waauw wrote:universalchiro wrote:waauw,
I'm alone in this theory. Here is my hypothesis: The earth had weaker gravity before the flood and greater oxygen concentration before the flood. As a result of the flood: gravity was increased approximately 25% and oxygen was decreased approximately 50%.
Here are the facts:
A. Oxygen:
1. Amber bubbles that have captured atmosphere concentration in the past, scientist have determined oxygen concentration was higher when the sap oozed out of the tree, captured the oxygen and then petrified.
2. Glacier core samples have also revealed that in the past, atmosphere oxygen concentration was 50% higher than today's value.
3. Science has grown insects in hypoxia and hyperoxia to determine if variations in oxygen concentration effect or affected life. Their findings was substantially yes. Hypoxia environments resulted in smaller insects as a whole. Those that had no size change, had enlarged tracheal tubules to bring in higher volumes of air, which provided less room for other organs. the result of enlarged tracheal tubes and smaller other tissue, was smaller muscles, smaller tendons, smaller organs. Which means the insects ran slower, less endurance, less thriving of life. Conversely, the insects grown in hyperoxia, were larger. those that had same size, had smaller tracheal tubules and larger other tissues, so they ran faster, longer, equaling a thriving life.
4. Humans suffer from a whole host of ailments associated with lack or loss of oxygen. From ischemia, necrosis, pale, lethargic, heart attack, death, etc. This is corroborated in the Bible Leviticus 17:11 "life is in the blood". Blood carries oxygen. And God breathed life into the living: Genesis 2:7,. So life thrives with more oxygen, and life suffers with a lack of oxygen.
I have to agree with all of this. Did some research and the evidence does seem to confirm this part
universalchiro wrote:B. Gravity:
1. Some dinosaurs weighed 100 tons. Their porous bone structure would not be able to sustain such massive tonnage in this current earth's gravitational system. But scientist observe the porous bone structure of dinosaurs and compare that to similar porous bone structures of birds and assume dinosaurs evolved into birds. After all, both lay eggs. But dinos layed leather eggs and birds lay calcium shelled eggs, wholly different.
2. Astronauts that spend a great deal of time in space will lose bone density/mass. One study of an astronaut one year in space lost 14% bone mass.
3. If one gains a lot of weight, bone density will increase to handle the load.
4a. Moon's gravity causes 2 ocean tides per day. Each ocean tide, takes angular momentum out of the earth's rotational velocity. Each reduction in the earth's angular momentum, reduces centripetal force thereby increasing the net effect of gravity, though the mass of the earth had not changed.
4b. The moon uses this energy from the earth's angular momentum to move away from the earth at 3inches per year. Which means as we go back in time, the moon was closer and thereby took more angular momentum out the earth's spin. Which means the moon slowed the earth's spin exponentially greater in past millenniums.
5. Space dust adds 80,000lbs to the earth's mass each year, increasing earth's mass.
6. Each impacting asteroid and comet on the earth (only the very large ones), takes away angular momentum from the earth's spin velocity and does the same as B4.
universalchiro wrote:C. Dinosaurs are reptiles. Reptiles will grow as long as they are alive.
can't argue with that
universalchiro wrote:D. Non-observable evidence, based on faith and deductive reasoning, this is not proven but a theory:
1. Genesis 1:2 "The earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters." At this point in time the universe was extremely small. How do we know this? Job 9:8, Jeremiah 51:15, clarify God stretched out the heavens. Why is this important? Well this is in harmony with science finding the universe is still expanding, meaning at one point it was small in size. Also, waters is in plural form: This could mean massive volume, but also simply that water existed in gas, liquid and solid state. How is this possible? Since the universe was densely packed, this would increase pressure and thereby reduce the freezing point. Also, if the waters had a high alkaline concentration (Na, Ca, P, Mg, Cl,etc), this would also reduce the freezing point. therefore allow waters to remain in 3 states (liquid, gas, solid).
2. Genesis 1:6- "Then God said, "Let there be an expanse in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters." God made the expanse, and separated the waters which were below the expanse from the waters which were above the expanse; and it was so. God called the expanse heaven. There was evening and there was morning, a second day." There were two expanses created, for later the name of the expanse, heaven, is in plural form. The first expanse becomes our atmosphere, the second expanse becomes space where all the galaxies reside. So this verse indicates there was an opening in the middle of water that became our atmosphere. How can we be sure there were more than one expanse? Paul was caught up to the "3rd heaven" in 2 Corinthians 12:1-4. So the first heaven is our atmosphere, with waters below and waters above. the second heaven is the universe, the third heaven is either distally beyond the universe or within our universe in a higher dimension (unknown). This 1st heaven/atmosphere/expanse is important to our gravity. How? The waters below the expanse become the seas in verse 9 "Then God said, "Let the waters below the heavens be gathered into one place, and let the dry land appear; and it was so. God called the dry land earth, and the gathering of the waters He called seas". The waters above the expanse stayed there until the global flood of Genesis 7.
