Conquer Club

Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

\\OFF-TOPIC// conversations about everything that has nothing to do with Conquer Club.

Moderator: Community Team

Forum rules
Please read the Community Guidelines before posting.

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby AslanTheKing on Sat May 24, 2014 5:23 am

saxitoxin wrote:
AslanTheKing wrote:i think i found one of the biggest problems, america is lacking -
its security,
financial security and social security and health security and education security
and last the security to defend your life with a gun...
a nation of 315 million people
how many of them are jobless, homeless, without healthsecurity.....
read this brainless sample budget yourselve,
written by the most intelligent people u can offer,
u have a gifted continent , u can feed yourselve, your national energy ressources are endless
and still , in your rich country you treat the people the worst, amazing

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/mcdonalds-sample-budget-sheet-is-laughable-but-its-implications-are-not-cm261920
in this link is even a funny video, worth watching it
http://www.motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2013/07/mcdonalds-budget-mcwrap

if u are poor-use it as an opooortunity...


Wait - what? You're mad McDonald's workers in the U.S. are only paid minimum wage ... when there's no minimum wage at all in Germany?!? Am I missing something?

There was a study about a decade ago, I can't find it online but here it is (http://www.amazon.com/Working-McDonalds ... l+Struggle) that found McDonald's workers earn 12% less in Austria and Germany than in any other developed country. So, if based on McDonald's crew shift pay, the U.S. treats people "the worst," then Austria and Germany treat people "12% worse than the worst." Schlimmer als schlimmste!


i understand your point, the only difference here in germany or austria is that we do have a social net for people
who dont earn enough to support themselves,
its true we dont have a minimum wage here, and i am not sure if giving a minimum wage to all will solve the problem,
it will be implemented in 2016, 2017, we dont know yet
my critic is also more about that balance sheet mc -don put public on display

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=202457&p=4437264#p4437264
I used to roll the daizz
Feel the fear in my enemy´s eyes
Listen as the crowd would sing:

Long live the Army Of Kings !


AOK

show: AOK Rocks
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class AslanTheKing
 
Posts: 1223
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:36 am
Location: Hamburg, Germany

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby kuthoer on Sat May 24, 2014 11:45 am

AslanTheKing wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
AslanTheKing wrote:i think i found one of the biggest problems, america is lacking -
its security,
financial security and social security and health security and education security
and last the security to defend your life with a gun...
a nation of 315 million people
how many of them are jobless, homeless, without healthsecurity.....
read this brainless sample budget yourselve,
written by the most intelligent people u can offer,
u have a gifted continent , u can feed yourselve, your national energy ressources are endless
and still , in your rich country you treat the people the worst, amazing

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/mcdonalds-sample-budget-sheet-is-laughable-but-its-implications-are-not-cm261920
in this link is even a funny video, worth watching it
http://www.motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2013/07/mcdonalds-budget-mcwrap

if u are poor-use it as an opooortunity...


Wait - what? You're mad McDonald's workers in the U.S. are only paid minimum wage ... when there's no minimum wage at all in Germany?!? Am I missing something?

There was a study about a decade ago, I can't find it online but here it is (http://www.amazon.com/Working-McDonalds ... l+Struggle) that found McDonald's workers earn 12% less in Austria and Germany than in any other developed country. So, if based on McDonald's crew shift pay, the U.S. treats people "the worst," then Austria and Germany treat people "12% worse than the worst." Schlimmer als schlimmste!


i understand your point, the only difference here in germany or austria is that we do have a social net for people
who dont earn enough to support themselves,
its true we dont have a minimum wage here, and i am not sure if giving a minimum wage to all will solve the problem,
it will be implemented in 2016, 2017, we dont know yet
my critic is also more about that balance sheet mc -don put public on display

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=202457&p=4437264#p4437264

Workers at McDonalds are union and earn approximately $21 per hour.
User avatar
Cadet kuthoer
 
