[Abandoned] - Dark Age Britain

[Telvannia]

Any progress on the change of name for Cardiff I suggested earlier?

I will get to work on it.

Furthermore, I'd really like to see Northumberland if at all possible. It is an important name from the period, a key area of Dark Age Britain, and one still with us today, and I think the map would benefit from having it written out in full.

I really can see a way of fitting it in without making it far too small.

For starters, I feel as if many elements of the large map are a touch fuzzy-looking. The "Cardiff" territory title is especially blurry, as is much of the text in the legend. And the borders have a general haziness to them, as if my eyes are just out of focus when I look at this.

That will be changed when i change the size of the large down to 700x700

I hate to keep harping on this, but it looks as if two territories in Tenenhair can hit and be hit from outside, Gate and Chapel... is this correct? Perhaps if you flipped the colors so that Gate and the actual walkway were the same? And maybe the trouble is that there's no border between terits within the castles other than color change, and my eyes don't pick up all of the distinctions.

I can make the colour change more obvious by increasing the opacity.

Back to color: picking up the color of a small word against a similar background will always be tricky for a genetically-challenged guy like me. So figuring out the color of the "Pictland" title and matching it to some thin lines is murder. It would solve the problem to lightly run the region name under the territories somehow.

I find it makes maps look really busy, but i will experiment and see what i can come up with.
If this works then i can put Northumberland on the mpa, but will it cause more confusion than it is worth?

Also, does Dorgig hit Cantwane? The water doesn't fully run between the two territories, so I'm not sure but I think it doesn't.

I will make the water more clear.

Anybody else think that this font is a bit hard to read? I'm guessing at the terit names.

I can read it. though i know what it is mean to say, but if more people complain about the font i can change it.

[MrBenn]

I agree that the font is a bit indistinct, and that it makes the names hard to read...

[FreeMan10]

I jumped in at Pg 7 and it took me a good 10 minutes of staring to come to the realization of where the castles are located (I think). At first, I assumed the grey lines in the water attached a castle to a territory, then I realized that a couple weren't attached that way. Then I thought the castle was just in the water, then figured out that wasn't. All in all, somewhat confusing. Are these the tert - castle combos?
Cardiff - Cardiff
E Seaxe - Londonburh
Monoth - Aberdeen
Brega - Tenenhair

I see the color links now, but if I were to just jump into a game with this map, I'd really need BOB to know that for sure.

Also, I'm having a hard time linking the continent colors in the legend to the terts which belong to them. The colors are not distinctive enough, and there doesn't appear to be a logical order to the continent listings.

The font, while very appropriate for this map, is excrutiatingly hard to read.

The water border that runs into Londonburh should continue on the east side and die into the legend, should it not?

Sorry to jump in and sound like a nit-picker, I was just really confused. If these issues have been resolved upthread, then please ignore me.

[Telvannia]

Here is a quick update. I have tried to deal with as many problems.
If there is anything that has been suggested and does not seem to be here tell me, it is probably me missing the post rather than ignoring you.
Apart from:
Oaktown - continents names under the territories
Oaktown - Font, i dont want to change it unless it is imperative to get this map quenched, i think it fits the theme.

I think that is it.

Small:


Large:

[suggs]

This looks absolutely quality.
If i was being a pedant (which i am!) i'd say go for historical accuracy and lessen the amount of provinces in England, maybe even just to the five Old Kingdoms of: Northumberland, Mercia, East Anglia, Wessex and Kent (and possibly Essex, though that's debatable).

Still, the beauty of the Dark Ages is that no one really knows what the political structure of England was, so fair play to you.

You could nick an idea of a board game I once played, and use the old Briton title of "BRETWALDA"- basically, overlord of England. This was the pre cursor to Kingship. In the game maybe you could get a small army bonus if you occupy 2/3 or 4/5 of England.

Anyway, it looks great!
Good luck with the rest of it.

[Guiscard]

Furthermore, I'd really like to see Northumberland if at all possible. It is an important name from the period, a key area of Dark Age Britain, and one still with us today, and I think the map would benefit from having it written out in full.

I really can see a way of fitting it in without making it far too small.

Well thinking about it, the name should really be Northumbria. That should fit. (Don't know why I didn't think of that earlier, actually).

Furthermore, in regards to names, what you have named Scotland would probably more accurately be (the Kingdom of) Strathclyde, ruled from Dumbarton. The term 'Scotland' is a little later than the period the map seems to be depicting (despite the fact that the Scots, who were Irish, were settled in the area at the time). Earliest mention is, I believe, the D manuscript of the Anglo-Saxon chronicle, which is mid 11th Century.

[Balsiefen]

Right. Ever so sorry for not helping you Tel for absolutely ages, I totally forgot we had this going.

This looks absolutely quality.
If i was being a pedant (which i am!) i'd say go for historical accuracy and lessen the amount of provinces in England, maybe even just to the five Old Kingdoms of: Northumberland, Mercia, East Anglia, Wessex and Kent (and possibly Essex, though that's debatable).

Still, the beauty of the Dark Ages is that no one really knows what the political structure of England was, so fair play to you.You could nick an idea of a board game I once played, and use the old Briton title of "BRETWALDA"- basically, overlord of England. This was the pre cursor to Kingship. In the game maybe you could get a small army bonus if you occupy 2/3 or 4/5 of England. Anyway, it looks great!
Good luck with the rest of it.

