Game of Thrones (series spoiling only!)

[jonesthecurl]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

[ooge]

Looking forward to seeing how the return of Jamie Lannister affects the whole Joffrey/Cersei/Tywin/Tyrion dynamic at play in King's Landing..

What to watch now? Dexter and Breaking Bad are back on soon but not soon enough!

I have not seen a single episode of breaking bad,is it really that good?

The title sums it up. I can explain you roughly part of the first episode just to understand what it's about (it's minor spoiling, and just about the first episode). The main actor is the father from malcom in the middle. He is a high school chemistry teacher who learns he has cancer. He also has a second job in a car wash to pay the bills and is pretty much mistreated in both jobs, he's quite a big loser. He's got a cripple teenager and a new born baby and a wife he's deeply in love with. When he learns he's got cancer, he realizes he will be completely unable to pay any hospital fee and that there is basically no solution to cure himself. They are quite close to his wife's sister,whose husband is a DEA officer. One day, he goes with him to see how the Albuquerque police deals with meth dealers. While his brother in law is busting the dealers with other officers in some house turned into a meth lab, he waits in the car. He sees someone jump out of the window and escape. He realizes this guy is an ex student of his and he lets him go without saying anything to his brother in law. He then tried to find him, and instead of lecturing him, he asks him to become his new business partner... and so it begins!

ok,thanks for all the details,but is the show any good? For example if someone asked me about True Blood,I would tell them I have watched the show since the beginning,but if it was not for the DVR and the ability to see a show in 20 mins. I would have given up on it.I dont think its very good and I cant recommend it.

[Haggis_McMutton]

In the scene following that clip, Tywin tells Tyrion that he wanted to have Tyrion killed as a baby. To me that seems like a strange thing to say. I mean even if it's true, you don't have to say everything that is true. How did Tywin come to the conclusion that it was the right thing to say? If he wants Tyrion to obey him, and he does, telling him that his first instinct was to have him murdered is not going to make Tyrion more eager to please his father. Tywin is supposed to be a smart man, surely he knows this.

I think Tyrion pretty much knows that his father blames him for his mother's death and that he resents him even more for the whole drunk, lecherous, dwarf thing since Tywin views it as a stain on the family name.
I mean there was the scene in season 1 where Tyrion says that all dwarfs are bastards in their father's eyes. There was the story about his first wife. There was Tywin sending him in the first wave with the hill people against Robb. And there was the brutal speech Tywin gave him when Tyrion asked to be lord of Casterly Rock.

Given that, I think the purpose of this current speech was not so much to say "I personally despise you", but "Even though I personally despise you, I recognize you as a Lanister, and grant you the responsibilities and power that comes with that. Don't f*ck it up."

[Gillipig]

In the scene following that clip, Tywin tells Tyrion that he wanted to have Tyrion killed as a baby. To me that seems like a strange thing to say. I mean even if it's true, you don't have to say everything that is true. How did Tywin come to the conclusion that it was the right thing to say? If he wants Tyrion to obey him, and he does, telling him that his first instinct was to have him murdered is not going to make Tyrion more eager to please his father. Tywin is supposed to be a smart man, surely he knows this.

I think Tyrion pretty much knows that his father blames him for his mother's death and that he resents him even more for the whole drunk, lecherous, dwarf thing since Tywin views it as a stain on the family name.
I mean there was the scene in season 1 where Tyrion says that all dwarfs are bastards in their father's eyes. There was the story about his first wife. There was Tywin sending him in the first wave with the hill people against Robb. And there was the brutal speech Tywin gave him when Tyrion asked to be lord of Casterly Rock.

Given that, I think the purpose of this current speech was not so much to say "I personally despise you", but "Even though I personally despise you, I recognize you as a Lanister, and grant you the responsibilities and power that comes with that. Don't f*ck it up."

It seems to me that his focus in that conversation was more to clarify how much he really hates him rather than to instill family name solidarity. At least I think that was what Tyrion took with him from that conversation. I imagine this was what went through his head. "Damn, my father really hates me!"