Posts: 304
Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2013 9:19 pm

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby saxitoxin on Sat May 24, 2014 1:16 pm

AslanTheKing wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
AslanTheKing wrote:i think i found one of the biggest problems, america is lacking -
its security,
financial security and social security and health security and education security
and last the security to defend your life with a gun...
a nation of 315 million people
how many of them are jobless, homeless, without healthsecurity.....
read this brainless sample budget yourselve,
written by the most intelligent people u can offer,
u have a gifted continent , u can feed yourselve, your national energy ressources are endless
and still , in your rich country you treat the people the worst, amazing

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/mcdonalds-sample-budget-sheet-is-laughable-but-its-implications-are-not-cm261920
in this link is even a funny video, worth watching it
http://www.motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2013/07/mcdonalds-budget-mcwrap

if u are poor-use it as an opooortunity...


Wait - what? You're mad McDonald's workers in the U.S. are only paid minimum wage ... when there's no minimum wage at all in Germany?!? Am I missing something?

There was a study about a decade ago, I can't find it online but here it is (http://www.amazon.com/Working-McDonalds ... l+Struggle) that found McDonald's workers earn 12% less in Austria and Germany than in any other developed country. So, if based on McDonald's crew shift pay, the U.S. treats people "the worst," then Austria and Germany treat people "12% worse than the worst." Schlimmer als schlimmste!


i understand your point, the only difference here in germany or austria is that we do have a social net for people
who dont earn enough to support themselves,
its true we dont have a minimum wage here, and i am not sure if giving a minimum wage to all will solve the problem


Two questions:

1. What are some specific examples of social welfare programs Germany and Austria have, that the U.S. doesn't have, that would help a low-paid McDonald's worker support themselves?

2. You realize that, in the German system of no minimum wage, you are now responsible to subsidize the McDonald's corporation by paying for social programs that allow them to pay their workers nothing? (Of course, many people who work in McDonald's in Germany are undocumented immigrants you've banned from receiving medical care, so maybe you're not paying that much. That system works as long as Germany can continue importing Turks and Ukrainians to work as your slaves.)
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=241668&start=200#p5349880
User avatar
Corporal saxitoxin
 
Posts: 13392
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 1:01 am

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby Lucky Se7en on Sat May 24, 2014 3:07 pm

KoolBak wrote:
Lucky Se7en wrote:Looks like some nice .338 Lepua rounds in the upper left, those things are massive


Got my 50 cal in the other safe ;o)

What do you have that shoots those? I'd love to get something that can have that kind of power from long range.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Lucky Se7en
 
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2007 2:35 pm

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby AslanTheKing on Sat May 24, 2014 5:40 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
AslanTheKing wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
AslanTheKing wrote:i think i found one of the biggest problems, america is lacking -
its security,
financial security and social security and health security and education security
and last the security to defend your life with a gun...
a nation of 315 million people
how many of them are jobless, homeless, without healthsecurity.....
read this brainless sample budget yourselve,
written by the most intelligent people u can offer,
u have a gifted continent , u can feed yourselve, your national energy ressources are endless
and still , in your rich country you treat the people the worst, amazing

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/mcdonalds-sample-budget-sheet-is-laughable-but-its-implications-are-not-cm261920
in this link is even a funny video, worth watching it
http://www.motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2013/07/mcdonalds-budget-mcwrap

if u are poor-use it as an opooortunity...


Wait - what? You're mad McDonald's workers in the U.S. are only paid minimum wage ... when there's no minimum wage at all in Germany?!? Am I missing something?

There was a study about a decade ago, I can't find it online but here it is (http://www.amazon.com/Working-McDonalds ... l+Struggle) that found McDonald's workers earn 12% less in Austria and Germany than in any other developed country. So, if based on McDonald's crew shift pay, the U.S. treats people "the worst," then Austria and Germany treat people "12% worse than the worst." Schlimmer als schlimmste!


i understand your point, the only difference here in germany or austria is that we do have a social net for people
who dont earn enough to support themselves,
its true we dont have a minimum wage here, and i am not sure if giving a minimum wage to all will solve the problem


Two questions:

1. What are some specific examples of social welfare programs Germany and Austria have, that the U.S. doesn't have, that would help a low-paid McDonald's worker support themselves?

