Russian peacekeeping forces enter Ukraine

[jusplay4fun]

Meanwhile the "peace keepers" destroy a maternity hospital.

Wheres that W anchors emoji when you need it?

Answer THAT, saxi, the Russian Troll

... [pause], then ...

Wow, saxi, I am honored. How long did the sketch and post TAKE?

Please fix the sketch, saxi. I am not bald; no facial hair, either.

I think I wrote pukin' putin, but maybe I missed the ' that time. I checked; I did not.

AND....I am MUCH better looking. (even if I say so myself.) Did you model that guy after the image in your mirror?

[saxitoxin]

Marco rubio vs Victoria Nuland ....interesting conversation about bio labs ,,, its these also Russian propaganda?

Also Presidend Of Ukraine sign law for confiscated all russian property,, i dont know how smart are these move during ongoing war? These thing happened mostly in Communist countries but only after end of WWII .

My high school had a biology lab, its a pretty broad term

I'd suggest the U.S. Government probably wasn't "concerned" at the possibility the Russian Federation Ground Forces might gain access to your high school biology lab.

USA: "There are no biological weapons in Ukraine."
USA: "Ukraine has biological research facilities."
USA: "We are very concerned the Russians could gain access to the samples held in Ukrainian biological research facilities."

OK. Samples of what? The Impossible Whopper? What biological samples does Ukraine have that are so troubling (but are not weapons) they have to be kept out of Russian hands?

Based on the carefully worded USA statements of there being no "biological weapons" I feel safe in saying we're talking about pre-weaponized material. Which raises the question how did Ukraine come into possession of such advanced biological technology that it is potentially something Russia - operator of the world's biggest biowarfare program - doesn't have and the USA is concerned about it getting ahold of? Russia already has Saxitoxin and probably also my sister, Phoneutria nigriventer toxin-3; and maybe our cousin Zetekitoxin AB.

When you spend five minutes scratching the surface of all these cagey and strangely worded statements, you get to the root of the issue which is a classic case of U.S. violation of Article III of the Biological Weapons Convention Nuland -- a member of Neocon Royalty -- is trying to avoid admitting to while also trying to avoid committing perjury to the Senate.

Each State Party to this Convention undertakes not to transfer to any recipient whatsoever, directly or indirectly, and not in any way to assist, encourage, or induce any State, group of States or international organisations to manufacture or otherwise acquire any of the agents, toxins, weapons, equipment or means of delivery specified in Article I of the Convention.

[jusplay4fun]

Confirmed: you now know what saxi looks like, and its not what he puts on his avatar or signature.

Thanks, saxi.

[bigtoughralf]

Just been watching Bloomberg News. They seem pretty keen to stress the point that US inflation was already rising pre-Ukraine and therefore is not due to the war, and that US trade sanctions are 'symbolic' and won't really hurt Russia. Like, deliberately asking their reporters multiple questions about this so that their reporters can repeatedly and explicitly deny that inflation is due to Ukraine.

Even with the USG on a war footing, the US news entertainment media finds the USG so uninspiring that it doesn't want to be seen to be supporting it

[jimboston]

In Germany, the Munich Iatros Clinic has announced it will not provide medical treatment to persons of Belarus or Russian ethnicity.

https://www.rtl.de/cms/muenchen-schock- ... 32473.html

This is how it starts. In the run-up to WW2, Germany also banned ethnic Slavs from medical treatment. It later executed 150,000 Slavs in concentration camps.

If you aren't standing with Russia, you're standing on the wrong side of history. The Russian nation defeated Napoleon, it defeated Hitler, and it will defeat you.

Russia was on the defense in those 3 conflicts.
(Initially, they were the non-instigator…. and only went on offense after in retaliation.)

The simple fact is that Russia does better when it’s attacked and not so well when it’s the instigator.

Also… yeah Russian missiles could wipe Kiev off the face of the Earth… this is true.
It’s also true that even Russia needs to play politics for both internal and external reasons… it it’s “too blatant” it could escalate.