[Gillipig]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

I think the books are called "A song of ice and fire" because it's a tale (song) of white walkers (ice) and dragons (fire). The dragons and white walkers is what the series ultimately is about. Their seasons may be varying in length length due to an uneven orbit around the sun or something. For us it's the tilt of the earth that gives regularly appearing seasons on earth, but maybe this planet doesn't have a tilt but instead orbits it's sun slightly more unevenly. Don't know enough about this type of science to know if it would be possible, just a guess.

[betiko]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

I think the books are called "A song of ice and fire" because it's a tale (song) of white walkers (ice) and dragons (fire). The dragons and white walkers is what the series ultimately is about. Their seasons may be varying in length length due to an uneven orbit around the sun or something. For us it's the tilt of the earth that gives regularly appearing seasons on earth, but maybe this planet doesn't have a tilt but instead orbits it's sun slightly more unevenly. Don't know enough about this type of science to know if it would be possible, just a guess.

Unless you re at a pole and the world has no tilt, i d say there has to be seasons... Maybe the tilt on this planet has cycles that last decades while it goes around the sun, and that you re either on the cold part of the planet for a decade or in the hot part..
But i don t know, i never took this as something important, as it s not something strange in westeros. Seasons last several years and thats it. I don t know, you have the lord of light crap, zombies and dragons in this fantasy world, i sure can take that in this universe seasons last several years

[betiko]

Looking forward to seeing how the return of Jamie Lannister affects the whole Joffrey/Cersei/Tywin/Tyrion dynamic at play in King's Landing..

What to watch now? Dexter and Breaking Bad are back on soon but not soon enough!

I have not seen a single episode of breaking bad,is it really that good?

The title sums it up. I can explain you roughly part of the first episode just to understand what it's about (it's minor spoiling, and just about the first episode). The main actor is the father from malcom in the middle. He is a high school chemistry teacher who learns he has cancer. He also has a second job in a car wash to pay the bills and is pretty much mistreated in both jobs, he's quite a big loser. He's got a cripple teenager and a new born baby and a wife he's deeply in love with. When he learns he's got cancer, he realizes he will be completely unable to pay any hospital fee and that there is basically no solution to cure himself. They are quite close to his wife's sister,whose husband is a DEA officer. One day, he goes with him to see how the Albuquerque police deals with meth dealers. While his brother in law is busting the dealers with other officers in some house turned into a meth lab, he waits in the car. He sees someone jump out of the window and escape. He realizes this guy is an ex student of his and he lets him go without saying anything to his brother in law. He then tried to find him, and instead of lecturing him, he asks him to become his new business partner... and so it begins!

ok,thanks for all the details,but is the show any good? For example if someone asked me about True Blood,I would tell them I have watched the show since the beginning,but if it was not for the DVR and the ability to see a show in 20 mins. I would have given up on it.I dont think its very good and I cant recommend it.

It is. The evolution of this character to the dark side (as per the title) is fantastically done. I never heard of people who didn t like it. Or maybe some conservatives might disaprove the immorality of a chemistry teacher cooking meth in his free time.

[betiko]

this is how tywinn ends up:

[jonesthecurl]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

I think the books are called "A song of ice and fire" because it's a tale (song) of white walkers (ice) and dragons (fire). The dragons and white walkers is what the series ultimately is about. Their seasons may be varying in length length due to an uneven orbit around the sun or something. For us it's the tilt of the earth that gives regularly appearing seasons on earth, but maybe this planet doesn't have a tilt but instead orbits it's sun slightly more unevenly. Don't know enough about this type of science to know if it would be possible, just a guess.

