57% Tax Rate

[The1exile]

...<edit> Claification on the ham (it's more than one!):

http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/!ut/p/_s ... 7/0322.xml

Right, so the government apparently bought a lot of ham, presumably to save the ham (and later cheese) industry. Could you clarify your point?

[Nobunaga]

...<edit> Claification on the ham (it's more than one!):

http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/!ut/p/_s ... 7/0322.xml

Right, so the government apparently bought a lot of ham, presumably to save the ham (and later cheese) industry. Could you clarify your point?

... lazy dolt. Read the other links.

...Replace / upgrade dumbwaiter - more than 300,000.

http://www.recovery.gov/?q=content/cont ... rimeid=545

... $1,444,100 to fix a door in Texas.

http://www.recovery.gov/?q=content/cont ... imeid=1400

...

[lgoasklucyl]

http://www.stinkyjournalism.org/latest- ... tes-97.php

Anything for a few more buys I suppose

[The1exile]

... lazy dolt.

...pointless flame.

Read the other links.

...Replace / upgrade dumbwaiter - more than 300,000.

I am unaware of how much freight elevators cost to replace and upgrade.

... $1,444,100 to fix a door in Texas.

http://www.recovery.gov/?q=content/cont ... imeid=1400

...

If you bothered to read that properly, you would notice that the bulk of the money goes not to fixing a door, but to repairing gas mains.

[Nobunaga]

REPAIR DOOR BLDG 5112... gas mains?

... That's what it says.

... And since when is a freight elevator a dumbwaiter?

...

[bedub1]

If you are in the highest tax bracket, you pay 35%. If you work for yourself, IE Self Employed, you have to pay both sides of social security, 15%. That's 50%. This doesn't even take into consideration property taxes, sales tax, parking tax, etc etc etc etc....

[The1exile]

REPAIR DOOR BLDG 5112... gas mains?

... That's what it says.

Yay, out of context! If you read the whole thing at http://www.recovery.gov/?q=content/cont ... ansactions you can mouse over the larger claim and find out it's for replacing gas mains. The door is a later modification.

... And since when is a freight elevator a dumbwaiter?

...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dumbwaiter_(elevator)

You might have heard of them from the Pinter play, but even if not... did you seriously think there was a grant for replacing a waiter who happened to be a mute? Surely you have some kind of law against that.

[PLAYER57832]

If you are in the highest tax bracket, you pay 35%. If you work for yourself, IE Self Employed, you have to pay both sides of social security, 15%. That's 50%. This doesn't even take into consideration property taxes, sales tax, parking tax, etc etc etc etc....

Yes, but you also get a good many tax breaks for many things that other people don't get to count -- everything from entertainment, which is almost always "business" to vehicles, etc.

Besides, if you are paying 35%, then you are making far more than most people to begin with.. yet, it is almost gauranteed that you don't really have more education, more intelligence or even more skill on any objective scale than so many others who don't make so much.

[jbrettlip]

If you are in the highest tax bracket, you pay 35%. If you work for yourself, IE Self Employed, you have to pay both sides of social security, 15%. That's 50%. This doesn't even take into consideration property taxes, sales tax, parking tax, etc etc etc etc....

Yes, but you also get a good many tax breaks for many things that other people don't get to count -- everything from entertainment, which is almost always "business" to vehicles, etc.

Besides, if you are paying 35%, then you are making far more than most people to begin with.. yet, it is almost gauranteed that you don't really have more education, more intelligence or even more skill on any objective scale than so many others who don't make so much.

Again, capitalism is about choices. If you don't like your life, change it. And don't tell people if they are in a higher tax rate that they don't deserve it. You want to live in Russia, move there. Oops, communism already failed there. Want to live in Europe, move there. Oops, they just routed the liberal socialists. Part of the US, is the ability to get rich. NOT TO BE PENALIZED FOR IT.

