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[GP/UI] 2-player "team" games (Polymorphic)

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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Timminz on Wed Feb 17, 2010 4:54 pm

Snowgun wrote:
Timminz wrote:One player vs. a full team is not part of this suggestion, nor do I think it should be.


Why not? it would be easy to implement if you run this code, and it would be awesome. How about quad games with each team having 2 players? Also awesome.

If you are gonna make a change like this you might as well complete the options.


As usual, I can only speak for myself, but 1v1 team games are exactly what I think should be implemented. I have little, to no interest in the other variants. Also, the other variations make for a much more complicated suggestion. For the sake of being more likely to actually get this thing implemented, I believe this suggestion should remain as is (only asking for 1v1 teams).

If this suggestion is implemented in the future, I believe that would be the time to make suggestions about expanding upon the idea. Until then, any discussion about anything above and beyond the basic suggestion is just going to add complexity, and reduce likelihood of implementation.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Snowgun on Wed Feb 17, 2010 5:01 pm

Good point timminz. too bad people are short sighted though....
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby prismsaber on Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:21 pm

1v1 team games as an option is the only thing I can think of that would make me consider buying premium again.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Nephilim on Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:59 pm

khazalid wrote:disagree cheph - i think it would completely take over in all areas. the effect on clans in particular would be catastrophic. what would be the point of having a partner other than yourself? i don't buy into the 2 heads are better than one thing very much. the best teams are those that play the game the same way. amongst the upper echelons in particular the effect would be extremely pronounced.

this option negates so much of the camaraderie and fun left in CC for me.

it would be interesting, don't get me wrong. i'd like to see how everyone is standing on one pair of feet and all that, but the price to pay is far too heavy for the community of this website. i hope (and suspect) that it will never be implemented.


this is khaz's philosophy on love/sex as well :twisted:

anywho, i've always love this idea, but i would go with what others have suggested: keep it to just doubles games (maybe triples). it is the only way to really have a 1v1 challenge.....
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby AAFitz on Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:16 pm

This would be a great 1v1 option... it would go far to rid the game of the luck factor, especially on bigger games... way more decisions=more strategy=less luck.

It will also help train other players how to play team games, without them having to know people on the site to do so.

Freestyle would be fun, but clearly this is a sequential option only
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby BoganGod on Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:51 pm

Great idea, simple to implement. Removes the first turn advantage, and lucky drops(have had opponents drop europe on classic, and go first... grrrrr) that plagues 1vs1. Please send me a link when you start a poll on this ahunda, I'll vote and get a few of the clan to do so as well. Cheers for the heads up on this :)
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Hopscotcher on Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:29 am

the.killing.44 wrote:Hopscotcher. I'll just say that you're really off the mark as to why this should be implemented. You seem to think people can't find good partners to play with. Obviously this isn't the problem—nay, there isn't a problem. That is the whole point.


Then what is the point of this? IF 1 v 1 is so important, why don't people simply get better at 1 v 1????? Sure, a lot of times it is a crap shoot, but my 1 v 1 percentage is rather fearsome because I spent a lot of time practicing. There are other much simpler ways to negotiate the luck factor. I.e. best of 3, 5, or 7.

I suck at multiplayer Escalating games, but I'm good in other areas. I am improving in general, but this has got to be the biggest load of codswallop I have ever seen.

My general OBJECTION is that we will see this in Clan Wars and CLA where I think it has no part. Clan and team warfare should be a collaborative event.

I just do not understand why people do not work to improve their 1 v 1 skills instead. This is an excuse for high end players to make all their moves instead of having to check into team games and tell each other what to do.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby chephren on Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:07 am

Thank you Timminz for replying to Hopscotch ...I deliberately didn't reply earlier as he hasn't read a single word I've written and is getting his knickers in a twist about nothing. You stayed a lot calmer than I would have done. To suggest that the players in favour of this are only in favour because they can't find decent team mates is just ridiculous and disrespectful. Look at my games (and Ahunda's games) and see the quality of team mates we attract, Hopscotcher, before you labour this way-off-the-mark point, yet again.