[jimboston]

Do you know how US-Nato coalition in 1999 bombarding of Yugoslavia call strike on civilians? Collateral damage
Nice words when you protect military of any kind of prosecution. Its very symptomatic that Bombarding of civilian areas of Yugoslavia,Iraq,Afghanistan Libya call unintentional killing of civilians by mistakes,,but from other side Russian are intentionally bombard civilians???
I really dont see any different when US bombing hospitals in Yugoslavia and Russian bomb hospital in Ukraine.

Can you please go to Wikipedia and edit this entry so that the REAL reason for NATO intervention is noted?

Thanks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bomb ... Yugoslavia

NATO's intervention was prompted by Yugoslavia's bloodshed and ethnic cleansing of Albanians, which drove the Albanians into neighbouring countries and had the potential to destabilize the region.

[saxitoxin]

Do you know how US-Nato coalition in 1999 bombarding of Yugoslavia call strike on civilians? Collateral damage
Nice words when you protect military of any kind of prosecution. Its very symptomatic that Bombarding of civilian areas of Yugoslavia,Iraq,Afghanistan Libya call unintentional killing of civilians by mistakes,,but from other side Russian are intentionally bombard civilians???
I really dont see any different when US bombing hospitals in Yugoslavia and Russian bomb hospital in Ukraine.

Can you please go to Wikipedia and edit this entry so that the REAL reason for NATO intervention is noted?

Thanks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bomb ... Yugoslavia

NATO's intervention was prompted by Yugoslavia's bloodshed and ethnic cleansing of Albanians, which drove the Albanians into neighbouring countries and had the potential to destabilize the region.

I didn't bother reading the Wikipedia article because it's Wikipedia. A small group of 100-200 articles on U.S. foreign policy have long had a suspicious series of synchronized edits from a tightly linked set of accounts.

Insofar as what actually happened, though, NATO claimed "100,000" Kosovars were killed by Serbia which was the basis for their illegal attack against Serbia. The 100,000 number was used to whip the American and European publics into a wild-eyed frenzy of war hysteria. The American and European publics, eyes bloodshot and demanding revenge, greenlit their governments to bomb Serbia into peace.

By 2008, it was discovered the number of dead was actually 3,000 - not 100,000. More recently, it's been further downgraded to probably less than 1,000, the majority of whom were armed combatants of the Kosovo Liberation Army.

Serbia acted within its sovereign rights. NATO was the aggressor. This is beyond contention or discussion. The only legitimate debate that remains is if NATO's aggression was due to accident or artifice. Was it duplicity or poor intelligence? My bet is duplicity but I'm willing to discuss the claim it was poor intelligence. What I would never legitimize with discussion is the false claim that NATO acted justly or lawfully.

[saxitoxin]

And to be clear, the U.S. is currently claiming Russia's invasion of Ukraine is illegal as it doesn't meet one of the criteria under international law needed to make war: (a) UN Security Council resolution, or, (2) self-defense. (Russia claims anticipatory self-defense under the Caroline Doctrine, but that's been treated as a pretextual claim and I'm even willing to admit the evidence is muddled.)

However, NATO's attack on Serbia didn't even have a pretextual claim to legality. It was not approved by the Security Council and no NATO state was under attack by Serbia. Even Robert Kagan (husband of Vicky Nuland, the Neocon Queen now orchestrating the West's insults against Russia), admitted back in 2007 the NATO attack on Serbia was illegal: https://www.hoover.org/research/end-dre ... rn-history. It was one of the two most naked cases of blatant international aggression in the last 30 years, the other being the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait. (I think the attack against Libya was more awful but there was a veil of legality it was cloaked in. There wasn't even a veil in the case of Serbia.)

[HitRed]

Seems the Russians are forming a new economic block.

C.R.I.

China, Russian and Iran.

[Qwert]

Do you know how US-Nato coalition in 1999 bombarding of Yugoslavia call strike on civilians? Collateral damage
Nice words when you protect military of any kind of prosecution. Its very symptomatic that Bombarding of civilian areas of Yugoslavia,Iraq,Afghanistan Libya call unintentional killing of civilians by mistakes,,but from other side Russian are intentionally bombard civilians???
I really dont see any different when US bombing hospitals in Yugoslavia and Russian bomb hospital in Ukraine.

Can you please go to Wikipedia and edit this entry so that the REAL reason for NATO intervention is noted?