Most of the structure we actually are nicking from a game. For gameplay reasons i think what we have is pretty good Northumbria, wessex and mercia, being the larger kingdoms are continents and within them we have tried to recreate the sub-counties of each one. The smaller kingdoms of the heptarchy however (Engle and Essex for indtance) have had to have been made into territories and placed into a single continent (As there is little space for them to be anything on their own)

And thats the thing with the dark ages, Its equally hard to be wrong as it is to be right.

Well thinking about it, the name should really be Northumbria. That should fit. (Don't know why I didn't think of that earlier, actually).

The name was origionally Northumbria, but as we have the Legend now, It's pretty hard to fit that in. I was hoping the XML at least would show it as that.

Furthermore, in regards to names, what you have named Scotland would probably more accurately be (the Kingdom of) Strathclyde, ruled from Dumbarton. The term 'Scotland' is a little later than the period the map seems to be depicting (despite the fact that the Scots, who were Irish, were settled in the area at the time). Earliest mention is, I believe, the D manuscript of the Anglo-Saxon chronicle, which is mid 11th Century.

I agree. origionally scotland continent comprised of Sci, Dal ridda reget and Ulster (with only reget actually bellonging to strathclyde). But for gameplay it had to be shifted to its current arrangement. Proberbly best to rename it Strathclyde now.

[Guiscard]

If I really cannot persuade you to cram Northumbria in then at least have the legend read 'Umbria' instead. Northumbria implies a Southumbria, although it isn't mentioned in any sources. 'N. Umbria' and 'Northumbria' in the XML would be a fair compromise, too.

[Balsiefen]

N'thumbria or somthing similar may fit. we'll have to look into that.

And I believe Southumbria was sort of Humberside aria but it wan't a popular name to any but the northumbrians.

Edit: Just noticed, Dornsaete needs to be respelled.

[Guiscard]

N'thumbria or somthing similar may fit. we'll have to look into that.

And I believe Southumbria was sort of Humberside aria but it wan't a popular name to any but the northumbrians.

Yes certainly, as it is essentially 'South of the humber', but never the name of a specific Kingdom.

[AndyDufresne]

Any news on an update? This map was coming along nicely, and I'd like to see it not fall into the Foundry Furnace...at least not without a fight.


--Andy

[Balsiefen]

I have been thinking the same thing these last few days, I'll contact Tel.

[Telvannia]

I was thinking about this map on my way home from school today.

I will see how much spare time i have to get some more done on this, but the XML was the really the thing that really needs doing and im not doing anything on that, i cant code anything, have not got the patience, to create it either.
I have a 5 day weekend this weekend, so i will try to get as much as possible done on the graphics then, if not before then.

I really need to have a word from oaktown on the colourblindness problem. Apart from that i think i know what needs changing.

[Balsiefen]

Right, I'm now in charge of XML, I have a four day weekend coming up as well.

[Telvannia]

small update, i have changed a few continent names, tried adding a continent label on the map, currently ive only done wessex, but i would like thoughts before i go on a spread it round the rest of the continents.

[gimil]

tel, where have you been?

[Telvannia]

Busy with school for far too long luckily i just had a 5 day weekend so managed to fit some map making in at last

Repost for new post:

[Balsiefen]

Nice Tel, Very nice.

Castles are definatly clear now and the new names work as well.

I definatly like the name on wessex, adds a nice feel to the map.

I wont do the XML just yet in case there's any more changes.

Sorry to be pedantic but i've been scouring the map and I've found two more territs i think are possibly slightly misspelled. Beonice should be Beornice, Cantwane should change to Cantware

Oh yes, little help, how is XML with handling stuff with Accents and symbols (Eg: É, Æ, æ)

[gimil]

From a graphic stand point I dont think you need army circles. There is no presence of any colors that will cause confusion. Also the solid color you used with in castles doesnt suit a solid color, sone kind of texture to fit with the map should be considered.

[Balsiefen]

Textures for the catle ares may be an idea, but it would have to be carefully done to make it work. As for army circles, i agree most territs dont need them, but some territs which contain more cramped arias which go over boarders like Cyll, Cerniu, Lindissi and Dornon do. (they will also be needed if the name underlay idea is put in place)

[Telvannia]

I have taken off the army circles, and was playing around and tried removing the glow on the territory names, what do people think of a less glowing map, personally i think it looks a lot less cramped and more map like...

[Balsiefen]

Looking at it, no army circles seem to be a definate improvement.

I'm yet to be decided on names, try fiddling with the transparency a little (nothing too major) it may make them look more like part of the map.

One problem is that Dornon now can't be seen, but you could always move it over sea.

[InkL0sed]

This map looks interesting, I like it.

I do prefer it without the territory names glowing, but it's not quite right without them either. Maybe you should make the glow very subtly. Or you could do Balsiefen's suggestion, I'm not sure which would be better.

[cairnswk]

I have taken off the army circles, and was playing around and tried removing the glow on the territory names, what do people think of a less glowing map, personally i think it looks a lot less cramped and more map like...

Agreed. It's a good look from me Telvannia

[Telvannia]

Reduced Glow:


Reduced Text:



Which do people prefer.