It honestly is absurd for a doc to save jonty. I also think it would be absurd for any "killing faction" to shoot jonty because of a few reasons. Here is why i don't think jonty was shot, nor was he saved. 1. he took so much heat day 1 2. he said he wouldn't use his power 3. RD flipped town, half decent chance a mafia was up for lynch day 1, and it was pushed onto the VT 4. if you are a protective role, you probably are gonna save someone you think is a strong player, someone you think is town.
MudPuppy wrote:I think jonty is still a solid suspect... but I'm definitely eager to hear jmac claim.
Storr, you mentioned you'd be looking at IB, pcm, & kgb... and your vote is still on jonty. I'd like to hear more on your reads of jak and jmac.
Any reasons in particular that you're curious about a claim from me, or do you also hear the voices in your head who tell you what to think and who to vote for? Because I've been given no real reason for either of the votes on me.
MudPuppy wrote:IF jonty is not part of Rishaed's faction, then they would have pegged him as a town PR or a member of the opposing scum faction. Either way, it makes him a likely target for them. I don't think it's absurd for a doc to save jonty. For the reasons stated before, he's a likely target for a hit... which makes him a likely target for a save if you believe his town claim.
I am not sure that someone who claimed Vig but says they won't be using the power for the time being and was close to being lynched after his claim is as big of target as you suggest.
You don't think I'm a VT? I pretty much said I'm not a bloody VT, I also called everyone out on it that didn't realized the VILLAGER is the only VT type in the game, using that info I found 1-2 more VT's one I am 100% on but will leave him alone unless he needs proof later on to save him from a lynch, the other is sort of by how he reacted.
I got Anark to claim on page 10, ever since that people have reacted one way or another to his claim. Roger Dodger believed his claim and now we know why.
^ The post that now confirms my suspicion of him NOT being a VT.
But what I find scummy is you want lynches with almost every case. You wanted Anark lynched, you wanted kgb lynched, you wanted RD lynched.
Someone said I didn't seem to care who got lynched when I was looking for information (Which now today we have a lot more than we did yesterday).
But you, you wanted everyone lynched that you talked about pretty much. What doesn't help your case is you have actually pretty few posts yesterday among the ones with the least posts, my gut says you're scum. Looking for every chance to lynch somebody before the day ends and not caring who we kill.
Now, blinded by the anger toward me for voting you, you ignore rereading and trying to find the reads I have. If you bothered to reread, the obvious VT would be clear to you too. If he is put under the L2 pressure, I will back up his claim with proof from quotes he's made.
FP'd by 2 people.
What IS your read on me Storr? MP gave his, Jmac is doing the OMGUS thing (I vote him, he immediately thinks I'm scum LOL). Funny thing is, he sheeped what I said on kgb yesterday.
Actually I'm curious as to what most people read me as, because I'm one of the few constantly posting and staying active (like I always do, you can even META that!).
FP'd by 2 again.
I just gave you a reason Jmac, it's Day 2 with still little info besides reading people's reactions from yesterday. So far I find YOURS the scummiest with your activity level.
You even admitted to reading the day and not posting until I called you out on showing up. Scummarining buddy, it doesn't get you too far in this game.
Highest Rank: Major:2157
"All wars are civil wars, because all men are brothers"
Regarding Jak, while i don't exactly see eye to eye with his views, he is very forceful with his opinion, and doesn't seem to give a flying f what people think. he has been super active with pressuring people (which has been great). So regarding yourself, i see no reason to lynch you with plenty of other far more scummy looking people. I've picked apart his posting before, finding weird thoughts. Which i have pointed out previously. My conclusion, because he is so opinionated on certain things with such passion, it exemplifies town imo.
spiesr wrote:Pending someone coming forward with a relevant night action or something I would like to consider lynching Jonty again today. With rishaed's death I have reason to believe that the multiple non-town killers theory is correct. I still think that having a Vig in addition to that would be too much. Vote Jonty I would also like some explanation for this.
spiesr wrote:
jonty125 wrote:No Jak I'm not willing to play your game, if scum choose no kill N1, then I'm really screwed.