Thanks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bomb ... Yugoslavia

NATO's intervention was prompted by Yugoslavia's bloodshed and ethnic cleansing of Albanians, which drove the Albanians into neighbouring countries and had the potential to destabilize the region.

Dont tell me that you still belive in US government propaganda? I also can use quotes from wikipedia.
=============================================
.... It was the first time that NATO had used military force without the expressed endorsement of the UN Security Council[citation needed], which triggered debates over the legitimacy of the intervention.....
,,,,On CBS' Face the Nation Cohen claimed, "We've now seen about 100,000 military-aged men missing. ... They may have been murdered."[201] Clinton, citing the same figure, spoke of "at least 100,000 (Kosovar Albanians) missing".,,,
,,,,Clinton compared the events of Kosovo to the Holocaust. CNN reported, "Accusing Serbia of 'ethnic cleansing' in Kosovo similar to the genocide of Jews in World War II, an impassioned Clinton sought Tuesday to rally public support for his decision to send US forces into combat against Yugoslavia, a prospect that seemed increasingly likely with the breakdown of a diplomatic peace effort.",,,
....The Department of State also gave the highest estimate of dead Albanians. In May 1999, Defence Secretary William Cohen suggested that there might be up to 100,000 Albanian fatalities."[206] Post-war examinations revealed these statements and casualty figures to have been exaggerated.,,,
=================================================
And these its way how US goverment attack other sovereign countries
Iraq 2003 WMD, never existed but US need to have reason for own citizens to believe in lie.
Afghanistan.....In the weeks ahead and at the beginning of the US and NATO invasion of Afghanistan, the Taliban demanded evidence of bin Laden's guilt, but subsequently offered to hand over Osama bin Laden to a third country if the US stopped its bombing and provided evidence of bin Laden's guilt.[150][151] A Bush administration official later stated that their demands were "not subject to negotiation" and that it was "time for the Taliban to act now....
US have force and power to avoid invasion on afghanistan find osama bin laden and capture or kill with special forces( how they done that in 2011 in Pakistan).
US gave ultimatum to Taliban, but dont give Ultimatum to Pakistan but decide for secret operation to entry into Pakistan and kill Osama?????? 20 years in Afghanistan with 70000 soldiers cost US 2355 killed and 19950 wounded and without mission accomplished,, and 1 night in Pakistan with 79 soldier mission accomplished no casualty

[aad0906]

In Germany, the Munich Iatros Clinic has announced it will not provide medical treatment to persons of Belarus or Russian ethnicity.

https://www.rtl.de/cms/muenchen-schock- ... 32473.html

This is how it starts. In the run-up to WW2, Germany also banned ethnic Slavs from medical treatment. It later executed 150,000 Slavs in concentration camps.

If you aren't standing with Russia, you're standing on the wrong side of history. The Russian nation defeated Napoleon, it defeated Hitler, and it will defeat you.

This was a private clinic and it caused widespread condemnation, and rightly so. So let's not pretend that Germans are suddenly all racist again. Napoleon defeated himself by foolishly chasing an interior Russian army into a vast empire in the midst of a bitterly cold winter. Hitler also defeated himself for doing pretty much the same. He entered Russia too late in the season and his troops were ill-prepared (no winter gear, no winter oil, vehicles getting bogged down in the mud during the fall downpours) for the harsh Russian winter. And let's also not pretend that the Russian/Soviet regime was peace loving. They all to keenly signed a pact with Germany to carve up Poland, they invaded Finland just to name a few. And Hitler basically beat Russia to the draw: Stalin had his eyes on Germany/Europe just like Hitler did.

[jusplay4fun]

Do you know how US-Nato coalition in 1999 bombarding of Yugoslavia call strike on civilians? Collateral damage
Nice words when you protect military of any kind of prosecution. Its very symptomatic that Bombarding of civilian areas of Yugoslavia,Iraq,Afghanistan Libya call unintentional killing of civilians by mistakes,,but from other side Russian are intentionally bombard civilians???
I really dont see any different when US bombing hospitals in Yugoslavia and Russian bomb hospital in Ukraine.

Can you please go to Wikipedia and edit this entry so that the REAL reason for NATO intervention is noted?

