[Abandoned] - The Powell Expeditions

[Industrial Helix]

Cool. i like the additions as it gives the map more flavor.

Though I'm not sure which way the river flows. EDIT: I see it now in the rules. My fault. You could use a compass on this map though to clearly identify which way is south and north, ect. It might be the first time a compass on a map actually had gameplay significance

And some of the landmarks have indication of what exactly the landmark looks like, such as Tse Bit'a'i, I'd like to see that on all the landmarks.

For areas where you need a donkey to get down the cliffs, I think the borders could be more clear. This current system shows that one can go from Red Desert to Lodore canyon, but the actual border looks like any other border. I'd like to see the red stop at the ridgeline, as it does with Island in the Sky or Rio Blanco. Can Green River City go down to Flaming Gorge? I think the impassables of the canyon could use clarification.

I'd also liek to see the supply routes be a little bigger. I can make out blocks, but am unsure what they are.

Keep it up! It won't be long before this map goes to gameplay. Its beautiful already, graphics should only be a tweak. I'm starting to like how it really says "this is a hot place in the desert" with the overly warm colors. Again, very nice. This map should be a winner!

[WestWind]

Thanks! And good suggestions- I'll work on implementing those next. As for the landmarks, I was planning on it for at least 2 others- the La Sal Mountains and Mogollon Rim. Island in the Sky is already kind of a landmark, but I'll see if I can make it stand out a little more I think I'll also start playing around with giving the legend more of a petroglyph feel, unless some pressing gameplay issue is brought up. Not sure how I'll do it, but I'll look at some art and see what happens.

[Industrial Helix]

Island in the Sky looks pretty good as it is. I see the image and make the connection with the name. It's say it stands out nicely already.

[WestWind]

Just a quick note that I'm still working on this. Some emergency-type stuff came up in the past couple weeks, but that's mostly gone so I can get back to updating. Other than the graphical suggestions, any more gameplay thoughts?

[WestWind]

Alright, finally have a new version out

Click image to enlarge.

Changes:
-Took IndustrialHelix's suggestions to simplify the borders a bit.
-Redid the supply point picture. It's supposed to be a barrel and a sack. If it doesn't look like that or you don't think it really fits, let me know.
-Changed the mule to a petroglyph creature. I thought it fit the style a little more
-Made the canoe image a little bit more sophisticated. I'm still not happy with it, but it's better.

Thoughts?

[natty dread]

Hm. The paper fold looks a bit odd next to the 3d canyons...

[WestWind]

Hm, the texture's big enough that I can easily move that around or rotate it if I want. I'll try and make it less parallel with the canyon.

[natty dread]

I meant it would be better without the paper fold.

[WestWind]

Alright, I can just recenter the texture so the fold's not visible. I also might look around for a texture that doesn't have quite so prominent folds...

[grifftron]

I dunno... i kinda like the feel the map gets with that fold in there...

-griff

[natty dread]

But it doesn't really fit with the 3d-shading of the canyons. It makes a weird thematic inconsistency: are we looking at a landscape from above or a map drawn on paper?

[Industrial Helix]

But it doesn't really fit with the 3d-shading of the canyons. It makes a weird thematic inconsistency: are we looking at a landscape from above or a map drawn on paper?

Thematic inconsistency? Are all maps drawn as if viewed from above, even maps depicting elevation?

If you can make the graphics bump in where the paper fold is then I think you should keep the fold in.

[TaCktiX]

You're started in the right direction, and we're sure you'll do just fine in the Gameplay Workshop. Go get 'em.

[WestWind]

Awesome, thanks to all so far who have helped me get here!

Anyways, there will be an update coming for this fairly soon. I'm just finishing up a rather busy set of weekends, so I'll have more time to devote to rolling out updates very soon

[The Bison King]

This looks different. Very cool, and unique. I'd
like to play this for sure

[WestWind]

Click image to enlarge.

Alrighty, new version with a few changes:
-Changed the paper texture to something more homogeneous. Like, dislike?
-Rearranged the Landmarks a little bit to give some more emphasis to the north.
-Added a small new bonus- Heritage. I figure I have a few well-known "ruins"in the map, so I thought I could tie them together with a bonus. If anyone has any more creative ideas than a typical bonus let me know

That's it for now. Thoughts on which direction you'd like to see this develop? I'm not about to believe that it needs no changes... :p

[MarshalNey]

I'm ambivalent about the loss of the paper fold- on the one hand, it looked really good, on the other hand the comment about the map texture disagreeing with a 2D 'paper map' idea was probably valid.

