Lord of the Rings mafia [Town wins]

[Falkomagno]

By the position in your list, and because my experinece in gambling, I would say that pmc is Saruman.

[Iliad]

I throw in a joke vote against pmc, and suddenly we all have a serious discussion vs him.

The naming of minor characters is kinda suspicious.
Speculation often is used by Mafia. Mafia want to reveal nothing but look like they are creating discussion. They simply drop the number of Mafia they "think" there are, careful to sound unsure. Tada it looks like they are contributing, where actually the discussion has not been pushed forward at all. So pmc looks slightly suspicious but I'm not voting him yet, and since my vote was a joke and the game is past the joke day 1 votes into serious discussion I will unvote

[Stroop]

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Vote count

pmchugh - 2 (Suspect101, karelpietertje)
Falkomagno - 1 (nagerous)
william18 - 1 (Falkomagno)
karelpietertje - 3 (AceArtemis, sam_levi_11, Hologram)
Hologram - 1 (pmchugh)
Iliad - 1 (Clive)
Minister Masket - 2 (spiesr, Thezzaruz)

Not voting: william18, Minister Masket, Mr. Squirrel, Iliad

With 15 alive, it takes 8 votes to lynch.

Day 1 will end approximately 316 hours from now
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[Mr. Squirrel]

Hmmm...karelpietertje has been pretty quiet so far this game.

[Suspect101]

I throw in a joke vote against pmc, and suddenly we all have a serious discussion vs him.

The naming of minor characters is kinda suspicious.
Speculation often is used by Mafia. Mafia want to reveal nothing but look like they are creating discussion. They simply drop the number of Mafia they "think" there are, careful to sound unsure. Tada it looks like they are contributing, where actually the discussion has not been pushed forward at all. So pmc looks slightly suspicious but I'm not voting him yet, and since my vote was a joke and the game is past the joke day 1 votes into serious discussion I will unvote

Ok:
1) You think that his naming of minor characters is suspicious.
2) He speculated, and you say that speculation is often used by mafia.
3) He has revealed nothing, but created discussion, which you say mafia do.
4) He said how many mafia he "thinks" there are, carefully to sound unsure.
5) Not to mention that you have the fact that he OMGUS voted right after I called him out.

And you think he looks slightly suspicious and not voting for him yet? Did you ever think that maybe your "joke" vote revealed some information about him? Not to mention that I voted for him first, so really all your vote was is a BW vote.

Let me tell you another thing that Mafia do. They vote for each other day 1 to try and give them some creditability later in the game. If the Scum buddy starts to feel some heat they un-vote, and claim that they look scummy leaving a doubt in people mind by saying the look suspicious, yet fail to find anyone else that looks more suspicious.

PMC had only 3 votes on him when you un-voted. Not really in any kind of trouble, he was at L-5, and you un-vote because you don't want to have a serious discussion about someone who looks scummy?

My vote stays on PMC and Iliad is next.

[pmchugh]

I throw in a joke vote against pmc, and suddenly we all have a serious discussion vs him.

The naming of minor characters is kinda suspicious.
Speculation often is used by Mafia. Mafia want to reveal nothing but look like they are creating discussion. They simply drop the number of Mafia they "think" there are, careful to sound unsure. Tada it looks like they are contributing, where actually the discussion has not been pushed forward at all. So pmc looks slightly suspicious but I'm not voting him yet, and since my vote was a joke and the game is past the joke day 1 votes into serious discussion I will unvote

Your vote wasn't serious but suspect was. As for the creating disussion part it was the very first post. Better than "vote illy cause he's a bitch" etc. And you can't deny it's created discussion it takes a lot longer to get to. Sometimes sacrificing looknig a little scummy gets the game going.

Ok:
1) You think that his naming of minor characters is suspicious.
2) He speculated, and you say that speculation is often used by mafia.
3) He has revealed nothing, but created discussion, which you say mafia do.
4) He said how many mafia he "thinks" there are, carefully to sound unsure.
5) Not to mention that you have the fact that he OMGUS voted right after I called him out.

I disagee with 1, by naming minor characters I was making you more aware of fake claims, how is that suspicious.

2 and 4 I knew people would say but still di it anyway.

As for 3 yes I have created discussion that is useful for the game, care to deny that?

