barackattack If the Argentines declare war this will be illegal and immoral, and the only countries that will stick with them (same as last time) are the other tin-pot jungle republics in S. America.
omg, what a joke-US and UK make so many illegal and immoral moves after WWII ,creating so many conflict and directly caused 5 to 10 milion civilian casualty. Argentina only try to get what belonge to Argentina, and whas UK steal in old colonial era. Uk ocupy Maldivas, British history not exist there. Then everybody who manage to get free from UK, can be called imperialist( India,Pakistan, for example). (24 conflict UK are been involved after WWII)
qwert wrote:Argentina only try to get what belonge to Argentina, and whas UK steal in old colonial era. Uk ocupy Maldivas, British history not exist there. Then everybody who manage to get free from UK, can be called imperialist( India,Pakistan, for example).
Lolwat. India and Pakistan chose to be independent so we let them. The Falklanders have no desire to split with the UK.
The Falklands are also totally different in that they do not represent the British occupation of land that was previously controlled by someone else. The Falklands were just islands, first claimed and inhabited by Britain. Argentina are just crying because, having heard about the oil, they wish they'd got there first.
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qwert wrote:Argentina only try to get what belonge to Argentina, and whas UK steal in old colonial era. Uk ocupy Maldivas, British history not exist there. Then everybody who manage to get free from UK, can be called imperialist( India,Pakistan, for example).
Lolwat. India and Pakistan chose to be independent so we let them. The Falklanders have no desire to split with the UK.
Malvinas residents are a prop people imported by the UK precisely so they could make a nonsense claim about self-determination. They are irrelevant.
The General Assembly of the OAS has unanimously (even Britain's patron the US, and little brother Canada voted for it) rejected this argument in June of this last year in a spirit of Pan-Americanism.
Whatever remnant capability Britain has to defend the Malvinas now (even though Admiral Woodward himself says there is none) will be erased at the next Labour government when a new round of budget cuts sends the last 7 British submarines to the scrapyard, where the last British carrier is already being broken-apart. For Argentina it's a waiting game. They just need to run out the clock.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
Hey, sax, you forgot to read the rest of my post again.
The Falklands are also totally different in that they do not represent the British occupation of land that was previously controlled by someone else. The Falklands were just islands, first claimed and inhabited by Britain. Argentina are just crying because, having heard about the oil, they wish they'd got there first.
You're welcome.
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are you know history,or you pretend to know only what british tell ? Argentina and maldivas whas Spanish colonu,and when argentina declare independent, maldivas whas Argentina territory,with Argentina settlers-in 1833 British take maldivas and in force expelled Argentina citizens,and bring people from UK to live in Maldivas.
barackattack wrote:Hey, sax, you forgot to read the rest of my post again.
The Falklands are also totally different in that they do not represent the British occupation of land that was previously controlled by someone else. The Falklands were just islands, first claimed and inhabited by Britain. Argentina are just crying because, having heard about the oil, they wish they'd got there first.
You're welcome.
I didn't forget. The rest of your rant was irrelevant and was succinctly answered by this:
saxitoxin wrote:Malvinas residents are a prop people imported by the UK precisely so they could make a nonsense claim about self-determination. They are irrelevant.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
The claim is nothing to do with the residents. The claim is to do with the fact that Britain got there first.
Argentina can't just wait a couple of hundred years and then overturn that by going 'but we're closer!'
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well you are British, these mean that these topic are not neutral, im not a british,and im not argentine citizens, so i have neutral view. You have subjective oppinion,so all these topic are irelevant. Your last post are so stupid claim "we came first ,and these is our territory" , that why half of Countires in world whas in British Empire, and need hundred of years to finaly liberated from British Tyrant Rule, and these cost milions and milions of murder civilian from British Crown.
barackattack wrote:The claim is nothing to do with the residents. The claim is to do with the fact that Britain got there first.
Great! Then they can also be the first to leave.
This is all so sad, nostalgic in a way. It reminds me of when Portugal was desperately trying to cling to Mozambique and Goa. They really went off the deep end then, as well. The last rock of empire is always the hardest to let go.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
They were uninhabited and unused islands. Bit different to Africa and elsewhere, where Europeans arrived and claimed land already lived on by other people.
The important thing to remember is that Argentina has no legitimate claim to the Falklands whatsoever.
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barackattack wrote:They were uninhabited and unused islands. Bit different to Africa and elsewhere, where Europeans arrived and claimed land already lived on by other people.
The important thing to remember is that Argentina has no legitimate claim to the Falklands whatsoever.
