[Official] Breaking Bad Mafia 4/18 Blue. Town&DEA+rug win

[cooldeals]

Also @cooldeals no need for the "in America" its a game of mafia.

I don't understand what you mean. We are a global website. We have different lingo and ways of speaking. I am from America. I am pointing out that in my culture the way I said that is a common way to joke, nothing more. If we are going to analyze how people speak we have to take in consideration well....how they actually speak where they come from.

[StorrZerg]

Just simply explain what you meant. no need to say "IN AMERICA WE CALLED THAT A JOKE" just simply "it was a joke" is fine. (i'm all for American love, but i don't want it to be tainted by scummy scum scum) So until i know you are 100% town lets leave America out of this ^_^

In some seriousness though. I have seen people catch scum from mistakes of grammar, word choice, etc. I'm not an expert on it, so i really don't have an opinion on the issue that Rodion is pressing against you. Some of it usually pertains to the sentences not "flowing" well. part of that is due to a townie doesn't "care" so much about the post they put out. Usually you are not thinking "did i post something that made me look scummy?" "was that a town thing to say?" Reason being is, if you are town, you god damn know it. Generally thats mafia thinking when they post, which sometimes leads to changing of words, and such which then leads to the sentence not sounding right.

[rishaed]

Oh wow the grammar police are out.

You got defensive pretty quickly, didn't you?

In America we call that a joke

Let's refresh that I was posting this from a phone shall we.

Oops I missed that = I did not catch on that Caff was saying he was third party

(I) wasn't sure what he was agreeing to = I didn't actually go back and check Caff's post but I remembered him saying "He is correct" as you'll see in the below post.

You see, correctly interpreting who Caffeine agreed with (be it Betiko or Jonty) is not the point here. The point is whether you realized that Caffeine had replied to Betiko or not. Check your quote:

I honestly didn't think he had replied to betiko. Reread iAmCaffeine's answer. Had he directly said "I am not 3rd party" we would not be having this discussion. Yet he said "although he can't spell my handle, he is correct". It is vague and I didn't understand it. When TFO said Caff was admitting 3rd party I assumed that line I didn't understand was his admission.

He has ignored Betiko's question about whether he is soft-claiming 3rd party too.

If you had realized he had agreed with someone (again, be it Betiko or Jonty), there would have been no legitimate grounds for this quote to exist, as Caffeine didn't ignore Betiko. He either agreed with him and confirmed his 3rd-party allegiance or agreed with Jonty and didn't want anything he said to be perceived as a softclaim.

The point of my questioning was:
"am not" - I JUST realized Caffeine did adress Betiko's question (after TFO pointed that out)
"was not" - I didn't realize it now, in the present. I actually had realized that already, in the past.

The issue if that if you had realized that in the past, saying you had "missed it" is a lie. And we all know what happens to liars.

Do you think that my thought process is not legitimate? Because that's what your grammar police ad hominem implied.

How about everyone else (especially people whose mother language is english), what do you guys think?

So English isn't your first language and you are nitpicking my grammar to make accusations out of it? I really think you are seeing something that isn't there, but believe what you believe it's really irrelevant to me. As I said in my above green response. I didn't think he had addressed the question of 3rd party. I did not understand Caff's vague response and when TFO said Caff was admitting to being 3rd party I assumed that was what he meant in that vague phrase.

If you remember that much, I assumed (a bad thing to do in mafia) that TFO must be referencing this post and actually know who misspelled iAmCaffeine's handle (jonty only miscapitalized it, he didn't misspell it) etc.

I take it now that Caff was saying jonty was correct when he said "don't think IamCaffeine was softclaiming 3rd party". Like I said before I was just checking on my phone and I didn't go back and reread the post because my vote on Caff was not dependent on him soft-claiming 3rd party. My entire post was more of a WOW response to some having claimed 3rd party for no reason. I mean that's like asking to be put at L-2. I probably should have reread the post but at the same time I was posting despite not having time while other people were enjoying Carnival and citing internet problems.

Defensive again?

For your information, if I end up deciding you acted in a scummy manner, the "at least I was posting instead of not posting" is not going to be a valid defense.

