Should Americans start stockpiling food?

[b.k. barunt]

On the other hand, we could band together and organize food and shelter for ourselves in urban areas, where 90% of us live. We could call on the expertise of medical and nutritional personnel and organize food collection and preservation locally. In other words, we could rely on our collective efforts.

Yes! We could call it... a city!

[Spuzzell]

I'm with Player. I get a cow every fall (used to get a pig but geez $$$), I'm looking at getting a pressure canner this winter too. My yard isn't that big, but it's big enough for a victory garden. Plus I live out in the country, so I have a thousand other options. Though my bogus step dad cut down my raspberry bushes before my mother gave him the boot. But I recommend getting grandfather/heritage seeds. The power hour had giant multi-packs of grandfather seeds at one point in time.... Now for $80 you get half of what you once did. But you'll never have to buy seeds again... so you pretty much have to pay it. So long as you plan on continuing the garden.
Unfortunitly counting the sea, humans are eating more food than the we are producing. And if the UN is correct, it'll be untill at least 2010 before we can start to remidy that... so doing anything is helpful.
Not to mention just growing your own herbs and spices is better for your health(insert weed joke). Most spices and a few herbs are radiated, and during this curing process they lose a bit of their helpful properties. Not much mind you, but there is a difference.
Country folk can survive!

Raspberry bush? You mean canes, right? Is this another US/UK language thing, or are raspberries different in the states?

I'd far rather have a nice easy bush than my bastard canes.

Once everything is growing nicely you should be able to reseed from your existing crop year by year, is that what you mean by heritage seeds?

I totally agree with the herbs and spices though. I only buy fresh herbs in any case, the dried stuff is nowhere near as good.

[Juan_Bottom]

Raspberry bush? You mean canes, right? Is this another US/UK language thing, or are raspberries different in the states?

It's a language thing. If enough "canes" grow together, you call it a "bush."

I'd far rather have a nice easy bush than my bastard canes.

Ditto. But if you cage them in as I did, they're a lot easier to handle. Or, since everyone land out here is fenced off, and birds love that, we get long rows of wild Raspberries. That's pretty nice too.

Once everything is growing nicely you should be able to reseed from your existing crop year by year, is that what you mean by heritage seeds?

Yup. I've been told to call them "heritage seeds," but we all call them "grandfather seeds." Monsanto is trying to get rid of them, and they even tried to get a law through Congress. So Heritage seeds have become a little hard to come by.

[PLAYER57832]

OK, to stockpile meat you need either to freeze it or cure it. If the food supply becomes unreliable, electricity will also and fule supplies with wither, thus freezing it is not a reliable option.

You apparently never heard of generators or other independent power sources (wind, solar ... enough to keep a freezer going anyway)

Curing meat is a complicated process, and a misstep will result in rancid meat or food poisoning.

Which might be why I mentioned a pressure cooker ... but truth is, those of us in the country still have or can pretty readily get those skills. It is those in the cities who will be the problem.

Growing vegetables requires a root cellar or lard to preserve over the winter, and this is only reliable in colder climates. Throughout the south and west, vegetables must be eaten fresh or preserved with chile. Of course there is always home canning, a process that regularly produced food poisoning in the past.

YOu are completely misinformed.

You can grow quite a lot in pots even in an apartment year round in any climate (tomatoes, lettuce, herbs particularly).

MOST vegetables keep quite well for several months if kept reasonably cool (shaded woodshed worked well for us in CA). There are 2 keys.
1. Do NOT wash them.
2. Keep them free of vermin.

BUT, you forget 2 things. Drying ... VERY reliable in dryer climates. AND the fact that where the climate is pleasant, you can grow real crops year round. Why else do you think Lompoc and Santa Maria (CA) are kings of Broccoli production? Also, trade is a very viable option when done responsibly. You grow what I cannot, I give you what you cannot get.

NEXT are greenhouses, cold frames, etc. The Poconos used to have huge winter farms that supplied the fresh produce the more well off New Yorkers got in the winter.

Chili is only one herb you can use to preserve and no where near as reliable as salt. (or, as I said earlier, just plain drying.

As for the food poisoning from home canning. You absolutely have to know what you are doing, BUT almost anyone can can fresh fruit, tomatoes and most pickles. They have enough acid/salts, etc to make them relatively safe if you start with sterile (boiled) jars, etc.


