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Heaven vs Hell | Circles of Hell | Dante's Inferno etc.

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Heaven vs Hell | Circles of Hell | Dante's Inferno etc.

Postby Virus(eX)Urban on Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:30 am

Ok, so this is my first map and first post on these forums. Be grateful that I play another game and that is where I spam. :D

Anyways, here goes and before someone asks the stupid question, yes it was made in paint. :P

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Questions/Comments/Concerns/Additions, are all welcomed. :P

Also, I'll be adding more shit into it, to make it loos less paint like. >.< And I'll try to connect the territories better aswell, but it's damn hard to make shapes with MS Paint. :lol: So excuse me on that.
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Postby BelJoDoe on Sun Jul 22, 2007 6:11 am

You're right, the look is fairly bad ;-) ... and I'm not very 'keen' on your borders and bonuses, as is (they look a little rushed and ill conceived)... BUT, I think the idea's kinda nice and I think that with a great deal of effort on your part and perhaps from others too, the map could be a visual treat and very fun to play on.

I do have a suggestion and that is, rather than making a map of Hell, you could expand the idea and make it a map of the wars between Heaven and Hell, with Earth caught in between. Both concepts (Heaven and Hell) have been explored to a great extent by pretty much every culture on Earth, from Buddhist-based cultures to the various monotheistic cultures. I think with a little research, a trip to your local library (to collect Dante's Divine Comedy... get one illustrated by Dore, it might inspire you) and much usage of the internet, you'll find yourself with a great deal of background information, enough to make this map 'great'.
... of course, it'd be a lot of hard work, so if you want to ignore all that I've just written, that's fine ;-)


In order to do such a map justice, of course, you'd need more than just Paint... fortunately, it seems the community here has done all the leg-room in providing the following thread to help you:
http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1410



Additional:
Planescape: Torment (a fairly old Baldur's Gate-style RP advernture game) might also be of use in giving you inspiration/ideas, as well as being a great deal of fun!
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needs work

Postby Keredrex on Sun Jul 22, 2007 12:47 pm

Map needs alot of work....

I am already working on Dante's Divina Comedia ( Divine comedy )....
But that is also only ONE Version Of Heaven, Purgatory & Hell.... Amongst How many Others.... I see no reason why you can't do Something with this theme based off another interpretation of Heaven & Hell... It could be very interesting
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Postby tlrb609 on Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:21 pm

:twisted:
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Postby Hitman079 on Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:32 pm

salvation is shaped like mickey mouse..there will be some copy right infringement there. you should rename and remap the territories, such as for the different sections of punishment (like from Dante's Inferno).
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salvation: The battel of heven and hell

Postby tlrb609 on Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:35 pm

im thinking of this 9 continents

Heaven made of 3 continents

Earth made of 4 continents

and Hell made of 2 continents


of course heaven will be at the top Earth in the middle and Hell at the bottom

Hell will have satin's realm and the tauther chambers

Heaven will have Gods throne, gates of judgment and paradise

not shore about earth yet its only a rough idea but im gonna keep working on it i have always had this idea what do you think

also ill be working on a map for this map idea


(i didn't write this post it was my brother on my computer) :x
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Postby biotxlub on Thu Aug 16, 2007 7:02 pm

Hi,

It's a creative idea, but in my experience, being a moderator and running a forum, it wouldn't be a good idea to bring any sort of religion or religious aspect into the game. It will almost definitely turn into a bad idea all around, and bring out alot of people that turn this into a really, really, really big religious fight. I've seen it happen before.

Just my two cents. :)
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Postby unriggable on Thu Aug 16, 2007 7:15 pm

I think a greek mythology version (since nobody believes that shit) would work. Or a zoroastrian map, since that is almost parallel to Christianity.
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Postby y-it on Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:01 pm

best idea ever who ever thought that deserves an award :D
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Dante's Inferno....Circles of Hell, etc.

Postby Phil1580 on Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:29 pm

New player here....but if anyone has ever read Dante's Divine Comedy, it's very structured and divided...."The Inferno" depicts Hell with its Nine Circles and areas very clearly. This would make a great map. The lesser known books "Purgatorio" and "Paradiso" also depict Purgatory and Heaven in structured ways....but The Inferno would probably work best/be most popular.
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Postby Inhuman14 on Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:00 pm

It might work, but it would make the most sense to have all of them in the same map.
Ideas in progress:
Average points count of enemies in profile page
http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=70340&st=0&sk=t&sd=a
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Postby dustn64 on Tue Oct 30, 2007 6:59 pm

Its in progress, problems with HTML or something.
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Postby Keredrex on Wed Oct 31, 2007 1:07 am

already working on it waiting for more updates on xml and map sizes.... tryin to scale it down to make it work with current size
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Postby Phil1580 on Wed Oct 31, 2007 2:03 am

Awesome, sounds good. I'll play that one.
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Dante's Inferno

Postby Tieryn on Tue Jan 22, 2008 4:33 am

So, I was thinking of a map of Dante's Inferno, or the Circles of Hell. Indeed, after a little bit of research, this becomes part one of a series of three maps, with the next two being Dante's Purgatory and Dante's Paradise (or the Terraces of Purgatory and the Spheres of Heaven).