Oh goodness. You are pulling an MoB on me. I'm calling out your scumminess. Here you are, you've stated no opinions at all and hardly posted D1 and the beginning of D2. Then out of the blue you make a case out of a typo and the word "wasn't" when I have an actual case (WIFOM included yes it's D2 no results) on Caff and he has the most momentum for pressure. What you are doing is coming to his aid. You say that you think he is possibly scum. In America we have the phrase "Actions speak louder than words". Your actions of coming out of your nonposting status to jump on a grammar mistake to get the heat off iAmCaffeine speaks much louder to me that you are trying to protect him than your words that you think he might be suspicious.

@Rodion so I take it you think iAmCaffeine is town?

I don't feel good about a handful of people (about half the remaining players). That includes Caffeine and, most recently, you. I know that several of my feels are wrong, as there can't be that many anti-town players in the game (plus, statistically, there must be at least 1 scum on the half of the list I currently have no issues with).

This is a very safe and broad response. What constitutes a handful of people? I would assume that means more than 2 yet you only list Caffeine and myself. To me this seems you are trying to be non-committal and hide your opinions. That seems scummy to me to be honest.

As for your vote on Caffeine, I find it pretty fishy for the following reasons:

1) I see PCM'S calling him scum (and me town) scum trying to distance themselves from other scum.
2) I thought his D1 play was suspect a well.
3) I get a town vibe from Betiko and think maybe this is more than just a hunch of Betiko's

1 - WIFOM
2 - Since you are using that D1 card as a reason, did you happen to mention you suspected his play back in D1 (maybe in one of the many moments Stor asked people to give their reads)?
3 - Betiko was the very guy who correctly said that the fact someone is town doesn't mean his reads are precise. Even if Betiko turns up to be town, getting a town vibe from him is hardly a reason to jump on a wagon.
3 again - That's basically you hoping Betiko has a cop guilty on Caffeine. It's both unlikely that Betiko is the cop from your pesrpective (1/14 assuming you're not it) and that Betiko would have investigated Caffeine pre-PCM's flip. Check that:

Come up with a better argument that doesn't include WIFOM today and I'll address it. I think it's possible betiko has some kind of result he wants to check against iAmCaffeine's claim. If you can't catch that subtle hint out of my posts I don't know why you think you can draw so much out of the word "wasn't".

honestly, super and caf didn't say anything that seemed strange to me at the time.

I responded in this color above. Your defense of iAmCaffeine is noted.

'
I find the two statements in red to be hypocritical from Cooldeals, specifically about the WIFOM statements. I am leaning slightly more on the Rodion side of the case, but I also had a pretty strong town vibe from cooldeals D1, I've been wrong before though so I'll follow my gut here. vote cooldeals
fp'd

[iAmCaffeine]

I've just about to caught up but I'm shattered. I'll voice up more tomorrow.

One thing I'd like to say is that when you have a string of quotes within a single quote, you are generally replying to the person last quoted, so I assumed it was obvious I was saying jonty was correct.

[Iron Butterfly]

Just simply explain what you meant. no need to say "IN AMERICA WE CALLED THAT A JOKE" just simply "it was a joke" is fine. (i'm all for American love, but i don't want it to be tainted by scummy scum scum) So until i know you are 100% town lets leave America out of this ^_^

In some seriousness though. I have seen people catch scum from mistakes of grammar, word choice, etc. I'm not an expert on it, so i really don't have an opinion on the issue that Rodion is pressing against you. Some of it usually pertains to the sentences not "flowing" well. part of that is due to a townie doesn't "care" so much about the post they put out. Usually you are not thinking "did i post something that made me look scummy?" "was that a town thing to say?" Reason being is, if you are town, you god damn know it. Generally thats mafia thinking when they post, which sometimes leads to changing of words, and such which then leads to the sentence not sounding right.

Ohhhh the irony. One of the nastiest games I ever played was against Rodian because of his use of the "language" card. His complaint was that English was not his first language and he did not understand the translation of a misspelled word. Yet he made eloquent grammatically correct posts and statements. I was Town he was mafia. We got into a nasty, heated drawn out battle because I dared question that he completely understood the context of what someone had written, yet pleaded ignorance. It became personal very quickly because it was no longer about the game but about me targeting someone for poor language skills. *grin* A lawyer playing the victim card.