2. You realize that, in the German system of no minimum wage, you are now responsible to subsidize the McDonald's corporation by paying for social programs that allow them to pay their workers nothing? (Of course, many people who work in McDonald's in Germany are undocumented immigrants you've banned from receiving medical care, so maybe you're not paying that much. That system works as long as Germany can continue importing Turks and Ukrainians to work as your slaves.)


well said sax, at least u can see the problem of our social economy
its modern slavery too, people get pushed into doing nothing since its better to not work and get all the social benefits
than to work for 1000 euro per month
and unfortunately the majority of people here who are jobless enjoy this security
getting money per month a .) from the gouvernment, and b.) still working secretly to get extra money
its sad we do have this system
all this foreigners working here lowincome dont speak the language good enough, or dont know their rights how to milk this system...
germany makes the companys richer, as u understand
a company pays 5 euros per hour for his worker ( example), we do have a 40 hour week in germany,
160 x 5 = 800 euro net, makes it to 1000 brutto
lets say he is single, than he has the rights for additional social security money of approximately 200 euros from the state,
means- he will have his 1000 euro net per month
and if he is married ( his wife doesnt work) and has two kids,
than he and his wife will get 700, and additional for every kid 250 euros, in his case 500 for kids, 700 for him and his wife
makes it to = 1200 euros ( note- rent, health care, electricity is free already, and more other benefits which i dont know now ,
i would have to read through it and post later - if u would speak german u can find it yourselve on the net

if the same worker would quit and apply for social security he would get even more money.... sick system :)
he would get 350 per month, he would get paid his rent,health care, electricity, a new kitchen.....
public transportation would be free, tv for free.....
and if he would be smart working secretly somewhere else he could make alot of money

another example from austria now
in austria everybody gets 14 month paid in 12 month,
every 6 month u still get your double wages
my bro earns 5000 euro per month in a big i.t. company, but twice a year he gets 10.000 euros, funny world

i am not a supporter of this german system, but trues is
nobody has to be homeless in germany, those u can see on the streets a.) maybe dont have the rights to milk the system
b.) are to stupid to get their rights ( alcohol, drugs....)
or c.) are illegals from other non eu countrys who mostly come through turkey, greece, or spain, or italy
I used to roll the daizz
Feel the fear in my enemy´s eyes
Listen as the crowd would sing:

Long live the Army Of Kings !


AOK

show: AOK Rocks
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class AslanTheKing
 
Posts: 1223
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:36 am
Location: Hamburg, Germany

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby saxitoxin on Sat May 24, 2014 6:40 pm

AslanTheKing wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
AslanTheKing wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
AslanTheKing wrote:i think i found one of the biggest problems, america is lacking -
its security,
financial security and social security and health security and education security
and last the security to defend your life with a gun...
a nation of 315 million people
how many of them are jobless, homeless, without healthsecurity.....
read this brainless sample budget yourselve,
written by the most intelligent people u can offer,
u have a gifted continent , u can feed yourselve, your national energy ressources are endless
and still , in your rich country you treat the people the worst, amazing

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/mcdonalds-sample-budget-sheet-is-laughable-but-its-implications-are-not-cm261920
in this link is even a funny video, worth watching it
http://www.motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2013/07/mcdonalds-budget-mcwrap

if u are poor-use it as an opooortunity...


Wait - what? You're mad McDonald's workers in the U.S. are only paid minimum wage ... when there's no minimum wage at all in Germany?!? Am I missing something?

