Two Sides Mafia: Side A, Endgame, The Old Ways

[new guy1]

there is only town A silly, quit acting like there is another town

I know there is, I was greeting you all! . This town is kind of scary.

[Victor Sullivan]

To see my confirmation, please go to Side B.

-Sully

[drunkmonkey]

confirm

[safariguy5]

I'm firm.

Also, it appears that day already started. Vote Sully because he's always scummy.

[Rodion]

Deadline is pretty short so I think we should be getting down to business.

I'm guessing a 12-player setup has 9 town and 3 mafia. I'm also guessing Mafia A and Mafia B are not exactly the same (roughly 0,6% if roles were random in both games - if they were not random, I'm guessing / made them different because otherwise we'd end up realizing that eventually).

Disregarding 3rd parties (which could exist), there are possibly 4 kinds of players:

town/town
town/mafia
mafia/town
mafia/mafia (roughly 2,72% if roles were randomly selected and if I did not f*ck up the math)

I'd like to try some sort of "plea bargaining" deal with town/mafia and mafia/town players. How does that work? By claiming you're town in one game and mafia in the other (for your safety, you don't have to specify), if I end up seeing you flip mafia in one of the games I'll most likely consider you cleared in the other. If you do not accept the deal and you flip mafia in one of the games, you will not earn any prerogative in the other (in fact, you'll be instantly earning a FOS in the other game as punishment for not being part of the deal).

That said, I'm a town/town player (going with the 9-3 speculation, there are at least 6 town/town players in the game).

Any town/mafia or mafia/town takers?

[pancakemix]

Vote Rodion, as he probably devised that as a mafia/mafia.

[Some7hingCLEVER]

Vote Rodion, as he probably devised that as a mafia/mafia.

lol that is some wierd logic lol nobody is gonna do that as they would just be killed in the mafia game and would win??

[drunkmonkey]

Vote Rodion, as he probably devised that as a mafia/mafia.

lol that is some wierd logic lol nobody is gonna do that as they would just be killed in the mafia game and would win??

vote Some7hingCLEVER until I decipher this.

[Victor Sullivan]

Deadline is pretty short so I think we should be getting down to business.

I'm guessing a 12-player setup has 9 town and 3 mafia. I'm also guessing Mafia A and Mafia B are not exactly the same (roughly 0,6% if roles were random in both games - if they were not random, I'm guessing / made them different because otherwise we'd end up realizing that eventually).

Disregarding 3rd parties (which could exist), there are possibly 4 kinds of players:

town/town
town/mafia
mafia/town
mafia/mafia (roughly 2,72% if roles were randomly selected and if I did not f*ck up the math)

I'd like to try some sort of "plea bargaining" deal with town/mafia and mafia/town players. How does that work? By claiming you're town in one game and mafia in the other (for your safety, you don't have to specify), if I end up seeing you flip mafia in one of the games I'll most likely consider you cleared in the other. If you do not accept the deal and you flip mafia in one of the games, you will not earn any prerogative in the other (in fact, you'll be instantly earning a FOS in the other game as punishment for not being part of the deal).

That said, I'm a town/town player (going with the 9-3 speculation, there are at least 6 town/town players in the game).

Any town/mafia or mafia/town takers?

Rodion, no one in their right mind would take that offer. You're basically asking them to forfeit one of the games.

Vote Rodion

-Sully

[Some7hingCLEVER]

Vote Rodion, as he probably devised that as a mafia/mafia.

lol that is some wierd logic lol nobody is gonna do that as they would just be killed in the mafia game and would win??

vote Some7hingCLEVER until I decipher this.

sorry EBWOP wouldnt ** win

[drunkmonkey]

unvote, as we really don't have time for a joke phase.

I agree that no one is going to play along with Rodion's "plea bargain" idea. Let's assume the 3/9 number is correct. That means each potential lynchee has a 25% chance of success today (with no information). If [player x] declares himself to be mafia/town, the odds of a successful lynch just rose to 50% for [player x]. We'd be silly not to lynch him. The only way out would be to declare himself as a power role on the other side, and now we're outing power roles on D1 (which is generally a bad idea).

[Some7hingCLEVER]

unvote, as we really don't have time for a joke phase.

I agree that no one is going to play along with Rodion's "plea bargain" idea. Let's assume the 3/9 number is correct. That means each potential lynchee has a 25% chance of success today (with no information). If [player x] declares himself to be mafia/town, the odds of a successful lynch just rose to 50% for [player x]. We'd be silly not to lynch him. The only way out would be to declare himself as a power role on the other side, and now we're outing power roles on D1 (which is generally a bad idea).

agree we dont have much time for joke voting since the days are only about a week long

this whole "plea bargain" idea is nonsense who in their right minds (or wrong minds) would say they were mafia to save themselves in another game in which they are town so unless they are already uber sccummy would already be fine it lol no offense it was just a stupid idea

[edocsil]

Halt! For I am FIRM!

Not feeling the town/scum business. Too much WIFOM, and we don't really know the setup. You are assuming random roles assigned in BOTH games, and I do not know why.

[safariguy5]

Assuming someone does take the plea deal, it sets up a huge WIFOM about the player's behavior in both threads. Also, information is not gained until the player is lynched or killed, which doesn't really help determine lynches in the early game. You also assume that mafia is different in both threads, which may not be true.

[jonty125]

vote Rodion. For instantly assuming there are no 3rd party players and asking some people effectively to give up one of the 2 games.

[Rodion]

Are you guys not taking the deal because you are town in both games or because you don't feel the conditions are worth it?

[jonty125]

Take this scenario: I am town/mafia. I could say town/town and then suicide as town where I was town and if I came under pressure as mafia I could say, look I'm a truthful guy - I must be town.

