burninchaoz, GallantPellham, donny the bull, and D[CLOSED]ES

[L M S]

Game 10179949

This is clearly gross abuse of the system.

Burninchaoz intentionally missed his turn to gain an advantage in next round's deploy. Obviously since they are a high level clan/team they were all in on the decision. Burninchaoz was able to play several speed games and take other turns during the time he "missed" his turn in the Hive game. He was able to take his turn but didn't, to gain a tactical advantage by abusing the system in place for deferred troops.

This is gross abuse of the system since they all know what will happen with the deferred troops and since he is (right now) in no danger of being eliminated.

Chickenshit way to play the game especially for a "high level clan" in a clan tournament.

Since the whole team had to have agreed on this, they should all be kicked from the game and warned. Maybe this will be the catalyst that changes the way deferred troops are handled.

At the very least its a strategically bullshit way to try to win the game, especially in a high profile game/tournament like this.

Accused:
burninchaoz
GallantPellham
donny the bull
DJ Teflon

The accused are suspected of:

Intentional/Gross abuse of the system.

Game number(s):
This is the game where the abuse took place. The "strategically' intentional miss to gain a tactical advantage by abusing the system.
Game 10179949

Examples of games to back up his ability to take the turns during the time period in question..
Game 10428978
Game 10429193
Game 10430544

[jefjef]

From the specific rules of the tourney:

Missed Turns in a No Spoils Game
Missed turns in no spoils will not be scrutinised or result in any penalty (it is very rare for an advantage to be gained).

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=441&t=148598

[L M S]

From the specific rules of the tourney:

Missed Turns in a No Spoils Game
Missed turns in no spoils will not be scrutinised or result in any penalty (it is very rare for an advantage to be gained).

I understand that JJ, this is bigger than that though.

BTW, that statement, by the TO (who coincidentally is an accused) kinda proves premeditation and intent don't you think? Sort of an odd, arbitrary, random 'rule' to intentionally put in the tourney rules, in light of this eh?

[Teflon Kris]

What a wierdo - how would we gain an advantage

[jefjef]

From the specific rules of the tourney:

Missed Turns in a No Spoils Game
Missed turns in no spoils will not be scrutinised or result in any penalty (it is very rare for an advantage to be gained).

I understand that JJ, this is bigger than that though.

BTW, that statement, by the TO (who coincidentally is an accused) kinda proves premeditation and intent don't you think? Sort of an odd, arbitrary, random 'rule' to intentionally put in the tourney rules, in light of this eh?

Well you did agree to the rules upon joining the tourney.

Also as few terts that one of them is down to (9) it's a really large risk to miss a turn and miss a big drop and subsequent attack.

[Teflon Kris]

From the specific rules of the tourney:

Missed Turns in a No Spoils Game
Missed turns in no spoils will not be scrutinised or result in any penalty (it is very rare for an advantage to be gained).

Sort of an odd, arbitrary, random 'rule' to intentionally put in the tourney rules, in light of this eh?

Not really random as it saves having to deal with spurious claims such as this

[patrickaa317]

Can someone explain to me how it is more beneficial to get the troops a round later as deferred rather than getting them during a normal turn?

[hmsps]

Can someone explain to me how it is more beneficial to get the troops a round later as deferred rather than getting them during a normal turn?

not neccisarily looking at the game in question but a no spoils game on hive you could effectually have a deploy of say 24, 12 normal and 12 deferred which if you pass them all to the next player could have 36+

[anonymus]

this is just silly LMS.. i fail to see any advantage in missing a turn in a nospoils huge-map game..
and i also think that previous C&A rulings on this matter has thought us that deferred troops are NEVER better than getting the troops now and taking your turn..
and you have been on this site long enough to be aware of this aswell..
/

[patrickaa317]

Can someone explain to me how it is more beneficial to get the troops a round later as deferred rather than getting them during a normal turn?

not neccisarily looking at the game in question but a no spoils game on hive you could effectually have a deploy of say 24, 12 normal and 12 deferred which if you pass them all to the next player could have 36+

No missed turn:
In Round 1, you drop 12 on person B.
In Round 2, you drop 12 on person B.


A missed turn:
In Round 2, you drop 12 on person B.
In Round 2, you drop 12 deferred on person B.


How is that any different? Because the other team doesn't know where you are going to put all the guys until they are all there?

[Teflon Kris]

I cant see the advantage either - always better to attack before the opposition if you ask me.

I was pretty p*ss*d-off to get up this morning and see a missed turn by chaoz - I assume he waited for advice from one of the rest of us or something.

2012-01-14 21:18:46 - DJ Teflon: 2012-01-13 00:39:19 - DJ Teflon [team]: 245-222
2012-01-14 21:18:54 - DJ Teflon: 2012-01-14 21:18:22 - DJ Teflon [team]: 212-253


I fail to see how going from 33 troops ahead to 41 behind is an advantage lol
Not to mention bonuses gained by you guys and lost by us and our weakest player being even weaker!