Again, I'm not an artist, so I'd need someone with graphics skills to come on board, but I am a programmer, so I'll do the XML :P and I'll also do some research and ideas. I'll post what I've started below

Dante's Inferno:

I envision this as a series of concentric circles, with a pathway winding its way through them perhaps? Or perhaps the pathway as the spiral, with each circle as a separate section image, a-la Bamboo Jack? Not sure exactly... Between each circle is a guardian usually, so I think the idea of a central spiral, with extended limbs perhaps?

Important Features:

:::Prior to entering Hell:::
Virgil - Roman Poet who guides Dante through Hell
Dante - He who journeys
Beasts: A Lion, A Leopard, A She-Wolf

>>>The Opportunists>>>
> Pope Celestine V
> Pontius Pilate
> Neutrals in the Rebellion of Angels
> Wasps
> Hornets
> Maggots (punishing the opportunists)

The Gate to Hell: "Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate", or "Abandon all hope, ye who enter here"
Shores of the Acheron: A branch of the River Styx to be crossed to enter hell
Charon: The ferryman who carries Virgil and Dante across the River Acheron

:::The First Circle - Limbo::: (Similar to Elysian Fields, an earlier, but "deficient" heaven)
The Unbaptized
Virtuous Pagans
Other Non-Christians
Green Fields
Infants stained by Original Sin
>>>A Castle - Dwelling place of the wisest men of Antiquity>>>
> Virgil himself (his home)
> Averroes
> Avicenna (Islamic Philosophers)
> Homer
> Horace
> Ovid
> Lucan (Poets)
> Socrates
> Plato (Philosophers)
> Saladin (Sultan of Egypy/Syria)
Caesar
Brutus
Lucretia
Aristotle
Democritus
Thales
Heraclitus
Euclid
Hector
Aeneas
Epictatus
Ptolemy
Hippocrates
[Obviously we would choose some of these, perhaps grouping them :P]

The Palace of Minos is a big winding structure where people get lost and end up coming alone to face
Minos - A Minotaur who stands at the end of the first circle and judges sinners, sentencing them to one of 8 lower circles
A one way set of stairs leads down into the second circle, or Minos can cast sinners into each of the levels of hell by wrapping his tail around them, the number of loops indicating which level of hell. I thought we could do this by the number of armies on Minos (mod 9) would determine which level of hell he could attack. 5 armies could attack level 5, 9 armies, level 9, 10 armies, level 1, etc. Again, I don't know if this is programmable, but would be cool.

"Circles 2-5 are the sins of Incontinence, wrong actions through inadequate control of natural appetites/desires"

:::The Second Circle - Lust:::
The steps from limbo peter out into a rocky 45 degree slope
A violent Storm blows souls about to and fro with no hope of rest, the winds of passion
Francesca da Rimini and
Paolo (her husbands brother) committed adultery
Kelevra and
Noirsa are Pagan souls in the second circle
All the great lovers are here - Semiramis, Cleopatra, Helen, Achilles, Paris, Tristan
Standing on the ground in the Second Circle are unsuccessful lovers attempting to be caught up by the winds of passion.

At the end of the slope ends the broad ledge of the Second Circle
On the edge of the cliff grows a single contorted tree
At the top of this tree grows a fruit. To advance to the next circle this fruit must be eaten.
It only reappears every once in a while (I think this could be a one way attack path, only useable once every 3 rounds if this could be coded)

:::The Third Circle - Gluttony:::
The gluttons are forced to lie in the mud under continual cold rain and hail
They are guarded by Cereberus, the 3 headed Dog of Hell
Ciacco (also called Hog) talks with Dante here
Aecrid
November Rain
Sumac
Jack

:::The Fourth Circle - The Hoarders and Spendthrifts:::
Entering the fourth circle, one meets Plutus, the god of Wealth
In this circle, the sinners are divided into two raging mobs.
Each mob is pushing madly at a great boulder-like weight (huge faceted diamonds, surfaces dulled by time)
One mob yells "Why Waste" the other mob yells "Why Hoard"
Until they crush their boulders together, they then push them apart again, and repeat

Allister Toomey sits in the middle getting crushed by the boulders (then resurrected and done again)

To advance to the next circle, a battle must be fought between two sinners,
The winner becomes the wrathful and the loser becomes the Sullen

:::The Fifth Circle - The River Styx:::
Wounds inflicted here will never heal and the comfort of death does not exist (not sure how to game-ise this)
This circle consists of a stinking swamp, mostly hidden by thick fog (I wonder, perhaps Fog always, even in no fog games?)