Is the same thing happening this game? Yes to the extent it is getting personal when it should not be.

[MoB Deadly]

"Caught up" from the weekend.
Glad Rodion is posting.

Caffeine soft claimed 3rd party? I would at least like a name claim from him so we can decide if he is threatening or not.

I have to reread Rodions case on CD....... I think ive read too much today because I couldn't even follow it.

If I dont like Rodion's case, I am thinking Gregwolf, because his posts have been sad in Day 2... And I don't like the wagonees on SuperKeener still. Especially Virus and IB.

fastposted by IB... I agree a little here that Rodion is very VERY shifty in every game I have played with him. I need to read the case he made on CD more than once before making a decision.

[betiko]

just some clarifications caff

I can assure you (although it will mean little) that I am far from a threat to town. Considering main characters in the programme, I imagine the mafia faction(s) will be rather small. After seeing the dead roles I doubt there is a second mafia faction, but we could expect third party players. Given the expected size of the scum squad, it would be an extremely high risk move for pancakemix to try and buss someone on d1.
.......
If people want a full claim then I will provide one, but I think it is too early.

why don't you say that you are town instead of a "not a threat to town"? this is what made me think of third party, then the fact that you prepare people to expect a lot of third parties. And regarding the rest.... I don't know how others are not curious to have your full claim after such statements.

I don't think third parties are a bad thing, but it's probably harmless to ask for a claim to understand some mechanics.

Third parties aren't inherently evil, but without a role that helps town, they'll be lynched, due to their wavering loyalties. And I don't think IamCaffeine was softclaiming 3rd party, that's generally not a good thing to do if you want to live.

Although he can't spell my handle, he is correct.

There are still a few players we haven't heard from yet. I'd like them to voice up before going further.

I don't know what "you can't spell my handle" means and if it's a british expression. And here you replyied to jonty's post in the third person... you confused a few of us; I thought you were confirming what I said. "he is right" would refer to me and "you are right" would refer to the erson you are answering to...

Anyway, yes, softclaiming third party is indeed basically putting yourself at L-2, that's why I backpedaled a bit because I thought that if caf did that he had to be telling the truth, a mafia wouldn't softclaim thrid party at that momentum...

Caf; can you confirm you are town and not something else? i want a clear answer.

[Metsfanmax]

Sorry for my lack of activity recently -- I've been very busy in RL recently and this thread has turned into a clusterfuck that is difficult to follow. I'll be back in action as soon as I can.

[Rodion]

I honestly didn't think he had replied to betiko. Reread iAmCaffeine's answer. Had he directly said "I am not 3rd party" we would not be having this discussion. Yet he said "although he can't spell my handle, he is correct". It is vague and I didn't understand it. When TFO said Caff was admitting 3rd party I assumed that line I didn't understand was his admission.

I don't need to reread it: I know it was vague as f*ck. There is Caffeine's interpretation that you reply to the last quote in the pyramid. There is also Betiko's valid interpretation that he should have adressed Jonty as "you", not "he". There's the fact that I didn't even know "handle" could be a synonym for "name" and that didn't change after I failed to google it. Then there's also your point that he didn't misspell, he misscapitalized it.

Back when I had to take a guess (before Caffeine's confirmation of what he meant), I supposed he agreed with Jonty, but I respect the fact other people interpreted it differently. Again, the point is not who Caffeine agreed with, it is that he agreed with SOMEONE, which meant he did take a stance regarding whether he softclaimed 3rd party or not.

Oh goodness. You are pulling an MoB on me. I'm calling out your scumminess. Here you are, you've stated no opinions at all and hardly posted D1 and the beginning of D2. Then out of the blue you make a case out of a typo and the word "wasn't" when I have an actual case (WIFOM included yes it's D2 no results) on Caff and he has the most momentum for pressure. What you are doing is coming to his aid. You say that you think he is possibly scum. In America we have the phrase "Actions speak louder than words". Your actions of coming out of your nonposting status to jump on a grammar mistake to get the heat off iAmCaffeine speaks much louder to me that you are trying to protect him than your words that you think he might be suspicious.

So, what is MoB famous for in your clan mafia games?

No, the case was not out of a typo. I thought it wasn't necessary to explain that, but now I see it might be.

