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BattleShip [V2.0]

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BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby DJENRE on Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:33 pm

BATTLESHIP

Gameplay/Main idea by DJENRE
XML by zimmah


216 territories in total
  • 12 Commanders = 12 starting points
  • 204 start Neutrals
    • 122 Seas (decay 1 or 2 per round)
    • 48 boat portions (are part of bonuses)
    • 15 red 'pins'
    • 15 blue 'pins'
    • 4 are 'pins tray'
Starting points (SP):
  • 2 players => 4 SP each + 4 remain neutrals
  • 3 players => 3 SP each + remain 3 neutrals
  • 4 players => 2 SP each + remain 4 neutrals
  • 5 players => 2 SP each + remain 2 neutrals
  • 6 players => 2 SP each
  • 7 to 11 players => 1 SP each + the SP left are neutrals
  • 12 players => 1 SP each


GAMEPLAY
e.g. given for 12 player game and a blue commander as your starting point.

From your blue commander you can attack any blue sea territ. The red pins are like impassable with a blue commander.
From seas you can jump to any boat. All regions are 4 ways attack now instead 8 directions on V1(unless there is a pin)!
    Gunboat = +2 bonus / bow can bombard opposite Gunboat's bow when you hold the entire bonus.
    Submarine = +2 bonus / bow can bombard opposite submarine's bow when you hold the entire bonus.
    Vessel = +3 bonus
    Cruiser = +4 bonus
    Destroyer = +5 bonus
    Aircraft Carrier = +8 bonus
The only way to conquer pins trays is owning the COMMAND CENTER on the Aircraft Carrier + any other COMMAND CENTER (Vessel, Cruiser or Destroyer).
COMMAND CENTER are a single region into some boats in green.
The Pins trays RESET NEUTRAL!
The same color (blue pintray in this example) pintray allow you to bombard other blue commanders.
The opposite color pintray (the red pintray in this example) allow you to jump on the other side by attacking any red sea on the J Line (J1 to J10) .
Once on the other side, you can attack and try to reach the opposite command center, then you take the red pintray to be able to bombard all red commanders left.
Also to be sure you are safe once you reach the other side, you have to reach quickly any blue pins. You can attack blue pins because you hold a blue commander.
Once there, and because red cannot attack a blue spin, you're safe and you have an entry.
There will be no need to attack the pintray anymore from your side (wich reset neutral).

V2.0 The rules and bonus are not written yet on the board, it's about gameplay for now.

Image

Image


show: MAP V1


If you found this, please take time to comment the map too. Thanks, DJ 8-)
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Last edited by DJENRE on Sat Dec 23, 2017 6:38 am, edited 8 times in total.
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DJENRE on Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:34 pm

CROWD FUNDING :

Those territories can be named :
    GunBoat = 100 Cr
    Vessels = 200 Cr
    Destroyer = 300 Cr
    Submarine = 400 Cr
    USS = 600 Cr
    Commanders = 900 Cr

(one territ is already reserved for me + 1 for XML)
Last edited by DJENRE on Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DJENRE on Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:34 pm

Reserved for other stuff :
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DoomYoshi on Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:39 pm

Having a ton of decay seas that don't provide a bonus seems superfluous. Is there any reason to ever attack A1?

This concept might work better if the grid was shrunk to 10x10 and had more features, or if there was a connect-4 type of bonus inherent in the maps. This second option could work by effectively treating the territories you own as the ships rather than the ships being a static map feature.

The thing that makes Arms Race great is that there are clearly 2 strategies - you can focus on one side, or try to work on both sides. It would be great if there was a smattering of starting territories on the board to not lose that brilliance of Arms Race.

Also, asymmetry in the board will be tougher to "balance" but probably make it more fun.
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DJENRE on Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:00 pm

Hello DoomYoshi and thank you for this quick first comment.

DoomYoshi wrote:Having a ton of decay seas that don't provide a bonus seems superfluous. Is there any reason to ever attack A1?
This concept might work better if the grid was shrunk to 10x10 and had more features, or if there was a connect-4 type of bonus inherent in the maps.