Are you saying that you are not willing to use you Vig power as a surrogate lynch if we decide we want to test your claim that way?
I believe the quote there has my reasoning.
Regarding, jmac, I think the case is weak, we build cases for lynching/claiming interchangeably.
jak111 wrote:I also have reason to believe that there were in fact 2 kill blocks (whether it be doc or roleblocker blocking the kills).
vote jak, there is nothing in the scene that implies this, so I cannot fathom how you can believe there were 2 kill blocks. You can't even say there were 0 kill blocks last night.
War doesn't determine who's right; it determines who's left.
spiesr wrote:Pending someone coming forward with a relevant night action or something I would like to consider lynching Jonty again today. With rishaed's death I have reason to believe that the multiple non-town killers theory is correct. I still think that having a Vig in addition to that would be too much. Vote Jonty I would also like some explanation for this.
spiesr wrote:
jonty125 wrote:No Jak I'm not willing to play your game, if scum choose no kill N1, then I'm really screwed.
Are you saying that you are not willing to use you Vig power as a surrogate lynch if we decide we want to test your claim that way?
I believe the quote there has my reasoning.
Regarding, jmac, I think the case is weak, we build cases for lynching/claiming interchangeably.
jak111 wrote:I also have reason to believe that there were in fact 2 kill blocks (whether it be doc or roleblocker blocking the kills).
vote jak, there is nothing in the scene that implies this, so I cannot fathom how you can believe there were 2 kill blocks. You can't even say there were 0 kill blocks last night.
I was not aware of this game being a "hint game" the only experience i have is the BB game where the Day/night posts flavor does not = what happened in day/night.
I'll ask the mod myself here to be sure. But i doubt if "saves" happened he would write them into the day post.
The day posts are basically here just an enhance for the game and to add a little bit to the theme.
The scenes that I write will try to recap what has happened without giving any SPECIFIC information into possible roles and/or successful/unsuccessful night actions, with only exceptions given to announcing a nightly kill.
StorrZerg wrote:Mod just told me there won't be anything in day posts regarding roles or night actions
So get that Crap out of here jonty
What are you talking about Storr? Jonty is questioning how Jak could have ANY information about kill attempts and blocks. He claims he does. The only way any of us (beyond outside influence/abilities) could have that information is if it was given in a scene. It was not. Do you have any reasons to believe that Jak should know this information? Jonty and I don't.
StorrZerg wrote:Mod just told me there won't be anything in day posts regarding roles or night actions
So get that Crap out of here jonty
What are you talking about Storr? Jonty is questioning how Jak could have ANY information about kill attempts and blocks. He claims he does. The only way any of us (beyond outside influence/abilities) could have that information is if it was given in a scene. It was not. Do you have any reasons to believe that Jak should know this information? Jonty and I don't.
I think it is pretty obvious the conclusion you can come to. And the mod has stated we won't be getting that kind of information in the scene, so we should just not being talking about that.
Instead we can conclude that jak has hinted he knows stuff several times. Should be pretty obvious HOW he knows something.
What i find interesting is that you both say he SHOULDN'T know anything yet he claims to know. I find that interesting...
In the end i really don't care what jak claims, I have my lead on jonty, and i'm going to continue to pressure jonty. ultimately i will do what i think is best for town, but i won't be shutting down my leads to just sheep jak.
StorrZerg wrote:What i find interesting is that you both say he SHOULDN'T know anything yet he claims to know.
OK, let me illustrate my point. Let us go with theory that this is straight town vs. mafia (or any other scenario, with one anti-town killing faction). I didn't use my kill. Busdriver swapped mafia's original target, and rish. Rish ends up dead. No kills have been blocked. I can't see how jak can believe there were two blocked kills, never mind one.
Now, let us say there was one blocked kill, which may or may not have happened. How would jak know it occured? Lets say he roleblocked player A, player B could have performed the kill. Lets say he docs player C, player D is targetted for the kill. Lets say he jailkeeps Player E, Player F could be the target or killer. I cannot think of a scenario where jak can have information that can lead to him knowing there was a blocked kill UNLESS he is a member of a killing faction, who's kill didn't go to plan, and as assumed it was due to a block.