When I see someone do something that is somewhat ambiguous and might be a scumslip depending on how that is interpreted, I like to follow a very specific procedure when interrogating. How? I ask them to clear them ambiguity FIRST and THEN I attack, depending on how the player cleared that ambiguity.

The reason I do that is obvious. Imagine the following scenario:

1 - Player A says something that can be interpreted "x" or "Y".
2 - Rodion says "I don't know if you meant 'X' or ''Y' here, but the 'X' interpretation is very scummy.
3 - Player A says he meant "Y". (we don't know if he really meant "Y" or if he meant "X" and lied because I showed my hand before the proper moment)

Instead, as I said, I proceed like this:

1 - Player A says something that can be interpreted "x" or "Y".
2 - I say "Hey, did you mean 'X' or 'Y' when you said that"?
3 - Player A picks one interpretation.
4 - If he picked "Y", I drop it. If he picked "X", he gets scummier and is hopefully exposed.

The only reason I asked you to clarify the "wasn't" typo was that I didn't want to build a case assuming you meant "wasn't" and then have you dismiss it by saying you mistyped a different word (you may think no other word would fit the context and as such you couldn't claim anything other than "wasn't", but I didn't want to take any risks).

See? I don't dislike the fact that you mistyped" wasn't". Not at all, my good sir. I just didn't want you to change the word in the middle of my case, that's why I made you correct it BEFORE writing the potential case.

I don't feel good about a handful of people (about half the remaining players). That includes Caffeine and, most recently, you. I know that several of my feels are wrong, as there can't be that many anti-town players in the game (plus, statistically, there must be at least 1 scum on the half of the list I currently have no issues with).

This is a very safe and broad response. What constitutes a handful of people? I would assume that means more than 2 yet you only list Caffeine and myself. To me this seems you are trying to be non-committal and hide your opinions. That seems scummy to me to be honest.

Sorry for not being clear enough.

I don't feel good about a handful of people (about half the remaining players).

You want the full list?

Other than the 2 I already mentioned, Virus, IB, Rishaed, Rugbirn and Nag/Greg.

Come up with a better argument that doesn't include WIFOM today and I'll address it. I think it's possible betiko has some kind of result he wants to check against iAmCaffeine's claim. If you can't catch that subtle hint out of my posts I don't know why you think you can draw so much out of the word "wasn't". [/b].

I caught the hint and I've explained why it's unreasonable to give Betiko's case a high level of trust on the offchance he has an investigative role and found something potentially incriminating about Caffeine.

[Rodion]

I honestly didn't think he had replied to betiko. Reread iAmCaffeine's answer. Had he directly said "I am not 3rd party" we would not be having this discussion. Yet he said "although he can't spell my handle, he is correct". It is vague and I didn't understand it. When TFO said Caff was admitting 3rd party I assumed that line I didn't understand was his admission.

I don't need to reread it: I know it was vague as f*ck. There is Caffeine's interpretation that you reply to the last quote in the pyramid. There is also Betiko's valid interpretation that he should have adressed Jonty as "you", not "he". There's the fact that I didn't even know "handle" could be a synonym for "name" and that didn't change after I failed to google it. Then there's also your point that he didn't misspell, he misscapitalized it.

Back when I had to take a guess (before Caffeine's confirmation of what he meant), I supposed he agreed with Jonty, but I respect the fact other people interpreted it differently. Again, the point is not who Caffeine agreed with, it is that he agreed with SOMEONE, which meant he did take a stance regarding whether he softclaimed 3rd party or not.

Oh goodness. You are pulling an MoB on me. I'm calling out your scumminess. Here you are, you've stated no opinions at all and hardly posted D1 and the beginning of D2. Then out of the blue you make a case out of a typo and the word "wasn't" when I have an actual case (WIFOM included yes it's D2 no results) on Caff and he has the most momentum for pressure. What you are doing is coming to his aid. You say that you think he is possibly scum. In America we have the phrase "Actions speak louder than words". Your actions of coming out of your nonposting status to jump on a grammar mistake to get the heat off iAmCaffeine speaks much louder to me that you are trying to protect him than your words that you think he might be suspicious.

So, what is MoB famous for in your clan mafia games?

No, the case was not out of a typo. I thought it wasn't necessary to explain that, but now I see it might be.