There was a study about a decade ago, I can't find it online but here it is (http://www.amazon.com/Working-McDonalds ... l+Struggle) that found McDonald's workers earn 12% less in Austria and Germany than in any other developed country. So, if based on McDonald's crew shift pay, the U.S. treats people "the worst," then Austria and Germany treat people "12% worse than the worst." Schlimmer als schlimmste!


i understand your point, the only difference here in germany or austria is that we do have a social net for people
who dont earn enough to support themselves,
its true we dont have a minimum wage here, and i am not sure if giving a minimum wage to all will solve the problem


Two questions:

1. What are some specific examples of social welfare programs Germany and Austria have, that the U.S. doesn't have, that would help a low-paid McDonald's worker support themselves?

2. You realize that, in the German system of no minimum wage, you are now responsible to subsidize the McDonald's corporation by paying for social programs that allow them to pay their workers nothing? (Of course, many people who work in McDonald's in Germany are undocumented immigrants you've banned from receiving medical care, so maybe you're not paying that much. That system works as long as Germany can continue importing Turks and Ukrainians to work as your slaves.)


well said sax, at least u can see the problem of our social economy
its modern slavery too, people get pushed into doing nothing since its better to not work and get all the social benefits
than to work for 1000 euro per month
and unfortunately the majority of people here who are jobless enjoy this security
getting money per month a .) from the gouvernment, and b.) still working secretly to get extra money
its sad we do have this system
all this foreigners working here lowincome dont speak the language good enough, or dont know their rights how to milk this system...
germany makes the companys richer, as u understand
a company pays 5 euros per hour for his worker ( example), we do have a 40 hour week in germany,
160 x 5 = 800 euro net, makes it to 1000 brutto
lets say he is single, than he has the rights for additional social security money of approximately 200 euros from the state,
means- he will have his 1000 euro net per month
and if he is married ( his wife doesnt work) and has two kids,
than he and his wife will get 700, and additional for every kid 250 euros, in his case 500 for kids, 700 for him and his wife
makes it to = 1200 euros ( note- rent, health care, electricity is free already, and more other benefits which i dont know now ,
i would have to read through it and post later - if u would speak german u can find it yourselve on the net

if the same worker would quit and apply for social security he would get even more money.... sick system :)
he would get 350 per month, he would get paid his rent,health care, electricity, a new kitchen.....
public transportation would be free, tv for free.....
and if he would be smart working secretly somewhere else he could make alot of money

another example from austria now
in austria everybody gets 14 month paid in 12 month,
every 6 month u still get your double wages
my bro earns 5000 euro per month in a big i.t. company, but twice a year he gets 10.000 euros, funny world

i am not a supporter of this german system, but trues is
nobody has to be homeless in germany, those u can see on the streets a.) maybe dont have the rights to milk the system
b.) are to stupid to get their rights ( alcohol, drugs....)
or c.) are illegals from other non eu countrys who mostly come through turkey, greece, or spain, or italy


You didn't answer the question: what specific social welfare benefits does Germany have that the U.S. does not? Unemployment insurance? Old age pensions? Housing subsidies? What?

The reason there are homeless people in the U.S. has almost nothing to do with income access ... 80%+ of homeless people in the U.S. are mentally ill; in 1973 California passed the Lanterman-Petris-Short Act which required all mentally ill people be released from hospital unless they were violent or consented to treatment. Every U.S. state has since passed similar laws. None of the German lander have these kind of laws and the mentally ill are forced into "treatment."

So, smugly enjoy your clean streets. You got them by locking up thousands of innocent people in "hospitals" with bars on the windows, no doctors, and staffed entirely by unpaid and untrained 19 year old conscripts from slave labor states like Thuringia and Brandenburg. sehen Sie kein Übel hören Sie kein Übel
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=241668&start=200#p5349880
User avatar
Corporal saxitoxin
 
Posts: 13392
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 1:01 am

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby patches70 on Sat May 24, 2014 7:38 pm

Saxi, c'mon man, quit bringing up social issues in Germany for Aslan to ponder on and let him pontificate on the US' social problems instead!

