 players)
  • NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)
  • The tournament structure must cause the eventual winner to play 3 games (ex. 4 games with 4 players and then the 4 winners playing a final game would not be allowed)
  • At least 50% of the spots available must be for open/public sign-ups and not filled with special invitations.
  • Each organizer can have only 3 tournaments recruiting players at once, and only 2 of those can be 32 players or less (has NO effect on ongoing tournaments or reserves threads)
  • The Tournament Directors reserve the right to deny privileges for your tournament if the tournament is deemed to break site rules or has an unfair structure.
  • If you wish to run a tournament based upon an actual sports league or another well-designed format, and it requires you to have less than the minimum amount of participants or games, please contact the Create/Join Director to discuss a possible exemption.

Thanks again for your feedback. Also, this isn't the only tournament update coming down the pipe in the near future: all the others are non-controversial, so you all can still be looking forward to that. ;)

~Night Strike
Head Tournament Director
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby grifftron on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:27 am

I never got it, but i guess im not a tourney organizer? Only finished around 10 and got 4 going now... what rules have changed? I don't get it... maybe cuz i just drove 3 hours back home... need some sleep and ill re read this


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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby angola on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:37 am

This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby grifftron on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:45 am

Whats the point to this rule? and is it open to the CC community to vote or choose together? Or is it gonna be Obama style?
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby jcstriker on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:48 am

angola wrote:This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?


yeah iv seen many tourneys for low rank players only, why cut out the high rank ones?
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby merch313 on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:49 am

angola wrote:This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?


Points is the reason I do not sign up for tourneys 1v1 games sucks when you go second almost every game to a very low ranked player/players so I think minimum point tourneys are a good thing.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby grifftron on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:50 am

AMEN to that brother! 8-)
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby General Flashman on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:50 am

I do not run tournaments, so accept that I may have a limited grasp of the issues raised here by Night Strike and HA.

However, as a regular player of tournaments, I feel I can chip in.

Specifically, I know HA runs a lot of tournaments - I have played in a lot of them. But it is always clear from the forum page and the title that it is one of his! Some people may not like the short and sharp competitions he runs, (although his comps are often of different specs) but no one is forced to play in the, and, as far as I know, they are generally fully subscribed!

Surely it is better to have lots of tournaments filling up quickly rather than a few which struggle.

People come on to CC to play games! HA, and many others, allows people to do so in a structured and competitive environment. If these rules, esp as regards limits to how many can be accepting sign ups at the one time, go through, then I suspect the forum for new tournaments will appear to have tumble weed going through it!

If someone is prepared, as many people such as moderators, directors and organisers do, to give up their time to make things better for the rest of the members, where is the harm in that?

In what way is restriction of choice here a good thing?

Night Strike, to whom many thanks for all the hard work put in, says that the changes "are meant to improve everyone's experiences in our tournament forums." Surely the goal should be improving experiences in playing the game? I must confess I am happier playing rather than in the fora!

I suspect this might be a popular topic (!) and it is sad to see people so obviously committed to CC having such difficulties.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby wolfpack0530 on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:52 am

angola wrote:This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?


I 100% agree. i am not biased. look at my tourney history. i play anyone. but i respect the right for those who only wish to play high ranks to do so. It is not like there is not enough tourneys out there for everyone to enjoy.

nightstrike, you are being overbearing!
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby RoOkAz on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:52 am

to be honest...i think the new rules are a bunch of shit.

Tourneys are going fine the way they are...why change a good running engine to make a possible defective same one
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby saraith on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:54 am

angola wrote:This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?

You don't consider Major to be a high rank? At the moment, you would not be able to participate in a tourney with a 2000 point minimum.

Personally, I see nothing wrong with the proposed rules. I think it's a good balance and a fair compromise.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby grifftron on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:58 am

saraith wrote:
angola wrote:This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?

You don't consider Major to be a high rank? At the moment, you would not be able to participate in a tourney with a 2000 point minimum.

Personally, I see nothing wrong with the proposed rules. I think it's a good balance and a fair compromise.


I dont agree... if we don't have 2000 points and Highlander makes a 2000+ tourney, then we dont play.... thats that.... and thats they way its been and they way it should stay. Wolfpack said it nicely... we should have to RIGHT to make certain tourneys with rank restriction!
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby jcstriker on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:59 am

saraith wrote:
angola wrote:This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?

You don't consider Major to be a high rank? At the moment, you would not be able to participate in a tourney with a 2000 point minimum.