[Rodion]

And who the friggin' hell offered any deals to town/town claims?

[drunkmonkey]

For one, I think it creates a dangerous false sense of security if there is a mafia/mafia who claims mafia/town.

[Rodion]

For one, I think it creates a dangerous false sense of security if there is a mafia/mafia who claims mafia/town.

Is this an answer to this?

Are you guys not taking the deal because you are town in both games or because you don't feel the conditions are worth it?

[edocsil]

For one, I think it creates a dangerous false sense of security if there is a mafia/mafia who claims mafia/town.

Is this an answer to this?

Are you guys not taking the deal because you are town in both games or because you don't feel the conditions are worth it?

Not taking the deal because I assume you are trying to trick me. I don't know your goal, and I could think of a hundred scenarios where some sort of claim biased thing that would be bad for me. You could be a cult recruiter for all I know looking for townies. Your plan offers me no visible benefit and large risks, regardless of my alignment. Why would I even consider it?

[drunkmonkey]

For one, I think it creates a dangerous false sense of security if there is a mafia/mafia who claims mafia/town.

Is this an answer to this?

Are you guys not taking the deal because you are town in both games or because you don't feel the conditions are worth it?

It was an answer to "why aren't you guys taking the deal?", I just didn't choose one of your prepared options. It's because I question the merits to town as a result of the plea bargains. I've mentioned two bad scenarios now - one is outing power roles because they gave us a reason to lynch them by claiming "mafia/town", and the other is handing mafia/mafia an easy fakeclaim in one of their games.

[Rodion]

Not taking the deal because I assume you are trying to trick me. I don't know your goal, and I could think of a hundred scenarios where some sort of claim biased thing that would be bad for me. You could be a cult recruiter for all I know looking for townies. Your plan offers me no visible benefit and large risks, regardless of my alignment. Why would I even consider it?

Interesting.

I would think a town/town player would say they are not taking the deal because they are logically ineligible to a deal that was offered to town/mafia and mafia/town players.

You are not taking the deal because you are afraid of being tricked and even raised, albeit hypothetically, the possibility of a cult recruiter into the game. In an ideal word I'd find that rather telling of alignment, but unfortunately you're not the only one shooting my plan down. Consider yourself FOSed.

It was an answer to "why aren't you guys taking the deal?", I just didn't choose one of your prepared options. It's because I question the merits to town as a result of the plea bargains. I've mentioned two bad scenarios now - one is outing power roles because they gave us a reason to lynch them by claiming "mafia/town", and the other is handing mafia/mafia an easy fakeclaim in one of their games.

What exactly are you envisioning for scenario 1?

Player A claims town/mafia.
Player A gets bandwagonned (before I get a chance to say anything) in the game that he is town.
Player A claims cop/doctor.

Is that it?

Because it doesn't have to play out like this and, the way I envisioned the process, it won't.

As for scenario 2, I said I'd "most likely" consider them cleared. As in they'd go to the bottom of the suspicion list. Doesn't mean I'd be shortsighted enough not to lynch that person after a cop claimed he had innocent results on everyone else. You can call it a "90% clearance" if you will.

Regardless of that, I must ask you, John: if someone were to claim "I am town in one game and mafia in the other", do you think players that are town in both would be more or less likely to win their games?

[Some7hingCLEVER]

Not taking the deal because I assume you are trying to trick me. I don't know your goal, and I could think of a hundred scenarios where some sort of claim biased thing that would be bad for me. You could be a cult recruiter for all I know looking for townies. Your plan offers me no visible benefit and large risks, regardless of my alignment. Why would I even consider it?

Interesting.

I would think a town/town player would say they are not taking the deal because they are logically ineligible to a deal that was offered to town/mafia and mafia/town players.

You are not taking the deal because you are afraid of being tricked and even raised, albeit hypothetically, the possibility of a cult recruiter into the game. In an ideal word I'd find that rather telling of alignment, but unfortunately you're not the only one shooting my plan down. Consider yourself FOSed.

It was an answer to "why aren't you guys taking the deal?", I just didn't choose one of your prepared options. It's because I question the merits to town as a result of the plea bargains. I've mentioned two bad scenarios now - one is outing power roles because they gave us a reason to lynch them by claiming "mafia/town", and the other is handing mafia/mafia an easy fakeclaim in one of their games.

What exactly are you envisioning for scenario 1?

Player A claims town/mafia.
Player A gets bandwagonned (before I get a chance to say anything) in the game that he is town.
Player A claims cop/doctor.

Is that it?

Because it doesn't have to play out like this and, the way I envisioned the process, it won't.

As for scenario 2, I said I'd "most likely" consider them cleared. As in they'd go to the bottom of the suspicion list. Doesn't mean I'd be shortsighted enough not to lynch that person after a cop claimed he had innocent results on everyone else. You can call it a "90% clearance" if you will.

Regardless of that, I must ask you, John: if someone were to claim "I am town in one game and mafia in the other", do you think players that are town in both would be more or less likely to win their games?

Dude...i guess u think makes complete sense but it doesn't ...who would say that there mafia in one game ..then they could be bandwagoned as u said and if they show up mafia great there cleared woohoo but if they dont then we just gave up a town to find a mafia in a different game which means in one fame they lost a random town it goes to night and the mafia gets a free kill

The amount of holes in your logic is not many but it only takes one for mafia to slip by and go through the game easy

[shieldgenerator7]

I'll take your deal rodion! I'm mafia/mafia. In fact, I'm Godfather in both games.

no srsly I can't take the deal cause I'm not town/mafia.

I would comment on it more, but it seems others have covered it. It's great playing with you again Rodion, been a long time since NBC / UNKNOWN.

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-SG7 ( )