Obama's rating: Strong. But Average. And Way Divided.

[Backglass]

First - Everyone did not get a stimulus check.

Right..."Stimulus". How was this any different? Taxpayer money was "spread about". In fact the more kids you had, the more you got. (I have three! Yay for me!)

punishing people who work hard by taking their money and turning it into welfare.

So, every multi-millionaire in the country got there through the virtues of hard work huh? They are all rags-to-riches, American dream mega-millionaires? Right.

And let me understand. You believe that instead of increasing the taxes on these people to the level they should have been all along, the ultra-rich should instead be given the BIGGEST tax break of all?! That makes perfect sense. After all, they do need it more than you or I. It is well documented that these people shelter themselves very well...often showing enough paper losses to pay no tax at all.

[PopeBenXVI]

Now I see why you want B.O. You don't know anything.

Frances socialist party has screwed them bad with corporate taxes for one.

NEWSFLASH: Heavy taxing of those "big nasty companies" does not result in jobs and increased production. It results in Job cuts, Pay cuts, and recession because of double digit unemployment LIKE IN FRANCE!

But you are right, The goverment is so much more efficient in feeding the homeless and helping the poor for nothing than the church has been for hundreds of years. So be patriotic and pay more taxes to big brother like Biden says and stop giving money to that Church who has all those volunteers that do it.

[Backglass]

But you are right, The goverment is so much more efficient in feeding the homeless and helping the poor for nothing than the church has been for hundreds of years.

Don't forget spending billions & billions on pointless wars! Both have a excellent track record at THAT as well.

So be patriotic and pay more taxes to big brother like Biden says and stop giving money to that Church who has all those volunteers that do it.

I say tax the churches. They are the BIGGEST business of all. You spout on about helping the poor while you pray in massive golden temples worth incredible sums of money.

[jonesthecurl]

Obama isn't an american. He doesn't want to be an american. He hangs out with and gets advice from people who hate america. His entire life, vacations, trips abroad, schooling and education, law school, has been funded by anti-american terrorists. I still believe he is a sleeper cell terrorist. He was thrust upon us illegally, by terrorists, long long ago, as the one true man to take down the great USA. He's one of the most liberal people in government, so far left that he makes Hillary Clinton look like a crazy right wing wacko. We don't need to fear everybody "out there". We need to fear the enemy within.

thats the stupidest thing i have read in a long time.

I know! Isn't it horrible! I've highlighted the parts that are my opinions and superstitions, the rest of it is documented. I can't believe how stupid everybody is that continues to think he is some sort of God. Shit in one hand, "Hope" in the other; see which fills first.

Are you sure you got your location right? Specifically, as in what planet you're from?

[Frigidus]

Obama isn't an american. He doesn't want to be an american. He hangs out with and gets advice from people who hate america. His entire life, vacations, trips abroad, schooling and education, law school, has been funded by anti-american terrorists. I still believe he is a sleeper cell terrorist. He was thrust upon us illegally, by terrorists, long long ago, as the one true man to take down the great USA. He's one of the most liberal people in government, so far left that he makes Hillary Clinton look like a crazy right wing wacko. We don't need to fear everybody "out there". We need to fear the enemy within.

thats the stupidest thing i have read in a long time.

I know! Isn't it horrible! I've highlighted the parts that are my opinions and superstitions, the rest of it is documented. I can't believe how stupid everybody is that continues to think he is some sort of God. Shit in one hand, "Hope" in the other; see which fills first.

Are you sure you got your location right? Specifically, as in what planet you're from?

I think what he means is that we should build our government on a foundation of shit. Kind of like now.

[mpjh]

Real Texas shit.

[Simon Viavant]

For all of the bashing France for "socialism', I think it should be mentioned that France has the best health care system in the world as well as free colleges and a much better education system than us and in general among the highest standard of living in the world. And then there's us with our small government and deregulation...

[Simon Viavant]

And I'd also like to congratulate mpjh on his trolling in this thread. Beautifully done and very well received with the intended audience.

[PopeBenXVI]

Allow me tell you why B.O’s economic plan is no good. He wants to raise taxes on businesses. When companies make a profit they expand business, which create jobs, more spending and revenue for the government. When businesses are taxed higher they do not hire they fire and downsize to survive and the remaining employee’s get their benefits cut. Then more people are out of work, which raises unemployment and those on welfare. This causes less money to be put into the economy for services, which leads to lower revenue to the government. Example: We have less spending right now because consumer confidence is down partly as a result of the media reporting all the bad news and Obama talking about the great depression every hour. If no one watched the news and heard all this and adjusted down their spending habits acordingly then spending would be higher and the economy would be better as people would be buying goods and services. Perception is a big part of what shapes reality like the placebo effect.