The biggest worry was always botchalism. BUT, all you have to do is boil food for 5 minutes (at a REAL ROLLING boil -- which for some of you uneducated in food means not just seeing the first few tiny bubbles, but real large rolling bubbles and for a FULL 5 minutes, no short cuts!) to negate the toxin. Which is one big reason, by-the way, most of our grandparents (make that great grandparents in most of your cases. .. mine was born in 1897)boiled the life out of vegetables before eating them.

On the other hand, we could band together and organize food and shelter for ourselves in urban areas, where 90% of us live. We could call on the expertise of medical and nutritional personnel and organize food collection and preservation locally. In other words, we could rely on our collective efforts.

Somewhat sensible, but read above.

First EVERYONE ... I don't care WHERE you live should have at least 1 week, preferably 2 (particularly in cities!!!) of ALL the basic supplies you need. That is just to prepare for the inevitable disaster. It can save your life in a big one ... earthquake (they DO hit all 50 states!!! not just CA), storm, etc. BUT it can also just save you some grief in the more minor events such as power outages, transit strikes, etc.

Second, you really need to take more responsibility yourself and LEARN what you can do YOURSELF rather than simply relying on "experts" "out there". Yes, "experts" are working on these problems, but each individually doing even a small bit will go MUCH further than any "expert" possibly can. Live in an apartment? Have a couple of pots with tomatoe plants and herbs. No it won't take you through the winter, but its a start. Add another pot with lettuce an spinach or radishes, carrots ... whatever you like. LEARN FIRST AID YOURSELF! (again, why count on an ambulance being near?) Try red worm composting. (NO, it DOES NOT STINK if done PROPERLY!!!) Anyway, you can take it as far as you want. Google "sustainable living" or check out places like "Real Goods" (a store and education company -- definitely for profit, but still good information).

Okay, enough of the book... go and find the information ... it is out there!

[PLAYER57832]

But I recommend getting grandfather/heritage seeds.

There are several websites. They sometimes don't produce quite as much volume as the "miracle grow" enhanced bio-engineered seeds, but you often get far better flavor and can find seeds that are really and truly adapted to YOUR climate and soils, so you don't NEED that "miracle grow" (fertilizer, generally, but natural kinds work BETTER and are sustainable).

[mpjh]

I don't know about you, but twoo weeks of basics is called leftovers where I live. I thought you guys were talking about "stockpiling" food.

Sorry I forgot you are all under 30 and childless.

[PLAYER57832]

I don't know about you, but twoo weeks of basics is called leftovers where I live. I thought you guys were talking about "stockpiling" food.

Sorry I forgot you are all under 30 and childless.

Not even close ... (I did say at the very least), but it looks like you did not even read through my post, so... think what you like.

(I probably have enough to supply not only my family, but my elderly neighbors for a good 6 months ... I call it "buying on sale" not "stockpiling")

[mpjh]

Yeah, Yeah, and no kids

[InkL0sed]

Looks like this genius picked the wrong end of the Philips Curve about which to forecast doom...

Pointing and laughing, that's what I'm doing. Pointing and laughing.

[Juan_Bottom]

Looks like this genius picked the wrong end of the Philips Curve about which to forecast doom...

Pointing and laughing, that's what I'm doing. Pointing and laughing.

Huh?

[Nickbaldwin]

Stockpiling no, growing their own, yes.

[DaGip]

Stockpiling no, growing their own, yes.

I agree, but in the meantime, stockpile!

[Johnny Rockets]

Stockpiling is always temporary.

It also chains you to it, so what you want is ammo.

J

[InkL0sed]

Looks like this genius picked the wrong end of the Philips Curve about which to forecast doom...

Pointing and laughing, that's what I'm doing. Pointing and laughing.

Huh?

The Philips Curve is the idea that unemployment and inflation have an inverse relationship. This guy was predicting hyper-inflation (more like prophecy-ing it); and now what do we have? Deflation and heightening unemployment.

I love it when self-righteous assholes are proven wrong.

[luns101]

Stockpiling no, growing their own, yes.

I agree, but in the meantime, stockpile!

I already tried purchasing some supplies to stockpile but the local grocery store only accepts Ameros

[DaGip]

Stockpiling no, growing their own, yes.

I agree, but in the meantime, stockpile!

