Jayde [Noted]

[Meister]

pLAYER jAYDE HAS A RACIST SYMBOL DISPLAYED IN HER PROFILE

[cena-rules]

ok a few things

1) use the form
2) its not a racist symbol but has been portrayed that way after its use in nazi germany

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika

[Meister]

IT IS STILL EXTREMELY OFFENSIVE, AND LACK (DEVELOPER OF THIS SITE) BEING A JEW HIMSELF WOULD AGREE

[jayde]

It's a sign of good luck in many eastern cultures. Also a widely used religious symbol. It's not this symbol:

http://www.kumah.org/uploaded_images/sw ... 750683.jpg

(sorry didnt mean to post that huge picture - not sure how to edit it so i'll just post link)

[stahrgazer]

All jayde could say when asked what it meant is, "it has many meanings, go read about it."

That says to me, it's not her religious symbol, it's a slim excuse to put a swastika in her profile.

I'm sure there are other, less questionable, religious symbols that can be used.

"The swastika remains a core symbol of Neo-Nazi groups, and is used regularly by activist groups to signify their opinion of supposed Nazi-like behavior of organizations and individuals they oppose."
"As a result, all of its use, or its use as a Nazi or hate symbol is prohibited in some jurisdictions. "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika

[Meister]

Thanks Stah - I agree!

[cena-rules]

Meister, you need to use the form to get this looked at

also, the fact lacks a jew, if that happens to be true, is using personal information which is against the forum guidlines.


Also the fact that this is a religious symbol, can be classed as religious discrimination if jayde is asked to remove it.

[Darwins_Bane]

i can see your POV, but i do feel the need to point out that the symbol in jayde's profile is in fact not a swastika, it is oriented opposite the normal way. In this orientation it actually represents peace and harmony and was first used in buddhism. I do not know if this meaning was their intent or not.

[jpcloet]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika#Buddhism

To "enlighten" the conversation

[stahrgazer]

Darwins Bane said:
i can see your POV, but i do feel the need to point out that the symbol in jayde's profile is in fact not a swastika, it is oriented opposite the normal way. In this orientation it actually represents peace and harmony and was first used in buddhism. I do not know if this meaning was their intent or not.

That was a use many thousands of years ago, but if you review the information being pointed out from wiki, it's obvious that many who used to use the symbol for "enlightenment" have made changes because of its more recent (decades rather than eons ago) use, and its continued use, as a symbol for groups espousing hatred, bigotry, and division.

Eons ago, shiny pebbles were used as coins. If "it used to be" means something today, then I should be able to buy a loaf of bread with a shiney pebble or two. The fact is, pebbles no longer have that meaning (even diamonds must go through a specialty exchange, converted to today's coinage, before being spendable).

Who can show me where buddhists today carve swastikas all over their religious temples? They don't. While they don't erase what was originally meant in a peaceful way, they also no longer propogate its use. Those who want to use the symbol 'today' have change its middle so the bent crosses are no longer the prevailing focus (again see that wiki website people keep referring to, and a flag that was established in recent decades).

Now, if Jade were a religious practitioner of a specific culture such as buddhism, she'd know that one of the concepts most associated with buddhism is "peace" in all things; lack of intentional antagonism. I believe that this is a sort of mindgame, "I can use a swastika in this way, claiming it has value as a wonderful religious symbol, and up yours, CC and anyone on there who may object."

Her reaction in chat to the person who started the objection showed me anything but buddhist enlightenment; neither does use of the symbol TODAY, claiming it has value to mean "peace," show me "enlightenment." Of course, I'm not very buddhist, I simply admire many buddhist methods; so maybe I missed out on lessons where using a swastika in today's society means you're peaceful and enlightened.

[jayde]

The swastika is as holy to the Hindus, Jains and Buddhists as it is evil to people from the West. In the West, the swastika remains a symbol of the evil of Nazism. However, much of the East has merely shrugged off the Nazi association. After all, the word "swastika" is derived from a Sanskrit term meaning "being good" or "wellbeing". Even new Buddhist and Hindu temples are decorated with swastikas. With knowledge and understanding, people from the Western world, while not forgetting their countries' experiences, can acknowledge, perhaps embrace, the swastika as an auspicious sign of the Asian world. As education and awareness replace prejudice, intolerance and narrow-mindedness, there is hope people will start to see the historical richness as well as the present-day significance of the swastika, and not just its unfortunate Nazi past.

