LINUX v. Windows

by **pmchugh** on Wed May 30, 2012 1:17 pm

Used both, either are fine.. just stay away from macs and you are perfectly fine. Some people just like to bum linux up because Microsoft are too mainstream.

Tip for BBS: Trolling about IE gets even better results.

by **natty dread** on Wed May 30, 2012 1:32 pm

DiM wrote:my nod32 antivirus version 5.2.9.12 runs very smoothly, never slows down my computer and it certainly never froze up. i'm running it on several laptops including an entry level piece of crap from 5 years ago and it still works perfect.

So? Point is you still have to run an antivirus. And isn't nod32 a non-free proprietary software, meaning you have to pay for it?

Like it or not, windows is simply inherently less secure than linux or any other unix-based system. That's not even disputed, it's just a plain fact.

DiM wrote:ou don't have to pay for windows either. there are plenty of methods to get it for free with no viruses and no restrictions.

That's illegal. So, irrelevant. You want to technically be a criminal just to get an OS for your computer, be my guest.

DiM wrote:and in windows you do? i never entered an activation key for my windows. the crack took care of that.

Also illegal.

DiM wrote:you don't have to restart windows after every update either. only after major updates.

You have to restart way more often in windows. Often even installing or removing new software requires restart. Updating certain drivers requires restart.

DiM wrote:you can customize windows in plenty of ways too. and free alternatives are abundant.

Yeah, you can change themes. WHOA. Themes. ...if you have windows 7 that is, since in XP, most of the "themes" available online are actually malware. Oh, and almost all "screensavers" you find online are actually malware.

What if you don't like the GUI of windows though? Tough shit, you're stuck with it, unless you want... some other version of windows I guess? With linux, you can just install a different desktop environment, change the window manager, or have several of them on your system and switch between them when you want. There just isn't anything even close to comparable on windows.

DiM wrote:and in windows you're not allowed to do new stuff? is somebody stopping you from learning whatever you want at your own pace?
[...]
saying windows is a slow os, that doesn't let you do anything and it's filled with viruses is the same as saying linux is a command based piece of crap that's not compatible with most hardware or software and where even for the easiest of tasks you have to be a programming guru.

Well I never actually claimed that... I was simply listing reasons why I love linux, it's just that you chose to take it as an attack against windows for some reason...

Also, slowness or fastness is relative, it's also a fact that you can create a way faster system with linux than you can with windows, if you compare them on the same hardware. I'm not saying windows is always slow, I'm just saying it's slower than linux.

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 1:47 pm

nietzsche wrote:
Did you know that many cracks have malware in them?

it depends on the source of your cracks. i currently have 30+ cracked programmes on my laptop. none of them has a malware.

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:05 pm

natty dread wrote:
DiM wrote:my nod32 antivirus version 5.2.9.12 runs very smoothly, never slows down my computer and it certainly never froze up. i'm running it on several laptops including an entry level piece of crap from 5 years ago and it still works perfect.

So? Point is you still have to run an antivirus. And isn't nod32 a non-free proprietary software, meaning you have to pay for it?

you don't HAVE to.

natty dread wrote:Like it or not, windows is simply inherently less secure than linux or any other unix-based system. That's not even disputed, it's just a plain fact.

actually your logic is faulty here. linux is not safer than windows because it is somehow better. it's safer because nobody bothers making viruses for some OS that's found in less than 1% of PCs.

if you were somehow able to reverse the market shares and put linux on 90% of the pcs i guarantee you that within hours there will be hundreds of new viruses. within days all linux based PCs would most likely be infected.

natty dread wrote:
DiM wrote:ou don't have to pay for windows either. there are plenty of methods to get it for free with no viruses and no restrictions.

That's illegal. So, irrelevant. You want to technically be a criminal just to get an OS for your computer, be my guest.

i feel so al capone right now. :lol:

natty dread wrote:
DiM wrote:and in windows you do? i never entered an activation key for my windows. the crack took care of that.