Thanks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bomb ... Yugoslavia

NATO's intervention was prompted by Yugoslavia's bloodshed and ethnic cleansing of Albanians, which drove the Albanians into neighbouring countries and had the potential to destabilize the region.

Dont tell me that you still belive in US government propaganda? I also can use quotes from wikipedia.
=============================================
.... It was the first time that NATO had used military force without the expressed endorsement of the UN Security Council[citation needed], which triggered debates over the legitimacy of the intervention.....
,,,,On CBS' Face the Nation Cohen claimed, "We've now seen about 100,000 military-aged men missing. ... They may have been murdered."[201] Clinton, citing the same figure, spoke of "at least 100,000 (Kosovar Albanians) missing".,,,
,,,,Clinton compared the events of Kosovo to the Holocaust. CNN reported, "Accusing Serbia of 'ethnic cleansing' in Kosovo similar to the genocide of Jews in World War II, an impassioned Clinton sought Tuesday to rally public support for his decision to send US forces into combat against Yugoslavia, a prospect that seemed increasingly likely with the breakdown of a diplomatic peace effort.",,,
....The Department of State also gave the highest estimate of dead Albanians. In May 1999, Defence Secretary William Cohen suggested that there might be up to 100,000 Albanian fatalities."[206] Post-war examinations revealed these statements and casualty figures to have been exaggerated.,,,
=================================================
And these its way how US goverment attack other sovereign countries
Iraq 2003 WMD, never existed but US need to have reason for own citizens to believe in lie.
Afghanistan.....In the weeks ahead and at the beginning of the US and NATO invasion of Afghanistan, the Taliban demanded evidence of bin Laden's guilt, but subsequently offered to hand over Osama bin Laden to a third country if the US stopped its bombing and provided evidence of bin Laden's guilt.[150][151] A Bush administration official later stated that their demands were "not subject to negotiation" and that it was "time for the Taliban to act now....
US have force and power to avoid invasion on afghanistan find osama bin laden and capture or kill with special forces( how they done that in 2011 in Pakistan).
US gave ultimatum to Taliban, but dont give Ultimatum to Pakistan but decide for secret operation to entry into Pakistan and kill Osama?????? 20 years in Afghanistan with 70000 soldiers cost US 2355 killed and 19950 wounded and without mission accomplished,, and 1 night in Pakistan with 79 soldier mission accomplished no casualty

As I recall, the USA almost got Osama bin Laden shortly after they went into Afghanistan. Bin Laden escaped. The USA basically could not find him again, until much later. Bin Laden was being hidden by Pakistan; after all, he was hiding near their Military Academy. It is very likely that the upper echelon of The Pakistani national Government and military KNEW where he was hiding. AND bin Laden was the most wanted man for the USA. AND you wanted the USA to go through the national government to help get him? NO.

Also, due to the ties and cozy relationship between the Taliban and bin Laden, I really doubt that the Taliban would have accepted ANY evidence of bin Laden's guilt in the planning of the attacks of 9/11. As I said before, getting bin Laden was the only real justification for me for the USA to go into Afghanistan. Once bin Laden was killed, the USA should have planned to pull out of that country under Obama, in 2011, as I recall. And now I will quote Wikipedia:

Immediately after the September 11 attacks, US government officials named bin Laden and the al-Qaeda organization as the prime suspects and offered a reward of $25 million for information leading to his capture or death.[28][209] On July 13, 2007, the Senate voted to double the reward to $50 million, although the amount was never changed.[210] The Airline Pilots Association and the Air Transport Association offered an additional $2 million reward.[211]

Bin Laden was believed to be hiding in the White Mountains (Spin Ghar) in Afghanistan's east, near the Pakistani border.[212][213] According to The Washington Post, the US government concluded that Osama bin Laden was present during the Battle of Tora Bora, Afghanistan in late 2001, and according to civilian and military officials with first-hand knowledge, failure by the United States to commit enough US ground troops to hunt him led to his escape and was the gravest failure by the United States in the war against al-Qaeda. Intelligence officials assembled what they believed to be decisive evidence, from contemporary and subsequent interrogations and intercepted communications, that bin Laden began the Battle of Tora Bora inside the cave complex along Afghanistan's mountainous eastern border.[214]

