Flame posts (no ronc this isn't in re of flame wars)

[jefjef]

Hi all!

It has recently come to my attention that a player was warned for posting what CC considered a flame directed at me.

This player is a long time trips pard of mine and we sit each others account. We are CC friends. We joke with each other constantly.

I explained this to CC and requested that the warning be withdrawn. Well that was a waste of time.

My view is if the player that a "flame" is directed at is not offended by said "flame" should we not have a say about it. Perhaps CC should contact the "offended" player to see if their truly was an offense.

Thoughts?

[Duality.]

I don't agree that if a particular player isn't offended by a flame, then the person who flamed them shouldn't be warned, because other people could still find it offensive. However, if it's commonly known or just obvious that those involved are friends then no warning should be issued. Of course, if they do it frequently and it starts to become awkward for other members or disrupts the forums then action should be taken, but if it's simply one friend jokingly ripping into another then I would see that as acceptable.

[scipioafricanus1]

depends on what was said. If other folks on the board might find it super offensive then yeah, a warning makes sense. If your friend wants to flame you without offending others then he/she should use PM you.

now having said that my gauge for offensive is set really freaking high. He/she would have to say something really bad to you to get me pissed off or offended.

[Commander62890]

As long as it doesn't become excessive, friends flaming friends should be allowed without any warnings/bans.

[hwhrhett]

if people could control their flaming into a set of circumstances that were allowed, then flame wars would still be here..

remember when flame wars was here, and there was flaming in every single forum because the mouth breathing retards that enjoy flaming have no sense of direction or limits...

[AndyDufresne]

As long as it doesn't become excessive, friends flaming friends should be allowed without any warnings/bans.

Friends can flame each other---in PMs. But when you start posting in public places (walls, forums, public game chat) you have to take into account that other people may view it and report it.


--Andy

[jefjef]

Well what he posted was just funny. No foul language or bigotry or racism. Just harmless fun. It was a stretch to call it a flame.

[AndyDufresne]

I'm just suggesting that everyone can protect themselves from being misinterpreted---by conducting borderline correspondence privately.


--Andy

[Evil Semp]

Your friend flames you and that is OK. What if someone you don't get along with flamed you with the exact same wording? Would that be OK? Would you take it the same way? What if your friend flames someone else with the exact same words and they report it as a flame? Your friends response could be it wasn't considered a flame when I said it to jefjef. Some times it is not what is said but who said it that can cause enforcement problems.

[Duality.]

Your friend flames you and that is OK. What if someone you don't get along with flamed you with the exact same wording? Would that be OK? Would you take it the same way? What if your friend flames someone else with the exact same words and they report it as a flame? Your friends response could be it wasn't considered a flame when I said it to jefjef. Some times it is not what is said but who said it that can cause enforcement problems.

That's exactly what the thread is about: that should it be okay for friends to 'flame' you if you don't mind? Did you even read it?

[jefjef]

Your friend flames you and that is OK. What if someone you don't get along with flamed you with the exact same wording? Would that be OK? Would you take it the same way? What if your friend flames someone else with the exact same words and they report it as a flame? Your friends response could be it wasn't considered a flame when I said it to jefjef. Some times it is not what is said but who said it that can cause enforcement problems.

Evil. It wasn't a flame. It was a JOKE from a casual online gaming site friend. I will type this slowly. I DO NOT CONSIDER IT A FLAME. YOU ALL DID. He called me a troll and added some descriptive comments in re of it. It was FUNNY. You consider me a "troll" and CC mods have stated themselves that if it is true than it is not a flame.

And who said it had not been previously disciplined but I realize he is viewed as what you would say is "anti-mod" at times.

BTW. Just cuz someone disagrees with a mod does not make them anti mod.

What I believe to be correct common sense would be for CC to contact the "flamed" person and receive their input BEFORE any judgment is handed out.

[Army of GOD]

Jefjef doesn't want to press charges....so....

[BigBallinStalin]

Jefjef doesn't want to press charges....so....

so nothing; it'll most likely get ignored.

[jefjef]

Jefjef doesn't want to press charges....so....

so... I am the ONLY one who could have found it offensive. That so.... AND my E-ticket was dismissed out of hand.

[hwhrhett]

What I believe to be correct common sense would be for CC to contact the "flamed" person and receive their input BEFORE any judgment is handed out.

that sounds like a full time job... i cant imagine how many people the mods would have to contact on any given day, although i assume it would be well into the hundreds, if not thousands. why limit their ability to do their job?

[the.killing.44]

Me: You are a motherfucking retard, Player X.

<I get warned/banned>

Me: We're friends, it's okay! [True]

<I get the warn/ban revoked>

==========================

Me: You are a motherfucking retard, Player Y

<I get warned/banned>

Me: We're friends, it's okay! [Untrue]

<Warn/ban is not revoked>

Me: But you revoked it last time after I said the same thing!