[hmsps]

I cant see the advantage either - always better to attack before the opposition if you ask me.

On a normal map maybe but on hive when the deploy usually is 12? better attacking with 39 than 15. Admittedly you could do as patrick says and build for a round.

The fact is people miss turns for whatever reason, it is unfortunate and also annoying but it happens. It was built into the rules of the tournament so nothing will be done and report will be closed

[Teflon Kris]

I cant see the advantage either - always better to attack before the opposition if you ask me.

On a normal map maybe but on hive when the deploy usually is 12? better attacking with 39 than 15. Admittedly you could do as patrick says and build for a round.

True, don't see how it will help us redress what our opponents have managed in the meantime:

.... going from 33 troops ahead to 41 behind i....
Not to mention bonuses gained by you guys and lost by us and our weakest player being even weaker!

[SirSebstar]

if ever there was a spurious report, this is it.
epic lol though....
tisk tisk dj teflon, mega lol. next time ban him from all tournaments...

[Ickyketseddie]

If its such a benifit just miss your turns for a round and by your logic your sure to win?!?

Personally, like most here, i think they've just hurt they're chances of winning this one.

[jghost7]

...BTW, that statement, by the TO (who coincidentally is an accused) kinda proves premeditation and intent don't you think? Sort of an odd, arbitrary, random 'rule' to intentionally put in the tourney rules, in light of this eh?

No, it doesn't, nor is it odd, arbitrary, or random. It was even further scrutinized in the AOD vs 1RFG matchup where there was an issue regarding missed turns in an ACC game in the second round.

Here is a quote from the cd's from that war thread:

....
-Did the missed turns in a "no spoils" game break a tournament rule? No. The rule was specifically put in place to avoid the intentional missing of turns in a nuclear game to avoid getting the final card. If the argument were made that this should apply to flat rate and escalating I would have to agree even with the knowledge that it was put in place for the nuclear issue only. However, the game at issue was a "no spoils" game. Thus, since the rule only applied to games WITH spoils, the rule was not broken by 1RFG. Accordingly, the TOs decision in this regard was appropriate. ....

After that incident the rules were given some extra detail, PMs sent out, and the details of the rules update posted in the main tourney thread here and here.

As it stands currently, there are no rules violations in evidence.

[anonymus]

If its such a benifit just miss your turns for a round and by your logic your sure to win?!?

Personally, like most here, i think they've just hurt they're chances of winning this one.

*snickers*

good answer!

/

[Namliam]

From the revised rules of this tournament.................

"As with deliberate missed turns / 'time outs', the opposing team will be automatically awarded a victory for the game in question if strong evidence is proivided."

Playing speed games while missing the turn in this very important tournament game, looks like plenty of evidence to me!

[GallantPellham]

bite me, he's got a 100% turn taken. LMS are you still farming ?' marks?

[GallantPellham]

Can someone explain to me how it is more beneficial to get the troops a round later as deferred rather than getting them during a normal turn?

me too, i was mad at him for not letting me know he was gonna be late.

[jghost7]

From the revised rules of this tournament.................

"As with deliberate missed turns / 'time outs', the opposing team will be automatically awarded a victory for the game in question if strong evidence is proivided."

Playing speed games while missing the turn in this very important tournament game, looks like plenty of evidence to me!

...Deadbeating
Deadbeating will not be considered to be a deliberate act unless evidence is provided to the contrary (e.g. evidence of the player turns being taken in other games when they could have taken place in the game in question). As with deliberate missed turns / 'time outs', the opposing team will be automatically awarded a victory for the game in question if strong evidence is proivided. ....

This is covered for deadbeating out of game. If he deadbeats out of the game, and you can proved he missed those turns deliberately, then this applies.

[HighlanderAttack]

Simple solution--take deferred troops out of the game--just do not allow them--wake up CC--you could fix so many issues just not giving players def troops--If the miss a turn--tough on them--seems like the right thing to do but when has that ever meant much in the real world

[Evil Semp]

This situation was covered under the rules that jefjef quoted. You joined the tourney so you must abide by the rules posted. Moving this to CLOSED.

[jghost7]

Simple solution--take deferred troops out of the game--just do not allow them--wake up CC--you could fix so many issues just not giving players def troops--If the miss a turn--tough on them--seems like the right thing to do but when has that ever meant much in the real world

Agree.

[Teflon Kris]

Simple solution--take deferred troops out of the game--just do not allow them--wake up CC--you could fix so many issues just not giving players def troops--If the miss a turn--tough on them--seems like the right thing to do but when has that ever meant much in the real world

Agree.

Thirded - will add as a suggestion