There are many dedicated to "reclaiming the swastika" - to sharing information that reveals its long and varied history and the spiritually deep meaning that underlies it. For, if we allow the swastika to remain forever distorted, then those responsible will have won. The goal now is to reclaim the swastika as a symbol of lasting spiritual victory and begin a great new chapter in human history. For those of you with open minds, thank you for allowing me to enlighten you.

And to stahr, I was busy earlier without time to explain while in chat, especially when meister was not open to hearing what I was saying. It's not something easily explained in a chat setting.

[insaneJB]

You people are full of shit! You only take it as a raciest symbol because the only thing that comes to mind when you see it is the Nazi's. That doesn't mean other religions use them as a sign of good! And the guy didn't even fill out the form! I'm not filling the form for this bull shit accusation! This guy can just get over it that he thinks everything is raciest!

[4 U 2 NV]

the symbol is in fact a symbol of peace. the swastika is reversed by the nazis and that makes it a symbol of war.

get your facts straight people.

[MrBenn]

The most relevant bit from the wikipedia page is this:

Wikipedia Wrote
Because of its use by Hitler and the Nazis and, in modern times, by neo-Nazis and other hate groups, the swastika is largely associated with Nazism and white supremacy in most of the Western countries. As a result, all of its use, or its use as a Nazi or hate symbol is prohibited in some jurisdictions. Because of the stigma attached to the symbol, many buildings that have contained the symbol as decoration have had the symbol removed. Westerners whose family originates from India, including religions such as Jain, Hindu and other Indian religions, still use the swastika as a religious symbol, with no connection to Nazism, although not without being accused of cultural insensitivity.

[hecter]

I have no issues with it. Then again, I think Hitler was right.

[jpcloet]

JAYDE, could you post a link to a picture of a temple with the symbol?

[jayde]

There are tons. http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q ... ages&gbv=2

[Natewolfman]

im on the side of Jayde in this one, i have always been an advocate for free speach/symbolism on this site, and yes this symbol was/is still a symbol of peace...

However on the flip side if it was a Nazi symbol, as it was stated that is a symbol of war... does that mean every symbol of war should be outlawed? the jewish 6-point star for the percicution of christianity when they slaughter thousands who followed it... the cross for being the holy symbol of war and death when christians when on the crusades killing anyone who would not convert?... the japanese flag for the attacks on pearl harbor?

point being it is just a symbol... nothing more, hate the man, not the picture behind the man... MOST Nazis at the time were simple citizens NOT evil or with any sort of evil intensions, they belived that the cause was just and most had no idea concentration camps happened, the symbol is just that, a symbol, nothing more and that stigma of symbols being evil should be left out of these forums... its all or nothing folks...

[MrBenn]

Westerners whose family originates from India, including religions such as Jain, Hindu and other Indian religions, still use the swastika as a religious symbol, with no connection to Nazism, although not without being accused of cultural insensitivity.

[Night Strike]

Alright, I took a few minutes to look into that symbol and discussed it with a couple other mods. The symbol itself is a Buddhist symbol and was not meant to display Nazism or the negative connotations with it. I have asked her to consider changing it to something that wouldn't have those types of negativity, but that choice is up to her. In the meantime, I would suggest to everybody to take some time and look into the symbols of various world religions when you see something that could be taken offensively; you might learn something contrary to your original conclusion.

[jayde]

Westerners whose family originates from India, including religions such as Jain, Hindu and other Indian religions, still use the swastika as a religious symbol, with no connection to Nazism, although not without being accused of cultural insensitivity.

Accused of is not relevant. I would say the insensitivity lies with the people overreacting with omg she's racist, who won't even listen to the actual meaning of my specific profile. That the symbol I posted is colored differently, laid out differently, faces a different direction, is not angled, and is surrounded by known symbols of harmony and balance seems to be lost on some people. Open your minds, if not your hearts.

Jayde

[cena-rules]

this has been noted

any mod response???

[stahrgazer]

As I said, other symbols are available; open your mind and your heart and consider using a different antiquated religious symbol.

[hecter]

this has been noted

any mod response???

Ya...

Alright, I took a few minutes to look into that symbol and discussed it with a couple other mods. The symbol itself is a Buddhist symbol and was not meant to display Nazism or the negative connotations with it. I have asked her to consider changing it to something that wouldn't have those types of negativity, but that choice is up to her. In the meantime, I would suggest to everybody to take some time and look into the symbols of various world religions when you see something that could be taken offensively; you might learn something contrary to your original conclusion.

[ManBungalow]

I have no issues with it. Then again, I think Hitler was right.

Finally, an open mind