War doesn't determine who's right; it determines who's left.
Or lets just not speculate anything and work off reads atm point is there is no way jonty you had any impact at night, cause you claimed to not use your power. the fact that you are so adamant about pushing jak the way you are right now is mafia imo. Jak will claim what he knows when he needs to. (such has been stated) if you think he is scum. present why and push it. But to simply say he has no way of knowing anything and trying to push that angle is scummy as hell.
MudPuppy wrote:IF jonty is not part of Rishaed's faction, then they would have pegged him as a town PR or a member of the opposing scum faction. Either way, it makes him a likely target for them. I don't think it's absurd for a doc to save jonty. For the reasons stated before, he's a likely target for a hit... which makes him a likely target for a save if you believe his town claim.
I am not sure that someone who claimed Vig but says they won't be using the power for the time being and was close to being lynched after his claim is as big of target as you suggest.
let's assume you're the town doc spiesr, who would you have targeted? a random person, nark or jonty?
if jonty is telling the truth, he would definitely be of interest to mafia
jonty125 wrote:
StorrZerg wrote:What i find interesting is that you both say he SHOULDN'T know anything yet he claims to know.
OK, let me illustrate my point. Let us go with theory that this is straight town vs. mafia (or any other scenario, with one anti-town killing faction). I didn't use my kill. Busdriver swapped mafia's original target, and rish. Rish ends up dead. No kills have been blocked. I can't see how jak can believe there were two blocked kills, never mind one.
Now, let us say there was one blocked kill, which may or may not have happened. How would jak know it occured? Lets say he roleblocked player A, player B could have performed the kill. Lets say he docs player C, player D is targetted for the kill. Lets say he jailkeeps Player E, Player F could be the target or killer. I cannot think of a scenario where jak can have information that can lead to him knowing there was a blocked kill UNLESS he is a member of a killing faction, who's kill didn't go to plan, and as assumed it was due to a block.
while i don't necessarily agree with jak and his seemingly 100% certainity of last night's events, it's not difficult for me to imagine a scenario where jak is some kind of town watcher, picked jonty to watch, and 3 different people visit jonty but no kills, from there he could assume a town doc and 2 members from different anti-town factions, thus his statement on 2 kills being stopped last night
Again, if jonty is what he says, with him NOT shooting, mafia have nothing to fear of him. Specially if he wasn't even pushing on mafia day 1 (hey look who he pushed for the lynch) Why would mafia waste a shot on him when they could be trying to hit other power roles???
that is if jonty is a threat to mafia... if jonty is mafia, which i think he is.. then of course mafia wouldnt' target jonty...
jak111 wrote:I also have reason to believe that there were in fact 2 kill blocks (whether it be doc or roleblocker blocking the kills).
vote jak, there is nothing in the scene that implies this, so I cannot fathom how you can believe there were 2 kill blocks. You can't even say there were 0 kill blocks last night.
Is that really voteworthy? That's totally speculative, and as the mod pointed out totally inaccurate. It'd be better to maybe suggest WHY that's not a true statement as opposed to voting him and saying it's not. I'm less inclined to believe your claim as time goes on, but what jak is saying could directly contradict what you're saying. Now that could go either way, but I'm more interested in seeing where this discussion goes at the moment.
kgb007 wrote:let's assume you're the town doc spiesr, who would you have targeted? a random person, nark or jonty?
Given that I wanted him lynched yesterday it seems unlikely that I would have tried to protect him last night. If I am a Doc I would have targeted one of the unclaimed players last night.
StorrZerg wrote:Again, if jonty is what he says, with him NOT shooting, mafia have nothing to fear of him. Specially if he wasn't even pushing on mafia day 1 (hey look who he pushed for the lynch) Why would mafia waste a shot on him when they could be trying to hit other power roles???
that is if jonty is a threat to mafia... if jonty is mafia, which i think he is.. then of course mafia wouldnt' target jonty...