Anyway, I don't like the 'broken canoe' icons. They're way too hard to see and I wouldn't know what they were supposed to be without being told.

I'd like to see a compass rose underneath the instruction about the river attack direction, with something to highlight on the compass the South-by-Southwest direction. Also, that instruction could probably stand to be larger or clearer (it blends a bit too much with the background), since it's pretty important.

I like the Heritage bonus and the icon for it.

Map looks great, can't wait to play it.

[WestWind]

Alright, I'll go back to the other background in the next version, but I'll probably need help once this gets to graphics in making the map conform to the folds. I'm still kinda new at making graphics, and all I have is Elements 5.

The change to the canoe I can do. I'll work on making a better image for that. Also, the compass rose shouldn't be too difficult, and would really clear things up, so I'll prioritize that. Thanks for the comments!

[MrBenn]

I haven't scrutinised the map very closely, but this looks pretty good!

Before doing too much work on the graphics, I'd shrink the map down a bit, to make sure everything remains legible on the small map (max 630 x 600px) - the text is verging on the small size for me already, and we just need to make sure everything will fit on there.

You're going to need to be really careful about using the rivers as impassables in addition to bonus region indicators (I'm assuming that's what the blue boxes on the legend are referrring to?)... although on second thoughts, it might just be that those boxes don't correlate to the actual colours on the map... I think what I'm trying to say, is to keep things as simple as possible

The other thing I am going to suggest, is to bring all the instruction text that you've spread around the map into the same general area; You've got plenty of room in that legend space to fit everything in - it just adds confusion when important instructions are all over the place.

I'm interested to see how this develops - there's the potential for a good map here

[Industrial Helix]

I dunno if you can squeeze in all that text into the same area... but certainly squeeze the stuff on the right hand side in with the left hand side stuff.

I don't totally understand what the heritage stuff is... perhaps you could fit a little explanation either on the territory or in the legend. You do a very nice job of telling story and information with pictures, perhaps you could change up the heritage icons a bit?

In places like cataract canyon, perhaps you could draw in a waterfall?

And looking at this map I'm starting to wonder what the scale is... perhaps something like a 1 inch = x miles might help to understand the scale of the Powell expeditions.

Tusayon to Little Colorado Canyon... doesn't one need a goat to get down there?

[WestWind]

Alright, I can condense things quite a bit I think...should give more room for fun stuff

I'll do a quick downsize on the next version and post it along with the large version. That should give us a quick indication of if the text size will work or not.

I think the main confusion with the colors comes from the change of background- it kinda threw off the original colors for the bonus regions- I'll see about fixing that

Heritage sites are basically Native American ruins- I'm planning on making some small illustrations for those, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

Maybe have a waterfall as the hazard symbol? It'd be more clear than a broken canoe, I think.

Thanks for pointing out the Tusayan-Little Colorado issue. I think the original donkey got lost in the conversion to the goat...

I think some sort of scale would be great...I'll try and think of a creative way of putting it in there.

Thanks for all the suggestions! New version coming once I catch a break in the next week or so

[isaiah40]

This is really started to look really good. Just one nitpick right now, You have an icon for the 71-72 expedition but I don't see one for the 69 expedition. Am I missing it? Or is the expedition actually on the rivers? I think this needs to be clarified, as for the rest of it, it is clear and understandable to me.

[ender516]

The Resupply icon needs a little work. The straight sides of the barrel make it look too much like a modern garbage can, and the sack tied at the top only reinforces the picture of a curbside pickup. Make the barrel bulge, add straps around it, and make a pile of sacks of flour (not tied at the top, but rectangular), or if the sacks don't work, try a wooden crate. Of course, this sort of thing can wait for the Graphics Workshop.

[WestWind]

Isaiah: The 69 (lol) expedition is listed under as a region bonus- it's basically all of the maroon. Is that still unclear? If so, I can try and come up with another way of doing it.

Ender: First off, didn't anyone tell you it's GARBAGE DAY in the southwest!?

Second, thanks for the suggestions. They do look pretty bad, and I'll try and fix them up

[isaiah40]

Isaiah: The 69 (lol) expedition is listed under as a region bonus- it's basically all of the maroon. Is that still unclear? If so, I can try and come up with another way of doing it.

Yes I see it now. Although it could use a little more clarifying as the colors in the bonus and the map do not seem to match.