You are also correct that some people were almost handed a business and did not work any to start it up. If you believe that is not fair then explain to me how it is fair to take that money and give it to someone completely unrelated to the company? It was their family that took the risk to start the company not the slacker with a hand out. People are rewarded for their work and if that system is gone then entrapenoureorship will not occur and that is what creates jobs. If there is no incentive to risk it then no one will.

Obama’s $3000 tax credit to hire is also a joke. It takes an average of $65,000 to bring on a new employee. I would take lower capital gains over Obama’s retarded tax credit any day. It’s called Reaganomics and it took a bad economy in the 1970’s under Carter from double digit unemployment (like France) and a very high inflation & interest rate, to having the longest economic growth in American history.

B.O. also says he will not raise taxes on the “middle class” Who is that? That is his label to make you feel included because most people think of themselves as not poor and not rich. What he is going to allow to happen is for the current tax breaks to expire in 2010 which is not the whole problem. He is not going to replace it with anything. That means most of the country will see their taxes go up to about 39% which would be a big tax increase. He says he won’t raise taxes but he will just let this expire which will do it for him and then he will also raise taxes on the other “Evil Rich People” so they are taxed over 50%. We already work 4 months out of the year to pay our taxes…no joke.

You also take away your own freedom when you vote to raise taxes to have government provide something for you like healthcare. The less money you have to make your own decisions the more control big brother has on you. Food is more of a basic right than healthcare so why don’t we raise taxes more and then have government provide us a food quota each month? Besides, if you get any news from unbiased places you would know that Hawaii’ had started universal healthcare 7 months ago for children and they just canceled the program because it went bankrupt…..in only 7 months!

I don’t care if some of you are social liberals because that is what America is about so you can think that way and I can think like a social conservative. I am not here to insult you for that but Obama’s econ plan is terrible. I was an economic minor in College and I own a small business. I also know about 25 other small business owners very personally in my weekly networking group and none of them are voting for Obama because they know they will have to lay people off if he does what he says he is going to do for business taxes.(Only a few of them would be considered rich by Obama) I have put a lot on the line for starting my business so I can create jobs for people like you. My Wife’s Aunt also works on Wall Street and said that the Dow is tanking in anticipation of an Obama Presidency. That means they know things will get worse under him and are preparing for it already.

Sorry for the long post but is this what you want?

[Backglass]

Allow me tell you why B.O’s economic plan is no good. <SNIP>

Typical Republican FUD.

Your glass is half empty.

I own a small business.

So, are we to believe that only hard right wing Republicans own small business's? I know 47 small business owners and THEY are very happy with his plan. Living in New York I also have multiple friends on Wall Street and THEY say it's fear of Angry Man McCain and his loose cannon empire! I win!

Seriously, while I still believe that Obama is the best & obvious choice, I do agree with you somewhat. On the low end of the scale, we should not be handing out refunds to those who pay no taxes. It should be a cut...not a gift. But this small amount is still much less than Bush's "stimulus" checks. The rest of his plan is spot on.

[mpjh]

I must admit, it was sweet to vote early for Obama.

[Snorri1234]

Allow me tell you why B.O’s economic plan is no good. He wants to raise taxes on businesses. When companies make a profit they expand business, which create jobs, more spending and revenue for the government. When businesses are taxed higher they do not hire they fire and downsize to survive and the remaining employee’s get their benefits cut. Then more people are out of work, which raises unemployment and those on welfare. This causes less money to be put into the economy for services, which leads to lower revenue to the government. Example: We have less spending right now because consumer confidence is down partly as a result of the media reporting all the bad news and Obama talking about the great depression every hour. If no one watched the news and heard all this and adjusted down their spending habits acordingly then spending would be higher and the economy would be better as people would be buying goods and services. Perception is a big part of what shapes reality like the placebo effect.

You are also correct that some people were almost handed a business and did not work any to start it up. If you believe that is not fair then explain to me how it is fair to take that money and give it to someone completely unrelated to the company? It was their family that took the risk to start the company not the slacker with a hand out. People are rewarded for their work and if that system is gone then entrapenoureorship will not occur and that is what creates jobs. If there is no incentive to risk it then no one will.