Just to re-iterate: 1v1 option - great idea. Can one player join 3 spots in a game where Team 1 is 3 different players? NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT.
It's only an option where both Team 1 and Team 2 are 1 player and could be used only as a 1v1 option in clan wars where both clans agree ( eventually every clan would agree to this, if they're interested in reducing the luck element of 1v1s). Repeat - it cannot be used as a Dubs,Trips or Quads game.

I really don't see the problem with giving people options. Don't like? Don't play. Just like me with Freestyle...I think that's a stupid format...so I don't play it.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby L M S on Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:18 am

*what I read*
"It's too hard for us to farm 1v1 cause the luck of the drop and first turn gets in the way, we need an easier way to keep our points up."

Sigh, yet another suggestion to make farming easier. Do we really need to make it easier than it already is?

just vote no. that's easy.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Hopscotcher on Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:24 am

chephren wrote:Thank you Timminz for replying to Hopscotch ...I deliberately didn't reply earlier as he hasn't read a single word I've written and is getting his knickers in a twist about nothing. You stayed a lot calmer than I would have done. To suggest that the players in favour of this are only in favour because they can't find decent team mates is just ridiculous and disrespectful. Look at my games (and Ahunda's games) and see the quality of team mates we attract, Hopscotcher, before you labour this way-off-the-mark point, yet again.

Just to re-iterate: 1v1 option - great idea. Can one player join 3 spots in a game where Team 1 is 3 different players? NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT. It's only an option where both Team 1 and Team 2 are 1 player.

I really don't see the problem with giving people options.


I am not suggesting you can't find decent team mates. I am simply stating what should be obvious: This is a bad bad bad bad bad idea. This is only going to serve to divide an already divided community even farther. No longer, do you have to search for team mates!!!!!!!! Come on, be your own friend!!!!!!!!

Hell make your own clan and play every single turn of every single game!!!!!!!!!! why not???????????

As far as your quality of team mates, I'm not going to look. I trust that you have a decent crew. I just don't understand why people want this option unless it is to farm people even more with Freestyle "team" games.

The Problem is not giving the Option.

The Problem is using this as any basis for any kind of skill.

I can tell I'm in the minority here. I don't have a hat or a star next to my name. I don't belong to IA or THOTA or whoever. But I know that this reeks of elitism.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby chephren on Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:59 am

I feel like I'm banging my head against a wall here, hopscotch

It doesn't REPLACE team games...

I can only speak from a personal point of view. For the record, I've never played a Freestyle game in my life...and I never play 1v1 games ....drop/first turn are king.

I've had clan mates play 1v1's, get 2nd turn in every game and lose 0-5. Nothing they could have done to stop it. That's not my idea of fun at all. To me it's a crapshoot....no "basis for skill" as you would put it....yet you seem to like playing standard 1v1's ( I'm not criticising that, it's up to you, but don't downgrade another potential format when you yourself play so many crapshoot games involving the least skill element of any format on CC)

I'm saying - with this option of 2 or 3 places open in a game - eg ahunda, ahunda, ahunda v cheph/cheph/cheph .. I would probably play it, because first turn especially becomes less important and bad drops can be overcome with skill and decent dice. It would be a fun format.

I've never farmed and I never will. Yes, it may be abused by some people on here but they always end up abusing whatever new rule/format that comes into play anyway....farmers will always find a way to farm.

The point is - it would NEVER stop me from playing chephren/lubawski/chuuuuck v ahunda and 2 of his mates or any other team game.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby brian fletcher on Thu Feb 18, 2010 5:25 am

I havent read all the posts on this, but i wouldnt be entirely against the idea, for a variety or reasons.

1. Would help eliminate the 1v1 games in the TLO tournament as could play 1v1 dubs trips or quads.
2. Adds another element to a players skills.
3. Would encourage freemiums to join CC as one 1v1 quads would take all their slots.