When I see someone do something that is somewhat ambiguous and might be a scumslip depending on how that is interpreted, I like to follow a very specific procedure when interrogating. How? I ask them to clear them ambiguity FIRST and THEN I attack, depending on how the player cleared that ambiguity.

The reason I do that is obvious. Imagine the following scenario:

1 - Player A says something that can be interpreted "x" or "Y".
2 - Rodion says "I don't know if you meant 'X' or ''Y' here, but the 'X' interpretation is very scummy.
3 - Player A says he meant "Y". (we don't know if he really meant "Y" or if he meant "X" and lied because I showed my hand before the proper moment)

Instead, as I said, I proceed like this:

1 - Player A says something that can be interpreted "x" or "Y".
2 - I say "Hey, did you mean 'X' or 'Y' when you said that"?
3 - Player A picks one interpretation.
4 - If he picked "Y", I drop it. If he picked "X", he gets scummier and is hopefully exposed.

The only reason I asked you to clarify the "wasn't" typo was that I didn't want to build a case assuming you meant "wasn't" and then have you dismiss it by saying you mistyped a different word (you may think no other word would fit the context and as such you couldn't claim anything other than "wasn't", but I didn't want to take any risks).

See? I don't dislike the fact that you mistyped" wasn't". Not at all, my good sir. I just didn't want you to change the word in the middle of my case, that's why I made you correct it BEFORE writing the potential case.

I don't feel good about a handful of people (about half the remaining players). That includes Caffeine and, most recently, you. I know that several of my feels are wrong, as there can't be that many anti-town players in the game (plus, statistically, there must be at least 1 scum on the half of the list I currently have no issues with).

This is a very safe and broad response. What constitutes a handful of people? I would assume that means more than 2 yet you only list Caffeine and myself. To me this seems you are trying to be non-committal and hide your opinions. That seems scummy to me to be honest.

Sorry for not being clear enough.

I don't feel good about a handful of people (about half the remaining players).

You want the full list?

Other than the 2 I already mentioned, Virus, IB, Rishaed, Rugbirn and Nag/Greg.

Come up with a better argument that doesn't include WIFOM today and I'll address it. I think it's possible betiko has some kind of result he wants to check against iAmCaffeine's claim. If you can't catch that subtle hint out of my posts I don't know why you think you can draw so much out of the word "wasn't". [/b].

I caught the hint and I've explained why it's unreasonable to give Betiko's case a high level of trust on the offchance he has an investigative role and found something potentially incriminating about Caffeine.

[Rodion]

I'm a firm believer that lynching day 1 is good for town, and to have someone in the game who is "consistent with no voting day 1" is sort of weird. Just seems like a cop out, possibly makes it hard for scum to find reason to kill you since you didn't do anything day 1, and makes it hard for people to build a case against you or agree with you as well.

viewtopic.php?p=3626101#p3626101

and

viewtopic.php?p=3703234#p3703234

That's where it all started. It helps me win games because it helps me survive, irrespective of whether I'm town or mafia. I'm really glad it has been incorporated to my meta.

Sure he is pushing cooldeals a little, can't tell if its "get the facts right" or "cool deals is scummy cause he keeps messing up the facts"

The facts that I'm trying to get right will determine the scuminess or non-scuminess of my CD read. Right now I'm not liking CD.

What i do find funny about this cooldeals vs Rodion interaction is the "grammar" stuff. I know i have terrible grammar and spelling, yet Rodion has not jumped on me for that.

Hopefully my last post to CD clarified that it had nothing to do with spelling.

I also don't see it as a grammar issue. I see it as a "this doesn't sound right issue" that is potentially being discredited when people reduce it to "mere grammar".


@Rishaed - can you clarify on the hipocrisy of the 2 red-highlighted CD statements?

@IB - funny thing is I REALLY didn't understand what he meant! And that was a nasty day indeed!

[strike wolf]

Official vote count

iAmCaffeine (2)-betiko, Cooldeals
Rishaed (1)-Virus90
Gregwolf121 (1)-X-Stor-x
Cooldeals (1)-Rishaed

With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch. Deadline is Monday, March 17th.

[StorrZerg]

HMMM anyone want to still defend Gregwolf121?

[TheForgivenOne]

So I'm sick as hell right now.