I already tried purchasing some supplies to stockpile but the local grocery store only accepts Ameros

My problem is that I keep eating all my stockpiles!

[DaGip]

Looks like this genius picked the wrong end of the Philips Curve about which to forecast doom...

Pointing and laughing, that's what I'm doing. Pointing and laughing.

Huh?

The Philips Curve is the idea that unemployment and inflation have an inverse relationship. This guy was predicting hyper-inflation (more like prophecy-ing it); and now what do we have? Deflation and heightening unemployment.

I love it when self-righteous assholes are proven wrong.

He also said that he was going to buy those same items every Friday or Saturday and post them on YouTube...he doesn't do it every Friday or Saturday. He just chooses when he wants to now.

I would say the argument is that the trillion plus dollars that was shelled out has yet to hit the market, and that is probably why we haven't seen a large increase in the price of food. I am only assuming that is what his argument would be on the matter.

[Juan_Bottom]

I already tried purchasing some supplies to stockpile but the local grocery store only accepts Ameros

I like how everyone jokes about this as some kind of conspiracy theory. Meanwhile the stock market is toxic, the government keeps magically finding funds to dole out to private institutions, graineries are empty, banks are predicting global depression/deep recession, emergancy meetings are being held by world leaders, and unemployment is rising very quickly.
Laugh it up you weirdos, *

If unemployment rises too much more I wonder if the government is going to have to bailout the unemployed?

I would say the argument is that the trillion plus dollars that was shelled out has yet to hit the market, and that is probably why we haven't seen a large increase in the price of food.

I imagine that the price will go down, as unemployment goes up.

My problem is that I keep eating all my stockpiles!

*Of the 5 in my immediate family, only 1 is working. Of the 12 in my next-of-kin, only 4 are working. Everyone is laid off.... and my immediates have eaten all my canned food... however much food you think that you may need by 500000000% more. I'm not a conspiracy nut, I'm just hungry and can't find work.

[DaGip]

I already tried purchasing some supplies to stockpile but the local grocery store only accepts Ameros

I like how everyone jokes about this as some kind of conspiracy theory. Meanwhile the stock market is toxic, the government keeps magically finding funds to dole out to private institutions, graineries are empty, banks are predicting global depression/deep recession, emergancy meetings are being held by world leaders, and unemployment is rising very quickly.
Laugh it up you weirdos, *

If unemployment rises too much more I wonder if the government is going to have to bailout the unemployed?

I would say the argument is that the trillion plus dollars that was shelled out has yet to hit the market, and that is probably why we haven't seen a large increase in the price of food.

I imagine that the price will go down, as unemployment goes up.

My problem is that I keep eating all my stockpiles!

*Of the 5 in my immediate family, only 1 is working. Of the 12 in my next-of-kin, only 4 are working. Everyone is laid off.... and my immediates have eaten all my canned food... however much food you think that you may need by 500000000% more. I'm not a conspiracy nut, I'm just hungry and can't find work.

I live with my Dad and he is retired with a fixed income. Any jump in living expenses really hurts him, not to mention that my sister and her disabled boyfriend (just recently paralyzed) aren't working and are put up into a hotel of which my Dad is paying for. Our house has a good stockpile, if times got really tough, I bet there is about six months or more supply in freezers and pantries; not to mention we have family up North who have lots of canned goods as well.

Centralization of family is important during rough times.

I am still working at my Tractor Cab factory job. The economy hasn't quite hit them yet, we are still going strong. I was expecting some lay offs this holiday, but nobody got laid off. Our workload projections look good, and I expect my part of the factory to be extremely busy in January. Our factory even had a giant banner out front saying: NOW HIRING.

If things get really bad for any of you, remember the Salvation Army as they are a billion dollar corporation. They always helped me out on the road with food.

As far as granaries being empty, our granaries are so full, that they have to dump the excess grain into giant mountains on the cold frozen ground. I believe the biggest mistake that we are making right now is in the ethanol industry. At face value, ethanol sounds good, but it has been shown to cause more damage to the environment than what was expected, not to mention that we are burning our food supply. Yet the government white washes it and still says that it is great for the environment.

Who am I to believe?

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/columnist/ ... ntor_x.htm
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 01869.html

It seems to me that if we are burning our food supply for fuel that eventually it will come home to roost somewhere down the line. Now I am wondering if all that corn laying on the ground is for human/animal consumption or is for the ethanol plant?