Personally, I see nothing wrong with the proposed rules. I think it's a good balance and a fair compromise.

i f uhv 2000 points u are a major :roll:
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby mgconstruction on Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:59 am

Wow to this PM to Tournament Organizers. I have a few questions & points here to make.

1 - As a Tournament Organizer myself, why did I not get a PM with this?
Was it because I already expressed my opinion in the following thread and it was not what they wanted to hear? viewtopic.php?f=89&t=105975

2 - Why is this being done secretly in PM's and with only select Tournament Organizers? Don't all organizers have a voice as well as the people who play in these tournaments?

Oh wait they did here voice their opinions here...viewtopic.php?f=89&t=105975
Were the opinions of premium paying customers not to someones liking?

3- The poll that Night Strike created here viewtopic.php?f=89&t=105975 shows the peoples opinions.

Was the results not what they wanted to hear? Do these peoples voices not count?

My view is plain & simple, not only is this PM quoted above trying change the way tournaments are run, but it' sneaky and vindictive against a particular player & Tournament organizer. Not only has this issue stopped me from starting anymore of my Tourney's, I will also no longer donate any premium prizes as well as not renew my own premium until this is resolved and we are all heard.

As I said in the other thread with poll (linked above), Tournament Organizers donate their time as well as premium prizes and if CC does not take our opinions seriously than I have no need to waste my time & money.


MG
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby poptartpsycho18 on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:01 am

I respect you HA, but this is an issue that I can see coming up repeatedly.

Edit: Losing my mind reading all the moot posts here...
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby Kinnison on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:01 am

Well, let's see.

1: I didn't get it either, I've run/finished 2 tourneys. This was obviously sent to people who have finished running MANY tourneys, and probably a relatively small group of them.

2: This is for discussion.

3: This was NOT supposed to be public.

-----

I recall the contentious thread in question. I assume HA's big beef with this is the new minimum size of tournaments, and the "3 per organizer recruiting at once".

The rest of the changes look fairly non-objectionable to me.
--At least 3 games required to be played by a winner? sure, I'd like it to be 5 or so, myself.
--No restrictions tougher than 2000+ ? Well, I can see why people might bitch about it. But it still seems reasonable, given the LONG-STANDING general guideline of "half the userbase must qualify"
--At least 50% of slots must be publicly available? This is more or less a current rule, variably enforced. phrasing it this way just makes enforcement simpler.
--TDs have right to deny provleges? well, duh. that's their job, if it doesn't meet the rules.

HA, did you CONSIDER making a polite reply, citing specifically an objection to the sizing requirements?

I suggest everyone reread NS's message. These are PROPOSALS, meant to be discussed by the TO's that RUN most of the tournaments.

Personally, I think these restrictions MIGHT go a bit too far, but it's a starting point for discussion.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby grifftron on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:05 am

mgconstruction wrote:Wow to this PM to Tournament Organizers. I have a few questions & points here to make.

1 - As a Tournament Organizer myself, why did I not get a PM with this?
Was it because I already expressed my opinion in the following thread and it was not what they wanted to hear? viewtopic.php?f=89&t=105975

2 - Why is this being done secretly in PM's and with only select Tournament Organizers? Don't all organizers have a voice as well as the people who play in these tournaments?

Oh wait they did here voice their opinions here...viewtopic.php?f=89&t=105975
Were the opinions of premium paying customers not to someones liking?

3- The poll that Night Strike created here viewtopic.php?f=89&t=105975 shows the peoples opinions.

Was the results not what they wanted to hear? Do these peoples voices not count?

My view is plain & simple, not only is this PM quoted above trying change the way tournaments are run, but i sneaky and vindictive against a particular player & Tournament organizer. Not only has this issue stopped me from starting anymore of my Tourney's, I will also no longer donate any premium prizes as well as not renew my own premium until this is resolved and we are all heard.

As I said in the other thread with poll (linked above), Tournament Organizers donate their time as well as premium prizes and if CC does not take our opinions seriously than I have no need to waste my time & money.

Furthermore this thread should be moved to Cheating & Abuse with Night Strikes name in the thread title because it is quite obvious he cannot do his job as Tournament Director objectively.

MG


Thats what im talking about... is CC gonna pass some sheesh without the peoples thoughts and input? seriously... I hope its a big mis understanding.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby JoshyBoy on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:07 am

I was not aware of any changes.

