Conquest of London [v13]

[danoprey]

Hello, here is my first ever map attempt with my suggested initial placements:
v13:

Click image to enlarge.

Territories: 78
Bonus Regions: 20
Victory Conditions: 1

Unique location: No London Maps

Unique Gameplay: Players start at one of zone 1's busiest commuter stations and have to use the tube to get around and conquer regions. Territories cannot attack each other, they can only attack/be attacked to/from bordering tube stations.

Issues:

- Copyright. The idea of a London Underground map has been brought up many times before and killed due to copyright issues. I believe I get around this by having a geographical layout and so not using the classic design. I also don't use the logo, or name 'London Underground'.

- Regions. Holding the lines will be very hard/impossible I think. I have added regions which players must get to, take and hold to get the bonuses. This is inline with the idea that you have to get around London on the Tube. All bonuses are a rough starting point, feel free to comment.

- May struggle to fit it all on a small version, I will look in to this.

To Do:

- Fix distortion problem with place army circles.

NB: I know Shoreditch isn't in Islington, but the map can't be perfectly accurate!

Thoughts?

[danoprey]

Right, I just read up on all the old threads on this (there are a lot) and it seems to me that if I get rid of the underground logo (obvious breach) then it might be OK?

Seems to me the only copyright they have is to the actual layout of the infographic. There's no copyright on the names of the stops, or how they connect, so since I've changed the layout from the original, shouldn't it be OK?

It's just a geographical map with some lines drawn on that happen to be the same as the tube lines...

Damn shame this map can't be made.

[captainwalrus]

Why can it not be made? Will the London underground care that we are using their rail maps to make a map?
The draft you have made is a really good start.
Maybe, don't make the land territories into actual territories, just add them for the graphics aspect, make it only about the underground.
Also, try to make it more clear what line is what, do you have a map of the underground that you are using as a reference?

[danoprey]

Someone actually went as far as to email them a draft of their tube map. They got a response saying that it did infringe on their copyright as it contained their logo and their info graphic. As I mentioned, I will take the logo out, and I really don't think the graphics infinge, it's just the particular layout and style that are copyrighted.

I think this is fine to go ahead, but I want more people's opinions before going ahead.

I like big maps, and the places not only make it more recognisable, add more territories but also adds an extra aspect to the gameplay rather than it just being just interconnecting lines, which is dull (although I do play Rail USA).

What are people's thoughts? It doesn't seem to be getting much attention here, perhaps I should post the draft in the main forum?

[captainwalrus]

You could probably post this in the drafting room, but you should clean up the bonuses first, since right now I can't really tell what line is in what statinos are part of what line.

[danoprey]

Cool, I will clear that up and add place all the land territories and labels for both.

Yeah, it's a normal tube map of central London. I will add the legend similar to the original.

I just didn't want to do any more work on it if people have already scrapped the idea, but I think this is sufficiently different.

[Nat-ldn]

am loving the map dan looks great. Tiny issue about the geography - picadilly and central connect at holborn, the location of bloomsbury to st pancras and holborn seems to be off. If your going for the stations as the bonuses then having the actual geographic location listed which don't necessarily correspond to the tube stations looks off. But am very impressed. I've been thinking about an idea for a map with the boroughs of london with tube stations connecting.

[danoprey]

Cheers mate!

Yeah, I haven't labelled the tube stations yet, I will do that so it'll be a bit more obvious. The geography can't be perfect, as it'd be really hard to make it workable with the gameplay. It's just a rough first draft, have just been picking area names near the locations. I will do a proper draft when I have time and post it in the main forum, I only posted it as it is now so that people could assess the copyright issue.

[Nat-ldn]

looks sweet, pos too many stations in the territories to make it worhtwhile holding non tube lines, like the idea of splitting up regions with the tube lines, could do less station territories and focus on areas, or all station territories. Is def gonna be great. Shotgun invite on debut on beta

[danoprey]

Right, here's an updated version with less territories and, I think, better graphics.

I haven't finished the labelling yet, but I really have to get back to work.

Click image to enlarge.

[danoprey]

No one like it?

[captainwalrus]

You need to add bonuses. Like hold this whole line and get 2 troops or whatever. then you will have all the things necessary to take this to the drafting room.