Also illegal.

what can i say? i'm a badass. illegal software today, mafia kingpin tomorrow :lol:

natty dread wrote:
DiM wrote:you don't have to restart windows after every update either. only after major updates.

You have to restart way more often in windows. Often even installing or removing new software requires restart. Updating certain drivers requires restart.

often? i have hundreds of things installed on my laptop. i know only 1 that required a restart. the antivirus. i think photoshop might have required a restart but i doubt it. anyway, 99% of what i installed didn't need a restart. :roll:

natty dread wrote:
DiM wrote:and in windows you're not allowed to do new stuff? is somebody stopping you from learning whatever you want at your own pace?
[...]
saying windows is a slow os, that doesn't let you do anything and it's filled with viruses is the same as saying linux is a command based piece of crap that's not compatible with most hardware or software and where even for the easiest of tasks you have to be a programming guru.

Well I never actually claimed that... I was simply listing reasons why I love linux, it's just that you chose to take it as an attack against windows for some reason...

actually you weren't saying why you love linux you were comparing linux with some distorted facts about windows.
for example if you say "i love linux because only kernel updates require a restart" is ok. saying "i love linux because only kernel updates require a restart whereas in window every update requires a restart" is wrong because you're using a false fact about windows.

PS: i might have to change my name to Badass Kingpin DiM :twisted:

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:16 pm

natty dread wrote:Is it just me or does it seem like there's more and more people getting fed up with windows these days and migrating to linux?

it is just you. for a short period of time linux made it above the 1% market share. after 18 years (!!!)
it even got to 1.5% and at that point people went crazy an predicted a linux boom.
but it quickly became obvious it was all gibberish and linux quickly went down to bellow 1%.

sure, linux is big when it comes to servers and mobile devices. but when it comes to home laptops and desktops.... well, let's just say that 1.5% market share may remain as the high point of this OS.

by **dwilhelmi** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:18 pm

I tried Linux for a while, but I got fed up with it. I kept running into things that just wouldn't work out of the box, and I'd have to go to google and find the right guide to walk me through the dozen steps needed in order to get everything running smoothly again. Some of the things were not the fault of Linux, but was still a drawback of Linux regardless - for example, my printer does not officially support Linux, so in order to get it to work you have to do some sort of fancy behind-the-scenes magic, and even then you can't get all of the features working. That is the fault of the printer, for not supporting Linux, but the fact remains that I never had problems with windows.

In the end, I switched to Mac and I haven't looked back. It has the power, speed, safety, and command line tools of Linux, with the just-works factor of Windows. It's a little pricy, but worth it.

by **natty dread** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:24 pm

DiM wrote:you don't HAVE to.

Try it...

DiM wrote:actually your logic is faulty here. linux is not safer than windows because it is somehow better. it's safer because nobody bothers making viruses for some OS that's found in less than 1% of PCs.

if you were somehow able to reverse the market shares and put linux on 90% of the pcs i guarantee you that within hours there will be hundreds of new viruses. within days all linux based PCs would most likely be infected.

Actually that's a misconception. Linux is more secure due to the way it's built. No malware can get access to the system files unless it's expressly given permissions. If you just don't run things as root, there isn't much any malware can do.

DiM wrote:what can i say? i'm a badass. illegal software today, mafia kingpin tomorrow

I'm just saying, it's kind of flawed logic to say "I can get windows for free too, all I have to is install an illegal copy"... if you have to break a law to install it, then it's not free. Sure, the risk of getting caught might be minimal, but it's still a risk, one that genuinely free software doesn't have.

DiM wrote:often? i have hundreds of things installed on my laptop. i know only 1 that required a restart. the antivirus. i think photoshop might have required a restart but i doubt it. anyway, 99% of what i installed didn't need a restart.

Either way, you still have to restart more often on windows than you do on linux.