Unless you re at a pole and the world has no tilt, i d say there has to be seasons... Maybe the tilt on this planet has cycles that last decades while it goes around the sun, and that you re either on the cold part of the planet for a decade or in the hot part..
But i don t know, i never took this as something important, as it s not something strange in westeros. Seasons last several years and thats it. I don t know, you have the lord of light crap, zombies and dragons in this fantasy world, i sure can take that in this universe seasons last several years

I for one will be hellishly disappointed if this doesn't turn out to be a key question. Granted, that's mainly because I've been telling everyone it IS important for years now, and GRRM (or rahter the characters) seems to have ignored the question. See, it's such an odd characteristic for a world to have, and is mentioned so early and so consistently, it has to be a key factor.
What was that Bob Shaw series where the value of pi turned out to be a key factor?

[betiko]

well if it is, the only force strong enough to do that is the lord of light i presume. In that case, I'd say the revolution around the sun lasts longer than usual. Inhabitants of the planet count years in terms of days (that last the right amount of time, presumably 24h like us) but not in terms of full revolution around the sun. Some force might make the planet travel slower even if the spin remains the same, i don't know. Even though, no one finds it odd. So if they don't, why should we? They know more about their world that we do...

[thegreekdog]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

show

[Army of GOD]

I'm not sure how it is in the novels but they're making Daenerys to be too likable of a character. She's hot, she's be wronged, she's honest, she's just, etc. From what I've seen from this season (aka the first season I've watched) is that any character can die at any time, which is pretty much what I've wanted from a movie/tv series for a while. As much as I like(d) Spartacus/Boardwalk Empire/Walking Dead, you KNOW for a god damned fact that the main characters (Spartacus, Nucky, Rick) aren't going to die (and if they do, it's the last episode ie Spartacus).

[kizkiz]

I'm not sure how it is in the novels but they're making Daenerys to be too likable of a character. She's hot, she's be wronged, she's honest, she's just, etc. From what I've seen from this season (aka the first season I've watched) is that any character can die at any time, which is pretty much what I've wanted from a movie/tv series for a while. As much as I like(d) Spartacus/Boardwalk Empire/Walking Dead, you KNOW for a god damned fact that the main characters (Spartacus, Nucky, Rick) aren't going to die (and if they do, it's the last episode ie Spartacus).

nobody is safe in the game of thrones
Martin will have you pulling your hair out at times
I'm being general here, btw

[Army of GOD]

I'm not sure how it is in the novels but they're making Daenerys to be too likable of a character. She's hot, she's be wronged, she's honest, she's just, etc. From what I've seen from this season (aka the first season I've watched) is that any character can die at any time, which is pretty much what I've wanted from a movie/tv series for a while. As much as I like(d) Spartacus/Boardwalk Empire/Walking Dead, you KNOW for a god damned fact that the main characters (Spartacus, Nucky, Rick) aren't going to die (and if they do, it's the last episode ie Spartacus).

nobody is safe in the game of thrones
Martin will have you pulling your hair out at times
I'm being general here, btw

As hot as she is, she needs to either die or at least become unlikable.


But hey-zeus christo she's sexy.

[jonesthecurl]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

show

Martin is not a lazy writer who will just say "Hey, it doesn't need to make sense. It's fantasy". Go read Dying of the Light to see how he integrates the physical peculiarities of a world into the plot.

[thegreekdog]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

show

Martin is not a lazy writer who will just say "Hey, it doesn't need to make sense. It's fantasy". Go read Dying of the Light to see how he integrates the physical peculiarities of a world into the plot.

I guess two things. First, I was marginally kidding. Second, I would call Martin a lazy writer, although with something like this (world creation) he is as ambitious and hard-working as anyone. In other words, the dude can build a world better than anyone so I'm sure he has an answer, we just don't know what that is yet. My guess is it has something to do with magic. Or else global warming.

[kizkiz]

There's obviously something that has happened that we know nothing of yet
There will be a reason that dragons, white walkers and magic etc have all come back/started working again after a thousand or more years

[jonesthecurl]

There's obviously something that has happened that we know nothing of yet
There will be a reason that dragons, white walkers and magic etc have all come back/started working again after a thousand or more years

Now we're getting somewhere.