The Washington Post also reported that the CIA unit composed of special operations paramilitary forces dedicated to capturing bin Laden was shut down in late 2005.[215]

also, from Wikipedia:

Osama bin Mohammed bin Awad bin Laden[a] (March 10, 1957[7] – May 2, 2011[8]), also transliterated as Usama bin Ladin, was a Saudi terrorist and founder of the Pan-Islamic militant organization al-Qaeda. The group is designated as a terrorist group by the United Nations Security Council, the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), the European Union, and various countries. Under bin Laden's leadership, al-Qaeda was responsible for the September 11 attacks in the United States, and many other mass-casualty attacks worldwide.[9][10][11]

In 1988, he formed al-Qaeda.[16] He was banished from Saudi Arabia in 1992, and shifted his base to Sudan, until US pressure forced him to leave Sudan in 1996. After establishing a new base in Afghanistan, he declared a war against the United States, initiating a series of bombings and related attacks.[17] Bin Laden was on the American Federal Bureau of Investigation's (FBI) lists of Ten Most Wanted Fugitives and Most Wanted Terrorists for his involvement in the 1998 US embassy bombings.[18][19][20]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osama_bin_Laden#Activities_and_whereabouts_after_the_September_11_attacks

I have said before that, in my mind, there was little, if any, justification for the USA to invade Iraq. We wasted American lives, lots of money, and much of the good "opinion" and good will of much of the world by invading Iraq. George W. Bush did not learn the lessons of Vietnam, did he? And Cheney, his VP, was given much of the same blame. The invasion of Afghanistan was questionable; the invasion of Iraq was not justified. And this despite the brutality of Saddam Hussein toward the other ethnic groups in Iraq, especially toward the Shiite Muslims.

Qwert seems to present only a narrow view of the war against Serbia to end the attack of Serbs against other ethnic groups living in and near Serbia. I see that Qwert accepts NO blame for the Serbs and their War to do "ethnic cleansing" in the country formerly called Yugoslavia. Overall, I see lots of proof of Serbian atrocities and I see no acknowledgement by Qwert of any of those brutal acts. He wants to debate again the military actions in and near Serbia. That War is over and done.

And whatever happened in and against Serbia, pukin' putin has NO justification for invading Ukraine. He is purposely making war against the civilians of Ukraine. His military is bogged down by fierce resistance by brave Ukrainians. They are fighting for the freedom and for their nation. HIs attack of the maternity hospital shows the depths of his depravity. It appears that all his other attempts at regime change in Ukraine failed, and now his invasion is having LOTS of problems. Lack of fuel and desertion by conscripts is part of his problems. The civilians of Ukraine will likely suffer MUCH more because the Russian military underestimated the resistance of the Ukrainian people. And now we hear that Russia may use chemical and/or biological weapons. More depravity. Was Syria training for ALL this?

[bigtoughralf]

The point isn't that America lied about its wars therefore Russia should be allowed to attack Ukraine. The point is that once again the US is lying about Ukraine (Putin deliberately bombs hospitals, Putin wants to use biological weapons etc) in order to justify increasingly aggressive attacks on Russia.

I'm surprised you even care about the suffering of the Bosniaks given they're Muslim.

[Dukasaur]

The point is that once again the US is lying about Ukraine

The US is not the only source of intelligence. The news from Ukraine is being verified by many nations, including not just governmental sources but NGOs and independent agencies.

[jimboston]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crime ... _civilians


I’m not comparing what Russia is doing now to what Serbia did.

I’m also not comparing what Russia is doing now to what the US/NATO did in Serbia.

In both cases there are similarities and differences.

1) There is a difference between civilian casualties as a result of air strikes and intentional murdering of civilians on the ground. The results for families may be the same… but there is a difference.

2) There is a difference between individual soldiers (or small groups of soldiers) committing atrocities while they are on the ground (perhaps after being there for too long with no clear goals and/or limited supervision)… and a policy of violence towards civilians that is supported by leadership.

3) There is a difference between initiating a conflict with the primary goal being political control of a piece of land… and involving oneself in an existing conflict with the primary goal being to end the conflict.

If you can’t understand the nuances stated above we have no basis for further communication.