It's always easier to look at another's faults instead of eyeing one's own.

I for one, think Germany or whomever can run their own country however the hell they want. For good or bad, it ain't my place to say "You're doing it wrong!". The US, however, can take the beating she receives from the rest of the world. So by all means, if ripping on the US makes one feel better about themselves and their own sense of superiority, then so be it. On behalf of the US I say "You're welcome!"
Private patches70
 
Posts: 1664
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 12:44 pm

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby Phatscotty on Sat May 24, 2014 8:30 pm

Saxi and Patches receive standing ovations for stellar delivery

Image
User avatar
Major Phatscotty
 
Posts: 3714
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:50 pm

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby mrswdk on Sun May 25, 2014 12:02 am

China's leaders have always respected the sovereignty of other states.
Lieutenant mrswdk
 
Posts: 14898
Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:37 am
Location: Red Swastika School

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby BigBallinStalin on Sun May 25, 2014 12:21 am

mrswdk wrote:China's leaders have always respected the sovereignty of other states.


Good one.
User avatar
Major BigBallinStalin
 
Posts: 5151
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:23 pm
Location: crying into the dregs of an empty bottle of own-brand scotch on the toilet having a dump in Dagenham

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby kuthoer on Sun May 25, 2014 6:36 am

mrswdk wrote:China's leaders have always respected the sovereignty of other states.

Must be comedy night at CC
User avatar
Cadet kuthoer
 
Posts: 304
Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2013 9:19 pm

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby Endgame422 on Sun May 25, 2014 11:11 am

mrswdk wrote:China's leaders have always respected the sovereignty of other states.

China has one of those signs like they have in power plants"7 days without stepping on another nations sovereignty" which is only accurate if you do not count the Hong Kong and Macau deal.
User avatar
Lieutenant Endgame422
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2013 2:35 pm
Location: Colorado

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby AslanTheKing on Sun May 25, 2014 3:47 pm



now with the ability of getting guns out of a 3 D printer,
the world will become more crazy
I used to roll the daizz
Feel the fear in my enemy´s eyes
Listen as the crowd would sing:

Long live the Army Of Kings !


AOK

show: AOK Rocks
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class AslanTheKing
 
Posts: 1223
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:36 am
Location: Hamburg, Germany

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby saxitoxin on Sun May 25, 2014 5:42 pm

AslanTheKing wrote:

now with the ability of getting guns out of a 3 D printer,
the world will become more crazy


1 out of every 47 million Americans was killed yesterday in a mass shooting 7,200 kilometers from Aslan = "the world has gone crazy"

1 out of every 3 million Belgians was killed yesterday in a mass shooting 600 kilometers from Aslan = "when is the Eurovision re-run on?"

Elvis would like to weigh-in on this ...

Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=241668&start=200#p5349880
User avatar
Corporal saxitoxin
 
Posts: 13392
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 1:01 am

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby Lucky Se7en on Sun May 25, 2014 5:58 pm

Guns have been around for a long time, there are plenty of them spread out across the world. If you really want to get your hands on them (legal or illegal) it's not that difficult. 3D printers won't have any significant impact on the availability of guns, only how they are registered. I understand the dad in that video is distraught, and I feel bad for him. At the same time though, I think he sounds like I mumbling idiot. The amount of gun deaths are almost insignificant compared to the amount of people that die in automobile accidents. You don't hear people complaining about the rights of civilians to own their personal vehicles. It's because everybody wants the independence to be able to use their car at their own discretion and society is fine with that. The issue of if the liability of owning a gun outweighs the benefits is a whole other issue I don't feel like talking about right now. Statistically speaking there has not been a huge increase in mass shootings like you would think from watching the news and there has been a general decrease in gun related homicides since the early 2000's. The way I see it is a societal and domestic issue. Showing the images of the shooter's face and giving a whole in depth biography on how their life led up to this tragic and hateful ending is only giving the shooter exactly what they wanted and it's going to provoke future shooters. And then that same reporter who just fed all this information and put ideas in the head of some sick freak who read his article writes another article saying how there should be more regulation on guns because they were the reason this happened...what a hypocritical douchebag. Also the Obama administration seemed to make banning certain guns a priority after Sandy Hook. It's ironic because 2 months earlier his administration passed a bill making it more difficult for people with non-physically debilitating illnesses to receive treatment.
User avatar
Sergeant 1st Class Lucky Se7en
 