[ooge]

Looking forward to seeing how the return of Jamie Lannister affects the whole Joffrey/Cersei/Tywin/Tyrion dynamic at play in King's Landing..

What to watch now? Dexter and Breaking Bad are back on soon but not soon enough!

I have not seen a single episode of breaking bad,is it really that good?

The title sums it up. I can explain you roughly part of the first episode just to understand what it's about (it's minor spoiling, and just about the first episode). The main actor is the father from malcom in the middle. He is a high school chemistry teacher who learns he has cancer. He also has a second job in a car wash to pay the bills and is pretty much mistreated in both jobs, he's quite a big loser. He's got a cripple teenager and a new born baby and a wife he's deeply in love with. When he learns he's got cancer, he realizes he will be completely unable to pay any hospital fee and that there is basically no solution to cure himself. They are quite close to his wife's sister,whose husband is a DEA officer. One day, he goes with him to see how the Albuquerque police deals with meth dealers. While his brother in law is busting the dealers with other officers in some house turned into a meth lab, he waits in the car. He sees someone jump out of the window and escape. He realizes this guy is an ex student of his and he lets him go without saying anything to his brother in law. He then tried to find him, and instead of lecturing him, he asks him to become his new business partner... and so it begins!

ok,thanks for all the details,but is the show any good? For example if someone asked me about True Blood,I would tell them I have watched the show since the beginning,but if it was not for the DVR and the ability to see a show in 20 mins. I would have given up on it.I dont think its very good and I cant recommend it.

It is. The evolution of this character to the dark side (as per the title) is fantastically done. I never heard of people who didn t like it. Or maybe some conservatives might disaprove the immorality of a chemistry teacher cooking meth in his free time.

ok,thanks,I will look into finding the show online so I can see it from the beginning

[Gillipig]

There's obviously something that has happened that we know nothing of yet
There will be a reason that dragons, white walkers and magic etc have all come back/started working again after a thousand or more years

We know nothing, couch potatoes!

[The Bison King]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

show

Martin is not a lazy writer who will just say "Hey, it doesn't need to make sense. It's fantasy". Go read Dying of the Light to see how he integrates the physical peculiarities of a world into the plot.

I guess two things. First, I was marginally kidding. Second, I would call Martin a lazy writer, although with something like this (world creation) he is as ambitious and hard-working as anyone. In other words, the dude can build a world better than anyone so I'm sure he has an answer, we just don't know what that is yet. My guess is it has something to do with magic. Or else global warming.

I've always assumed it was more in line with the planet having an irregular axis. Not something that's really important, or within the characters realm of control, just something he added in to make the world a little more dynamic and raise the dramatic tension.

[denominator]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

show

Martin is not a lazy writer who will just say "Hey, it doesn't need to make sense. It's fantasy". Go read Dying of the Light to see how he integrates the physical peculiarities of a world into the plot.

I guess two things. First, I was marginally kidding. Second, I would call Martin a lazy writer, although with something like this (world creation) he is as ambitious and hard-working as anyone. In other words, the dude can build a world better than anyone so I'm sure he has an answer, we just don't know what that is yet. My guess is it has something to do with magic. Or else global warming.

I've always assumed it was more in line with the planet having an irregular axis. Not something that's really important, or within the characters realm of control, just something he added in to make the world a little more dynamic and raise the dramatic tension.

I've only just started reading the first book, and am now finally caught up on the TV series.

Everything I've read/seen so far regarding the long, irregular seasons seems to me to be a way to make the audience uncomfortable. It adds to the unpredictability of the world and shakes the reader/viewer out of their comfort zone from the start. We're so used to consistent length day/year/season that the notion of a winter that is unpredictable in length is very unsettling.

It's the same with the major, unexpected deaths. The novelty and unexpected nature of deaths such as Eddard, Renly, Robert, or Robb hook the audience in. Just like someone above said, the Daenerys character is bland because you know she can't die yet. There is nothing unexpected about her storyline. Martin has introduced enough characters that the story will drive forward regardless of who dies - this is the true brilliance in Game of Thrones.

