What's good maps for beginners?

[Georgerx7di]

Here are some basic maps, similar to classic.

I almost completely disagree. This is the typical advice, but it is given from the perspective of someone who has already developed their style of play and succeeds. It is NOT from the perspective of someone new who has never played any of the variations.


Further, you have to look at more than just maps!
1. Enroll in cooks forum. They will guide you through the Classic map, with help. (exception to below!)

2. READ! LOOK at the map before you play, study the legend that explains bonuses, etc.

3. Play 1 vs 1 to learn the "rules" with less "commitment" than larger games. However, DO be aware that 1 vs 1 strategies differ from larger games AND that many games are decided largely by dice/drop vagaries.

4. Stick mostly with Terminator (in 3+ player games) if you worry about points, BUT the real advice is to NOT worry about points right off. Learn. The only way to really learn is to take chances, try different things and that will mean losing.

5. AVOID Freestyle unless you don't mind sitting at your computer until the game is over, know the map well AND don't mind aggressive competition. THREE and FOUR player games can help you learn multiple player strategies, BUT a lot of multis use them (that is, cheaters -- 2 usernames that are really the same player). A lot of people like no spoils, but they can be very, very slow.

Classic art(of course)

no, No, NO, NO!!!!!
Sure, you recognize it, but so does everyone else in the world! Those who play it regularly tend to be very, VERY good.
If you do wish to play, stick with those who are corporals or below. (The exception is the Cook's Forum training grounds.)

I advise people to try some of the maps that look strange, but are rarely played. BUT, here is the thing, picking them out is hard because almost inevitably, there are a few farmers who like to wait for someone such as yourself to start a game or to join one they started and then POUNCE! I did well with Crossword at first, but now don't do so well. Circus Maximus has long been dominated by Farmers. On the other side is Age of Realms 2. (not 1 or 3) It is not difficult to play at all, BUT the play is different and so many people just don't like it. Arms Race, particularly since the strategy guide is now out, is a decent choice, but again, you HAVE TO READ!

The other option is to go for newer maps, those still in Beta, BUT wait until new ones come out, because right now, everyone knows those maps pretty well already.

I have grouped all but the most recent maps in the following link:
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=78766&p=1868221#p1868221


Ultimately, other than avoiding the plain comlicated maps (big maps with lots of different bonuses), the only REAL answer is to just play, play, play. EXPECT to lose at first, but learn. You will find plenty of players who will help you along while you discover what maps you like.

Uh, I think you need to read the title of this thread buddy. If someone asks you where mcdonalds is and you tell them how to get to salad works, you may think you are helping them; but you're really not.

[squishyg]

luv ya Player, but Georgie's got a point.

[PLAYER57832]

Uh, I think you need to read the title of this thread buddy. If someone asks you where mcdonalds is and you tell them how to get to salad works, you may think you are helping them; but you're really not.

I did provide a list, in the link.

There is no one answer to the question. It depends on what you like to play and the options you prefer, particularly the number of people you like to play and the spoils.

I hestitate to give out specific names, though, because as soon as a few new people become comfortable with one or two, it becomes farmer territory (seen it happen too many times).

My suggestion:

If you like playing things like Classic, wait for the new Beta issues and find a map with regular 1 for 3 and adjoining area bonuses only.

If you want something new, read through the rules of the new Betas, when they first come out, give any that seem easy to understand a try and ... go from there!

[Mr Changsha]

Here are some basic maps, similar to classic.

I almost completely disagree. This is the typical advice, but it is given from the perspective of someone who has already developed their style of play and succeeds. It is NOT from the perspective of someone new who has never played any of the variations.


Further, you have to look at more than just maps!
1. Enroll in cooks forum. They will guide you through the Classic map, with help. (exception to below!)

2. READ! LOOK at the map before you play, study the legend that explains bonuses, etc.

3. Play 1 vs 1 to learn the "rules" with less "commitment" than larger games. However, DO be aware that 1 vs 1 strategies differ from larger games AND that many games are decided largely by dice/drop vagaries.

4. Stick mostly with Terminator (in 3+ player games) if you worry about points, BUT the real advice is to NOT worry about points right off. Learn. The only way to really learn is to take chances, try different things and that will mean losing.

5. AVOID Freestyle unless you don't mind sitting at your computer until the game is over, know the map well AND don't mind aggressive competition. THREE and FOUR player games can help you learn multiple player strategies, BUT a lot of multis use them (that is, cheaters -- 2 usernames that are really the same player). A lot of people like no spoils, but they can be very, very slow.