One negative i can foresee would be deadbeats could miss 2 turns on all 4 turns in quads meaning an 8 day stall. Unless it could be implemeted that 3 turns missed overall would count as a loss.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby jammyjames on Thu Feb 18, 2010 6:33 am

that is an incredible idea, im definately up for that. nice sugg ahunda :P
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby AAFitz on Thu Feb 18, 2010 7:18 am

Hopscotcher wrote:
chephren wrote:Thank you Timminz for replying to Hopscotch ...I deliberately didn't reply earlier as he hasn't read a single word I've written and is getting his knickers in a twist about nothing. You stayed a lot calmer than I would have done. To suggest that the players in favour of this are only in favour because they can't find decent team mates is just ridiculous and disrespectful. Look at my games (and Ahunda's games) and see the quality of team mates we attract, Hopscotcher, before you labour this way-off-the-mark point, yet again.

Just to re-iterate: 1v1 option - great idea. Can one player join 3 spots in a game where Team 1 is 3 different players? NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT. It's only an option where both Team 1 and Team 2 are 1 player.

I really don't see the problem with giving people options.


I am not suggesting you can't find decent team mates. I am simply stating what should be obvious: This is a bad bad bad bad bad idea. This is only going to serve to divide an already divided community even farther. No longer, do you have to search for team mates!!!!!!!! Come on, be your own friend!!!!!!!!

Hell make your own clan and play every single turn of every single game!!!!!!!!!! why not???????????

As far as your quality of team mates, I'm not going to look. I trust that you have a decent crew. I just don't understand why people want this option unless it is to farm people even more with Freestyle "team" games.

The Problem is not giving the Option.

The Problem is using this as any basis for any kind of skill.

I can tell I'm in the minority here. I don't have a hat or a star next to my name. I don't belong to IA or THOTA or whoever. But I know that this reeks of elitism.



Well, maybe it even does reek of elitism...but mentioning clans in a suggestion reeks of jealousy, and shortsightedness.

The actual reason many good team players like this idea, and the reason you seem to not be able to grasp why it is so wanted, is because it will be a great way to test team playing skills against another player's team playing skills directly. It does remove the team aspect, which is very important to team play, but it still includes the dynamics of game play in team games, which means those without partners can practice in them, learn them, and get better at them. It also allows newer players, or freemiums who might not know as many people, and might not want to spend the time it takes in a quads game, the opportunity to play one, without the burden of having 3 deadbeats as partners. It will also make the games go much faster, only having to wait for one player as opposed to 7 to play.

It also reduces the luck factor in a normal 1v1 game greatly, because instead of going first and having a massive drop bonus and first attack priveledges, the drop is much smaller, which results in a more even first turn, ie, a better game. Not always, but more often without a doubt.

Now, if you dont understand the game well enough to see these opportunities at first glance, thats fine...but dont go complaining about elitism, or conspiracy theories...call Jesse Ventura instead. Or, maybe just think about it with a less closed mind.

You also seem to miss the very important fact that if you are in THOTA or IA, you dont need this option. I myself can send out a few pms and have a top team in a heartbeat, but not all are so fortunate. Some have to rely on public games, and have to hope they get a good teammate. This is who the option will really benefit, and that fact couldnt be more obvious really, with even a moments thought. This suggestion is actually better for players NOT in top clans or clans of any type. It means they can go up against a top team member, and not pay a penalty for simply not having their own team. It actually reduces the advantage of top clans, because the reason top clans are so successful is because they have so many players that are successful. Again, its obvious, with a moments thought.

That being said, it will be theoretically possible to farm on these settings, and no doubt it will happen, but at the same time, the reason it is farmable is the same reason its a great idea. The least farmable maps are those that are luck based...ie: a coin toss. The most happen to be the most skilled games. Now, arguing that you should not allow an option because it requires a lot of skill is just a silly thing to do, when we simply crave new ways and new opportunities to use skill in the game.
Though you may be happy with the little heads tails games, some crave some new competition, and not all are as popular as you with great teammates to draw on whenever they need a team game.