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2007 2:35 pm

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby Dukasaur on Sun May 25, 2014 6:16 pm

Endgame422 wrote:
mrswdk wrote:China's leaders have always respected the sovereignty of other states.

China has one of those signs like they have in power plants"7 days without stepping on another nations sovereignty" which is only accurate if you do not count the Hong Kong and Macau deal.

... border skirmishes with Vietnam and Laos, intervention in Cambodia, pretty much being the dominant belligerent in the Korean War, the conquest of Sinkiang and Tibet, covert intervention in Burma, not-so-covert intervention in Nepal, the list goes on and on.

Make no mistake. China is an expansionist imperialist power. On the north and west, its expansion has mainly been curtailed by the logistical nightmare of the Himalayas, the Gobi, and the taiga. On the east and south, its expansion has been curtailed mainly by the fact that other imperialist powers -- first the Arabs, then the Europeans, then Japan, and finally the U.S. -- got there first and until recently China didn't have the firepower to argue with them. That is no longer the case, and China will be the Hun of the 21st century.
“‎Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget to sing in the lifeboats.”
― Voltaire
User avatar
Lieutenant Dukasaur
Community Team
Community Team
 
Posts: 28068
Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:49 pm
Location: Beautiful Niagara
32

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby mrswdk on Sun May 25, 2014 9:34 pm

Blood-curdling speech, Duke. Really shook out the cobwebs.

Dukasaur wrote:pretty much... the dominant belligerent in the Korean War


For real? China wasn't involved at all until the US piled hundreds of thousands of troops into the Korean Peninsula and went on a rampage.

If you're genuinely interested then I can write a longer post about those other tussles, and why they are not examples of Chinese imperialism, too.
Lieutenant mrswdk
 
Posts: 14898
Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:37 am
Location: Red Swastika School

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby mrswdk on Sun May 25, 2014 9:36 pm

@EndGame Hong Kong and Macau were issues of national sovereignty (the clue is in the names)
Lieutenant mrswdk
 
Posts: 14898
Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:37 am
Location: Red Swastika School

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby BigBallinStalin on Sun May 25, 2014 11:40 pm

mrswdk wrote:Blood-curdling speech, Duke. Really shook out the cobwebs.

Dukasaur wrote:pretty much... the dominant belligerent in the Korean War


For real? China wasn't involved at all until the US piled hundreds of thousands of troops into the Korean Peninsula and went on a rampage.

If you're genuinely interested then I can write a longer post about those other tussles, and why they are not examples of Chinese imperialism, too.


Yeah, go ahead. I'd like you to explain how the PRC didn't first send 200k+ troops into North Korea and then attack South Korea.
User avatar
Major BigBallinStalin
 
Posts: 5151
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:23 pm
Location: crying into the dregs of an empty bottle of own-brand scotch on the toilet having a dump in Dagenham

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby BigBallinStalin on Sun May 25, 2014 11:42 pm

mrswdk wrote:@EndGame Hong Kong and Macau were issues of national sovereignty (the clue is in the names)


China is like any other state. It will take whatever it can. It doesn't matter if other places were thriving without its help. Any state wants tax revenues, and China--like others--will take the cheapest means to reclaim those revenues.

On net, the world would've been better had Macau and Hong Kong been completely autonomous, but of course that wouldn't have maximized the PRC's profits.
User avatar
Major BigBallinStalin
 
Posts: 5151
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:23 pm
Location: crying into the dregs of an empty bottle of own-brand scotch on the toilet having a dump in Dagenham

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby mrswdk on Mon May 26, 2014 5:43 am

HK was a Chinese city. Then the British attacked and forced China to concede it. I see no reason why HK shouldn't go back to China.

