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Phatscotty wrote:yet the mechanic can still hold the principle to not bullshit people by assuring them they can do a job they cannot do
Metsfanmax wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Metsfanmax wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Will the costs of your poor decisions be significantly felt by you and your favored politicians?
What, specifically, are the poor decisions made by the voters in question?
Choosing and promoting particular politicians who provided that age-old meme: "I have a plan" (Obamacare). The decisions were made poorly because the voters were (and still are) uninformed.
How might voters have effected a better health care law had they been better informed? The number of politicians to choose from is not particularly large.
PLAYER57832 wrote:Begin by actually looking at systems that really do work in other countries, instead of just pretending that only US ideas, and private basis ideas are worth considering.
Night Strike wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:Begin by actually looking at systems that really do work in other countries, instead of just pretending that only US ideas, and private basis ideas are worth considering.
Or you could begin looking to the private sector instead of always looking to the government. Why is the government your savior of everything?
Night Strike wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:Begin by actually looking at systems that really do work in other countries, instead of just pretending that only US ideas, and private basis ideas are worth considering.
Or you could begin looking to the private sector instead of always looking to the government. Why is the government your savior of everything?
BigBallinStalin wrote:
E.g. an uninformed mechanic is a mechanic who doesn't know much about fixing cars, but nonetheless gets to predominantly rely on his feelings and beliefs when fixing your car. He lacks an education/understanding on what's he doing and can't really see/understand the outcomes.
BigBallinStalin wrote:Did the origin of medicine and insurance arise by government mandate or by the interactions of many within markets?
PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:
E.g. an uninformed mechanic is a mechanic who doesn't know much about fixing cars, but nonetheless gets to predominantly rely on his feelings and beliefs when fixing your car. He lacks an education/understanding on what's he doing and can't really see/understand the outcomes.
Your analogy works for cars becuase there is a defined outcome. It does not work when the best outcome is not fully understood. Medicine is one case where that happens.
Too often people think they want x, but in truth y is really better. That data to come to that conclusion is long and drawn out, so its pretty easy for a lot of "quick fix" folks to come in and pretend that they have some greater expertise, when its really just superficial pretense.
Case in point.. use of antibiotics.
PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Did the origin of medicine and insurance arise by government mandate or by the interactions of many within markets?
Neither.
You gave no option that was real.BigBallinStalin wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Did the origin of medicine and insurance arise by government mandate or by the interactions of many within markets?
Neither.
Oh, so what's your answer?
(the deleted part wasn't an answer).
PLAYER57832 wrote:There is no fully private universal healthcare system in existance. I am suggesting considering those systems that actually work already might be a good place to start considering reforms of our own system.
PLAYER57832 wrote:Insurance arose initially as a way for people to control their healthcare costs by pooling money (teachers union.. forget which state). It then was expanded because private employers wanted to pay certain employers better, but were prohibited from increasing salaries during the war.
PLAYER57832 wrote:You gave no option that was real.BigBallinStalin wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:BigBallinStalin wrote:Did the origin of medicine and insurance arise by government mandate or by the interactions of many within markets?
Neither.
Oh, so what's your answer?
(the deleted part wasn't an answer).
Night Strike wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:Begin by actually looking at systems that really do work in other countries, instead of just pretending that only US ideas, and private basis ideas are worth considering.
Or you could begin looking to the private sector instead of always looking to the government. Why is the government your savior of everything?
Night Strike wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:There is no fully private universal healthcare system in existance. I am suggesting considering those systems that actually work already might be a good place to start considering reforms of our own system.
Universal healthcare doesn't work in the government system either.
Night Strike wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:Insurance arose initially as a way for people to control their healthcare costs by pooling money (teachers union.. forget which state). It then was expanded because private employers wanted to pay certain employers better, but were prohibited from increasing salaries during the war.
Thank you for finally acknowledging that it was the government that caused the current problems. Now, how does MORE government fix those same problems?
Woodruff wrote:Night Strike wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:Begin by actually looking at systems that really do work in other countries, instead of just pretending that only US ideas, and private basis ideas are worth considering.
Or you could begin looking to the private sector instead of always looking to the government. Why is the government your savior of everything?
I can say that I truly believe there are some things that DO NOT AT ALL belong in "the private sector" (by which I mean capitalism). In my personal opinion, capitalism doesn't work well when you're talking about something like health care, because it is in the interests of the provider to scrimp and save, which tends to be bad for the customer/patient.
I know BBS will claim that when some businesses aren't taking care of people the right way, those customers will simply move to a company that will, or that company will be created. But the health insurance industry shows us that is certainly not the case. When they're all basically doing the same thing, there is no choice.
Straight capitalism simply cannot work for the same reason that straight communism cannot work. People suck.
Woodruff wrote:Neoteny wrote:Took me, like, a few hours.
It definitely took me longer. And I read at a pretty decent clip.
Did you just skim?
Napoleon Ier wrote:You people need to grow up to be honest.
Neoteny wrote:I exaggerated a little. I left out some bits that I felt weren't super important as well. Point is that it's not that long of a read if you are a True American (TM) and want to know what your government is up to. Scotty could have read a page a day and be done by now, or used his ban time to read it instead of howling about Obama on CC, but he's not actually concerned with reading the bill; he just wants to make a point.
AndyDufresne wrote:I added the earlier frames for you. Also, I remember watching this in real time and did not notice how not-even-close Kirk's fist gets to McCoy's face.
--Andy
Phatscotty wrote:Wibbly wobbly
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