If you do understand the nuances state above please explain to me what “benefits” you believe the US hoped to achieve for its’ gain by involving itself in Serbia in the 90’s.

[Qwert]

Like i say in beginning, for me Russia and US are same. big powers who Invade other small countries and change regimes how they want. for these you have hundreds examples and no mater how you want to ignore these its facts . If big power are interest then one small country could be suddenly ally and next year he could be enemy.
Ukraine fight against insurgency in Donbas ,Serbia fight against insurgency in Kosovo .
Big difference its that Ukraine are ally with US, and Serbia was not , and because that Ukraine have right to use all forces to eliminate
insurgency and take back hes territories. Serbia from other side dont have right to defend .
Ukraine respect territorial integrity of Serbia and refuse to recognize ,created by use of force Republic of Kosovo.
Serbia also respect territorial integrity of Ukraine and will never recognize Crimea and Donbas.

US benefits? Do you believe that Kosovo its sovereign state who can do whatever they want? What ever US say, Kosovo government need to obey. US create ally who dont have full recognition, who need to be fully funded and protected from US . These country can not survive without US military and financial support.

[saxitoxin]

There is a difference between initiating a conflict with the primary goal being political control of a piece of land… and involving oneself in an existing conflict with the primary goal being to end the conflict.

Agreed.

There had been 7 years of conflict in Donbas that claimed 10,000 lives. Today, for the first time in 7 years, there is no fighting in Donbas. Russia has brought an end to the conflict, just like it promised two weeks ago. #IStandWithRussia

[jusplay4fun]

There is a difference between initiating a conflict with the primary goal being political control of a piece of land… and involving oneself in an existing conflict with the primary goal being to end the conflict.

Agreed.

There had been 7 years of conflict in Donbas that claimed 10,000 lives. Today, for the first time in 7 years, there is no fighting in Donbas. Russia has brought an end to the conflict, just like it promised two weeks ago. #IStandWithRussia

You claim THAT as justification for the WAR? NO, it is NOT. This is another saxi FALSE Narrative, or Fake News, pure and simple.

[Dukasaur]

Today, for the first time in 7 years, there is no fighting in Donbas. Russia has brought an end to the conflict, just like it promised two weeks ago.

Easy enough to end something that you are orchestrating. Nobody ever doubted that the separatist thugs in the Donbass were on the KGB payroll.

"Oh look, we'll stop committing the crimes we've been committing for seven years! Aren't we little angels?"

[saxitoxin]

Today, for the first time in 7 years, there is no fighting in Donbas. Russia has brought an end to the conflict, just like it promised two weeks ago.

Easy enough to end something that you are orchestrating. Nobody ever doubted that the separatist thugs in the Donbass were on the KGB payroll.

"Oh look, we'll stop committing the crimes we've been committing for seven years! Aren't we little angels?"

The people of the Donbas democratically voted to separate from Ukraine. They were attacked by the Ukrainian army continuously for seven years just for exercising their voting rights. Russia intervened and expelled the Ukrainian Army from the Donbas. Now the conflict in the Donbas is over. Per Jim, it's justified to involve "oneself in an existing conflict with the primary goal being to end the conflict."

People of Luhansk voting for independence from Ukraine in 2014. Because they put pieces of paper in a clear box, the Ukrainian Army directed heavy artillery fire at them.

[saxitoxin]

EU on Ukraine Membership: "Thanks, but that's a hard pass!"

The EU stands with Ukraine, but today clarified that just means issuing supportive press releases.

European Union leaders have ruled out fulfilling Ukraine's call for a fast-track integration with the bloc during a meeting in France.

https://www.dw.com/en/eu-leaders-in-ver ... a-61080856

Of course, this was always a foregone conclusion because - at the end of the day for neoliberals - money talks and values walk. The moment the EU admitted Ukraine it would instantly have 10% of its population earning 5% of the average EU salary. And that 10% would have employment rights in the rest of the bloc. There would be an instant, and immediate, mass exodus from Ukraine. Everyone who could leave, would leave to France, Sweden, Belgium. Why would a physician earning $5,000/year in Ukraine stay there when he could earn 15 times that much as a junior lab assistant in the Netherlands? And, once there are no physicians left in Ukraine, why would anyone else stay? The entire country would be cleared out in about 30 days.