35 nations of the OAS disagree
appending one's sentences with the word "whatsoever" is unlikely to change that, though this daft strategy does seem to mirror the desperate death throws in which the Foreign Office is engaged
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
It's not my fault that the US has been pussy-whipped by a bunch of South American despots.
Timid OAS statements do not mean that Argentina has any right to the Falklands.
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barackattack wrote:It's not my fault that the US has been pussy-whipped by a bunch of South American despots.
Timid OAS statements do not mean that Argentina has any right to the Falklands.
boisterous grandstanding of a militarily neutered nation, furiously printed in the pages of the Sun with captioned photos of the Union flag (soon to be stripped of the St. Andrew's cross), also does not mean UK has any right to the Malvinas
even Spain - a fellow EU state - supports the legality of the Argentine claim to the Malvinas
I really don't know why - other than nostalgia of lost glory of the faded past - Britain insists on making its last stand on Malvinas. There are dozens of nations aligned against it and, for the life of me, I can't think of a single one - save Luxembourg - supporting her. As I said, I suppose this is for the same reason Salazar insisted the Portuguese defenders of Goa fight to the death against the Indian Army back in '70 or whenever it was ... inability to accept the new order of the world. Change can be difficult.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
i really don't know why - other than nostalgia of lost glory of the faded past - Britain insists on making its last stand on Malvinas
I believe you already mentioned the oil reserves. These are also the exact reason that Argentina is so stroppy.
inability to accept the new order of the world
Painful, coming from the man who refuses to believe that China is the next superpower.
(the OAS statement is merely a call for negotiation, btw. It has nothing to say about legality or sovereignity.)
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Oh Jesus, there is one of two ways all barackattack threads end. He gets argued into a corner and then it's either:
ENDING A
barackattack wrote:
ENDING B
barackattack wrote:<random link to some factoid about China he found on page 1 of his google search results, inserted sans commentary, analysis or context>
Someone unplug his cord, we need a break. The University of East Anglia is really producing some dolts these days.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
Am I missing something here, or what right does Argentina have to the islands? The British have ruled the islands for nearly 200 years and intermittently prior to that (whenever Spain wasn't contesting their rule); Argentina was defeated last time they tried to take the islands by force; and currently the inhabitants of the islands want to continue under British rule. Sounds to me like Argentina doesn't have a leg to stand on.
Ray Rider wrote:Am I missing something here, or what right does Argentina have to the islands? The British have ruled the islands for nearly 200 years and intermittently prior to that (whenever Spain wasn't contesting their rule); Argentina was defeated last time they tried to take the islands by force; and currently the inhabitants of the islands want to continue under British rule. Sounds to me like Argentina doesn't have a leg to stand on.
- The 35 member nations of the Organization of American States - including Canada - have endorsed Argentina's demand for bilateral negotiations over the future of the Malvinas. These nations, including Canada, have also refused to recognize UK sovereignty over the Malvinas. The US reiterated Britain's obligation to the OAS General Assembly declaration in June during the Central American Security Integration Conference in Honduras when it tabled the Hemispheric Declaration on Pan-American Solidarity.
- As of December, "Falkland"-flagged vessels have been banned from docking in MERCUSOR ports - Argentina, Uruguay, Brazil. Faced with a destruction of their fish-dependent economy, they have been forced to fly Argentine flags to offload their stocks for export.
- In addition to the non-recognition of UK sovereignty, Spain, Portugal, Brazil, Uruguay, Paraguay, Venezuela, Cuba, Mexico and the People's Republic of China all go one step further by directly recognizing Argentine claims to the Malvinas.
- Finally, Right of Arms, the right by which Britain illegally seized Malvinas to begin with, can be used to recover what was stolen ... see:
Were I to be asked to speculate, I would do so as follows ... With world opinion against them and the resources used to retake Malvinas in 1982 all long gone to the scrap yard, and the Brit military largely demobilized to buy votes with various goodies and welfare to single moms in Manchester, Anglos on the Malvinas can simply be ejected like the Argentines were ejected before them. Before it comes to that, they'll likely petition for a reasonable accommodation to avoid the inevitable. I'm sure a negotiated settlement has already been reached and the Kirchener and Cameron governments are just treading water with boisterous statements for benefit of public opinion for now. The settlement will probably be announced after the next UK election as such controversial positions are often held in confidence.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
saxitoxin wrote:- The 35 member nations of the Organization of American States - including Canada - have endorsed Argentina's demand for bilateral negotiations over the future of the Malvinas. These nations, including Canada, have also refused to recognize UK sovereignty over the Malvinas. The US reiterated Britain's obligation to the OAS General Assembly declaration in June during the Central American Security Integration Conference in Honduras when it tabled the Hemispheric Declaration on Pan-American Solidarity.