The Wrathful fight each other on the surface
The Sullen lie under the river, bubbling away

Phlegyas transports Dante and Virgil across on his Skiff
They are accosted by Filippo Argenti along the way.

They reach the Stygian Marsh, and then the City of Dis (containing the active, not passive sinners)

:::The City of Dis:::
The walls are guarded by fallen angels
In the city is the Human Bureaucracy of Hell - a vast organisation that wastes everyone's time doing things that aren't helpful.
Furies will appear if one loiters too long, flapping down from the sky,
and call upon Medusa to turn the loiterers into stone and keep them in Hell forever.

:::The Sixth Circle - The Heretics:::
a countryside of pain and anguish, teeming with tombs
Divided into two parts:
One part is a plain of flinty ground dotted with the iron tombs of heretics, Dante talks to
Farinata degli Uberti and
Cavalcante de' Cavalcanti here

The other part of Dis is a huge white marble mausoleum, Behind each slab is imprisoned an unbeliever
square-cut marble slabs each of which has a brass plate listing name, birth date and date of death
In other places the walls are lined with densely-packed niches, each with an urn in it
In yet others there are short alcoves with huge, ornate tombs in various styles
Some of the corridors of the mausoleum lead back to the iron walls of Dis
Other halls lead to the drop-off into the Seventh Circle.

Inward from the torn-down gate in the wall of Dis is a craggy landslide
At the edge of the Sixth Circle a disgusting stench arises from below. This is so strongly offensive that travellers may have to wait to become accustomed to it.

:::The Seventh Circle - The Violent:::
This circle holds those condemned for Brutishness or Bestiality
The guardian of this circle is the Minotaur
This Circle is divided into three rings, each with different types of sinners
--RING I - THE RIVER PHLEGETHON - TYRANTS AND MURDERERS
River Phlegethon (also known as the River Phlegyas), a river of boiling blood
Fierce Centaurs roam the banks.
leader of the Centaurs is Chiron
Nessus, another Centaur, was appointed by Chiron to guide Dante and Virgil

one sunken wooden sailing ship immersed in it. This contains slave traders
an island, entirely made up of officials who knowingly let criminals go free

In one place a stream of the blood leaves the River Phlegethon and flows downwards through the rest of this Circle towards the drop into the Eighth Circle.

---RING II - VIOLENCE AGAINST SELF
those who raised a hand against themselves, such as in suicide,
or those who gamble all their wealth away and weep when they should have rejoiced.

violent against themselves are eternally destroyed by Harpies in the Wood of the Suicides
souls of the suicides are encased in thorny trees, only able to speak when attacked by harpies

Running through the wood are the Violent Wasters
Pursued by wild dogs who would tear them apart

The polluters also make up a section of this ring, wastelands of oil and rubbish

---RING III - VIOLENCE AGAINST GOD AND NATURE
those who were violent against God in life
blasphemers, usurers and sodomites
Plain of Burning Sand - The Abominable Sands

Blasphemers, who were violent against God, are stretched supine and naked upon the ground under the burning rain
Sodomites, also naked, must wander forever on those hot sands, or squat with their arms about themselves.
Usurers, who were in life violent against art, must crouch on the hot sand with heavy moneybags around their necks.
Loan Sharks are the modern Usurers, and are also condemned here.