Classic art(of course)

no, No, NO, NO!!!!!
Sure, you recognize it, but so does everyone else in the world! Those who play it regularly tend to be very, VERY good.
If you do wish to play, stick with those who are corporals or below. (The exception is the Cook's Forum training grounds.)

I advise people to try some of the maps that look strange, but are rarely played. BUT, here is the thing, picking them out is hard because almost inevitably, there are a few farmers who like to wait for someone such as yourself to start a game or to join one they started and then POUNCE! I did well with Crossword at first, but now don't do so well. Circus Maximus has long been dominated by Farmers. On the other side is Age of Realms 2. (not 1 or 3) It is not difficult to play at all, BUT the play is different and so many people just don't like it. Arms Race, particularly since the strategy guide is now out, is a decent choice, but again, you HAVE TO READ!

The other option is to go for newer maps, those still in Beta, BUT wait until new ones come out, because right now, everyone knows those maps pretty well already.

I have grouped all but the most recent maps in the following link:
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=78766&p=1868221#p1868221


Ultimately, other than avoiding the plain comlicated maps (big maps with lots of different bonuses), the only REAL answer is to just play, play, play. EXPECT to lose at first, but learn. You will find plenty of players who will help you along while you discover what maps you like.

Ah, the old find a map no one plays and get good at that. I can see the point if you play 1vs1 (as I think you do) but if one wants to make a success of large games, then in the end they have to get in there on the main maps, lose a few, and begin to understand the psychology of the game. If they just hang out on the specialist maps they might win reasonably well in 4-6 player games (through knowing the tricks) but once they venture on to 2.1 they'll get eaten by those who understand how the game flows.

Your point about classic IS interesting though. Everyone does know that map and everyone knows how to play four man flat rate on it. I think there would be no better way to get into CC than by starting off with the classic map, because the new player would get a true understanding of their actual ability/glaring mistakes on such a level playing field.

I disagree with those that say 2.1 is not for beginners. Yes it is big, but the bonus structure is fairly simple...in the end it is just the classic map blown up to orgasmic proportions for large games. I can think of no better way to learn the large singles game than on a 6 man flat rate 2.1.

Finally, most of the best standard players play large standard games on the simple maps...classic, europe usa, 2.1, asia, australia etc etc. The skill is not in understanding the bonus structure, but in reading the board.

So if he's a 1vs1 player then I think player's advice is quite good. However, if he wants to play large standard games then I would suggest joining some classic games and learning how to read the board...for that's the key to playing CC well.

*edit* by 'reading the board' I mean judging the oppositions likely tactics and strategy, not literally 'reading' to find out that Russia is worth +2 and Scandinavia +5!!!

[PLAYER57832]

Ah, the old find a map no one plays and get good at that. I can see the point if you play 1vs1 (as I think you do) but if one wants to make a success of large games, then in the end they have to get in there on the main maps, lose a few, and begin to understand the psychology of the game. If they just hang out on the specialist maps they might win reasonably well in 4-6 player games (through knowing the tricks) but once they venture on to 2.1 they'll get eaten by those who understand how the game flows.

Your point about classic IS interesting though. Everyone does know that map and everyone knows how to play four man flat rate on it. I think there would be no better way to get into CC than by starting off with the classic map, because the new player would get a true understanding of their actual ability/glaring mistakes on such a level playing field.

I disagree with those that say 2.1 is not for beginners. Yes it is big, but the bonus structure is fairly simple...in the end it is just the classic map blown up to orgasmic proportions for large games. I can think of no better way to learn the large singles game than on a 6 man flat rate 2.1.

Finally, most of the best standard players play large standard games on the simple maps...classic, europe usa, 2.1, asia, australia etc etc. The skill is not in understanding the bonus structure, but in reading the board.

So if he's a 1vs1 player then I think player's advice is quite good. However, if he wants to play large standard games then I would suggest joining some classic games and learning how to read the board...for that's the key to playing CC well.

*edit* by 'reading the board' I mean judging the oppositions likely tactics and strategy, not literally 'reading' to find out that Russia is worth +2 and Scandinavia +5!!!

I agree that to be really good, you have to play standard maps with lots of people. I just don't think that is the best way to start.

The best way to learn to play standard maps is the Cook's forum. It is just that not everyone wants to take that route. For one thing, it is pretty slow. Also, a lot of people like variety.

My basic point is just that people have different tasts, skill levels and so forth. Too often, experiences players center more on their own personnal favorites instead of trying to help a new player find what that player really likes and dislikes. I try to set aside my personnal preferences and just give people information so they can decide.

