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I'm not an anti-abortionist, but that's a weak argument.Falkomagno wrote:I just read a book that assure that, the big drop in crime rates in USa is given, mainly, because a event called “Roe v. Wade” , where the supreme court allows in some cases the abortion. That’s because a harsh law against abortion produces more unwanted children in the poorest conditions, that has the bigger probabilities to become criminals after years.
So, allows abortion can work in the opposite direction, where a young poor women can abort easily, or in fact, defer the birth of his child, until the conditions can be better, and that can reflect in a lower of criminal rates in any countries.
A provocative theory undoubtedly
JESUS SAVES!!!PLAYER57832 wrote:Too many of those who claim they don't believe global warming are really "end-timer" Christians.
Yes. Falko is talking about Freakonomics.thegreekdog wrote:Question - does the study consider that abortion used to be a crime and that the legalization of abortion necessarily reduced the crime rate?
Exactly. It's not an argument for legalizing abortion. It was never intended to be. It was actually used more to discredit the notion that the falling crime-rate in the 90's was due to various state- and citygovernments being "tough on crime". It seems it was more due to the legalisation of abortion reducing the overal number of people which in turn leads to lower crime-rates and such.Executing every third person in those poor areas would also reduce the crime rate.
It's not liberal rhetoric. It's economics.jay_a2j wrote:So abortion has led to a decrease in criminals? Could you spare me the liberal rhetoric? It's quite nauseating.

No the crime-rate also decreases. Which is logical and backed up by studies and facts. (A small town does not merely have a lower amount of crimes, but also a lower crime-rate.)thegreekdog wrote:Okay... I'm not a mathematician (I just play one on TV)... but,
Pre-Abortion Population - 100
Crimes - 20
Crime rate - 20%
Post-Abortion Population - 50
Crimes - 10
Crime rate - 20%
So, what we're really saying is that the "right" people are having abortions.
How is what you just typed "no?" The only way the crime rate decreases is if the "right" people are having abortions. That's the answer.Snorri1234 wrote:No the crime-rate also decreases. Which is logical and backed up by studies and facts. (A small town does not merely have a lower amount of crimes, but also a lower crime-rate.)thegreekdog wrote:Okay... I'm not a mathematician (I just play one on TV)... but,
Pre-Abortion Population - 100
Crimes - 20
Crime rate - 20%
Post-Abortion Population - 50
Crimes - 10
Crime rate - 20%
So, what we're really saying is that the "right" people are having abortions.
New crime rate wouldn't be 20%. That wouldn't be a decreased crime rate.thegreekdog wrote:How is what you just typed "no?" The only way the crime rate decreases is if the "right" people are having abortions. That's the answer.Snorri1234 wrote:No the crime-rate also decreases. Which is logical and backed up by studies and facts. (A small town does not merely have a lower amount of crimes, but also a lower crime-rate.)thegreekdog wrote:Okay... I'm not a mathematician (I just play one on TV)... but,
Pre-Abortion Population - 100
Crimes - 20
Crime rate - 20%
Post-Abortion Population - 50
Crimes - 10
Crime rate - 20%
So, what we're really saying is that the "right" people are having abortions.
Snorri1234 wrote:New crime rate wouldn't be 20%. That wouldn't be a decreased crime rate.thegreekdog wrote:I just did the math above... by your calculation, the crime rate would have to go down for some other reason (i.e. increased vigilance or the "right" people are having abortions). Why, if there are half as many people would the crime rate go down more than half unless there is some other reason?Snorri1234 wrote:No the crime-rate also decreases. Which is logical and backed up by studies and facts. (A small town does not merely have a lower amount of crimes, but also a lower crime-rate.)thegreekdog wrote:Okay... I'm not a mathematician (I just play one on TV)... but,
Pre-Abortion Population - 100
Crimes - 20
Crime rate - 20%
Post-Abortion Population - 50
Crimes - 10
Crime rate - 20%
So, what we're really saying is that the "right" people are having abortions.
By the "right" people, I mean people whose children have a tendency to commit crimes. I mean nothing nefarious. Either children who tend to grow up to commit crimes are being aborted (however anyone figures that shit out) or something else is going on.
How is what you just typed "no?" The only way the crime rate decreases is if the "right" people are having abortions. That's the answer.
What do you mean by "right" people?
Because that's how it works. Less people means a lower crime rate, not just fewer crimes. Just compare small towns with big cities. We don't know exactly why (we can guess) but we can see that the crime rate as a percentage of the population goes up as the population increases.thegreekdog wrote:
I just did the math above... by your calculation, the crime rate would have to go down for some other reason (i.e. increased vigilance or the "right" people are having abortions). Why, if there are half as many people would the crime rate go down more than half unless there is some other reason?
Yup, kids who would've grown up in a poor neighborhood with lots of crime weren't born. And that not only reduces the overal amount of crimes, but also the percentage of crimes relative to teh populace.By the "right" people, I mean people whose children have a tendency to commit crimes. I mean nothing nefarious. Either children who tend to grow up to commit crimes are being aborted (however anyone figures that shit out) or something else is going on.
It's not about the math. It's about the stats.thegreekdog wrote:LESS PEOPLE DOES NOT MEAN A LOWER CRIME RATE!!!
I will retract the above, if you, Snorri, can prove to me, mathematically, and all other things being equal, how less people = a lower crime rate.

