ObamaCare - exchanges ,report your states options!

[Metsfanmax]

Actually, if President Obama is taking jobs away from Waffle House, that's in the plus column for helping the health of Americans.

[saxitoxin]

Actually, if President Obama is taking jobs away from Waffle House, that's in the plus column for helping the health of Americans.

I doubt you'll be saying that next time you go to the doctor and find that Rizzo, previously the swing shift fry cook at the Wafflehouse, is in charge of administering your prostate exam.

[Metsfanmax]

Actually, if President Obama is taking jobs away from Waffle House, that's in the plus column for helping the health of Americans.

I doubt you'll be saying that next time you go to the doctor and find that Rizzo, previously the swing shift fry cook at the Wafflehouse, is in charge of administering your prostate exam.

Rizzo can examine my prostate any time she pleases.

[saxitoxin]

Actually, if President Obama is taking jobs away from Waffle House, that's in the plus column for helping the health of Americans.

I doubt you'll be saying that next time you go to the doctor and find that Rizzo, previously the swing shift fry cook at the Wafflehouse, is in charge of administering your prostate exam.

Rizzo can examine my prostate any time she pleases.

"Yo, I'm Rizzo."

[Phatscotty]

What probably really happened...

Obama said to his tech czar and his health czar, "now listen, let me be clear. You have 3 years and 3 times more money than you need. Work together and make me a website that will be just like the internet is. Amazon.com, you want something, there's the price, you buy it, boom! Got it? Remember, my name is on this shit, SO DON'T Fu%K IT UP!"

and then he never bothered to check on it, figuring if there was something wrong, Kathryne would let him know, except Kathryne didn't bother to check on it either, figuring Rizzo-Rhan Khan would let her know if something was wrong, and Rizzo-Rhan Khan never even heard of the people he was supposed to be working with all along, so it wasn't even possible for him to know.

It's like a group of freshman who have all semester to do their group project, and then meet up the night before it's due and each bring what they got so far, not even considering they might want to spend a bit of time integrating their material.

[saxitoxin]

LMAO!!!

YESTERDAY -

Sebelius praised the performance of the data hub, which connects to the Social Security Administration and Internal Revenue Service to verify applicants' identity and income. She said it took the hub less than 1.2 seconds to route information, and called it "a model of efficiency and security."

http://news.yahoo.com/sebelius-finds-si ... iness.html

TODAY -

A data center critical for allowing uninsured Americans to buy health coverage under President Barack Obama's healthcare law went down on Sunday, the U.S. government said. Peters said the newest glitch also affected a data services hub - an electronic traffic roundabout that connects numerous federal agencies and can verify people's identity, citizenship, and other facts. Problems with the data services hub affect customers of both HealthCare.gov and the state-run exchanges.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/ ... DH20131027

[saxitoxin]

I'm actually becoming a fan of Obamacare in a gawking-at-the-crash kinda way.

This is like watching a 10 car pileup on the I-5 at rush hour. Then a dinosaur shows up and attacks the survivors.

[BigBallinStalin]

I wonder if it will be enough to disabuse people of the illusion of government capability--at such a macro level.

[Phatscotty]

btw BBS, remember that post a long time ago about how they are going to take unpaid medical bills out of people's tax returns and have their paychecks audited if they didn't pay on time?

here is the link that I couldn't provide back then because there wasn't any proof, but now that it's too late, we have the proof, except having proof now is meaningless

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/oba ... 62237.html

It's in my state as well. I'm sure not all states are going to do this, but I bet most of them do.

[Phatscotty]

It's funny to look at the old Obamacare commercials from 2009-2010


and you knew this one was just a matter of time

[BigBallinStalin]

I don't recall anything about that.

<clicks link>

Ohhhhh, yeah. Look at that.

"[W]e may share information provided in your application with the appropriate authorities for law enforcement and audit activities."