And number 5, it was A JOKE vote. Hardly a serious OMGUS.

Scum Tells aren't 100% look at the context first.

[Suspect101]

I disagee with 1, by naming minor characters I was making you more aware of fake claims, how is that suspicious.

By giving other scum characters that they can claim. You can not make people aware of fake claims. The only ways to tell if a claim is fake is either by a player countering or by lynching. Just naming random characters who, although the chance is small, could still be in the game, does not make anyoen aware of anything. It just gives people who would lie, scum, more in their arsenal to lie with.

2 and 4 I knew people would say but still di it anyway.

You knew they were scum tells, and you did them anyways? Misleading people is not very town like. If you were town why would you do things that you knew were scummy?

As for 3 yes I have created discussion that is useful for the game, care to deny that?

no I don't, but you are since the discussion is about you.

And number 5, it was A JOKE vote. Hardly a serious OMGUS.

Ofcourse you would claim it as a joke, since you got no bandwagon going. If you did I doubt you would be calling it a joke.

Scum Tells aren't 100% look at the context first.

I am.

[Hologram]

As far as the speculation goes, you all seem to have forgotten the possibility mentioned by our loving mod that there are townie roles out there.

Of course, I suppose they could be VT and still have a name...


Anyway, pmc is at least giving other scum possible claims, and at most giving himself possible claims with the assumption that he is scum.... Hmmm....


Reluctant unvote vote pmc

[pmchugh]

Urg mafia is so frustrating these days, people look at slightly scummy behaviour and go well he must be scum! No scum are more careful than town, learn that.

You knew they were scum tells, and you did them anyways? Misleading people is not very town like. If you were town why would you do things that you knew were scummy?

They are not major tells, I expected to get a few votes and that would be it, I even said this. I am not misleading townies I am fishing for reaction. Reaction is a great thing and that is what I mean by creating conversation that is useful not putting myself in the spotlight.

And number 5, it was A JOKE vote. Hardly a serious OMGUS.

Ofcourse you would claim it as a joke, since you got no bandwagon going. If you did I doubt you would be calling it a joke.

I figured I would get a few votes for it, by SCUM!

unvote vote suspect

This vote is not serious, otherwise I would have said:

"I was acting slightly scummy in order to find scum jumping on the first townie they could find, and suspect clearly fits that. Most people are joking about but suspect is taking this way too seriously showing that he is eager to lynch the first townie he can."

Or something similar, I certainly wouldn't be expecting anyone to jump on a wagon such as what I actually wrote but the above statement may have pulled some votes. I know how to start BW's better than that, and the fact you are pointing to this vote as serious shows desperation.

Scum Tells aren't 100% look at the context first.

I am.

No you think you are.

[AceArtemis]

Unvote to withdraw my random vote.

As for pmc's bandwagon, there's way too much speculation going on. Pmc could just be someone who knows the theme well and wants to guess the setup, or he could be mafia trying to act helpful. There's no knowing which. I don't like this bandwagon on pmc, though, because this speculation is giving the town information, such as what claims are likely to be fake.

scum are more careful than town, learn that.

From my experience being scum, this is very true. I am a lot more careful when I am scum than when I am town.

[karelpietertje]

Hmmm...karelpietertje has been pretty quiet so far this game.

yes i was quiet because i didnt know quite what to say... this is all very confusing to me
that is also why i say: unvote

so i thought that after 36 hours day 1 would end... why hasn't it?
of course i dont want it to end... i have most votes at the moment

so can anybody explain to me why they voted me that much? I mean, im still learning too, i want to know what to do about this.
because I never liked the thought of having nothing to stand on when I have a rope tied around my neck

[Hologram]

Unvote to withdraw my random vote.

As for pmc's bandwagon, there's way too much speculation going on. Pmc could just be someone who knows the theme well and wants to guess the setup, or he could be mafia trying to act helpful. There's no knowing which. I don't like this bandwagon on pmc, though, because this speculation is giving the town information, such as what claims are likely to be fake.

scum are more careful than town, learn that.

From my experience being scum, this is very true. I am a lot more careful when I am scum than when I am town.

True that, true that, but I see no other scum tells, what with it being day one and all.