I tend to cringe when I hear people say things like "avoid AOR at all costs", simply because they don't like it. (I also cringe when farmers tell people to "try Circus".. etc.)

[ender516]

I wonder if Donald Fung is still following this topic, or decided to get on the game?

[squishyg]

hehe, it's been over 24 hours since he's logged in. maybe he's hiding from us.

[Woodruff]

I suggest Circus Maximus, Supermax: Prison Riot!, WWII Ardennes, WWII Gazala, and Poison Rome.
everyone agree

I would actually agree about Circus Maximus...it's a very straightforward game, given that you don't get region bonuses. Definitely not the others, though. <grin>

[Donald Fung]

hehe, it's been over 24 hours since he's logged in. maybe he's hiding from us.

I'm right here.

[squishyg]

so you are. fancy a game if something? you can pick the map and settings.

[PLAYER57832]

I suggest Circus Maximus, Supermax: Prison Riot!, WWII Ardennes, WWII Gazala, and Poison Rome.
everyone agree

I would actually agree about Circus Maximus...it's a very straightforward game, given that you don't get region bonuses. Definitely not the others, though. <grin>

The main problem with circus maximus, at least in the past, was that a group of Farmers used it as their "pouncing" territory. That said, I, too, found it relatively easy.

[Donald Fung]

so you are. fancy a game if something? you can pick the map and settings.

I don’t like making games cause it’s usually better players who join which would just weaken my w/l ratio (which is 0/9) more. I feel sad that I still haven’t won a game yet. I usually just try to join games made by cook/ cadet/ private/ and private 1st class.

[ender516]

Don't lose heart, Donald. The first game I won was the ninth game I finished, and my second win came in the fourteenth. It will happen for you eventually.

[PLAYER57832]

so you are. fancy a game if something? you can pick the map and settings.

I don’t like making games cause it’s usually better players who join which would just weaken my w/l ratio (which is 0/9) more. I feel sad that I still haven’t won a game yet. I usually just try to join games made by cook/ cadet/ private/ and private 1st class.

Start a few 1 vs 1. (one at a time) They don't play exactly like the larger games (you need to be more aggressive, usually). However, the games are quick and I find you are less likely to be "pounced" upon.

[e_i_pi]

Some beginners maps that aren't run-of-the-mill are:
8 Thoughts (symmetry is easy on the eye, trine bonuses aren't too difficult to understand)
Conquer 4 (pretty easy to understand)
Scotland (cities bonus adds a tiny bit of complexity, but still easy to understand)
Texan Wars (more complex than Scotland, but same basis on bonuses)
Any of the USA pack (eg - USA Great Lakes)
Castle Lands (pretty simple stuff - the catapult icons are a great visual trigger for their ability)

[squishyg]

Donald, I sent you an invite to play with me. pw is fung. The offer is a friendly game with some free advice on world 2.1

[jleonnn]

once you get used to CC, you should try different maps. I found aor2 and found I'm good at it. won hundreds of points there

[PLAYER57832]

once you get used to CC, you should try different maps. I found aor2 and found I'm good at it. won hundreds of points there

AOR 2 is one reason I always cringe at people suggesting new folks stick with "classic-like" maps. It IS easy and fun, just not for everyone.

hmmm... seems like we have played a few games ...

[Donald Fung]

Donald, I sent you an invite to play with me. pw is fung. The offer is a friendly game with some free advice on world 2.1

Thx a lot!

[Falkomagno]

doodle

[jleonnn]

if you're thinking of being a high-ranker, stay OUT of doodle earth.

[Donald Fung]

if you're thinking of being a high-ranker, stay OUT of doodle earth.

and... why is that? Doodle is 90% based on luck and 10% based on skills.

[Mad Pineapples]

if you're thinking of being a high-ranker, stay OUT of doodle earth.

and... why is that? Doodle is 90% based on luck and 10% based on skills.

Precisely. Although, I think as long as you use Flat Rate or Escalating it can be a good game, and requires more skill. With Unlimited and No Spoils, first turn usually wins.

[Donald Fung]

if you're thinking of being a high-ranker, stay OUT of doodle earth.

and... why is that? Doodle is 90% based on luck and 10% based on skills.

Precisely. Although, I think as long as you use Flat Rate or Escalating it can be a good game, and requires more skill. With Unlimited and No Spoils, first turn usually wins.

yeah I tried a 5 ppl game with that. But mostly everybody suicided most of their troops on their first and second turn (including me) and lost. The player that actually didn't suicide won because we all had 1-2 troops per territory.

[jleonnn]

that was me Game 5387849