Obama’s $3000 tax credit to hire is also a joke. It takes an average of $65,000 to bring on a new employee. I would take lower capital gains over Obama’s retarded tax credit any day. It’s called Reaganomics and it took a bad economy in the 1970’s under Carter from double digit unemployment (like France) and a very high inflation & interest rate, to having the longest economic growth in American history.

B.O. also says he will not raise taxes on the “middle class” Who is that? That is his label to make you feel included because most people think of themselves as not poor and not rich. What he is going to allow to happen is for the current tax breaks to expire in 2010 which is not the whole problem. He is not going to replace it with anything. That means most of the country will see their taxes go up to about 39% which would be a big tax increase. He says he won’t raise taxes but he will just let this expire which will do it for him and then he will also raise taxes on the other “Evil Rich People” so they are taxed over 50%. We already work 4 months out of the year to pay our taxes…no joke.

You also take away your own freedom when you vote to raise taxes to have government provide something for you like healthcare. The less money you have to make your own decisions the more control big brother has on you. Food is more of a basic right than healthcare so why don’t we raise taxes more and then have government provide us a food quota each month? Besides, if you get any news from unbiased places you would know that Hawaii’ had started universal healthcare 7 months ago for children and they just canceled the program because it went bankrupt…..in only 7 months!

I don’t care if some of you are social liberals because that is what America is about so you can think that way and I can think like a social conservative. I am not here to insult you for that but Obama’s econ plan is terrible. I was an economic minor in College and I own a small business. I also know about 25 other small business owners very personally in my weekly networking group and none of them are voting for Obama because they know they will have to lay people off if he does what he says he is going to do for business taxes.(Only a few of them would be considered rich by Obama) I have put a lot on the line for starting my business so I can create jobs for people like you. My Wife’s Aunt also works on Wall Street and said that the Dow is tanking in anticipation of an Obama Presidency. That means they know things will get worse under him and are preparing for it already.

Sorry for the long post but is this what you want?

I'm starting to notice a pattern here of you talking out of your ass.

[robertsmith]

this is very dull. obama is going to win by a mile. and then not be able to do anything because of the global recession.
case closed.

[king lard]

omgz a black man as yoor president what a shit country

[PopeBenXVI]

Oh, so you have lots of friend who have contributed to the Wall street greed and world wide economic crisis...I only have one:) I Win! If Obama does what he says he will do with business taxes your friends won't like him much in 4 years. The stimulus checks could have been done better so I agree with that. The proposed tax changes will cost much more so that I disagree with. The Government also did not quickly tax people more this year in order to give that money out to stimulate the economy. Higher taxes take peoples money and the check gave money which belonged to us that they had already taken, It is how your candidate says, "A fundamental difference"

Obama's plan has been tried before and has been a proven economic failure....& I am not a republican as I mentioned before. I am a Capitalist and a social conservative and Obama is neither and Mccain is about 1/4. I am not saying Mccain's plan is great either but Obama's is much worse. Mccain at least said you don't raise taxes on anyone in a recession which is correct.

Do you think the government will magically run a government healthcare plan as good as they have dug social security into the ground? Yah, they have also done a GRRREAT job with Medicare and others as well.....lets give them more of our money!

I will just keep waiting to hear something intelligent from anyone on my questions. For example: It takes an average of 3 years to break even after starting an average business.....like mine for instance. My wife and I both have worked another job to pay the bills and invest in the businesses future. This next year will be year 3 and I might make 1 income off the company and then be able to quite my second job. So, I am still waiting to hear someone give me a good answer on how it's fair for Obama to "spread the wealth around" by taxing my business more so I can't grow it and create jobs. He will then take my money that I earned after 2 years of making nothing to give as wellfare because it's "fair".

Maybe someone here could also try to defend B.O. for lying about taking public funding for his campain and then changing his mind and outspending mccain 4-1 nationwide. 6-1 in my state of Wisconsin. You know darn well if this were the other way around the media would have a fit by telling everyone the presidency is for sale. The Democrats also had a big fat bonus for ACORN in the first Bailout Bill they tried to pass because they are tight with those frauds.

I could go on and on but I really have not heard any good reason from anyone on why Obama should be President. I only hear about how people love him in NY and California which are overwhelmingly Democratic states.

[pimpdave]

Everything the current administration has done to help the economy has been to continue to support the house of cards. It's all financed on debt. So the stimulus package will just be paid for by future administrations.

