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jpcloet wrote:Timminz wrote:jpcloet wrote:People really need to learn to listen.
That they do, indeed. Although, I suspect it's not just the ones you're referring to.
I was not referring to anyone, or any group in particular. We all say we can listen, but I've learned through various techniques at work that less than 3% of us really listen. I've learned that it is very difficult to learn, and even harder to teach. The forum goers need to know that people are listening, even if action has not been taken, will not be taken, or will be taken. Do not interpret lack of action to be passive acceptance of the issue. I wish people would worry about themselves and not what others are doing.
b.k. barunt wrote:Didn't see the "reach out" post before, but if it's suggestions you want, there's a plethora of them out there on these complaint threads. Have you responded to any of them? You might have to take the time to read the threads.
Honibaz
AAFitz wrote:...
Further, We all know, that no matter what happens, what decisions are made, what rules are out there, there will be an outcry of complaints forever. Always. Some people just like to complain. They always will. Nothing will stop that, except them leaving, or hell freezing over. And even then youll get complaints, because some will argue that hell freezing over was natural, and others will complain that we caused it with C02 emissions. The argument will continue until the last breath is taken, by the last person.
El Capitan X wrote:The people in flame wars just seem to get dimmer and dimmer. Seriously though, I love your style, always a good read.
AAFitz wrote:b.k. barunt wrote:Didn't see the "reach out" post before, but if it's suggestions you want, there's a plethora of them out there on these complaint threads. Have you responded to any of them? You might have to take the time to read the threads.
Honibaz
Well, BK, I spent quite a bit of time responding to every point you made in a thread, and you obviously didnt read it, because you didnt respond to any of my comments... so before you go suggesting other people arent taking the time to read...perhaps you should.
As useful as just posting that people are always making mistakes, and that they must be asskissing selfrighteous prigs... maybe reading why they feel this way is relevant....or, just skip it for the quick an easy post...
IMO there is not fundamental problem with a perma ban. To think that someone, who after repeated attempts to sabotage the forum will stop after some repeated number of 7 day bans or something is just delusional, or naive at best. Im not suggesting that the perma ban should not be the last resort, and I'd love to see perhaps a more graduated system. However, with most of the people banned that Ive seen. It has been obvious that there is no ban ever, that will make them stop breaking the forum rules, except a forum ban. Using Xtra as an example...Is there anyone that believes anything less than a perma ban would get him to stop crossing the line. That there was any warning possible that would make him come back, and bite his tongue. Not a one year ban, not a ten year ban. Anyone with that much passion for breaking the rules, will continue to break them. That is the purpose of the warnings. So, there is no problem with the perma-ban whatsoever. Its an obvious and necessary evil. Further, to suggest that a website should spend time and resources banning someone for 7 days or some longer period indefinitely is just ridiculous.
For a useful solution to this, perhaps a more graduated banning process is possible. However, the bans would have to get progressively longer to be of any real deterrent. You cant ban someone for a day, and expect any kind of change. If someone is out to cause trouble, they are out to cause trouble, and will never, ever stop doing that. The short bans and warnings, are obviously for those players that can use a warning shot across the bow. Many, who may not even know they broke a rule, and for others that obviously need to know the site is serious about enforcing the rules.
So, suggesting a perma ban is not useful or needed is pointless. This is self evident I believe. However, maybe some longer ban periods could be institued first, such as 6 month, or 1 year even. This if nothing else would relieve some of the severity of the perma ban, and if a player cant come back and play nice after a full year off, then they never will, and the perma ban is clearly the only way to keep them from wasting the mods time.
Most of this is obvious to anyone whos really thought about it. Its fun to try to fight the system, to try to get as much as possible, and hope that the sheer volume of complaints will somehow justify the argument, but reasonable people, even the ones who play such games...and make no mistake...im one of them....know better.
Further, We all know, that no matter what happens, what decisions are made, what rules are out there, there will be an outcry of complaints forever. Always. Some people just like to complain. They always will. Nothing will stop that, except them leaving, or hell freezing over. And even then youll get complaints, because some will argue that hell freezing over was natural, and others will complain that we caused it with C02 emissions. The argument will continue until the last breath is taken, by the last person.
mpjh wrote:Geez, BK it is really difficult to tell what do you want.
jpcloet wrote:Which actions, like all notes/warnings? Can you clarify?
Bruceswar wrote:jpcloet wrote:Which actions, like all notes/warnings? Can you clarify?
There should be a sub forum for only mods to post it in. I will say things like...
