High Seas [Quenched]

jasnostj · Post by **jasnostj** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:03 pm

Pretty good!

If you put 'Barents Sea' to the left of its army circle, 'Laptev Sea' to the right of its army circle, and the names of the other 2 Arctic Ocean ters a bit down as well, you can have more ice in the Arctic, and thus lose the extreme global warming look.

Besides I think my Caspian Sea idea is creative enough to get a response about.

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:41 pm

jasnostj wrote:How about adding the Caspian (very visible, and distorted, on this map) as a little gimmick? You are f**ked if you get initial placement there, or not because nobody can touch you there. Could have a +1 bonus or some other small advantage to compensate for the isolation. It could turn neutral if the owner loses its last other territory.

I don't want to add a gimmick just for sake of having a gimmick. Anyway, I don't think what you want to see happen is even possible given the current xml options.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:45 pm

Is it just me, or is Caspian Sea not actually on the map anywhere, so I don't know where to find what is being discussed. . . .

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:06 pm

Optimus Prime wrote:Is it just me, or is Caspian Sea not actually on the map anywhere, so I don't know where to find what is being discussed. . . .

correct. it's a land-locked sea in central asia which isn't represented on the map. The joke is that it would have no attack routes, so it would be nothing more than a gimmicky annoyance on this map.

jasnostj · Post by **jasnostj** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:32 am

Optimus Prime wrote:Is it just me, or is Caspian Sea not actually on the map anywhere, so I don't know where to find what is being discussed. . . .

It's very clearly visible on the map examples Oaktown gave for a changed outlook of his map to the world of the 16th century, a few pages back. It is by far the biggest, if not only, inland sea, or the biggest lake in the world, depending on what you call it. Size is comparable to that of the nearby Black Sea.

Anyways, if you don't like the idea, or it isn't possible in xml, that's fine.

Carry on the good work!

gangster2b · Post by **gangster2b** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:11 am

Very good!!:D
I really like the idea and it looks cool too

yeti_c · Post by **yeti_c** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:15 am

gimil wrote:Oaktown found an intresting fact, did you know hippos are colorsblind? Is your avatar a coicidence? Or did you know this already?

As always though your graphics are the sort of thing that set te standards around here

By the very nature that most animals in this world are colourblind this isn't really a massive shock...

Of course - Oaktown doesn't realise that the Hippo is actually Pink!?!?!

C.

PS - On topic - looking good - I think the latest version is very readable... my only small concern is the "adriatic" label... and the small dotted border for it.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 3:39 pm

I know you are busy with C.A. duties and life outside of CC, Oaktown, but I surely hope you don't forget about this beautiful map.

--Andy

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:29 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:I know you are busy with C.A. duties and life outside of CC, Oaktown, but I surely hope you don't forget about this beautiful map.

--Andy

thanks for the praise, andy. I'd like to blame the time commitment of being CA, but really I just haven't felt inspired to work on it. I'll get back to it in time.

Incandenza · Post by **Incandenza** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:59 pm

A little something to hopefully keep you motivated:

Carta Marina

I've been pretty obsessed with old maps my whole life, so I'm a wee bit excited about this one coming to fruition.

Ditocoaf · Post by **Ditocoaf** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:18 am

Where is australia?

sfhbballnut · Post by **sfhbballnut** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:26 am

anyone else think this is painfully cool? and was i the only one to not realize what I was looking at for a good minute?

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 1:09 pm

It's been so long since I've worked on this, I didn't really know where to begin. There are no gameplay changes to this update, but i'm open to suggestions.

• Med-Red impassable land bridge is, hopefully, a bit wider
• Flattened some seacoasts to make them less accurate
• Added more ice to the arctic
• Moved some circles and titles for increased clarity
• Made the water a bit more blue and the land a bit darker so the land doesn't pop out quite as much... thoughts?
• Small map (above) comes in at 630x480 pixels. I have a new idea for resizing map circles which, if it works, I'll let you all in on.

I can already see that territory borders on the smallmap are going to need some work... the to-do list begins![/i]

TaCktiX · Post by **TaCktiX** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 1:35 pm

The bottom bonus globe looks very cramped, and almost exposes the important border "To Scotia Sea." Any chance of making that edge a little cleaner?

I like the sea idea for the map. Too many maps are obsessed with using land.

asl80 · Post by **asl80** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 6:09 pm

yeah, oaktown, can you remind us what era this is set in and from whose perspective? - to justify the "incognition" of some of the terrain ... hehe ?

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 6:25 pm

asl80 wrote:yeah, oaktown, can you remind us what era this is set in and from whose perspective? - to justify the "incognition" of some of the terrain ... hehe ?

Taken from the first post of the thread...

Graphics: I was going to go 19th century moby dick, but I seem to have stepped back in time a bit. Now we've gone fully 16th century, with California as an island and Australia as terra incognita. The characters in the corners are pulled from an early 16th century engraving by Albrecht Durer.