It would have to be only a 1v1 option though, because without it, it really would be the biggest farming field ever sewn on CC I think. But it would be more fun without a doubt to play all four guys against 4 other players...unfortunately though, the abuse potential is so great, I cant imagine how it would ever work, unless of course players like you worried less about farming, and more about how to make the game fun. :D
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby comic boy on Thu Feb 18, 2010 7:50 am

Like many others I avoid normal 1 v 1 games because of the overwhelming luck factor , this idea looks good to me.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby thebest712 on Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:35 am

looks great for me, then the team medailles are easyer to get :p
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby ahunda on Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:45 am

For what it´s worth: Poll added.

Spread the word ... O:)
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Big Whiskey on Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:57 am

I am all for this.I don't know if this has been mentioned or not but I think it would stop some players from creating 2 accounts.Sometimes a player creates 2 accounts to play only in team games.Having this new option would stop that imo.Also,it should be made that you can't join any "team games."What I mean exactly is,say if a cadet and a cook created a doubles game.One player should not be allowed to join that game being able to control both moves.The new A+A player against the B+B player should be in it's own setting.Let the players that want to play team games keep doing so.And let the players that want this new setting,play against the players that want it also.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby AAFitz on Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:59 am

khazalid wrote:disagree cheph - i think it would completely take over in all areas. the effect on clans in particular would be catastrophic. what would be the point of having a partner other than yourself? i don't buy into the 2 heads are better than one thing very much. the best teams are those that play the game the same way. amongst the upper echelons in particular the effect would be extremely pronounced.

this option negates so much of the camaraderie and fun left in CC for me.

it would be interesting, don't get me wrong. i'd like to see how everyone is standing on one pair of feet and all that, but the price to pay is far too heavy for the community of this website. i hope (and suspect) that it will never be implemented.


you would be right that it would ruin team games if one person could play against a team...but the team games would remain...this would just be in addition to them as 1v1 games.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Mr Changsha on Thu Feb 18, 2010 9:40 am

As a sequential player I really don't bother with 1vs 1 due to the luck factor. I think (and have thought for a long time) that this option would open up a new game style for many sequential players. Would it be a preferred style for many current dubs, trips and quads players? For some probably yes...those that 'run' teams may prefer quads 1vs 1, but then I suspect that some of those that run teams specifically enjoy the team format due to the opportunity to lead. I doubt therefore they would seriously consider switching over long-term.

A second factor in support of this idea is that I am quite positive there are a significant number of players who would like to play team games but can't (for whatever reason) find 'decent' players to play with. You see them joining random teams all the time and then naturally getting smashed by established teams. These types of players would benefit from the style as well.

Personally, I'd probably play it a bit but not all that much... but then I prefer standard games overall. Many though would see this as an improvement to the site and it should be considered on that basis.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Hatchman on Thu Feb 18, 2010 9:46 am

Would be great to see this come into effect. Good idea Ahunda.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby prismsaber on Thu Feb 18, 2010 9:58 am

For those who think this would encourage farming or otherwise unfair play...you are wrong. If one is going for points it's more beneficial to team up with some lower ranks rather than do the "1v1 team game." All this new game option would be for is bragging rights and clan play, but definitely not points.
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby Bruceswar on Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:12 am

prismsaber wrote:For those who think this would encourage farming or otherwise unfair play...you are wrong. If one is going for points it's more beneficial to team up with some lower ranks rather than do the "1v1 team game." All this new game option would be for is bragging rights and clan play, but definitely not points.



Bingo! Now get premium when this comes out and I will kick your ass real quick ;)
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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby yeti_c on Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:19 am

Suggested before - would be great... no chance it'll get done in the next decade.

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Re: 1v1 Team Games

Postby oVo on Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:46 am

Hopscotcher wrote:If you can't find team mates that support each other and know how to work together well, Retool your clan or find better mates.

This concept creates a new 1v1 option and is not replacing the "team games" format.
I think it would level the playing field and make some very competitive 1v1 games
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