3. Waters above the atmosphere would increase atmospheric pressure. This increased atmospheric pressure would create a buoyancy effect, thereby reducing the net effect of gravity without changing the mass of the earth.
4. When the global flood came and rained for 40 days and 40 nights, this would increase the mass of the earth, thusly increasing gravity.
5. Prior to the flood: There was a canopy of water surrounding the earth, which created a green house effect.
a1. Ambient global temperatures: Genesis 3 "Adam and Eve were naked", no one is naked unless the temperatures are ambient..
a2. Ambient global temperatures: would mean no wind: Genesis 8: After the flood, massive polar ice caps formed.. Verse 1 "God caused a wind to pass over the earth".
a3. With Ambient global temperatures: There would be no wind, therefore no hydrological cycle and no rain: Genesis 2:5b "...For the LORD God had not sent rain upon the earth, and there was no man to cultivate the ground. But a mist used to rise from the earth and water the whole surface of the ground". The only way this would be possible if the water tablet in the ground was high, essentially massive amounts of water underground: Genesis 7:11b "...on the same day all the fountains of the great deep burst open, and the flood gates of the sky were opened. The rain fell upon the earth for forty days and forty nights". So not only did it rain, but water burst out of the earth from massive water caverns.
6. With a canopy of water surrounding the earth, before the global flood, the oceans would be much smaller, which means more land would be usable for vegetation and allow more production of oxygen. After the flood, there would be polar ice caps, desert because no ambient temperatures and massive oceans covering useful land. Hence oxygen drops by 50%.
6. Prior to the flood, the seas were not as deep as today, the mountains were not as high as today, the massive catastrophe of water bursting out of the earth in Genesis 7:11 caused great tectonic shifting.
7. As a result of the canopy of water coming down on earth, this highly alkaline water, to keep in liquid form while hovering around our atmosphere, would kill off a great deal of aquatic based behemoths that couldn't adapt to the change from fresh water to salt water. Potentially explains how water based dinosaurs died.
8. This massive amount of water coming down to earth in the global flood, would increase earth's gravity and decrease earth's oxygen concentration in the atmosphere. Paleontologist determine that dinosaurs nostril and lung capacity could not sustain them in today's oxygen concentration. Ergo, when dinos lived oxygen was higher, the flood sending that much water to form massive oceans, and the loss of the canopy of water equaled a loss of ambient global temperatures, resulting in polar ice caps and deserts, further reducing vegetation, further reducing oxygen production.
Summary: A global flood, explains the reduction of oxygen concentration and the increase in gravity.
The moon's gravity also increases earth's gravity (see Gravity: 4a & 4b)
That before the flood earth's gravity was 25% weaker, is an approximation.
that before the flood, oxygen concentration was 50% higher, is an approximation.
I don't think water is enough to increase the earth's gravity by 25%. Keep in mind that our planet's water is only 0.023% of our planet's mass(
http://www.universetoday.com/25822/water-on-earth/). So an increase of 25% seems like an absurdly large amount of water, especially if you consider it's volume. Where would all that water have gone after the great flood? And do you have any proof that the moon was once close enough to earth to cause more such drastic differences in gravity, considering the timespan proclaimed by Bible theorists? The moon doesn't move away fast enough to have done this in only a few thousand years.(I think, not sure about the calculations)
Lastly do you have any other proof than the Bible that there was so much water envelopping around our athmosphere?(I'm not gonna discuss the validity of the Bible again as the discussion didn't go very well in the past)
==> didn't answer the rest of your text as it seemed to be the same as what you already said before, but in more detail. A
lso sorry if my text is a bit messy, I responded while not having read your entire text(didn't want to read such a vast text twice)I have to admit, if I sounded condensending before it was due to your theory of increased gravity. Having read this and researching it to confirm it, I have to thank you for enlightening me about this. I had no clue these theories even existed. Though I have one issue that I have about this. The theory of expanding earth is based on the fact that either mass or volume has changed.
- change in volume: This theory requires the earth to cool down. However current knowledge of materials and earth composition requires many millions of years for our planet to cool down, which of course doesn't agree with your view of the earth only being a couple of thousand years old.