[PLAYER57832]

Again, capitalism is about choices. If you don't like your life, change it. And don't tell people if they are in a higher tax rate that they don't deserve it. You want to live in Russia, move there. Oops, communism already failed there. Want to live in Europe, move there. Oops, they just routed the liberal socialists. Part of the US, is the ability to get rich. NOT TO BE PENALIZED FOR IT.

No, capitalism in its pure form is about he who is the strongest gets is all and who cares about anyone else.

Capitalism has its definite advantages in most things, but your pretense that the rich are somehow better or more deserving is plain poppy cock and you have not examined more than your own backyard and know only your associates if you truly believe people get rich because they somehow deserve it. Over 99% of it is pure and simple luck.

Also, your idea that taxes are all about the raw percentage you pay .. never mind deductions, never mind the benefits you gain.. is also baloney.

Furthermore, if you are truly going to be a leader and not just a bully, then it behooves you to learn a bit more about people before you smack off judgements about the world around you.

[GabonX]

There are plenty of places in the world where success is marginalized by the shortcomings of others.

Until recently, we in the United States took pride in being the land of opportunity.

[PLAYER57832]

There are plenty of places in the world where success is marginalized by the shortcomings of others.

Until recently, we in the United States took pride in being the land of opportunity.

We are still the land of opportunity for many, but bedub keeps asserting that those who are rich are just better than those who are not.

Also, if the "opportunities" come only at the expense of others, then I am not sure it is really something to be proud about. I don't say that is always the case, but it is far far harder for a poor child to "make it" today than it was 30-50 years ago.

[GabonX]

Also, if the "opportunities" come only at the expense of others, then I am not sure it is really something to be proud about.

I agree with you.

This is why I think it is wrong to place a 57% tax rate on the wealthy.

Even worse, such a rate discourages productivity after a point...

[jbrettlip]

Well, if you want to get to know the people around you, then you should know me. I work very hard. I was raised in a military family. People in the army don't get rich. My sister makes probably 4 times what I make. She works 90 hours a week for her job. I work 50+ including travel time. You sit at home with your kids, and rant about how f'ed up the US system is. Our success wasn't 99% luck. You make your own luck. I made mine. People should make theirs.

Not everyone deserves to go to college. Not everyone deserves to own a house. Not everyone deserves to own a new car. that is what America is about. Work for what you want, earn what you can.

[PLAYER57832]

Also, if the "opportunities" come only at the expense of others, then I am not sure it is really something to be proud about.

I agree with you.

This is why I think it is wrong to place a 57% tax rate on the wealthy.

Even worse, such a rate discourages productivity after a point...

I am not sure I follow your logic on the first.

For one thing, the wealthy almost never pay taxes on their full income. The so-called adusted minimum tax was supposed to correct some of that, but as usual all sorts of exclusions were written in to benefit the truly wealthy. Those who are just above middle class get hit hardest on that. (but still tend to get more breaks than your "average joe")

As for the second, there is no real tie between income and productivity anyway. Nor is there a tie (negative or positive) between taxes and productivity, except at the very lowest levels. I, for example, would be far better off financially if I simply divorced my husband. I could get free rent, food for my kids, medical care, a car, further education and even child care.

[PLAYER57832]

Not everyone deserves to go to college. Not everyone deserves to own a house. Not everyone deserves to own a new car. that is what America is about. Work for what you want, earn what you can.

If you work over 40 hours a week, then you do deserve to either own or rent a decent house and transportation -- be it a car in rural areas or buses, etc in a big city.

[jbrettlip]

Not everyone deserves to go to college. Not everyone deserves to own a house. Not everyone deserves to own a new car. that is what America is about. Work for what you want, earn what you can.

If you work over 40 hours a week, then you do deserve to either own or rent a decent house and transportation -- be it a car in rural areas or buses, etc in a big city.

No you don't. You SHOULD be able to afford it, I agree. But it shouldn't be given to you. You have to sacrifice,save and make good decisions with your money.

[PLAYER57832]

Not everyone deserves to go to college. Not everyone deserves to own a house. Not everyone deserves to own a new car. that is what America is about. Work for what you want, earn what you can.