@IAC, thanks for clarifying about the 3rd party. Unvote.

As regards to the other cases, I want to reread them when my head isn't pounding, but quick thoughts.

Greg- Where are you? Might be best to pressure him.

CD/Rodion - I simply couldn't comprehend the case with how bad my head hurts.

The only thought I have is how useless Rugbirn is being right now. We've pointed out repeatedly on D1 (He was constantly on the roles going in order as well as Anark's Signature having a quote from virus) and D2 (That anark somehow knew Neb was a doctor and the mafia somehow knew that anark knew) that his posts/cases are absolute useless.

[iAmCaffeine]

just some clarifications caff

I can assure you (although it will mean little) that I am far from a threat to town. Considering main characters in the programme, I imagine the mafia faction(s) will be rather small. After seeing the dead roles I doubt there is a second mafia faction, but we could expect third party players. Given the expected size of the scum squad, it would be an extremely high risk move for pancakemix to try and buss someone on d1.
.......
If people want a full claim then I will provide one, but I think it is too early.

why don't you say that you are town instead of a "not a threat to town"? this is what made me think of third party, then the fact that you prepare people to expect a lot of third parties. And regarding the rest.... I don't know how others are not curious to have your full claim after such statements.

I don't think third parties are a bad thing, but it's probably harmless to ask for a claim to understand some mechanics.

Third parties aren't inherently evil, but without a role that helps town, they'll be lynched, due to their wavering loyalties. And I don't think IamCaffeine was softclaiming 3rd party, that's generally not a good thing to do if you want to live.

Although he can't spell my handle, he is correct.

There are still a few players we haven't heard from yet. I'd like them to voice up before going further.

I don't know what "you can't spell my handle" means and if it's a british expression. And here you replyied to jonty's post in the third person... you confused a few of us; I thought you were confirming what I said. "he is right" would refer to me and "you are right" would refer to the erson you are answering to...

Anyway, yes, softclaiming third party is indeed basically putting yourself at L-2, that's why I backpedaled a bit because I thought that if caf did that he had to be telling the truth, a mafia wouldn't softclaim thrid party at that momentum...

Caf; can you confirm you are town and not something else? i want a clear answer.

I don't like to be straightforward usually, it takes a bit of fun out of the game, but yes I am town. How MoB still thought I was claiming third party I have no idea - stop skimming!

Betty, I was never talking in third person. When I said "he mispelt my handle but he is correct", I was talking about jonty. I still think it's fucking stupid how people don't realise that I am talking to or about the last person quoted.

[betiko]

i say something->jonty replies to me-> you reply to jonty. Next time, just say "you are correct", there would be no confusion possible... and you confused not only me.

Anyway; why would PCM find anything you did on day 1 scummy? I still think it looks like he was keeping distances from you, because you flew well under the radar on day 1.

TFO: why did you unvote caff? you were basically agreeing on my case, him being scum. Then from his reply I kind of understood he was softclaiming third party ("I am far from a threat to town"). He was not; so you unvoted. The case in the first place was him being scum... and it got deviated by this misunderstanding regarding a possible thrid party softclaim. It doesn't change anything to the original case; so what made you change your mind?

regarding rugbirn; unfortunately I doubt he could be of any help, his assumptions are all very wrong, almost as if he was doing it on purpose. I don't think there's much to lose there..

[superkeener]

HMMM anyone want to still defend Gregwolf121?

I agree. More than enough time has been allowed for greg to make some decent contributions.

As far as the whole “typo” thing. I am not interested in it. Maybe it is because that conversation was very hard to follow (even after a few re-reads) and I just don’t think if it is significant.

However, the following comment popped out at me very strongly.

I don't like to be straightforward usually, it takes a bit of fun out of the game, but yes I am town.

The only people that would not be straightforward in Maifa would be scum. I was already on the fence about you, but this shoots you to the top of my list.

VOTE: iAmCaffeine

[MoB Deadly]

I reread Page 13 finally.
iamcaffeine was SUPER wishy-washy.
He has no reasons to hide why he thinks xstor is scum.
Him talking about PRs and Setup is neutral to me.
His town-read on cooldeals doesn't sit right with me. I cannot figure out CD right now and I don't know how he could possibly get a town read on him.
------------------

\How MoB still thought I was claiming third party I have no idea - stop skimming!