Bruceswar - Warning - Simple reason why in the thread and lost.
Owenshooter - 1 Month Ban - Trolling...
Or whatever....
mpjh wrote:Isn't this sort of a score card for the bad boys, and doesn't it reveal personal information about an indivicual?
b.k. barunt wrote:AAFitz wrote:b.k. barunt wrote:Didn't see the "reach out" post before, but if it's suggestions you want, there's a plethora of them out there on these complaint threads. Have you responded to any of them? You might have to take the time to read the threads.
Honibaz
Well, BK, I spent quite a bit of time responding to every point you made in a thread, and you obviously didnt read it, because you didnt respond to any of my comments... so before you go suggesting other people arent taking the time to read...perhaps you should.
As useful as just posting that people are always making mistakes, and that they must be asskissing selfrighteous prigs... maybe reading why they feel this way is relevant....or, just skip it for the quick an easy post...
IMO there is not fundamental problem with a perma ban. To think that someone, who after repeated attempts to sabotage the forum will stop after some repeated number of 7 day bans or something is just delusional, or naive at best. Im not suggesting that the perma ban should not be the last resort, and I'd love to see perhaps a more graduated system. However, with most of the people banned that Ive seen. It has been obvious that there is no ban ever, that will make them stop breaking the forum rules, except a forum ban. Using Xtra as an example...Is there anyone that believes anything less than a perma ban would get him to stop crossing the line. That there was any warning possible that would make him come back, and bite his tongue. Not a one year ban, not a ten year ban. Anyone with that much passion for breaking the rules, will continue to break them. That is the purpose of the warnings. So, there is no problem with the perma-ban whatsoever. Its an obvious and necessary evil. Further, to suggest that a website should spend time and resources banning someone for 7 days or some longer period indefinitely is just ridiculous.
For a useful solution to this, perhaps a more graduated banning process is possible. However, the bans would have to get progressively longer to be of any real deterrent. You cant ban someone for a day, and expect any kind of change. If someone is out to cause trouble, they are out to cause trouble, and will never, ever stop doing that. The short bans and warnings, are obviously for those players that can use a warning shot across the bow. Many, who may not even know they broke a rule, and for others that obviously need to know the site is serious about enforcing the rules.
So, suggesting a perma ban is not useful or needed is pointless. This is self evident I believe. However, maybe some longer ban periods could be institued first, such as 6 month, or 1 year even. This if nothing else would relieve some of the severity of the perma ban, and if a player cant come back and play nice after a full year off, then they never will, and the perma ban is clearly the only way to keep them from wasting the mods time.
Most of this is obvious to anyone whos really thought about it. Its fun to try to fight the system, to try to get as much as possible, and hope that the sheer volume of complaints will somehow justify the argument, but reasonable people, even the ones who play such games...and make no mistake...im one of them....know better.
Further, We all know, that no matter what happens, what decisions are made, what rules are out there, there will be an outcry of complaints forever. Always. Some people just like to complain. They always will. Nothing will stop that, except them leaving, or hell freezing over. And even then youll get complaints, because some will argue that hell freezing over was natural, and others will complain that we caused it with C02 emissions. The argument will continue until the last breath is taken, by the last person.
Fitz, i will readily admit to not taking the time to read this or any of your long winded, self satisfied paeans to diarrhea of the mouth. Whatthefuck does that have to do with this thread? If i had indicated that i was interested in what you had to say, and then didn't read your long winded, couldasaidthesamein25wordsorlessbutidosolovetotalk exercizes in verbosity, then there might be a similarity and you would not simply be trolling here, but i didn't indicate such, and i really have no interest in your typical sychophantic drivel.
JCloet indicated an interest in suggestions, and i can see from his post that he did in fact take the time to read at least one of them. This is a gesture of good faith on his part as far as i'm concerned, but has very little, if anything to do with you and me, so please take your trolling elsewhere.
Honibaz
El Capitan X wrote:The people in flame wars just seem to get dimmer and dimmer. Seriously though, I love your style, always a good read.
jpcloet wrote:That is just going to lead to some people questioning every single decision.
timmytuttut88 wrote:jpcloet wrote:That is just going to lead to some people questioning every single decision.
Like that doesn't happen now.
El Capitan X wrote:The people in flame wars just seem to get dimmer and dimmer. Seriously though, I love your style, always a good read.
timmytuttut88 wrote:jpcloet wrote:That is just going to lead to some people questioning every single decision.
Like that doesn't happen now.
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