Did you see that you can attack ANY A = A1 to A13 actually.
That's why there are 13 "lines" where players can advance into the seas.
With 13 "lines", it gives all player the opportunity to have their "own line" with a neutral "line" beetween all of them.

EDIT : The connect 4 bonus is a good idea, but maybe a connect 4 square should apply here.... Why not!

An additionnal idea for this map was to 'add' another bonus :
    Add some 'Sailors' on some sea territs (symbol = sailor hat). If you save 3 sailors (from sinking), you have +3 bonus then +1 for any additionnal sailor.
    Those sailors will be easy to take to another player because with the decay 1, most of them will only have 1 troop left.
    But it's far away from the original game and I'm not 100% for it!

The thing that makes Arms Race great is that there are clearly 2 strategies - you can focus on one side, or try to work on both sides. It would be great if there was a smattering of starting territories on the board to not lose that brilliance of Arms Race.

Should be a 'kind of' too.
It almost depend of your initial drop, you can focus on one side or try to take both. But you know if you're eliminated from one side, you'll need to conquer most of your side to be able to conquer the other side. And win the game!
But if one player conquer one side and another the other side, more or less at the same round, there will be a huge opposition on K + L lines!!!

Another idea could be :
I cancel all Starting points
I put some more boats (smallest ones), and starting positions are into the sea (only A+B+C lines) , with the decay 1, you have to take position on boats really quickly.
It's a really different gameplay!


Also, asymmetry in the board will be tougher to "balance" but probably make it more fun.

I know, but I wanted to keep the 'spirit' from the original game...


I put a vote on top!
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby HitRed on Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:17 pm

I like the idea. We all know and love Battleship. :D This map is impressive and impressively large. Can there be an attack pattern like in KNIGHTS? Like, 4 up and 1 over? It would be more fitting of navel fire to look more random than straight lines. Consider captains/admirals to attack into the map at any non-ship location would increase the fun. Giving players freedom should make them happy.

:idea: Naval mines scattered around the ships could cost a player a troop like in USApocalypse. Take the carrier...avoid the mines!

If the ships were closer together then you wouldn't need many naval mines. It might also reduce the size of the map some and increase the enjoyment.

The carrier shape confused me.
vertical
OO or 00
OO or 00
OO or 000
OO or 000
OO or 000

Keep going, this is a great beginning! :D

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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DJENRE on Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:30 am

HitRed wrote:I like the idea. We all know and love Battleship. :D This map is impressive and impressively large. Can there be an attack pattern like in KNIGHTS? Like, 4 up and 1 over? It would be more fitting of navel fire to look more random than straight lines. Consider captains/admirals to attack into the map at any non-ship location would increase the fun. Giving players freedom should make them happy.

But if they're able to attack anywhere they want, it will be easier to take the USS and sub (which are keys to take the side and reach the other side because they can bombard and attack 2 or 3 lines away).
The commanders must take one of the first boat (gunboat or vessel or carrier) then advance to the submarine and/or USS to win the side!


:idea: Naval mines scattered around the ships could cost a player a troop like in USApocalypse. Take the carrier...avoid the mines!

Seas are already decay 1 so maybe it's enough no?

If the ships were closer together then you wouldn't need many naval mines. It might also reduce the size of the map some and increase the enjoyment.

The carrier shape confused me.
vertical
OO or 00
OO or 00
OO or 000
OO or 000
OO or 000

I gonna try to make more design for the boats but I want to keep the original game 'design ' too
What do you mean with the OO or oo?


Keep going, this is a great beginning! :D

Thank you mate

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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DJENRE on Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:41 pm

This is the 10x10 new board.
Do you think I should go for it?
As you can see the submarine became also bigger. The bonus will change too.

Sorry for the design, it's only to show a new size!