thegreekdog wrote:LESS PEOPLE DOES NOT MEAN A LOWER CRIME RATE!!!
I will retract the above, if you, Snorri, can prove to me, mathematically, and all other things being equal, how less people = a lower crime rate.
Yes, that is my point. Just because there are less people, it does not mean the crime rate is lower. The crime rate is lower because of less unwanted children (i.e. the "right" people are having abortions).Falkomagno wrote:thegreekdog wrote:LESS PEOPLE DOES NOT MEAN A LOWER CRIME RATE!!!
I will retract the above, if you, Snorri, can prove to me, mathematically, and all other things being equal, how less people = a lower crime rate.
Is not less people. It's less unwanted children in poor neighbourhoods, with higher posibilities to become criminals

All else being equal? That's exactly my point, the amount of people influences how a city behaves. It won't be equal. The more people you get the more likely you get ghettos, poor education and a higher pay-off for crime. Cities have higher crime-rates because they are cities.thegreekdog wrote:LESS PEOPLE DOES NOT MEAN A LOWER CRIME RATE!!!
I will retract the above, if you, Snorri, can prove to me, mathematically, and all other things being equal, how less people = a lower crime rate.
Yes, the real world. Where the rate of crime doesn't drop simply because there are less people.Snorri1234 wrote:All else being equal? That's exactly my point, the amount of people influences how a city behaves. It won't be equal. The more people you get the more likely you get ghettos, poor education and a higher pay-off for crime. Cities have higher crime-rates because they are cities.thegreekdog wrote:LESS PEOPLE DOES NOT MEAN A LOWER CRIME RATE!!!
I will retract the above, if you, Snorri, can prove to me, mathematically, and all other things being equal, how less people = a lower crime rate.
Let's say there is a finite amount of the resource "education". First that is spread over 100 kids, but a few years later that same amount is spread over 50 kids. That means those 50 kids all get a better education, and are therefore less likely to resort to criminal activities. Same with lots of other things like housing, clothing and food down to the amount of love and support you receive from your parents.
This is the real world, not some mathproblem with everyone being equal.
Actually, if you go and killed 100,000 people the crime rate would drop. Criminality isn't genetic. If you kill people then there are more resources left for the rest who then don't have to engage in criminal activities.thegreekdog wrote:Yes, the real world. Where the rate of crime doesn't drop simply because there are less people.Snorri1234 wrote:All else being equal? That's exactly my point, the amount of people influences how a city behaves. It won't be equal. The more people you get the more likely you get ghettos, poor education and a higher pay-off for crime. Cities have higher crime-rates because they are cities.thegreekdog wrote:LESS PEOPLE DOES NOT MEAN A LOWER CRIME RATE!!!
I will retract the above, if you, Snorri, can prove to me, mathematically, and all other things being equal, how less people = a lower crime rate.
Let's say there is a finite amount of the resource "education". First that is spread over 100 kids, but a few years later that same amount is spread over 50 kids. That means those 50 kids all get a better education, and are therefore less likely to resort to criminal activities. Same with lots of other things like housing, clothing and food down to the amount of love and support you receive from your parents.
This is the real world, not some mathproblem with everyone being equal.
If I go kill 100,000 people right now, the crime rate wouldn't drop. If I go kill 100,000 criminals, it would.
This analogy doesn't work, because the resource "education" isn't finite. It is variable, based on the amount of money the taxpayers pay in to the system.Snorri1234 wrote:All else being equal? That's exactly my point, the amount of people influences how a city behaves. It won't be equal. The more people you get the more likely you get ghettos, poor education and a higher pay-off for crime. Cities have higher crime-rates because they are cities.thegreekdog wrote:LESS PEOPLE DOES NOT MEAN A LOWER CRIME RATE!!!
I will retract the above, if you, Snorri, can prove to me, mathematically, and all other things being equal, how less people = a lower crime rate.
Let's say there is a finite amount of the resource "education". First that is spread over 100 kids, but a few years later that same amount is spread over 50 kids. That means those 50 kids all get a better education, and are therefore less likely to resort to criminal activities. Same with lots of other things like housing, clothing and food down to the amount of love and support you receive from your parents.
This is the real world, not some mathproblem with everyone being equal.