To pmc:
Yeah, it can be frustrating the first day when there's little to go on and people start over analyzing things, but that's the name of the game when it comes to web-based Mafia. You can't read faces or even tone of voice/mode of delivery. You must make your assumptions solely on what is being said. Believe me, I've been lynched on the first day on the smallest of scum tells many times, and I've never ever been scum.

[Stroop]

so i thought that after 36 hours day 1 would end... why hasn't it?

Not 36, Day 1 will end 360 hours (15 days) after it started. 36 hours isn't enough to have a productive day.

[Hologram]

Hmmm...karelpietertje has been pretty quiet so far this game.

yes i was quiet because i didnt know quite what to say... this is all very confusing to me
that is also why i say: unvote

so i thought that after 36 hours day 1 would end... why hasn't it?
of course i dont want it to end... i have most votes at the moment

so can anybody explain to me why they voted me that much? I mean, im still learning too, i want to know what to do about this.
because I never liked the thought of having nothing to stand on when I have a rope tied around my neck

It's Day One which means random voting. You being a newb, especially as enthusiastic as you came off, makes you an easier target, simple as that.

By the way, just dropping out the conversation is considered submarining which is a scumtell and should be avoided because you're telling everyone else that you have something to hide and don't want it to be uncovered by a slip of the tongue or something.

And yes, Mafia is confusing. That's the name of the game. The scum want to confuse us townies into killing other townies while the scum quietly make their kills. Lies and deceit, deceit and lies.

[Mr. Squirrel]

I dont agree with Karel's reasoning for unvoting PMC. He uses his naivety to the game as an excuse to unvote. I don't understand this game any more than he does and Suspect's analysis is making want to vote for PMC more and more, not the other way around. The only reason he could have for unvoting (as far as I can tell) is to protect another mafia member. What do some of you veterans think?

[Hologram]

I dont agree with Karel's reasoning for unvoting PMC. He uses his naivety to the game as an excuse to unvote. I don't understand this game any more than he does and Suspect's analysis is making want to vote for PMC more and more, not the other way around. The only reason he could have for unvoting (as far as I can tell) is to protect another mafia member. What do some of you veterans think?

To me it seems perfectly innocent. He saw a bandwagon forming and he didn't want to be part of it until he had more time to think about it. I would do the exact same thing.

I'm not going to comment on your rationale as it has both good and bad parts to it, but I will tell you not to let anyone's analysis be your sole basis for anything, because the mafia works by trying to influence the town to vote in their favor, usually by making compelling, but untrue arguments. Make your own analysis before making any decisions.

[spiesr]

The only reason to unvote is to protect a scum buddy?
No, you can also unvote because you are no longer as sure that that person is scum...

[karelpietertje]

I dont agree with Karel's reasoning for unvoting PMC. He uses his naivety to the game as an excuse to unvote. I don't understand this game any more than he does and Suspect's analysis is making want to vote for PMC more and more, not the other way around. The only reason he could have for unvoting (as far as I can tell) is to protect another mafia member. What do some of you veterans think?

I'm not a veteran, but I think im indeed naive, and also i dont have enough time to read all of this thread

From my experience being scum, this is very true. I am a lot more careful when I am scum than when I am town.

this is exactly what scum would say
youre trying to pretend that you are now good, but fact is: once a scum, forever a scum. (this applies only for you though... i bet everybody has been scum at some poin )
vote AceArtemis

[Mr. Squirrel]

I'm not going to comment on your rationale as it has both good and bad parts to it, but I will tell you not to let anyone's analysis be your sole basis for anything, because the mafia works by trying to influence the town to vote in their favor, usually by making compelling, but untrue arguments. Make your own analysis before making any decisions.

I am not letting his analysis be my sole basis. If I was, I would have voted for PMC already. Although I believe that PMC is looking the scummiest so far, I don't think that Suspect's argument is strong enough to warrant my vote.

The only reason to unvote is to protect a scum buddy?
No, you can also unvote because you are no longer as sure that that person is scum...

I agree there are other reasons for unvoting, but what has changed so far that makes PMC look less scummy? Nothing. If anything, he is looking more scummy, so I don't see why Karel would unvote.

this is exactly what scum would say
youre trying to pretend that you are now good, but fact is: once a scum, forever a scum. (this applies only for you though... i bet everybody has been scum at some poin )
vote AceArtemis

What is this? Karel unvotes on PMC because he feels he didn't have enough info on him or experience to make a good vote yet he turns around and throws a vote at Ace for what seems like a random reason. Why would he feel uncomfortable having a vote on a somewhat scummy character yet feel fine having a vote on one who has said nothing scummy the whole game?