What other power roles would the mafia target? Until today with jmac's soft power role claim, there weren't any other known power roles. And even if jonty wasn't going to shoot last night... that doesn't prevent him from shooting the next night, if he thinks he's pretty sure about a scum. That is dangerous for scum, and I wouldn't blame scum for trying to off him before he figured out who to target.
There is always a chance jonty is scum... but right now I don't think you will build enough support to lynch him today, so I would rather look elsewhere to get more info/find other scum.
Regarding the jmac/jak discussion, it is obvious that they are both either power roles, or scum. Based on their posts, jak has sounded more townish to me, and jmac more scummish... so I will vote jmac (jonty's defense of jmac and going after jak will raise some serious questions, depending on how the jmac/jak situation resolves itself... )
All speculation based on jonty telling the truth: mafia doesn't fear jonty for N1 but how about future nights? mafia is faced with eliminating a role that could kill one of their own at night or targeting someone else at random
I'll drop it since I originally came out against jonty today given the posts made my Rishaed. I have to say I'm annoyed by jak in his play today. You make several soft claims but won't provide any information to back up your accusations - that's why I think more people aren't inclined to jump on Jmac just because you say so. You're deliberately withholding information from town bc:
jak111 wrote:Of course I am holding back information, everyone with any type of power role or not claimed yet is holding back information. For now, I am waiting to see if the information I know needs to be known today or not. As of yet, I see no reason it needs to be known. (Same with everyone else who have talked and not given what they know yet).
Obviously this is your decision and I cannot force you to spill the beans but no other PR seems to be offering up even the slightest bit of a hint that they know something. Unless you're willing to supplement your vote against Jmac besides "based on his posts talking about lynching people from D1" I'm not voting Jmac based on that reasoning alone and now we're stuck on this jonty & jmac vs jak theme so far today..
If you find jaks play scum, then push him tbh i do not see him as scum right now with the way he is playing. I'd prefer he didn't claim today. given what we know 1.jonty did not shoot 2. a mafia died 3. no town died.
I see no reason to pressure jak for a claim.
Lets ask the question, what does mafia want to do now? 1. they want to know what happened at night so they can avoid it, or kill the protector. In my eyes, it would be scummy to force claims today when we have a clear lead over mafia. Specially since i believe i have locked onto a mafia...
No worries, it's fine that they're both after me, it shows they don't want me to know something. I have already hinted at why I know what I know without fully explaining it.
However, you see how this turns out to be a bit correct. They are pushing harder to know HOW I know what I know. Leading me to believe one or both for possible scum.
Don't you find it odd how when Jonty says he will not kill, there is no mafia kill during the night? Whether the two kills are blocked or just chose not to kill is up for debate.
Not only that, but now that I go after Jmac, he's right there defending him?
I am not sure who the last mafia(s) are. But once we get one more out of the way, I'll explain the other threat to town that I am aware of.
Highest Rank: Major:2157
"All wars are civil wars, because all men are brothers"
jak111 wrote:No worries, it's fine that they're both after me, it shows they don't want me to know something. I have already hinted at why I know what I know without fully explaining it.
However, you see how this turns out to be a bit correct. They are pushing harder to know HOW I know what I know. Leading me to believe one or both for possible scum.
Don't you find it odd how when Jonty says he will not kill, there is no mafia kill during the night? Whether the two kills are blocked or just chose not to kill is up for debate.
Not only that, but now that I go after Jmac, he's right there defending him?
I am not sure who the last mafia(s) are. But once we get one more out of the way, I'll explain the other threat to town that I am aware of.
This is what I dislike. It appears you have soft claimed a power role yet you have said from your own mouth that you have no relevant information to hang scum. Ordinarily that would be a great play if you are VT trying to draw fire but you get indignant that someone would dare suggest that.
So you are a PR that has not received relevant information yet. There is another threat you wish to warn us about. WHY are you telling us this IF you are not ready to tell us? Yes we are playing "Village of Secrets"....add mystery organ music for effect.
The point I am making is that because you are Town does not make your theories anymore valid or stronger because you have soft claimed. It just tells everyone you have potential to release information.