DiM wrote:actually you weren't saying why you love linux you were comparing linux with some distorted facts about windows.
for example if you say "i love linux because only kernel updates require a restart" is ok. saying "i love linux because only kernel updates require a restart whereas in window every update requires a restart" is wrong because you're using a false fact about windows.

Well I didn't actually even mention windows in that post...

by **Haggis_McMutton** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:25 pm

hmm, a mac guy appeared. Now the windows and linux people can happily put their differences aside in order to beat on the apple.

Honestly, those mac vs pc commercials made me hate apple instantly.
If that's the selling point of your computer, I'm not interested.

by **maxfaraday** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:27 pm

Linux >> Windows.

That's not arguable.

If you're stupid, uneducated or didn't bother to try Linux (these are the only reasons I can see not to use Linux), then stick with Windows, I don't care.

I'll just tell you that you have no idea what you miss.

by **natty dread** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:34 pm

DiM wrote:
natty dread wrote:Is it just me or does it seem like there's more and more people getting fed up with windows these days and migrating to linux?

it is just you. for a short period of time linux made it above the 1% market share. after 18 years (!!!)
it even got to 1.5% and at that point people went crazy an predicted a linux boom.
but it quickly became obvious it was all gibberish and linux quickly went down to bellow 1%.

sure, linux is big when it comes to servers and mobile devices. but when it comes to home laptops and desktops.... well, let's just say that 1.5% market share may remain as the high point of this OS.

You can see the future now? Careful there - it's hard to make predictions on computer technology. No one would have thought back in 60:s that personal computers would even become a thing. No one could predict the popularity of the internet in the 80:s.

For all we know, linux could have the leading market share in 10 years. If m$ keeps fucking things up as badly as they're going to with win8, it could even be likely.

by **john9blue** on Wed May 30, 2012 2:58 pm

free software tends to win out in the end, as its quality and usability approach those of commercial software. i can see the same thing happening with linux.

by **AndyDufresne** on Wed May 30, 2012 3:06 pm

natty dread wrote:You can see the future now? Careful there - it's hard to make predictions on computer technology. No one would have thought back in 60:s that personal computers would even become a thing. No one could predict the popularity of the internet in the 80:s.

For all we know, linux could have the leading market share in 10 years. If m$ keeps fucking things up as badly as they're going to with win8, it could even be likely.

Isn't your second paragraph...a half-hearted sort-of prediction?

--Andy

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 4:29 pm

natty dread wrote:You can see the future now? Careful there - it's hard to make predictions on computer technology.

true. but at least my prediction was based on 18 years of data.

natty dread wrote:If m$ keeps fucking things up as badly as they're going to with win8, it could even be likely.

could you also tell me the lotto numbers for this weekend?

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 4:36 pm

maxfaraday wrote:Linux >> Windows.

That's not arguable.

If you're stupid, uneducated or didn't bother to try Linux (these are the only reasons I can see not to use Linux), then stick with Windows, I don't care.

this doesn't sound like an educated and smart argumentation :roll:

but i could be wrong. after all i'm a windows user so i'm clearly stupid and uneducated because despite trying several distros of linux i still kept using windows. all i hope is that during the several years of using win and linux in parallel some of the genius that comes with linux has rubbed on me.

PS: is there any chance you're one of those windows users that pretends to like linux just because they think it makes them smarter?

by **maxfaraday** on Wed May 30, 2012 4:55 pm

DiM wrote:
maxfaraday wrote:Linux >> Windows.

That's not arguable.

If you're stupid, uneducated or didn't bother to try Linux (these are the only reasons I can see not to use Linux), then stick with Windows, I don't care.

this doesn't sound like an educated and smart argumentation
but i could be wrong. after all i'm a windows user so i'm clearly stupid and uneducated because despite trying several distros of linux i still kept using windows. all i hope is that during the several years of using win and linux in parallel some of the genius that comes with linux has rubbed on me.