If you work over 40 hours a week, then you do deserve to either own or rent a decent house and transportation -- be it a car in rural areas or buses, etc in a big city.

No you don't. You SHOULD be able to afford it, I agree. But it shouldn't be given to you. You have to sacrifice,save and make good decisions with your money.

No one said given, I said "earned". And no, I don't mean "no matter what you do with your money".

Way too many people today work 2-3 jobs, DO scrimp and save and still cannot afford a house or get one and then lose it all simply because a family member was so irresponsible as to get sick.

But the irony is that my former deadbeat neighbor gets to sit on her porch, feed her kids junk food.. all at taxpayer expense.

[jbrettlip]

I don't think your neighbor is a former deadbeat. Perhaps you meant your former neighbor? (not trying to be a smart ass, just saying they still sound like deadbeats).

If you don't think people can afford stuff now, just wait until jobs evaporate under the two bills in Congress (health care and cap and trade). They are the end of the US, and the culmination of Obama's plan to ruin our country once and for all. Thank God even the Dems have turned on his radical policies.

[PLAYER57832]

I don't think your neighbor is a former deadbeat. Perhaps you meant your former neighbor? (not trying to be a smart ass, just saying they still sound like deadbeats).

cute, but putting adjectives in a string, while perhaps open to misunderstandings at times, is correct grammar.

If you don't think people can afford stuff now, just wait until jobs evaporate under the two bills in Congress (health care and cap and trade). They are the end of the US, and the culmination of Obama's plan to ruin our country once and for all. Thank God even the Dems have turned on his radical policies.

See, now you go more than off the deep end.

Without doing anything, most people will be without healthcare and bankrupt right now. There is no option. It would be nice if folks had stopped partying long enough to understand the piper would have to be paid earlier, but they haven't.

I won't weigh in on cap and trade. I just don't know enough about the specifics, but at the same time, it doesn't seem you really know more than a few headlines. I do know the environment and biology and I can tell you that we have to stop screwing with our air and water or humanity as a whole, not just the US, is in for a very, very rough ride. And no, that is not some 1970's clap trap. I have the data, the facts, but proving it would require you to read through a few volumes of text. And not Al Gore's book, either!

[GabonX]

Your view Player, seems to be that income has no relation to hard work. While hard work will not always result in a 6 figure income, if you work 40 hours a week and you're not making a decent living, you're doing something wrong.

It's possible that such a person has opted for a job which does not require as much skill as another. A convenient store clerk is never going to make as much as the manager, even if they work more hours. Time spent working is not the only consideration as the required skill and the quality of work also play a role.

What about people who drink and smoke everyday? I don't have much sympathy for people who spend their money on frivolous things (which often have a detrimental affect on one's health) who then complain that they cannot AFFORD health care.

[jbrettlip]

You could say "deadbeat former neighbor". The adjectives are still in a string, but now they would be correct.

I haven't read the entire 1100 page bill, and I will never read it. But that puts me on the same level as the rest of Congress. But i can look at places like CA, NY and other tax the rich, give to the poor economies to see how the story ends. Everyhting the government gets involved in gets screwed up. Housing bubble, university tuition bubble (already here, but few are discussing it), and now the gross devaluation of the dollar.

[GabonX]

Gold, guns, or government..

..Place your bets people.

[The1exile]

What about people who drink and smoke everyday? I don't have much sympathy for people who spend their money on frivolous things (which often have a detrimental affect on one's health) who then complain that they cannot AFFORD health care.

OK, so now we're getting somewhere. How about "I don't see public healthcare as a bad thing to protect people from acts of god, but I'm against my taxes being used to fund smokers getting lung cancer and alcoholics with liver failure"?

[HapSmo19]

What about people who drink and smoke everyday? I don't have much sympathy for people who spend their money on frivolous things.........

Excellent. I drink and smoke almost every day and I dont want your sympathy.

I don't want to pay for your healthcare either.