No one's going to talk about gameplay? Well I think you could get a stamp at this point if you weren't going to change anything. As we said before a +3 continent somewhere would be nice. I'll leave it to see if more suggestions come since you haven't had an update in a while.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 8:59 pm

Regarding game play, since Edbeard mentioned it, the Indicus Ocean may be more of a 5 than 6. If your using the Classic as a standard, the Indicus is a North America...3 borders with 10 territories (1 more than NA), but then if you knock it down it seems odd to have both it and Pacificus being a 5...so perhaps stick with 6...

(I'm more thinking outloud than anything.)

I suppose one could also make an argument for Aethiopicus and Mar to be perhaps a 3, but that might be under valuing them...

=================

Atlanticus seems like one of the strongest areas, due to the Australia-esque Med. continent opening up into it...as Atlanticus is no Asia.

I'd say Arctus is also a nice place to start...

=================

I realized I accomplished little with this post! Forgive me.

--Andy

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 9:55 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:Regarding game play, since Edbeard mentioned it, the Indicus Ocean may be more of a 5 than 6. If your using the Classic as a standard, the Indicus is a North America...3 borders with 10 territories (1 more than NA), but then if you knock it down it seems odd to have both it and Pacificus being a 5...so perhaps stick with 6...

The advantage that North America has is its proximity to a smaller, easier to hold territory (S. America). I'd argue that Indian is significantly more difficult to hold because it doesn't have a neaighboring source of easy income, and thus worth an extra army.

AndyDufresne wrote:(I'm more thinking outloud than anything.)

I suppose one could also make an argument for Aethiopicus and Mar to be perhaps a 3, but that might be under valuing them...

I would like one of these areas to be a +3, which in either case would require eliminating one border. We had only one northern border in Ethopicus, but it was pointed out that this allowed one to hold Atlantic and Great Seas by holding just two territories. Blah.

Maybe the solution is making the south pacific (Mar Zur) a +3 by isolating Melanesia. Java Sea could easily be extended down to Australia - or I could just extend Australia up, since we've already thrown geography out the window on this one! We may have a winner in this idea.

AndyDufresne wrote:Atlanticus seems like one of the strongest areas, due to the Australia-esque Med. continent opening up into it...as Atlanticus is no Asia.

I would disagree, though I've gone back and forth on this. The Med is clearly the easiest first bonus to nab, but once you have it Altanticus is going to be a bitch.

AndyDufresne wrote:I'd say Arctus is also a nice place to start...

I agree - that's where I'd hope to start. But again, both bordering bonus regions are expansive... the Classic Australia dilemma. You got it, but now what the hell do you do?

AndyDufresne wrote:I realized I accomplished little with this post! Forgive me.

--Andy

Actually, you pushed my thinking on South Pacific... this may be the gameplay breakthrough we needed. I'll work on it later this evening.

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:31 pm

Alright EdBeard, here's your +3. Mar del Zur is a better place for it - creates three attractive starts, separated from each other.

Dropped some army counts in there for kicks.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:38 pm

I like the new bonus and arrangement.

--Andy

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:50 pm

I think Oceanus Indicus is probably more of a 5 bonus

10 territories, 3 can attack it, 3 defensive

Compare that to the combined Oceanus Aethiopicus and Mar Del Zur with a 7 bonus

10 territories, 8 can attack it, 5 defensive

a 1 bonus difference from those two areas seems a bit small.

Perhaps I'm missing something else about the gameplay.

repost for new page

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:17 am

Yes, the recent tweaking has left some other bonuses questionable... how about this?

I've made South Indian a border territory with the Ethiopicus region. I think this solves two problems:
• Adding a border to defend makes Indian a more respectable +6. By my calculations it comes out at +5.8. Of course, you could still take Cape Basin and reduce your borders to three, but it requires holding an 11th territory and getting into it with whoever is trying to take Ethipicus.
• It adds a 6th (!) territory from which Ethiopicus can be attacked, which makes the region a more respectable +4. (My calculations put it at +3.6.)

I'm pretty pleased with this bonus set-up. What I'm less pleased with are all of the dead-ends. California, Baffin Bay, Arabian Sea-Red Sea, Adriatic, Black Sea, and Baltic all have only one attacker. Easy holds early. I may try to extend the Sea of California up to Alaska (why not?), and Lacadive to Red Sea.

is it clear to everybody that Caribbean borders Eqautorial Current? There's a lot going on there, I'll try to make it less busy.

CatfishJohnson · Post by **CatfishJohnson** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 10:49 am

damn nice

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:15 am

In regards to Caribbean and Equatorial Current, I think it looks fine. You could always alter the shape of northeast South America to add more room.

I like the new set ups, and in regards to Dead-Ends...

Most seem like an okay Keep...and as you stated you can alter California...could also alter Baffin Bay, but I don't see the dead ends being too much a problem.

--Andy

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:10 pm

I don't think it would make too much sense to extend the Baffin Bay because well it's a bay.

But, extending the Sea of California to the Gulf of Alaska is a bit less of a stretch and seems to be good for gameplay.

And, the additional border territory down south there is a good change.