NS is on a bit of a power trip.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby grifftron on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:09 am

Hey i got 4 tourneys running at the moment, was not aware of these new rules expecially the 3 game one... im pretty sure mine already met those requirments but if they do not but meet the old ones can i still finish these up? dis is wack man
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby pissedoffsol on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:15 am

I think having nearly any rules is pretty stupid. Pretty much the only thing i agree with would be minimums for player count.

How does having restrictions or min players affect in a negative way? If you don't qualify, play better until you do rank.

You don't start Doom with the BFG..... and CC doesn't have a god mode code that i know of.
You need to work your way up to a level if you want more features. Every game is like this.
1 map/1 track/1 character/1 gun/etc etc and as you play you unlock more options.

Why should this place be any different? And honestly, point restrictions on tourneys is pretty rare as it is.


Effectively, these new rules will turn everything into something like bracketed drag racing.
1/4, semis, and finals.

this also will limit tourneys to 64 players max. (8 players per each 8 teams)
any more than that will not be allowed to ever 'finalize'
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby Kinnison on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:28 am

pissedoffsol wrote:I think having nearly any rules is pretty stupid. Pretty much the only thing i agree with would be minimums for player count.

How does having restrictions or min players affect in a negative way? If you don't qualify, play better until you do rank.

You don't start Doom with the BFG..... and CC doesn't have a god mode code that i know of.
You need to work your way up to a level if you want more features. Every game is like this.
1 map/1 track/1 character/1 gun/etc etc and as you play you unlock more options.

Why should this place be any different? And honestly, point restrictions on tourneys is pretty rare as it is.


Effectively, these new rules will turn everything into something like bracketed drag racing.
1/4, semis, and finals.

this also will limit tourneys to 64 players max. (8 players per each 8 teams)
any more than that will not be allowed to ever 'finalize'


Where do you see a maximum size on this? There have been, and even under these rules, could be, some HUGE tourneys run. When one or more of the big-name TOs runs something huge, everyone wants in. They fill up in well under 30 days.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby amazzony on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:29 am

I hope you are ashamed Highlander because you were trusted by a moderator in a discussion and misused the trust. This is low and you've shown what awful and childish person you can be.
I will not answer to the points because Night Strike will get my private answer as was asked in his PM.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby angola on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:30 am

saraith wrote:
angola wrote:This rule:

# NO tournament may have a point restriction greater than 2000 points per player (or average of 2000 points per player in team tournaments)


is dumb.

Maybe folks don't want to play a tournament with low ranks? What's wrong with offering ones to high ranks only?

You don't consider Major to be a high rank? At the moment, you would not be able to participate in a tourney with a 2000 point minimum.

Personally, I see nothing wrong with the proposed rules. I think it's a good balance and a fair compromise.


Well, if it wasn't for the damn Map Blaster tourney ( :) ) I'm in, I'd still be rocking 2,100 points.

Seriously, though, I don't need to be in every tournament. If folks want to start tourneys that are restricted, I don't see the problem.
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby johnkelly00 on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:31 am

First off, I have personally enjoyed HA's tourneys and he runs a fairly tight ship from what I can tell.

Unfortunately, not all organizers are as... organized. Some tourneys I have no idea where things stand, when the next round is starting or what the ranks are.

I have never been too upset by tourneys that go nowhere because my expectations are low. At the end of the day, I don't think I'm alone in saying that I just want to play some games and have fun.

One last point before I move on... HA - I can understand where you are coming from - you invest a lot of your own time to make solid tourneys that are fun for the greater community. You probably feel like you are being squashed in creating new tourneys with the same level of freedom that you previously had. That being said, you might have tried addressing your concerns privately first before escalating it to the masses.

Good luck all - let's remember: it's only a game!
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Re: HighlanderAttack is tired of Night Strike

Postby The Mantis on Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:42 am

I dont have much to add but my 2 cents are that

I think HA does a great job and the time and effort that he puts into his tourneys is something that i would never do, yet without HA putting in all of his efforts I would not be able join fun and a multitude of tournaments of which i have become hooked on playing.

Im not really sure where night strike is going and of course I have only heard of HA's version of events but looking into the glass bowl from HA's perspective i feel he feels he is getting the bum rush and he may also feel it is more personal rather than for the greater good of CC.

So in a nutshell I will continue to play in HA's tournaments and if people dont like it, dont join but guessing from the numbers that join there are more that do than font.

Cheers
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