One question, no puns intended or anything; have you read the books?
I largely agree with what you're saying, I also cringed when they started calling her mother and worshiping her (that happened in the book as well but I just fast read past it). It made little sense and that's particularly painful to see in a series that is otherwise pretty logical. Things don't go your way unless you do all the right things and even then you're not safe from bad luck (ex, Tyrion did nothing wrong and still got thrown in jail for the murder attempt on Bran). But if your name is Daenarys, you're safe. She's almost as naive as her brother and while he was very openly arrogant, her arrogance is more subtle but you can definitely tell that it runs in the family. You forgot to mention that time when she was about to drink poison but Jorah saved her. She's basically a naive duckling that only survives because Mr Martin needed her to. He thought of this character he wanted to include, realized she would have to live for a long time in the book, but couldn't quite make it seem likely that she actually would, if this was a real world. But hey, the man has done so many things right, Tyrion is a master stroke for example.

well maybe he is building up positivity to make it all come crashing down, which is why we love mr. martin's work
'the bigger the rise, the bigger the fall'

I expect her to sit the iron throne at some point, that seems inevitable, everything is leading up to that, the question is though, how long will she hold it? I personally hope that she doesn't draw the longest straw in the end, I can think of several people I'd rather see walk away with it. One thing to keep in mind with Daenerys is that she can't ride all three dragons at the same time herself, she'll need to find others to trust, and with trust comes......the possibility of betrayal hehe.

show

[Gillipig]

I've said this elsewhere, but I'm not sure if I've said it in cc before: nobody seems to be picking up on what I think is going to be the key to this entire world - exactly HOW are the seasons longer than the years? And of variable length? What sort of cosmology makes that happen? And is it a clue to why the ice zombies have reappeared and the fire zombies have emerged for (so far as we know) the first time? Think about it - the series is called "Ice and Fire".

show

Martin is not a lazy writer who will just say "Hey, it doesn't need to make sense. It's fantasy". Go read Dying of the Light to see how he integrates the physical peculiarities of a world into the plot.

I guess two things. First, I was marginally kidding. Second, I would call Martin a lazy writer, although with something like this (world creation) he is as ambitious and hard-working as anyone. In other words, the dude can build a world better than anyone so I'm sure he has an answer, we just don't know what that is yet. My guess is it has something to do with magic. Or else global warming.

I've always assumed it was more in line with the planet having an irregular axis. Not something that's really important, or within the characters realm of control, just something he added in to make the world a little more dynamic and raise the dramatic tension.

I've only just started reading the first book, and am now finally caught up on the TV series.

Everything I've read/seen so far regarding the long, irregular seasons seems to me to be a way to make the audience uncomfortable. It adds to the unpredictability of the world and shakes the reader/viewer out of their comfort zone from the start. We're so used to consistent length day/year/season that the notion of a winter that is unpredictable in length is very unsettling.

It's the same with the major, unexpected deaths. The novelty and unexpected nature of deaths such as Eddard, Renly, Robert, or Robb hook the audience in. Just like someone above said, the Daenerys character is bland because you know she can't die yet. There is nothing unexpected about her storyline. Martin has introduced enough characters that the story will drive forward regardless of who dies - this is the true brilliance in Game of Thrones.

One question, no puns intended or anything; have you read the books?
I largely agree with what you're saying, I also cringed when they started calling her mother and worshiping her (that happened in the book as well but I just fast read past it). It made little sense and that's particularly painful to see in a series that is otherwise pretty logical. Things don't go your way unless you do all the right things and even then you're not safe from bad luck (ex, Tyrion did nothing wrong and still got thrown in jail for the murder attempt on Bran). But if your name is Daenarys, you're safe. She's almost as naive as her brother and while he was very openly arrogant, her arrogance is more subtle but you can definitely tell that it runs in the family. You forgot to mention that time when she was about to drink poison but Jorah saved her. She's basically a naive duckling that only survives because Mr Martin needed her to. He thought of this character he wanted to include, realized she would have to live for a long time in the book, but couldn't quite make it seem likely that she actually would, if this was a real world. But hey, the man has done so many things right, Tyrion is a master stroke for example.