Anyway, what autonomy does Hong Kong lack?
Lieutenant mrswdk
 
Posts: 14898
Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2013 10:37 am
Location: Red Swastika School

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby BigBallinStalin on Mon May 26, 2014 11:47 am

mrswdk wrote:HK was a Chinese city. Then the British attacked and forced China to concede it. I see no reason why HK shouldn't go back to China.

Anyway, what autonomy does Hong Kong lack?


Well, I already mentioned the reason as to why the PRC wants HK--it's not just a historic case, e.g. see the rocks and reefs China is currently feuding over. Historic cases are only made when they're favorable. It's still about that 'cash money' and states being belligerent to get what they want.

Do you really think the PRC has no political influence over HK? From what I recall, things in the HK are politically the same except there's a Chinese govt. official who changes whatever he doesn't like. That doesn't seem as democratic as before.
User avatar
Major BigBallinStalin
 
Posts: 5151
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:23 pm
Location: crying into the dregs of an empty bottle of own-brand scotch on the toilet having a dump in Dagenham

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby Dukasaur on Mon May 26, 2014 12:35 pm

mrswdk wrote:Blood-curdling speech, Duke. Really shook out the cobwebs.

Dukasaur wrote:pretty much... the dominant belligerent in the Korean War


For real? China wasn't involved at all until the US piled hundreds of thousands of troops into the Korean Peninsula and went on a rampage.

If you're genuinely interested then I can write a longer post about those other tussles, and why they are not examples of Chinese imperialism, too.

Sure. Feel free to explain what Chinese historical interest is served by enforcing regime change in Nepal.
“‎Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget to sing in the lifeboats.”
― Voltaire
User avatar
Lieutenant Dukasaur
Community Team
Community Team
 
Posts: 28068
Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:49 pm
Location: Beautiful Niagara
32

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby patches70 on Mon May 26, 2014 12:57 pm

Dukasaur wrote:
mrswdk wrote:Blood-curdling speech, Duke. Really shook out the cobwebs.

Dukasaur wrote:pretty much... the dominant belligerent in the Korean War


For real? China wasn't involved at all until the US piled hundreds of thousands of troops into the Korean Peninsula and went on a rampage.

If you're genuinely interested then I can write a longer post about those other tussles, and why they are not examples of Chinese imperialism, too.

Sure. Feel free to explain what Chinese historical interest is served by enforcing regime change in Nepal.


Because Nepal is next to Tibet? Hahaha,

If I read the history correctly, Nepal brought the communist Maoists into power through democratic vote. Which of course led to violence. Right?

I also seem to remember not too long ago something about a crown prince of Nepal going on a shooting spree and wasting the king and a bunch of other family members. Maybe it was somewhere else but I thought it was in Nepal.

But I'm pretty sure Nepal is a parliamentary republic that is led by communists. China did that? (I don't know, that's why I'm asking). I didn't know China was involved that much with Nepal, other than the standard treaties and what not. Pretty sure Nepal and China have fought each other in the past, and Nepal lost, a long time ago. Maybe that's historic enough?

Nothing shows subservience much better than getting your ass whipped in a fight and bowing down in surrender. And didn't Nepal invade Tibet once? Or twice? Why how dare they! Anybody who messes with Tibet must be assholes!

That's PC, right? Standing up for Tibet (but not actually doing anything except express outrage?). If so, PC indignation, Check.


Seriously, China is as much assholes as anyone else. Nations do what they do and always try to spin their actions in a positive light. Truth is not relevant.
Private patches70
 
Posts: 1664
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 12:44 pm

Re: Shame on you USA and your right to OWN guns

Postby Dukasaur on Mon May 26, 2014 3:48 pm

patches70 wrote:
Dukasaur wrote:
mrswdk wrote:Blood-curdling speech, Duke. Really shook out the cobwebs.