[Juan_Bottom]

As far as granaries being empty, our granaries are so full, that they have to dump the excess grain into giant mountains on the cold frozen ground.

It must depend on where you are. ThePowerHour had a few guests on a while back that were trying to get support to stop foriegners from buying up all the Kansas graineries stock. They still had plenty in their graineries, but it was all purchased already. They were having the same troubles in Nebraska I believe.

I am still working at my Tractor Cab factory job. The economy hasn't quite hit them yet, we are still going strong.

Not joking, that's actually a really safe place to be. Even if our economy takes a dive, there will still be foriegners purchasing American-made farming equiptment. John Deere has some healthy sales in South America... Interesting I was just reading about that the other day.

[DaGip]

I am still working at my Tractor Cab factory job. The economy hasn't quite hit them yet, we are still going strong.

Not joking, that's actually a really safe place to be. Even if our economy takes a dive, there will still be foriegners purchasing American-made farming equiptment. John Deere has some healthy sales in South America... Interesting I was just reading about that the other day.

Exactly, we do a lot of business with Europe. The cabs I work on are CASE International Harvesters/New Holland which is a European company. I am assuming that the Europeans are getting a bigger bang for their Euro right now with the collapse of the dollar. The cost of labor must have went down for them, my only worry is that the price of steel will go up because of the collapsing auto companies. I really hate working for the same wages, but at this moment a job is a blessing.

[mpjh]

Please everyone stockpile perishables, so you will have to keep replenishing the supply, thus spending money, thus helping the economy. Your wallet to our economy.

[GeckoGirl]

Should we "start" stockpiling food? The real question should be "How much do you have stockpiled?" I'm an oldhead, and my grandparents raised a family during the Great Depression and came from sturdy frontier stock. They always had two YEARS worth of food "put up" as my grandmother would say. And they had seeds "put up" and the compost piles in various stages of readiness, and nothing went to waste. Stockpiling a few months worth of factory farmed, "modern" manufactured convenience foods might keep you alive for a few months. And it might get confiscated by the National Guard when the sh*t hits the fan. I wouldn't try to convince anyone that they shouldn't bother, because they should definitely being preparing for the worst. We've been prepared for a long time and have been homesteading and "putting up" about two years worth of food. And we do not expect any company out here, so nothing is shipped to the homestead. Don't advertise, but do be prepared in case you can't get to a grocery store for a couple of weeks or months.

[PLAYER57832]

Should we "start" stockpiling food? The real question should be "How much do you have stockpiled?" I'm an oldhead, and my grandparents raised a family during the Great Depression and came from sturdy frontier stock. They always had two YEARS worth of food "put up" as my grandmother would say. And they had seeds "put up" and the compost piles in various stages of readiness, and nothing went to waste. Stockpiling a few months worth of factory farmed, "modern" manufactured convenience foods might keep you alive for a few months. And it might get confiscated by the National Guard when the sh*t hits the fan. I wouldn't try to convince anyone that they shouldn't bother, because they should definitely being preparing for the worst. We've been prepared for a long time and have been homesteading and "putting up" about two years worth of food. And we do not expect any company out here, so nothing is shipped to the homestead. Don't advertise, but do be prepared in case you can't get to a grocery store for a couple of weeks or months.

Nice idea, but since there just are not enough single family farms to go around, there is this invention called "trade".

Anyway, as someone predicted earlier, prices of food are going down again as oil proces have dropped.

Of course not ALL the way down ... sneaky manufactureres have shrunk a lot of products so we only think they are staying cheap (Breyers ice cream packages slant at the bottom, peanut butter and mayonaise jars are rounded up, not flat, ceral boxes are slightly narrower, etc.)

The REAL answer is not stockpiling and pretending the rest of the world doesn't exist. If the "stuff" ever really does hit the fan, no one family will possibly defend themselves. The REAL answer is to think about what you buy. Are those pereishables and disposable items produced in a sustainable way? Are those cleaners going to cause your family more harm than the germs they are killing (and more harm to the factory workers, the community surrounding the factory?)

We need a sustainable economy, sustainable products and food. THEN we won't have to stockpile.

[mpjh]

I suggest that those who have no faith in the rest of us and in our collective strength should start stockpiling food. They should start with peanut products and pistachios, please.