If the Democratic candidate is campaigning on a platform of a return to a White House that exercises self-control and a Congress that isn't acting simply to spite the opposition party, then perhaps the responsible approach will be taken to the problems with the economy (primarily, that it is based on a house of cards, and we need to come up with some real and lasting methods for generating a GDP capable of both maintaining our current standard of living while continuing to grow the pie).


Trees need to be pruned in order to bear more fruit than otherwise. We may have to do a bit of pruning, or, taxing the super-rich, in order to make that happen. Don't worry, your tears will provide the rest of us with something to drink.

[Frigidus]

Don't worry, your tears will provide the rest of us with something to drink.

I'm sure you've converted him.

[PopeBenXVI]

Just one more Obama/Biden flip flop to record.

Joe Biden told Ellen DeGeneres that if I lived in California, I would vote against Proposition 8. This initiative reads, Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California.'
Yet in his debate with Sarah Palin on October 2, Biden said that Barack Obama nor I support redefining from a civil side what constitutes marriage.

The issue here is not marriage but that once again he has changed his mind and pandered to those he is talking to just like he did with the clean coal topic and many others.

Even more than the average politician they are telling you what you want to hear to get your vote. How can you be confident that they will do what they say if they continue to lie and flip flop? Their is a serious charactor flaw here that can not be ignored.

[pimpdave]

How can you be confident that they will do what they say if they continue to lie and flip flop? Their is a serious charactor flaw here that can not be ignored.

Um, the same could be said about McCain/Palin. This is a criticism of Politicians as old as the earth is (6,000 years, to be completely approximately accurate).

Just consider the utter "hypocrisy" of Moses, who claimed he would lead the Jews to the land of milk and honey, but only ended up wandering around in the desert for 40 years. Was he a complete flip-flopper? By your rubric, I would have to say yes.

[Backglass]

Just one more Obama/Biden flip flop to record.

Careful throwing stones in that glass house....McCain has over 100 documented flip flops. He does a 180 depending on the crowd he is talking to...sometimes within days.

His most recent involves you directly:

Flip: On September 16th, a major flip-flop was recorded when Senator McCain, long the champion of "deregulation", suddenly cast himself as being highly "pro-regulation" following the finacial collapse on Wall Street, claiming to now recognize the need for... not just "reasonable" regulation, but "excessive" regulation... to guard against greed and reckless behavior by businesses without regard for the potential consequences.

Flop: Despite this, during a stump speech before Small Business Owners in Colorado Springs, CO, Senator McCain again proclaimed his strong support for "deregulation":

"They [small business owners] feel that what they need is lower taxes and less government regulation of their business"

And another:

Flip: After Senator Obama inadvertently described his tax policy as a plan to "spread the wealth around", The McCain/Palin campaign has been accusing Senator Obama of advocating "Socialism":

"At least in Europe, the Socialist leaders who so admire my opponent are upfront about their objectives," McCain said in a radio address. "They use real numbers and honest language. And we should demand equal candor from Sen. Obama. Raising taxes on some in order to give checks to others is not a tax cut; it's just another government giveaway."

Gov. Palin, in a campaign appearance with Senator McCain in Reno, NV, accused Senator Obama of wanting to "redistribute the wealth":

"When it comes to taxes, you have a real choice on Nov. 4th. It's not negative, not mean-spirited... He's (Obama is) hiding his real agenda of redistributing your money."

Flop::

At an October 2000 town hall on MSNBC’s Hardball, an audience member asked Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) about why the rich pay higher taxes than the middle class. McCain defended progressive taxation, stating, “I think it’s to some degree because we feel, obviously, that wealthy people can afford more”:

[T]he very wealthy, because they can afford tax lawyers and all kinds of loopholes, really don’t pay nearly as much as you think they do when you just look at the percentages. […]

So, look, here’s what I really believe, that when you are — reach a certain level of comfort, there’s nothing wrong with paying somewhat more. … And frankly, I think the first people who deserve a tax cut are working Americans with children that need to educate their children, and they’re the ones that I would support tax cuts for first.


So which is it John? Perhaps his memory is failing and he just cant remember what he truly believes.

[Snorri1234]

Just one more Obama/Biden flip flop to record.

Joe Biden told Ellen DeGeneres that if I lived in California, I would vote against Proposition 8. This initiative reads, Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California.'
Yet in his debate with Sarah Palin on October 2, Biden said that Barack Obama nor I support redefining from a civil side what constitutes marriage.

HOLY SHIT THAT IS SO FUCKING NOT A FLIP-FLOP!