Honestly, in most contracts I've signed with privately owned companies, it says something to this effect too. Usually, it says that they'll share whatever with the authorities if they're asked to do so, but I imagine Maryland's Health Connection will put up zero fight in defending one's information--or would actively send one's information because why not. Maybe have the NSA and whoever hook up some equipment to their servers too.

[Metsfanmax]

btw BBS, remember that post a long time ago about how they are going to take unpaid medical bills out of people's tax returns and have their paychecks audited if they didn't pay on time?

here is the link that I couldn't provide back then because there wasn't any proof, but now that it's too late, we have the proof, except having proof now is meaningless

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/oba ... 62237.html

It's in my state as well. I'm sure not all states are going to do this, but I bet most of them do.

That article doesn't prove what you said. It states, at minimum, that if you do get audited by the IRS, that the state exchange will provide relevant information. This is hardly surprising given that it's a government operation.

[saxitoxin]

as of today, it remains no longer possible for any person to receive Obamacare ... for all the years of hootin' and hollerin', simple incompetence has achieved what the Republicans could not

Neither HHS nor Verizon responded Monday to CNNMoney's questions about the status of efforts to fix the problem.

This malfunction impacted the "Data Services Hub," which connects the website to IRS and other databases used to determine eligibility. On Saturday, HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius touted the "hub" as one of the Obamacare technologies that was working.

http://money.cnn.com/2013/10/27/news/ob ... ?hpt=hp_t1

[PLAYER57832]

What I DO like is the fact that all Americans are required to hold a policy or pay a fine/penalty/tax (I could care less which term was/is used). I like it because then, I am not paying for the uninsured to get care through MY taxes. Also, the law does a lot around incenting providers to keep costs lower, and provide incentives for people to get preventive screenings, for example.

And what about all the people who have had affordable insurance but are now seeing their prices skyrocket or having their plans dumped all together?

Mostly, those are people, who like yourself, seem to think that they will always be as healthy as they are now and therefore "don't need" insurance or only need a very, very minimal policy.

It also might include poorer singles in the states that have refused to expand Medicaid.

In most states, CA most notably, the prices of insurance policies are actually far LESS than predicted, not more.

per the "dumped" bit.. again, some are in the first category -- the policies these people had were not decent policies and insurers cannot offer them any longer. Others are in the category that has been getting bigger every year anyway.. employers who just decide they don't want the extra expense of insurance. The difference is that now, the people who were "dumped" can actually GET affordable insurance even without going through their employers.

Why is this program so great when it harms 260,000,000 people in order to help 15,000,000 people?

First explain how you can claim 260,000,000 people are being harmed?

Don't forget, more than 80% of country already had health insurance before this law was passed. And now many of those same people are having their insurance prices skyrocket or their plans dumped altogether. If that's a solution, it's an extremely perverse one.

Again, show your data.

And, how can you claim that all these people are seeing their prices skyrocket when the enrollment for the exchanges only began a couple of weeks ago and most people have not even checked the prices out yet?

Simply saying that insurance went up this year just doesn't do it. I have yet to live through a year when my insurance rates did NOT rise and benefits were NOT reduced... and that goes back a long way before anyone outside of Illinois even knew who Obama was!

I'm just sick of the "waah waah waah the law sucks and the bad Democrats passed it so it must be evil". The law is here, and we have to deal with it. I prefer to look forward and continue to improve it, instead of bitching about something that is here to stay, and won't be repealed.

The law IS evil, no matter who passed it. And we deal with bad laws by working to get rid of them, not settling on having them.

You have yet to show why. All you put forward are a bunch of unverified opinions and unreasoned position statements.

As a disclaimer, I'm not a Democrat.

You're still a progressive, regardless of whether or not you consider yourself a Democrat.

[/quote]
And you want to celebrate a past that never actually happened.

[PLAYER57832]

I wonder if it will be enough to disabuse people of the illusion of government capability--at such a macro level.

The question is if the alternatives are better. Evidence shows "not".