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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby HitRed on Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:46 pm

The 10 X 10 size is much more friendly/playable. :)

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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby Thorthoth on Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:06 pm

HitRed wrote:The 10 X 10 size is much more friendly/playable. :)

HitRed

Actually, maps that players can actually play are ''much more friendly/playable''.

Let's get all of these maps out of the foundry and into actual play.
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby riskllama on Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:30 pm

Thorthoth wrote:
HitRed wrote:The 10 X 10 size is much more friendly/playable. :)

HitRed

Actually, maps that players can actually play are ''much more friendly/playable''.

Let's get all of these maps out of the foundry and into actual play.

:?
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DoomYoshi on Wed Nov 15, 2017 7:26 am

This map is going to play a lot like Baseball now that I understand the legend properly. DJENRE, I see you haven't played that map in a few years; you should play it so you can understand how the opening turns usually play out. I foresee the same thing happening in this game. Rather than everyone taking their own row, they will just follow each other through the same row. I'm not saying it's exact, but the opening probably is. The biggest difference is that while baseball has several almost-equal bonuses, this map has few inequal bonuses. So the paths will be even more optimized.
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby HitRed on Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:05 am

The joy of Battleship for me was choosing any spot on the map. Every small kid could make big decisions. B7!...Hit! Good memories!

I would look again at the Knights style movement and launching into any non-ship territory. The fun factor is HUGE.
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DJENRE on Sat Nov 18, 2017 11:17 am

HitRed wrote:The 10 X 10 size is much more friendly/playable. :)

Yes, I think the same.

Thorthoth wrote:Let's get all of these maps out of the foundry and into actual play.

Thank you for the support, even if I think that making a good map is a long process before being playable.
I need comments to think about how to make it funnier for all. Before making it playable. ;)
I don't pretend to make a good map on V1.

DoomYoshi wrote:This map is going to play a lot like Baseball now that I understand the legend properly. DJENRE, I see you haven't played that map in a few years; you should play it so you can understand how the opening turns usually play out. I foresee the same thing happening in this game. Rather than everyone taking their own row, they will just follow each other through the same row. I'm not saying it's exact, but the opening probably is. The biggest difference is that while baseball has several almost-equal bonuses, this map has few inequal bonuses. So the paths will be even more optimized.


Actually I didn't play baseball myself but I've sitted some players who played it so I played it recently. ;)
In Baseball, all starting points can attack only the BATTER who reset neutrals.
Here there are many points to attack and it's decay, not reset. And also they're grouped with 6 commanders only.

But I understand your worries. Maybe for a few rounds, all will attack a single points to make spoils.
But there are both gunboat and vessels quickly reachable. I'm not sure all will aim the same.
Also , there are 2 sides, you have to think about same colored commanders, but also the commanders on the other side.

About ammount of bonuses, that can be changed easily, we'll think about it when it will be the matter. It was only examples.

HitRed wrote:The joy of Battleship for me was choosing any spot on the map. Every small kid could make big decisions. B7!...Hit! Good memories!

I would look again at the Knights style movement and launching into any non-ship territory. The fun factor is HUGE.

I see, I'm not for the knight movements (even if I really like it in "knights" map), because it's not something we see in the regular battle ship game.
And yes it seems that you and Doom think almost the same = attack any points into sea square from any commanders.


@ ALL
I wait for more comments, maybe Iancanton will have a few minutes to read and give his vision of this map.
I gonna think about it on my side too.
In the event we go for it (commanders can attack all sea squares) :
    Do we keep two groups of 6?
    How do you jump from one side to another?
    And what is/are the winning condition(s)?
    How do you kill or conquer commanders?
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DoomYoshi on Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:01 pm

Two groups of six is a keeper.

It should be bombard only for jumping.

No Winning Condition.

Killing or Conquering Commanders is an interesting one.