well maybe he is building up positivity to make it all come crashing down, which is why we love mr. martin's work
'the bigger the rise, the bigger the fall'

I expect her to sit the iron throne at some point, that seems inevitable, everything is leading up to that, the question is though, how long will she hold it? I personally hope that she doesn't draw the longest straw in the end, I can think of several people I'd rather see walk away with it. One thing to keep in mind with Daenerys is that she can't ride all three dragons at the same time herself, she'll need to find others to trust, and with trust comes......the possibility of betrayal hehe.

show

Before reading any of the books I watched the two first tv series seasons (back to back because I didn't watch season 1 when it first came out), after seeing those two seasons I got so interested I read the four first books before season 3 aired and are currently reading the fifth book. I'm about halfway through it now and it's interesting how some of the things I've said/"wondered about" in this thread either have been fleshed out, came true or been rejected after having read the first half of this book. I will say this though, book four and five are not as good as book 1,2 and 3. They held a higher standard. In book four and five there's too much following of uninteresting characters (not gonna name them of course) that I just skip in order to get to the good stories. And some characters that I used to find it interesting to read about have now become boring. That can be a problem when you kill off so many good characters, you're left with the bad ones to finish the story lol.

Who John Snow's mother is have not yet been revealed where I am in the books (we still think he's Ned's bastard son), but we can speculate of course and if your guess is correct he would be one the favorites to sit the Iron Throne in the end. Connecting the south by blood, the north through his stepfather and the wall through his station. If he were of the dragonblood though I would get the feeling that Maester Aemon somehow could sense it and told Sam or something.

[betiko]

yes this theory was already mentioned here, and also that it's just a theory among readers. I am not too sure though. I m pretty sure that he has some targaryen blood though.
I also overheard once that jon snow and thoros of myr are milk brothers and were raised together in their first years by thoros's mother. But I don't know, I think it would be too easy to end up with jon on the throne, seems too predictable. (but then, martin is trying so hard to be unpredictable that the predictable becomes unpredictable )

It is true that with ned stark having such a sense of honour, it seems pretty strange to imagine him cheating on catlyn mostly in his first years of marriage. Was he trying to protect his sister's virtue and memory after her death? did rhaegar rape his sister? Did he know how important was jon's lineage, and that if it was revealed people would ve tried to murder him? Could he not trust catlyn and tell her the truth instead of putting himself in such an embarassing situation? robert baratheon and john aryn probably knew the truth... so he would trust them more than his loving wife, and would put himself in the "danger zone"? Not to mention that jon was hated by cathlyn all his childhood because of that..

[Gillipig]

yes this theory was already mentioned here, and also that it's just a theory among readers. I am not too sure though. I m pretty sure that he has some targaryen blood though.
I also overheard once that jon snow and thoros of myr are milk brothers and were raised together in their first years by thoros's mother. But I don't know, I think it would be too easy to end up with jon on the throne, seems too predictable. (but then, martin is trying so hard to be unpredictable that the predictable becomes unpredictable )

It is true that with ned stark having such a sense of honour, it seems pretty strange to imagine him cheating on catlyn mostly in his first years of marriage. Was he trying to protect his sister's virtue and memory after her death? did rhaegar rape his sister? Did he know how important was jon's lineage, and that if it was revealed people would ve tried to murder him? Could he not trust catlyn and tell her the truth instead of putting himself in such an embarassing situation? robert baratheon and john aryn probably knew the truth... so he would trust them more than his loving wife, and would put himself in the "danger zone"? Not to mention that jon was hated by cathlyn all his childhood because of that..

Robert Baratheon certainly didn't know. That would be the first person he'd want to keep that knowledge away from.