See, its not enough to simply find problems.. you have to have a viable and real better solution. Corporations as governance is a nightmare, not a dream.

[Night Strike]

per the "dumped" bit.. again, some are in the first category -- the policies these people had were not decent policies and insurers cannot offer them any longer. Others are in the category that has been getting bigger every year anyway.. employers who just decide they don't want the extra expense of insurance. The difference is that now, the people who were "dumped" can actually GET affordable insurance even without going through their employers.

What power do YOU have to determine what other people consider to be good policies for them? And what's affordable about paying several hundred dollars a month in premiums with thousands of dollars in deductibles for coverage that then only pays 60% of expenses?

First explain how you can claim 260,000,000 people are being harmed?

Don't forget, more than 80% of country already had health insurance before this law was passed. And now many of those same people are having their insurance prices skyrocket or their plans dumped altogether. If that's a solution, it's an extremely perverse one.

Again, show your data.

It's simple math. Although your Keynesian beliefs probably preclude knowing that. You progressives constantly cited 45 million people as not having health insurance. There are approximately 305 million people in the US, meaning 260 million people had health insurance prior to this law. That comes out to more than 80% of the country having health insurance.

And, how can you claim that all these people are seeing their prices skyrocket when the enrollment for the exchanges only began a couple of weeks ago and most people have not even checked the prices out yet?

Because we HAVE heard stories already.

Simply saying that insurance went up this year just doesn't do it. I have yet to live through a year when my insurance rates did NOT rise and benefits were NOT reduced... and that goes back a long way before anyone outside of Illinois even knew who Obama was!

How many years did they go up by 50%? 75%? 100%? 150%?

You have yet to show why. All you put forward are a bunch of unverified opinions and unreasoned position statements.

Because the government controls what you do with your private money. How many hours do I have to work a week that go directly to the government? Why do you deserve more of my money than me?

[WILLIAMS5232]

i find it ridiculous. 25% of my check goes to the govt right now. how much more could anyone feel i should give.

it pisses me off when someone thinks that since they're a human it's they're right or duty to dictate what i do with myself beyond what matters to them. this goes way beyond healthcare. saying that i will use healthcare eventually shouldn't justify someone deciding how i am to pay for it. i could care less how many people have health insurance in this country. if you can't get treated and you don't have the money, then you're obviously unwilling to apply yourself to a meaningful skill or a dick to people that would be willing to help. the better your character the better your healthcare i say.

now, i know you're going to say "but wiliams5232, what about the kids and granny and the disabled? you're so hateful and a bad human!"

go ahead, you're not going to change your outlook on that no matter what i say. but the money we spend on the kids, granny, and the disabled is nothing compared to what's fixing to be spent. hell the cost of the all the pre-obamacare launch preperations would probably have covered that for 10 years alone.

i'm not against govt healthcare, if it's organized properly, i'd be willing to bet that the money is already there without forcing me to pay a tax just to opt out. that doesn't even make sense.

what pisses me off the most is all the lies and deception that has gone along with all this. someone is getting rich under the guise of "caring for poor people" and there is a bunch of naive do-gooders running around like we're on the verge of creating the perfect country. makes me sick.

[Night Strike]

Even NBC finally admits that Obama is a liar.

http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/28/21213547-obama-admin-knew-millions-could-not-keep-their-health-insurance?lite

Too bad they were busy campaigning for him last year to do this investigation.

[WILLIAMS5232]

Even NBC finally admits that Obama is a liar.

http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/28/21213547-obama-admin-knew-millions-could-not-keep-their-health-insurance?lite

Too bad they were busy campaigning for him last year to do this investigation.

the funniest thing about it is, all the "crazy nutjobs" that don't trust the govt. knew this already. but they were too busy being crazy to tell anyone.

[BigBallinStalin]

I wonder if it will be enough to disabuse people of the illusion of government capability--at such a macro level.

The question is if the alternatives are better. Evidence shows "not".