[Suspect101]

Urg mafia is so frustrating these days, people look at slightly scummy behaviour and go well he must be scum! No scum are more careful than town, learn that.

It is day 1. We have nothing to go on. If you are the person acting scummy, even a little bit, you will get the votes and the questions thrown your way.

You knew they were scum tells, and you did them anyways? Misleading people is not very town like. If you were town why would you do things that you knew were scummy?

They are not major tells, I expected to get a few votes and that would be it, I even said this. I am not misleading townies I am fishing for reaction. Reaction is a great thing and that is what I mean by creating conversation that is useful not putting myself in the spotlight.

Why are you so worried about your votes and being so defensive? At the time this was posted you only had 2 votes. not even close to a lynch. If you go fishing for a reaction, you have to be able to understand that the reaction you might catch is one of scum towards you. You might put yourself in the spotlight.

And number 5, it was A JOKE vote. Hardly a serious OMGUS.

Ofcourse you would claim it as a joke, since you got no bandwagon going. If you did I doubt you would be calling it a joke.

I figured I would get a few votes for it, by SCUM!

unvote vote suspect

This vote is not serious, otherwise I would have said:

"I was acting slightly scummy in order to find scum jumping on the first townie they could find, and suspect clearly fits that. Most people are joking about but suspect is taking this way too seriously showing that he is eager to lynch the first townie he can."

Or something similar, I certainly wouldn't be expecting anyone to jump on a wagon such as what I actually wrote but the above statement may have pulled some votes. I know how to start BW's better than that, and the fact you are pointing to this vote as serious shows desperation.

Desperation? You are at L-7 not L-1 and you are flailing around like you are at L-1. You are trying to pass this off on me taking your "slightly scummy" activites as actual scum tells.... because even if they are slightly scummy, they are still scummy.

Scum Tells aren't 100% look at the context first.

I am.

No you think you are.

Like I said, it is day one. I put my vote and gave my reasons for the person acting the scummiest, to which you have had a majorly bad reaction like you caught a rash. You are at L-7 and are being way to defensive. For all theses reason, my vote stays on you. You may be town, but you certainly do not act like it.

[karelpietertje]

BLABLABLABLABLABLABLA...PMC looks scummy... BLABLABLABLA...karel is acting weird, lets vote on him.... BLABLABLABLABLABLAkarelp seems to be voting for a random reason

hmm it seems like you have a lot of talking going on! and I'm afraid it's working too
you made me change vote because i was too inactive so i thought i'd place a random (i used random.org) vote.

I think you are scum and trying to disquise it by putting all that attention on me (thanks for you attention people ) and making everybody confused.
this is exactly what scumbags will try to do.

You are Sauron, trying to break up the Fellowship.

unvote, vote Mr. S(auron/queer)

the word "queer" is in no way an attempt to offend our gay community

[spiesr]

So, are pmc and Suspect scum buddies having an angry, but ultimately futile, argument on day 1 to distance themselves from each other?

[Clive]

It is day 1. We have nothing to go on. If you are the person acting scummy, even a little bit, you will get the votes and the questions thrown your way.

Not true, just because it's D1 doesn't mean there's nothing to go on. And I really hate your second sentence. D1 is not just about a random lynch. You also seem to imply that only one person can act scummy on D1, which doesn't make any sense.

I find your attempt to generate a wagon on Pmc scummy, I fail to see how speculating on what we might be up against is a scumtell.

Iliad: It didn't sound much like a joke vote, but i'll let it go.

Unvote;
Vote: Suspect

[Thezzaruz]

First off, UnVote. It was never serious anyhow.


Got to say that I'm not seeing the case against karel, he seems to have handled the pressure well to.

So, are pmc and Suspect scum buddies having an angry, but ultimately futile, argument on day 1 to distance themselves from each other?

That could be it tbh, the case against pmc have looked flimsy all along.

[Thezzaruz]

First off, UnVote. It was never serious anyhow.

EBWOP, and I do it again...