=========================

People have asked for consistency in modding. This is what they're trying to do by not allowing friend-flaming in the forums.

[jefjef]

Me: You are a motherfucking retard, Player X.

<I get warned/banned>

Me: We're friends, it's okay! [True]

<I get the warn/ban revoked>

==========================

Me: You are a motherfucking retard, Player Y

<I get warned/banned>

Me: We're friends, it's okay! [Untrue]

<Warn/ban is not revoked>

Me: But you revoked it last time after I said the same thing!

=========================

People have asked for consistency in modding. This is what they're trying to do by not allowing friend-flaming in the forums.

Well thats a really cute anology. He called me a troll with out the profanity. CC mods have themselves stated that calling someone a troll is not flaming.

They warned xplayer for flaming because he called me a troll.

Does not = consistency.

[Evil Semp]

Me: You are a motherfucking retard, Player X.

<I get warned/banned>

Me: We're friends, it's okay! [True]

<I get the warn/ban revoked>

==========================

Me: You are a motherfucking retard, Player Y

<I get warned/banned>

Me: We're friends, it's okay! [Untrue]

<Warn/ban is not revoked>

Me: But you revoked it last time after I said the same thing!

=========================

People have asked for consistency in modding. This is what they're trying to do by not allowing friend-flaming in the forums.

That's what I was trying to say.

As far as the actual instance that this thread is about I did not read or see it.

[Woodruff]

I think the problem is exactly that of consistency. The problem isn't that you weren't offended, jefjef, it's that it would give the PERCEPTION that such a "flame-but-not-a-flame" was in fact ok with the site. In other words, someone ELSE posting exactly the same thing would then get warned/banned/whatever and their argument would be that "so and so didn't get warned/banned/whatever for it"...and they'd be exactly right. We've been begging for consistency, so I'd hate to see that get torn down rather than built up.

[Snowgun]

Woody two shoes is right on. How can we bitch about consistancy and then try to insert grey areas into the methodology?

I'm all for being able to talk shit to your buddies or even aquantances on the boards so others who know those involved can get a chuckle. However, in the open forum, this will create issues with the mods having to police all this stuff.

That's why I keep (most of) my shit talking to my clan forum, where we can joke and flame away with impunity. This is similar to me being able to piss in my buddies yard when i'm drunk, but not in the park across the street..... Or something like that...

[AndyDufresne]

Woody two shoes is right on. How can we bitch about consistancy and then try to insert grey areas into the methodology?

I'm all for being able to talk shit to your buddies or even aquantances on the boards so others who know those involved can get a chuckle. However, in the open forum, this will create issues with the mods having to police all this stuff.

That's why I keep (most of) my shit talking to my clan forum, where we can joke and flame away with impunity. This is similar to me being able to piss in my buddies yard when i'm drunk, but not in the park across the street..... Or something like that...

Right, as I mentioned earlier---feel free to talk it up with your buddies in PM, in private team chat and in private forums. Those are private areas where you can express yourself without many moderation restrictions, so use them.

But in the public forums, on walls, in public games, anywhere else in the public sphere, it will be up for moderation.


--Andy

[King_Herpes]

If only this sort of plea would work when I beat my spouse...

[jefjef]

Woody two shoes is right on. How can we bitch about consistancy and then try to insert grey areas into the methodology?

I'm all for being able to talk shit to your buddies or even aquantances on the boards so others who know those involved can get a chuckle. However, in the open forum, this will create issues with the mods having to police all this stuff.

That's why I keep (most of) my shit talking to my clan forum, where we can joke and flame away with impunity. This is similar to me being able to piss in my buddies yard when i'm drunk, but not in the park across the street..... Or something like that...

Right, as I mentioned earlier---feel free to talk it up with your buddies in PM, in private team chat and in private forums. Those are private areas where you can express yourself without many moderation restrictions, so use them.

But in the public forums, on walls, in public games, anywhere else in the public sphere, it will be up for moderation.


--Andy

Interesting.

So in private forums flaming and joking it's ok. But when the social group "flame trolls" was applied for ronc was turned down because you said private flaming is not allowed.

ok. I understand.

[AndyDufresne]

While our moderators do not moderate private forums, we do moderate their creation, and those that are created to simply spur further forum infractions usually won't make it through the cut. But this isn't on topic jefjef. From the responses so far, it seems people understand.

Have your jokes by all means, but if they are going to be borderline, keep them in private or otherwise you may unfortunately be disciplined.


--Andy

[jefjef]

While our moderators do not moderate private forums, we do moderate their creation, and those that are created to simply spur further forum infractions usually won't make it through the cut. But this isn't on topic jefjef. From the responses so far, it seems people understand.

Have your jokes by all means, but if they are going to be borderline, keep them in private or otherwise you may unfortunately be disciplined.


--Andy

Now come on. Not on topic? My thread. You directed me to other forms of communication and when I comment on it you say I'm off topic? wow.

OK. Gotta go. Have a nice day.