[DoomYoshi]

Why would anyone go to Europe if Russia is so good?

Riddle me that Batman.

[jusplay4fun]

Today, for the first time in 7 years, there is no fighting in Donbas. Russia has brought an end to the conflict, just like it promised two weeks ago.

Easy enough to end something that you are orchestrating. Nobody ever doubted that the separatist thugs in the Donbass were on the KGB payroll.

"Oh look, we'll stop committing the crimes we've been committing for seven years! Aren't we little angels?"

The people of the Donbas democratically voted to separate from Ukraine. They were attacked by the Ukrainian army continuously for seven years just for exercising their voting rights. Russia intervened and expelled the Ukrainian Army from the Donbas. Now the conflict in the Donbas is over. Per Jim, it's justified to involve "oneself in an existing conflict with the primary goal being to end the conflict."

People of Luhansk voting for independence from Ukraine in 2014. Because they put pieces of paper in a clear box, the Ukrainian Army directed heavy artillery fire at them.

Just because some members of one minority LIVE in another nation does not give those minority persons to right to violently join another country and take territory from one nation and to join it to another. If Canadians move into the USA in 2023, that does not give those Canadians to the right to take the land from the USA and join those lands to Canada. (I am sure someone who knows History will say that is how Texas became first an independent nation that later joined the USA.)

The exact meaning of US President Wilson's ideas on "self-determination" are still being debated and discussed, even over 100 years later:

Aside from the establishment the League of Nations and solidifying a lasting world peace, Wilson's other main goal at the Paris Peace Conference was that self-determination be the primary basis used for drawing new international borders.[229] However, in pursuit of his League of Nations, Wilson conceded several points to the other powers present at the conference. Germany was required to permanently cede territory, pay war reparations, relinquish all of her overseas colonies and dependencies and submit to military occupation in the Rhineland. Additionally, a clause in the treaty specifically named Germany as responsible for the war. Wilson agreed to allowing the Allied European powers and Japan to essentially expand their empires by establishing de facto colonies in the Middle East, Africa, and Asia out the former German and Ottoman Empires; these territorial awards to the victorious countries were thinly disguised as "League of Nations mandates". The Japanese acquisition of German interests in the Shandong Peninsula of China proved especially unpopular, as it undercut Wilson's promise of self-government. Wilson's hopes for achieving self-determination saw some success when the conference recognized multiple new and independent states created in Eastern Europe, including Poland, Yugoslavia, and Czechoslovakia.[230][229]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woodrow_Wilson#Historical_reputation

We have seen that some of those "success" stories have resulted in further fragmentation by the former nation of Czechoslovakia and the major fragmentation of the former nation of Yugoslavia. The east-west split of Czechoslovakia is not a surprise to me. Neither is the fragmentation of Yugoslavia, given the long and complex history of the Balkans and the many war, invasions, and ethnic groups present there.

[saxitoxin]

Today, for the first time in 7 years, there is no fighting in Donbas. Russia has brought an end to the conflict, just like it promised two weeks ago.

Easy enough to end something that you are orchestrating. Nobody ever doubted that the separatist thugs in the Donbass were on the KGB payroll.

"Oh look, we'll stop committing the crimes we've been committing for seven years! Aren't we little angels?"

The people of the Donbas democratically voted to separate from Ukraine. They were attacked by the Ukrainian army continuously for seven years just for exercising their voting rights. Russia intervened and expelled the Ukrainian Army from the Donbas. Now the conflict in the Donbas is over. Per Jim, it's justified to involve "oneself in an existing conflict with the primary goal being to end the conflict."

People of Luhansk voting for independence from Ukraine in 2014. Because they put pieces of paper in a clear box, the Ukrainian Army directed heavy artillery fire at them.

Just because some members of one minority LIVE in another nation does not give those minority persons to right to violently join another country and take territory from one nation and to join it to another.

Oh, okay. Got it.

- Americans revolt against Britain and create a new nation called the United States of America: GOOD
- Donbasis revolt against Ukraine and create a new nation called the Luhansk People's Republic: BAD

[2dimes]