- change in mass: Where would all that mass have come from? The amount of space dust every year is way too small for this and a giant asteroid of enough size hitting the earth would have killed not only the dinosaurs but us too(according to you humans and dinosaurs once lived on earth together). Where do you explain the extra mass coming from?
Summary of my questions about your theory:- Where did all the water of the flood dissapear to?
- Do you have any other proof than the Bible that there was this massive amount of water over and around our athmosphere?
- Do you have proof that the moon moves away fast enough to have created such drastic changes in gravity?(even in combination with water) do you have proof of the math?
Change is volume: You are assuming that the earth cooled over billions of years. Dr. Robert Gentry proved this to be false by his discovery of radioactive halos in granite rock. See early post.
http://www.halos.com/http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEMDqTxfkmMChange in mass to increase gravity: The earth can have the same mass, but with a canopy of water surrounding the atmosphere, this creates a buoyancy effect. Which means gravity is weaker. Kind of like being in water. In water, there is more pressure: Adding the atmosphere + water surrounding a person in the water = greater pressure = buoyancy. And that is what the canopy of water does. This alone would be sufficient enough to change the gravity enough to allow creatures to grow to massive height.
1. Does The effect of the Moon slowing the earth affect gravity? First let's establish that the moon does slow the earth rotation velocity:
The gravitational torque between the Moon and the tidal bulge of the Earth causes the Moon to be constantly promoted to a slightly higher orbit and the Earth to be decelerated in its rotation
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_acceleration... Now we need to establish is the moon using 100% of the energy it takes from the earth's spin?
energy and angular momentum are transferred from the rotation of the Earth to the orbital motion of the Moon (however, most of the energy lost by the Earth (-3.321 TW) is converted to heat by frictional losses in the oceans and their interaction with the solid Earth, and only about 1/30th (+0.121 TW) is transferred to the Moon).
So the moon is slowing the earth, but only 1/30th of the energy lost from the earth's spin is noticed by the moon's recession. So the moon moving away from the earth at 3 inches per year is 1/30th of the effect the moon is having on the earth.
Now that we know the moons is slowing the earth, does that affect earth's gravity? In other words, if the earth spun faster would gravity seem weaker? The acceleration of gravity at the poles were there in no loss of gravity to centripetal force is 9.83m/s/s. While the acceleration of gravity at the equators, were there is loss of gravity to centripetal force, because the earth is spinning 1,000mph, is 9.78m/s/s. So there is 0.5% change in gravity resulting from the spin of the earth. Which means a 200lb man would weigh 1lb more at the poles and 1lb less at the equator. This still isn't much, but it does establish a link between the earth's spin velocity and the strength of gravity.
Where did all the water disappear to? This is a fair question. Why? so Bible thumpers want people to believe in the flood that covered the whole earth in water, well then tell me what happened to all this water? This answer is two fold.
1. Before the flood, the mountains were not as tall and the valleys were not as deep (such as the Marianas Trench was not existent). Psalms 104: 6- "You covered earth with the deep [water] as with a garment; The waters were standing above the mountains. At your rebuke they fled, At the sound of Your thunder they hurried away. The mountains rose; the valleys sank down to the place which You established for them. You set the boundary that they may not pass over, So that they will not return to cover the earth. He sends forth springs in the valleys, They flow between the mountains; They give drink to every beast of the field," The verse points out that after the flood water came from melting snow caps between mountains, which is not how water was dispersed prior to the flood. Genesis 2:6 "a mist used to rise from the earth and water the whole surface of the ground".
2. As a result of global rain for 40 days and nights in the Genesis 7 flood, and the loss of global ambient temperatures with the loss of the canopy of water, the earth's temperatures reduced significantly. And water froze at the poles.
How much water is at the poles? if the south pole melted, the ocean levels would rise 200 feet. If just Greenland melts, the ocean would rise 7 feet. but if the earth was flat, the ocean level would be 1 mile above ground level. So do we have enough water on earth from a flood? yes.
The earth's gravity increasing is an approximation at 25% and it's not from one contributor. If I put estimates of which effect caused earth's gravity to increase and by what %, maybe that will help. Again, let me emphasize these are estimates and this is a theory.
the moon slowing the earth's spin: 4-5%
Asteroid/comet impacts, fractionally slowing the earth's spin: 1-5%
space debris adding mass:<1%
Canopy of water adding atmospheric pressure: buoyancy: 7-10%
Canopy of water coming down upon the earth to form oceans & ice caps: 1-2%
So the approximation of how much gravity increased from pre-flood to today is: 14-27%
This article I found today, summarizes my view very well:
http://www.present-truth.org/3-Nature/E ... r%2007.htm