See, its not enough to simply find problems.. you have to have a viable and real better solution. Corporations as governance is a nightmare, not a dream.

At the State-level? Sure, it's better. More localized knowledge reduces the costs of central planning (thus increasing its efficiency). It also allows for a greater variety of public policies, thus enabling greater scope of trial-and-error while accommodating for more local differences (culture, geography, blah blah blah).

Then there's mutual aid societies which have been crowded out by federal and state spending on 'welfare'. Same benefits accrue from mutual aid societies in respect to local knowledge, innovation, and efficiency--yet even better, it requires an objective measure of performance: profit and loss, so it's not going to be as blind as political planning nor as distorted (campaign contributions).

The legacy of trade and its benefits are also another point about how people have become better--not just by coerced transfers of wealth but instead by the creation of wealth through production and trade. Redistribution and central planning are more inefficient or have been complete failures--but they certainly make many people feel better, which is important regardless of how naive it is.

To reject all of this is to reject history--or to show very little knowledge of it.

[Night Strike]

Even NBC finally admits that Obama is a liar.

http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/28/21213547-obama-admin-knew-millions-could-not-keep-their-health-insurance?lite

Too bad they were busy campaigning for him last year to do this investigation.

the funniest thing about it is, all the "crazy nutjobs" that don't trust the govt. knew this already. but they were too busy being crazy to tell anyone.

And it was only terrorists who would delay the individual mandate by 1 year during the government slimdown, but then the Democrats immediately turn around after the government is fully open and want the individual mandate delayed by 1 year.

[saxitoxin]

Even NBC finally admits that Obama is a liar.

http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/28/21213547-obama-admin-knew-millions-could-not-keep-their-health-insurance?lite

Too bad they were busy campaigning for him last year to do this investigation.

WOW. Great link and a great investigation by NBC ... this is a pretty major scandal about to erupt ...

President Obama repeatedly assured Americans that after the Affordable Care Act became law, people who liked their health insurance would be able to keep it. But millions of Americans are getting or are about to get cancellation letters for their health insurance under Obamacare, say experts, and the Obama administration has known that for at least three years. Four sources deeply involved in the Affordable Care Act tell NBC NEWS that 50 to 75 percent of the 14 million consumers who buy their insurance individually can expect to receive a “cancellation” letter or the equivalent over the next year because their existing policies don’t meet the standards mandated by the new health care law. One expert predicts that number could reach as high as 80 percent. And all say that many of those forced to buy pricier new policies will experience “sticker shock.”

That means the administration knew that more than 40 to 67 percent of those in the individual market would not be able to keep their plans, even if they liked them.
Yet President Obama, who had promised in 2009, “if you like your health plan, you will be able to keep your health plan,” was still saying in 2012, “If [you] already have health insurance, you will keep your health insurance.”

[BigBallinStalin]

Wow, if that's true, then I'm thoroughly disappointed in every believer of Obama. Maybe--just maybe, they'll understand what the nirvana fallacy is. Maybe they'll understand what actually keeps government going.

I doubt it though! Cya at the polls!

[saxitoxin]

Wow, if that's true, then I'm thoroughly disappointed in every believer of Obama.

his pathology for lying is one of the hallmarks of a sociopath; if the U.S. had decent mental health care, Obama would be strapped to a hospital bed in leather restraints receiving an IV drip of lithium - he would sign a behavior contract with his physicians and, if he obeyed it, his daughters would be allowed to visit him for 20 minutes, once each week

[saxitoxin]

Unions giving the finger to White House over Obamacare's War on Workers

Put off by new reinsurance fees on group health care plans that affect union members, Big Labor is largely sitting out the effort to enroll people for health care coverage or make the White House’s public case that the mangled rollout of HealthCare.gov doesn’t mean the entire Affordable Care Act is flawed. The AFL-CIO isn’t lifting a finger to help the White House — it remains in negotiations at the White House and on Capitol Hill to change elements of the law it finds objectionable to workers.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/u ... 98988.html