He says that he does not support redefining what constitutes marriage. Which means that, since proposition 8 redefines marriage as someting only between a man and a woman, he would vote against proposition 8.

He is saying that he and Obama do not want to redefine either way what a marriage is, and are confident to leave it to the states themselves. I do not understand why on earth you are saying that that is flip-flopping.

[jonesthecurl]

Allow me tell you why B.O’s economic plan is no good. He wants to raise taxes on businesses. When companies make a profit they expand business, which create jobs, more spending and revenue for the government. When businesses are taxed higher they do not hire they fire and downsize to survive and the remaining employee’s get their benefits cut. Then more people are out of work, which raises unemployment and those on welfare. This causes less money to be put into the economy for services, which leads to lower revenue to the government. Example: We have less spending right now because consumer confidence is down partly as a result of the media reporting all the bad news and Obama talking about the great depression every hour. If no one watched the news and heard all this and adjusted down their spending habits acordingly then spending would be higher and the economy would be better as people would be buying goods and services. Perception is a big part of what shapes reality like the placebo effect.

You are also correct that some people were almost handed a business and did not work any to start it up. If you believe that is not fair then explain to me how it is fair to take that money and give it to someone completely unrelated to the company? It was their family that took the risk to start the company not the slacker with a hand out. People are rewarded for their work and if that system is gone then entrapenoureorship will not occur and that is what creates jobs. If there is no incentive to risk it then no one will.

Obama’s $3000 tax credit to hire is also a joke. It takes an average of $65,000 to bring on a new employee. I would take lower capital gains over Obama’s retarded tax credit any day. It’s called Reaganomics and it took a bad economy in the 1970’s under Carter from double digit unemployment (like France) and a very high inflation & interest rate, to having the longest economic growth in American history.

B.O. also says he will not raise taxes on the “middle class” Who is that? That is his label to make you feel included because most people think of themselves as not poor and not rich. What he is going to allow to happen is for the current tax breaks to expire in 2010 which is not the whole problem. He is not going to replace it with anything. That means most of the country will see their taxes go up to about 39% which would be a big tax increase. He says he won’t raise taxes but he will just let this expire which will do it for him and then he will also raise taxes on the other “Evil Rich People” so they are taxed over 50%. We already work 4 months out of the year to pay our taxes…no joke.

You also take away your own freedom when you vote to raise taxes to have government provide something for you like healthcare. The less money you have to make your own decisions the more control big brother has on you. Food is more of a basic right than healthcare so why don’t we raise taxes more and then have government provide us a food quota each month? Besides, if you get any news from unbiased places you would know that Hawaii’ had started universal healthcare 7 months ago for children and they just canceled the program because it went bankrupt…..in only 7 months!

I don’t care if some of you are social liberals because that is what America is about so you can think that way and I can think like a social conservative. I am not here to insult you for that but Obama’s econ plan is terrible. I was an economic minor in College and I own a small business. I also know about 25 other small business owners very personally in my weekly networking group and none of them are voting for Obama because they know they will have to lay people off if he does what he says he is going to do for business taxes.(Only a few of them would be considered rich by Obama) I have put a lot on the line for starting my business so I can create jobs for people like you. My Wife’s Aunt also works on Wall Street and said that the Dow is tanking in anticipation of an Obama Presidency. That means they know things will get worse under him and are preparing for it already.

Sorry for the long post but is this what you want?

I'm starting to notice a pattern here of you talking out of your ass.

"The papal seat"

[Juan_Bottom]

Feds Bust Skinhead Plot to Kill Obama
http://news.aol.com/?feature=227448

Federal authorities say they broke up a plot to assassinate Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama and shoot or decapitate 88 black people. Agents say two neo-Nazi skinheads planned to rob a Tennessee gun store and attack a predominantly black high school, then go on a nationwide killing spree with Obama as the final target.

[mpjh]

You know what the last words of a young southern skinhead are, don't you?


"Hey fellas, watch this!"

[Juan_Bottom]

Obama: Constitution Reflects Fundamental Flaw In This Country
http://amerpundit.com/2008/10/27/obama- ... s-country/

Federal judge throws out Berg lawsuit

The judge also said the harm Berg alleged did "not constitute an injury in fact" and Berg's arguments to the contrary "ventured into the unreasonable."

This means that Berg will be making his evidence public!

Obama: Redistribute the wealth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iivL4c_3pck
I don't know what this is about, but it's making the rounds...