Sorry I did miss your repeated posts saying you did not soft-claim 3rd party. However I do not believe you.
------------------
ORIGINAL QUOTE

Okay, I've just about managed to catch up.

Please betty, you need to stop exaggerating so much. I was not totally convinced on who was town, as you said, but I had a couple of townreads. Notice the bold? That is a read, not a statement declaring I am convinced that they're town. I still townread you, since you've chosen someone you have a gut feeling against and you're pushing them; in this case that's me but I don't have a problem with that.

I can assure you (although it will mean little) that I am far from a threat to town. Considering main characters in the programme, I imagine the mafia faction(s) will be rather small. After seeing the dead roles I doubt there is a second mafia faction, but we could expect third party players. Given the expected size of the scum squad, it would be an extremely high risk move for pancakemix to try and buss someone on d1.

I'm intrigued as to how he died though, and why. I, as others have also said, couldn't really see a good reason to suspect him. Although I completely condone those actions!

If people want a full claim then I will provide one, but I think it is too early.

Even after you stated multiple times that you are not softclaiming 3rd party this quote makes it look like you did. The last sentence even hints again that you softclaimed. That does not even touch the whole "you are correct" line.

just some clarifications caff

I can assure you (although it will mean little) that I am far from a threat to town. Considering main characters in the programme, I imagine the mafia faction(s) will be rather small. After seeing the dead roles I doubt there is a second mafia faction, but we could expect third party players. Given the expected size of the scum squad, it would be an extremely high risk move for pancakemix to try and buss someone on d1.
.......
If people want a full claim then I will provide one, but I think it is too early.

why don't you say that you are town instead of a "not a threat to town"? this is what made me think of third party, then the fact that you prepare people to expect a lot of third parties. And regarding the rest.... I don't know how others are not curious to have your full claim after such statements.

Betiko expresses my thoughts here.

I don't like to be straightforward usually, it takes a bit of fun out of the game, but yes I am town.

The only people that would not be straightforward in Maifa would be scum. I was already on the fence about you, but this shoots you to the top of my list.

VOTE: iAmCaffeine

And Superkeener is right on the money here.

Vote iamcaffeine

Gregwolf is definitely on my immediate suspect list as well, due to non-contributions.
Virus dropped down on the scumdar with his attempted case, however I still would like him to be more active in the rest of the cases on the board.
I cannot figure out Left from Right on Rodion/CD.
I still got my eyes on virus and IB from the superkeener wagon. I won't forget about this one easily, as I still think it could be one of the most scummy things that has happened so far.
Some people have been talking about rishead... I havent been able to shift my thinking his way yet with all thats been going on. My initial impressions is that he defended himself just fine.

[gregwolf121]

thanks for those notes of concern, but yes i am still here, had a project take longer to finish than i thought it would.
anywho, i can understand rodion wanting clarification of CD's word use, it was a reasonable question, and then it got blown out of proportion, i don't think a vote is warranted yet but i'll keep this in mind
as for MOB's case on caff, well i didn't read caff's orginal post that way but with the above i see MOB's point, caff's post definitely looks like he was soft-claiming third party, then caff said he hadn't, this now seems to me to be a case of LAL so vote iamcaffeine

[StorrZerg]

HMMM anyone want to still defend Gregwolf121?

I agree. More than enough time has been allowed for greg to make some decent contributions.

As far as the whole “typo” thing. I am not interested in it. Maybe it is because that conversation was very hard to follow (even after a few re-reads) and I just don’t think if it is significant.

However, the following comment popped out at me very strongly.

I don't like to be straightforward usually, it takes a bit of fun out of the game, but yes I am town.

The only people that would not be straightforward in Maifa would be scum. I was already on the fence about you, but this shoots you to the top of my list.

VOTE: iAmCaffeine

That is a really bad comment for you to hammer super
Seems like you waited long enough for something "good enough" to slip onto the wagon. "Rodion does not think straight forward, his meta is to not do anything to day one to live. That act is selfish, that is a scum mindset. (not calling Rodion scum) It could be said that i don't think straight forward, since im used to a different meta. Does that make me scum? of course not. So for you to hammer onto something that seems a bit silly is quite scummy in my eyes.