[danoprey]

Yes, I've put place holders at the bottom, but haven't set them yet. I will finish labelling everything, make the army icon holders bigger and add speculative bonus', then will post in the main forum.

[Nat-ldn]

Looks really good man, going to be interesting, looks like it'd be easier to hold the territories now

[captainwalrus]

Yes, I've put place holders at the bottom, but haven't set them yet. I will finish labelling everything, make the army icon holders bigger and add speculative bonus', then will post in the main forum.

You should probably change the thread name, to be more informative, then when the requirements are met, just PM thenobodes80 and he can move it to where it needs to go (the drafting room, not main foundry).

[LordDusan]

Nice one Big Man.

[danoprey]

Cheers, mate.

I can't change the thread title, as I did not start it. I will just start a new thread in the Drafts section when I have completed the neccesary steps and we can start afresh there.

[RedBaron0]

Then just start a thread in the Drafting room and inform a CA that this thread is attached to it and they can move the posts from here into that thread.

Make sure your first post has all the draft room requirements in it though!!
Drafting Room Guidelines

[rattius]

thanks for your help, i'm hopeless at designing things, i'll change the name for you, so it can be seen

and i've gotta say, i love the map for it right now

[MrBenn]

Personally I thought your first draft looks much better than your 2nd one - it looks cleaner somehow, and a lot less in your face...

If you're going to pursue this, drop me a PM and I'll move the thread into the drafting room

[danoprey]

Personally I thought your first draft looks much better than your 2nd one

Oh, no. I was waiting for someone to say that.

Bear in mind, the second one has a lot more labels on it, but I do see what you mean.

Others' thoughts?

[Halmir]

Maybe because it's I'm a Londoner .... (it's a song we have here, to be sung whilst being bombed by the Luftwaffe, and other more joyful occasions!). I'd really stick with the London Underground tube map theme. I saw a poster recently where the tube map layout was a direct copy of the actual map, but the station names had been changed to famous actors (art, I guess!). The map I've seen so far is too busy - keep the terrritory ones and just do a separate map for that as it'd work really well, but leave the train stations off it? The Tube map is enormous, a couple of hundred stations so that's some serious coding if attempted. However it would be great (and as I live near Amersham at the top left of the map, I'm gonna go for that area first lol).

However the bonus structure would have to be thought out carefully - if u can capture an entire train line then u have won already, almost all of them go right across the map so u would have to be darn strong to hold a line for a turn.

[danoprey]

Hey Halmir,

I'm also a Londoner (Wimbledon) and I think the London Tube map alone would be great, however the reason I decided to focus on central London and include territories is because:

a) there are copyright issues with using the tube map. I know you mentioned changing the names, but the iconography (if that's a word) is the copyright concern, so it'd end up just being lots of made up names linked by lines that happen to be the same as the underground lines.

b) it makes it more interesting to non-Londoners, which is key. People know the names of the central London territories from Monopoly and other references, so it has a worldwide appeal. We're allowed to use real place names, just not the real London tube map (someone attempted it and was shot down by someone from the London Underground, and it ended up looking horrible in my opinion).

c) The tube map is very linear, with lots of places, such as Wimbledon or Amersham, being a point at the end of a line. This doesn't make for very good gameplay.

d) As you mention, the lines themselves will be very difficult to hold as they have so many interchanges and cover most of the map. Adding territories gives players much smaller and more achievable bonuses to hold. I feel if it were just the lines then most games would just end up as a straight effort to kill the other player without holding regions, which would just come down to dice.

e) Most importantly, I think it'd be more fun. I think the idea that territories can only be attacked by tube stations means people have to travel on the tube to get he bonuses. I may end up taking out any bonuses for the lines themselves as they will be extremely difficult to hold. Maybe even have hold the circle line to win, since it is nearly impossible.

[Gilligan]

I remember a map like this... back when Alexander's Empire was in Final Forge... Let me see if I can dig it up...

EDIT: found it

viewtopic.php?t=1401

[rattius]

i also suggested when i gave this idea that some of the further stations, such as amersham, and rickmansworth (where i am), would have to be excluded, as they are only on the met line, and are therefore only able to be attacked from the stations next to it, and cenral london is all interlinked, so makes for a more competitive game play