:::The Eighth Circle - Malebolge - The Fraudulent:::
BOLGE I/THE FIRST EVIL DITCH - PANDERERS AND SEDUCERS
BOLGE II/THE SECOND EVIL DITCH - FLATTERERS
BOLGE III/THE THIRD EVIL DITCH - SIMONIACS
BOLGE IV/THE FOURTH EVIL DITCH - SORCERERS, SOOTHSAYERS AND FORTUNE TELLERS
BOLGE V/THE FIFTH EVIL DITCH - BARRATORS AND GRAFTERS
BOLGE VI/THE SIXTH EVIL DITCH - HYPOCRITES
BOLGE VII/THE SEVENTH EVIL DITCH - THIEVES
BOLGE VIII/THE EIGHTH EVIL DITCH - FRAUDULENT COUNSELLORS/DECEIVERS
BOLGE IX/THE NINTH EVIL DITCH - SOWERS OF DISCORD, SCANDAL AND SCHISM
BOLGE X/THE TENTH EVIL DITCH - THE FALSIFIERS

Then an empty rocky land (perhaps reserved for new sins, not made up yet)

THE WELL OF GIANTS
On the far side of this land enormous giants are buried from the navel down in the ground.
The giant Antaeus can be persuaded to carry travellers to the Ninth Circle
Another of the other giants is Nimrod, the supposed builder of Babylon
A third is named Ephialtes, a giant son of Poseidon from Greek mythology

:::The Ninth Circle - Cocytus - The Traitors:::
four Regions
CAINA - TRAITORS TO KINDRED
ANTENORA - TRAITORS TO THEIR COUNTRY
PTOLOMEA - TRAITORS TO THEIR GUESTS OR HOST
JUDECCA - TRAITORS TO THEIR BENEFACTORS

THE EXIT FROM HELL
To exit Hell, one must climb down the body of Lucifer, which is covered in shaggy hair; the ice stops a yard or so from Lucifer himself. If one climbs down for long enough, one eventually feels as if one is climbing up again. This marks that one is crossing the centre of the earth, or "the point to which all weight from every part is drawn". One then makes their way up to a type of hollow tomb, a echoing grotto of dimly lit grey rock, from the floor of which the hooves of Lucifer project upwards, upside-down from this perspective. A stream of clear, sweet water runs through this grotto.

This place serves as the exit of Hell and entrance to Purgatory. Its roof goes up thousands of miles, tapering gradually until the opening into Purgatory is reached. This distance must be climbed, and when it is the travellers finally make their way to the surface, where they come "out to see once more the stars" on the shore at the base of Mount Purgatory...



So - anyone still reading? Heh... I think there's a lot of potential here. I'm going to do up some sketches of possible ways to implement this, if anyone else has any ideas, especially in a gameplay sense, I'd love to hear them.
Last edited by Tieryn on Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby MrBenn on Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:44 am

There's quite a lot here, and I'm still not sure how you see it in practice...

You probably need to get at least a sketch posted of how you see this working before people will make any helpful comments.
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Postby the_fatty on Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:50 am

looks like you did a lot of reaseach :D


im ok at graphics (just gto GIMP, still learning to use all of its feaures...) but if noone else will help u make it, then i will, so PM if u want any amatuer help. :D
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Postby Lone.prophet on Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:57 am

ill be willing to do the graphics :)

maybe post a sketch so people will understand itt better

^^ how you will do the territory distrubution
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Postby Keredrex on Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:18 pm

I already started on this and was waiting for XML Updates
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Postby Lone.prophet on Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:39 pm

^^ cant find your thread

and what XML update did you want?
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Postby I GOT SERVED on Tue Jan 22, 2008 5:18 pm

I love the idea, and I'd like to see someone(s) attempt this. Sounds complicated, but I have faith that this idea is in the right hands.
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Postby Tieryn on Tue Jan 22, 2008 10:18 pm

^^ All I managed to find were a couple of posts in the map ideas thread... If you've got any further developed ideas, and you'd like to collaborate, please post them. I noticed you said your map would include purgatory and paradise, but I really think these should be three separate maps, if they want to be developed in detail far enough. (although a single, consolidated, three map journey map, a-la-Western+Eastern Front would be phenomenally huge, and lots of fun!)

If you've got any more developed info, please share it. I'd like to push this idea forward.
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Postby Erdem559 on Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:52 am

Show us a rough draft because I'm to lazy to read all your wrighting.
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Postby bryguy on Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:36 am

Erdem559 wrote:Show us a rough draft because I'm to lazy to read all your wrighting.


i hear ya, i am also to lazy to, although i spend like 10 minutes reading every post on 3 page boards sometimes :lol:
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Postby Tieryn on Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:46 am

rough draft is in the conceptual stages at the moment, it's kind of a hard concept to map/visualise, dealing with the underworld and all, not exactly the most three dimensional of places, but I'm coming up with a few ways and I should get something out within the next few days.

I envision 4 discs, slowly getting smaller, to a river, then a wall, and a city/graveyard/mausoleum, then a river of blood, with some rings, down to a barren plain , through to some giants around a well, then down the well to an ice field, finally finishing up with Lucifer at the bottom...

Of course... fitting this into a map is my next challenge.
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