Dukasaur wrote:pretty much... the dominant belligerent in the Korean War


For real? China wasn't involved at all until the US piled hundreds of thousands of troops into the Korean Peninsula and went on a rampage.

If you're genuinely interested then I can write a longer post about those other tussles, and why they are not examples of Chinese imperialism, too.

Sure. Feel free to explain what Chinese historical interest is served by enforcing regime change in Nepal.


Because Nepal is next to Tibet? Hahaha,

If I read the history correctly, Nepal brought the communist Maoists into power through democratic vote. Which of course led to violence. Right?

I also seem to remember not too long ago something about a crown prince of Nepal going on a shooting spree and wasting the king and a bunch of other family members. Maybe it was somewhere else but I thought it was in Nepal.

But I'm pretty sure Nepal is a parliamentary republic that is led by communists. China did that? (I don't know, that's why I'm asking). I didn't know China was involved that much with Nepal, other than the standard treaties and what not.

Well, it was, as you say, democratic elections. Except that the rural areas were completely controlled by Maoist bandits. Non-communist politicians would go out to the villages to make speeches and present their point of view, and they would vanish. The earth just swallowed them up, or maybe they were abducted by flying saucers. For whatever reasons, they would go out to the villages to speak, and they were never seen again. After a while, the non-communist parties couldn't find any volunteers willing to go out to the villages to speak. Can't imagine why.

Western reporters would go out to interview the bandits, and they would notice a curious fact. The bandits would have Chinese advisors, and when the Western reporters would ask them a question, the bandits would glance over at their Chinese advisors before answering. Almost as if the Chinese were in charge, and the bandits were looking for approval or permission to speak.

The Nepalese elections were probably as democratic as, for instance, the Czechoslovak elections of 1948. Which is to say, not completely undemocratic, but substantially so, and largely controlled by military operatives of a foreign power.


patches70 wrote:Seriously, China is as much assholes as anyone else. Nations do what they do and always try to spin their actions in a positive light. Truth is not relevant.

Oh, absolutely. And trust me, I'm not some hypocrite that's going to tell you that those guys are evil so our guys are good. I think the leaders of China are wicked thugs that deserve to be guillotined. I believe the leaders of the U.S.A. are wicked thugs that deserve to be guillotined. I believe the leaders of Russia are wicked thugs that deserve to be guillotined. I believe the leaders of Germany are wicked thugs that deserve to be guillotined. I believe the leaders of Algeria are wicked thugs that deserve to be guillotined.

Shit floats to the top. That is an immutable fact of politics. In any hierarchical organization, the attributes required to rise to the top are dishonesty, ruthlessness, and callous disregard for the concerns of others. The larger the organisation is, the stronger this tendency gets, so that a major nation is 99.999% certain to have a leader who is an evil thug. An honest man might beat the odds and become mayor of a small town, but he isn't going to become the leader of any nation larger than Denmark. And even in Denmark, the odds are long and hard against him.

Human instincts have evolved to make good choices of leader when we work in groups on natural human scales: 30 to 50 individuals. As the group expands beyond that size, and the basic human dynamics are replaced by a need for mass communication, our instinctive ability to judge people's motives by their facial expression, etc., are defeated, and we become sitting ducks for propaganda and organisational manipulation.

I wasn't discussing China because of any special animosity to China, but only because I was incensed by mrswdk's sanctimonious comments that China has never troubled her neighbours. There are a lot of historical and geographical coincidences that have limited China's expansion in the past. Factor those out, and you have an imperialist power as evil as any other.
“‎Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget to sing in the lifeboats.”
― Voltaire
User avatar
Lieutenant Dukasaur
Community Team
Community Team
 
Posts: 28068
Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:49 pm
Location: Beautiful Niagara
32

PreviousNext

Return to Acceptable Content

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users