If I were to imagine the map, it would be that you can invade any point on the A-line, like you have it. However, there should be more little bonuses (right now attacking A1-4 is the best option). Then row I bombards the other side and row J bombards all the commanders (but have no bonuses in I or J). I would eliminate your big block bonus entirely and replace it with little ones. Big bonuses almost never see tactical play (when's the last time someone took Asia as their strategy?)
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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby HitRed on Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:31 pm

idea

Each ship has a command center called the BRIDGE. The bridge is a launch point into the red and white pin trays (see below). So the entire ship is bonus but the bridge is also a launch point.

On the side of the board add the two trays where the red and white plastic pins are stored. These could bombard or assault the Capains. White attacks the captains on your side. Red assaults the other ocean side of the map. Consider CONDITIONAL to attack the plastic pins. 3 bridges you can attack the white. All bridges you can attack the Red which assaults the other side of the map. So each side has a winner as you hoped. Modify as needed.

Just ideas. I'm an idea generator. :)

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Re: BattleShip (V1.0)

Postby DJENRE on Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:56 am

DoomYoshi wrote:Two groups of six is a keeper.

It should be bombard only for jumping.

No Winning Condition.

Killing or Conquering Commanders is an interesting one.

If I were to imagine the map, it would be that you can invade any point on the A-line, like you have it. However, there should be more little bonuses (right now attacking A1-4 is the best option). Then row I bombards the other side and row J bombards all the commanders (but have no bonuses in I or J). I would eliminate your big block bonus entirely and replace it with little ones. Big bonuses almost never see tactical play (when's the last time someone took Asia as their strategy?)


If you bombard, you cannot jump in the other side. Or maybe I missunderstanding something!
About options on A line, If I see 2 or 3 players fighting for the Gun boat (A1-A4), I will maybe wait for a few income and I'll go to the vessel. Letting other players fight for the gun boat. No?
For the big bonus, I presume when a player reach / hold this bonus it's because he 'won' his side. And now he will have to fight vs the 'winner' on the other side.
For more bonus I thought about having a few plastic pin on each side which give another bonus.


HitRed wrote:idea

Each ship has a command center called the BRIDGE. The bridge is a launch point into the red and white pin trays (see below). So the entire ship is bonus but the bridge is also a launch point.

On the side of the board add the two trays where the red and white plastic pins are stored. These could bombard or assault the Capains. White attacks the captains on your side. Red assaults the other ocean side of the map. Consider CONDITIONAL to attack the plastic pins. 3 bridges you can attack the white. All bridges you can attack the Red which assaults the other side of the map. So each side has a winner as you hoped. Modify as needed.


Actually I already thought about having those two trays with plastic pins for something, but I cancelled this idea on the first version because it was useless. Now it could be an option.
I like the idea of the bridge. It could work but I have to modify my boats. Gunboat should be 3 squares instead 2 (except if we add that rule of multibridges to be able to attack pins) and maybe no boat bigger than 5 squares. Don't you think?
Actually I thought about having only one tray per side (one red and one BLUE actually), like the normal game.
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Re: BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby DJENRE on Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:57 pm

V2.0 is on!
1st post edited :arrow:
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Re: BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby DJENRE on Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:12 pm

Many thanks to zimmah who's ready to help in coding!! =D> =D> =D>
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Re: BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby Bruceswar on Tue Nov 28, 2017 12:35 am

Interesting idea. Can't offer much help yet... but on the graphics side I can.
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Re: BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby DJENRE on Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:09 am

Bruceswar wrote:Interesting idea. Can't offer much help yet... but on the graphics side I can.

Seriously? You're ok to help about design?
It would help, I'm not that good.
Do you have any ideas to make it nicer?
Or do you want to start to make some proposal about design?
Let me know.
DJ 8-)
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Re: BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby Bruceswar on Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:47 pm

Are you using photoshop? If so I can help you a ton.
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Re: BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby DJENRE on Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:19 am

Bruceswar wrote:Are you using photoshop? If so I can help you a ton.


Nope Actually I'm working on GIMP. I'm not photoshop at all....
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Re: BattleShip [V2.0]

Postby Bruceswar on Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:28 pm

I am not sure they translate? I will check into it.
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