PS: is there any chance you're one of those windows users that pretends to like linux just because they think it makes them smarter?

No, my computer had Windows when I bought it and I got rid of Windows,
I didn't just install Linux with Windows, I made a clean installation of Ubuntu on the whole hard drive.
Maybe your personal taste is Windows, but in my opinion Linux is way better.
Actually Windows just doesn't compare to Linux.
A few years ago it was still a work in progress, but today's distributions are very mature and will fulfill all your expectaions.

by **natty dread** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:25 pm

I can sort of understand those guys who just don't care or know about the ideals of free & open source software, and keep using windows... they just don't know any better.

But the people I really don't get are those who agree with the free software movement in principle, but then they're all "but but, I just want to use windows because it's easier!"

It's kind of like, ok, it's understandable if you drive a Hummer if you're a global warming denialist - idiotic, but understandable - however, if you know about global waming and still drive a Hummer... then it's like, you have no excuse.

by **natty dread** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:27 pm

DiM wrote:
natty dread wrote:You can see the future now? Careful there - it's hard to make predictions on computer technology.

true. but at least my prediction was based on 18 years of data.

Kind of like this?

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:34 pm

maxfaraday wrote:No, my computer had Windows when I bought it and I got rid of Windows,
I didn't just install Linux with Windows, I made a clean installation of Ubuntu on the whole hard drive.
Maybe your personal taste is Windows, but in my opinion Linux is way better.

see, this is a much more mature and intelligent statement.

maxfaraday wrote:Actually Windows just doesn't compare to Linux.
A few years ago it was still a work in progress, but today's distributions are very mature and will fulfill all your expectaions.

all your expectations ... maybe. all my expectations ... clearly no.
i like playing games, a lot.
to play windows games you need wine and even then you're not sure it will work. and if it will work, you're not sure how good the performance will be, or what sort of stability issues you'll encounter.

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:38 pm

natty dread wrote:
DiM wrote:
natty dread wrote:You can see the future now? Careful there - it's hard to make predictions on computer technology.

true. but at least my prediction was based on 18 years of data.

Kind of like this?

the person that made that graph doesn't really know much about making graphs, or logic, or math.
so no, not like that.

by **natty dread** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:42 pm

DiM wrote:the person that made that graph doesn't really know much about making graphs.

Whoa. I'm pretty sure the person who made that knows EVERYTHING about making graphs.

The person who made that is like the grand fucking master ninja sensei of graphs.

by **Army of GOD** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:44 pm

appeal to xckd should be a logical fallacy

by **natty dread** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:47 pm

Army of GOD wrote:appeal to xckd should be a logical fallacy

No way, it should be the exact opposite of that

like an awesomacy, or something

by **DiM** on Wed May 30, 2012 5:53 pm

natty dread wrote:
DiM wrote:the person that made that graph doesn't really know much about making graphs.

Whoa. I'm pretty sure the person who made that knows EVERYTHING about making graphs.

The person who made that is like the grand fucking master ninja sensei of graphs.

my point was my argument was logical while yours was a fairy tale.

linux has managed to break the 1% market share after 18 years and then quickly went back to bellow 1%.
saying that for the forseeable future linux won't take windows' place is a logical statement.

your prediction was that microsoft will f*ck up everything with win8 giving linux a big boost and probably transforming linux in a huge deal 10 years from now.

not saying my prediction will come true and yours won't. i'm just saying my prediction is more probable than yours.

for all we know an alien spaceship might come and give us their technology and we'll forget all about windows and linux.

by **BigBallinStalin** on Wed May 30, 2012 8:19 pm

The future is uncertain. Projecting past data into the future does not make your expectations 100% certain. Who knows how certain the prediction may be. However, it's very likely that Linux's market share will remain around 1% in the next five years.

With windows, if Win8 sucks, then people will revert to the older versions. The network externalities of Windows enables that product to retain its dominant market share. In other words, to use an analogy, fax machines become more useful as more people use them.