[iAmCaffeine]

This bandwagon is beautiful! Great job, lmfao.

show: Response to Superkeener

show: Response to MoB

More replies to come later, work is finishing so I have to leave.

[StorrZerg]

@iAmCaffeine i know you have a lot of pressure right now. And its really hard to think straight about a person who votes you, (note the many that have)

I'd be interested if you could give some reads on people who have not looked at you.

[StorrZerg]

also @ virus, anything change lately?

[virus90]

@ mobdaily,

well i try to keep up but with these bursts of posts it is a lot to process sometimes. As can be seen from my big post and in my opinion this one aswell, i tend to explain clearly where my opinion is based on, i thoroughly read the posts and try to make a decent post. This sometimes takes me 1 or 2 hours, not the amount of time i want to spend on a daily basis to this topic. Since im in several other maffia aswell my number of posts might not be high, but in my opinion its about quality and not quantity. I try to give mine a bit more quality.

The iamcaffeine case
First of all let me say; i am biased in my opinion on iamcaffeine since we are in the same clan, i know you should see this apart from the game but i believe there is always some bias. that does not mean i have no opinion on the case. Here it is:
I do not agree with the iamcaffeine case, the votes on him are based on a post in which he says he's no threat to town, and he point out there might be third party's involved. Well to be honest anyone could have said that in my opinion. Since its a 18 player game i am pretty sure that there are third parties involved aswell. (so now people are gonna vote me aswell for saying this? [sarcasm])
even if he is third party that does not mean we should vote him, third parties can be town alligned. maybe even important town alligned. The setup is still largely unknown, we got badger as VT and the drug-lady as maffia. skyler as doctor. Where would you guys put a person like Hank as a DEA cop in this spectrum, or Marie his wife if she is there? or even Walt might be third party for all we know now he is alligned with the drugs and with the family (skyler turned out town) so what is his allignement? Unless anyone has solid leads to why caffeine should be a danger to town im not voting him based on the speculation of him hinting third party. even if he deliberatly hinted third party, why would you do that? its not like maffia would hint they are maffia right? so his hinting third party to be seen as scummy i dont get it.
i do get why people call him defensive and vague etc.

@ greg
I must say greg; you admit to not reading the case thoroughly but you are happy to vote iamcaffeine. besides the case was already rolling when you replied last weekend (march 8 my local time, page 36) so why did you not join it at that time, at that point you said you did a thorough reread, then you said sun 9, page 37; that you wanted to wait for caffeine to respond. and i quote "i'm not going to vote until i believe some one is scum" so now you do believe he is scum?
so FOS gregwolf. (only problem i have with that, is that this is typicaly his meta, but it makes him so damn hard to read, and i think my point is valid)

@ everyone wanting my notes:
i explained the system, that does not mean i will share it, in my opinion i bring enough of my opinions to the table you just got some of it again. Maybe i will trade my notes with you if you post yours first.

i am happy to keep my vote where it is, it was a early vote indeed (@ superkeener page 37), but it was because in my opinion he was active in posting, but not posting much content, only agreeing to simple things as gregwolf is scummarining a bit. not brinigng new information or own opinions. he now joined the vote on cooldeals. in which he says: i had a town feeling day 1, but hey i vote him now. so my vote stays.

got fastposted 4x since i also took a 30 min break from writing this

[betiko]

virus, you didn't understand anything in the caff case, you got it all wrong
(and please: it's mobdeadly, not mobdaily, he is not a newspaper!!! and mafia not maffia)

the case on caf is not about him being third party, the case on caff is about him being scum with PCM, as that is the only lead we have from day 1 and PCM is a proved scum.
Caff's response to my accusations, was basically that post that can be interpretated as caff soft claiming third party. That made me backpedal a bit although I wanted a claim. Everything you are saying about this case is absolutely not what happened, all timings are wrong and you skimmed many things.
Basically:
suspicions on caff -> small wagon forms -> caff says smething that sounds like a thrid party softclaim -> bandwagon loses wagons -> caf confirms he is town -> bandwagon starts again

mob and CD are also clanmates and it's not because of that that they cannot be from different alignments. Of course, there has to be some bias, but it doesn't mean people should blindly trust each other.