- As of December, "Falkland"-flagged vessels have been banned from docking in MERCUSOR ports - Argentina, Uruguay, Brazil. Faced with a destruction of their fish-dependent economy, they have been forced to fly Argentine flags to offload their stocks for export.
- In addition to the non-recognition of UK sovereignty, Spain, Portugal, Brazil, Uruguay, Paraguay, Venezuela, Cuba, Mexico and the People's Republic of China all go one step further by directly recognizing Argentine claims to the Malvinas.
- Finally, Right of Arms, the right by which Britain illegally seized Malvinas to begin with, can be used to recover what was stolen ... see:
Were I to be asked to speculate, I would do so as follows ... With the resources used to defend them in 1982 all long gone to the scrap yard, and the Brit military largely demobilized to buy votes with various goodies and welfare to single moms in Manchester, Anglos on the Malvinas can simply be ejected like the Argentines were ejected before them. Before it comes to that, they'll likely petition for a reasonable accommodation to avoid the inevitable. I'm sure a negotiated settlement has already been reached and the Kirchener and Cameron governments are just treading water with boisterous statements for benefit of public opinion for now. The settlement will probably be announced after the next UK election as such controversial positions are often held in confidence.
Other nations bullying the UK about the islands doesn't give Argentina any right to them. As I said, what right does Argentina have to the islands? And when did Britain illegally seize the islands "by right of arms"? There are 3,000 people living there who have lived there for generations and are happy with British rule. Why not allow them to continue?
saxitoxin wrote:- The 35 member nations of the Organization of American States - including Canada - have endorsed Argentina's demand for bilateral negotiations over the future of the Malvinas. These nations, including Canada, have also refused to recognize UK sovereignty over the Malvinas. The US reiterated Britain's obligation to the OAS General Assembly declaration in June during the Central American Security Integration Conference in Honduras when it tabled the Hemispheric Declaration on Pan-American Solidarity.
- As of December, "Falkland"-flagged vessels have been banned from docking in MERCUSOR ports - Argentina, Uruguay, Brazil. Faced with a destruction of their fish-dependent economy, they have been forced to fly Argentine flags to offload their stocks for export.
- In addition to the non-recognition of UK sovereignty, Spain, Portugal, Brazil, Uruguay, Paraguay, Venezuela, Cuba, Mexico and the People's Republic of China all go one step further by directly recognizing Argentine claims to the Malvinas.
- Finally, Right of Arms, the right by which Britain illegally seized Malvinas to begin with, can be used to recover what was stolen ... see:
Were I to be asked to speculate, I would do so as follows ... With the resources used to defend them in 1982 all long gone to the scrap yard, and the Brit military largely demobilized to buy votes with various goodies and welfare to single moms in Manchester, Anglos on the Malvinas can simply be ejected like the Argentines were ejected before them. Before it comes to that, they'll likely petition for a reasonable accommodation to avoid the inevitable. I'm sure a negotiated settlement has already been reached and the Kirchener and Cameron governments are just treading water with boisterous statements for benefit of public opinion for now. The settlement will probably be announced after the next UK election as such controversial positions are often held in confidence.
Other nations bullying the UK about the islands doesn't give Argentina any right to them. As I said, what right does Argentina have to the islands? And when did Britain illegally seize the islands "by right of arms"? There are 3,000 people living there who have lived there for generations and are happy with British rule. Why not allow them to continue?
If it is as innocent as that, the Britishers will have no objection to surrendering all oil rights to the surrounding ocean in exchange for keeping the rocks. They won't so they'll have to deal with having them taken away. Life isn't always fair. That will be a valuable lesson the Falklanders can take with them on the refugee ships as they sail back to England.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism
qwert wrote:well you are British, these mean that these topic are not neutral, im not a british,and im not argentine citizens, so i have neutral view. You have subjective oppinion,so all these topic are irelevant. Your last post are so stupid claim "we came first ,and these is our territory" , that why half of Countires in world whas in British Empire, and need hundred of years to finaly liberated from British Tyrant Rule, and these cost milions and milions of murder civilian from British Crown.
You worry about the recent war crimes of your own countrymen and let us worry about those awful imperialistic warmongers of ours.
