ANTI-RACIST MATH(S)

[Snorri1234]

Races don't really exist.

I thought it had been established that people with Asian ancestors had cultural values that caused them to work harder. What do you call that group of people?

People from asia? Or Asian-americans. Or people in an Asian/american culture.

Races are being mixed as we speak, but "no races" is still a stretch...

In the sense that they're not genetically different from us by any meaningfull way.

I don't really mind the use of Asian as reffering to certain cultural aspects which are common in Asia and more to the point common in Asian cultures which we're familiar with.

However, one thing I like to note is that what we're talking about is far more common in Asian-American culture than in Asian europeans. I think that has to do with american culture actually also being quite focused on excellence, perhaps a more broader excellence with sports and art too.

[Timminz]

Races don't really exist.

I thought it had been established that people with Asian ancestors had cultural values that caused them to work harder. What do you call that group of people?

It has nothing to do with ancestors. It's the environment in which they are raised. Yes, the culture of an region comes from the people of the past (among many other things), but it's not so direct as you are stating it. Bloodlines, or genetics have nothing to do with it, except that people tend to usually live in areas that are culturally similar to where their ancestors did.

[BigBallinStalin]

Races don't really exist.

I thought it had been established that people with Asian ancestors had cultural values that caused them to work harder. What do you call that group of people?

Races are being mixed as we speak, but "no races" is still a stretch...

Well, define "Asian." (it's more than what you may think)

You've just covered an entire continent made up of 100s (perhaps 1000s) of different ethnicities and cultures, and then saying they all have cultural values that caused them to work harder. That's ridiculous.

[SultanOfSurreal]

man. it's only 15x17 pixels but it makes a post about 100,000 times more rage-inducing.

[john9blue]

Yeah that smiley's dumb.

[thegreekdog]

Okay, so I have to admit... I read the OP and I read the linkey. I read the first two or three posts after the OP and then ignored the rest (figured it was more of the same). However, this from the link:

Discussion of the mathematical knowledge of ancient civilizations outside of Europe, and non-European contributions to mathematical knowledge and discovery.
The avoidance of racial stereotyping when forming and communicating expectations of pupils' attainments in mathematics.
The avoidance of racial stereotypes or cultural bias in classroom materials, textbooks, coursework topics and examination questions.
Effective and unprejudiced methods of distinguishing between the merits of individuals. In particular, by ensuring equal exposure to examinable learning materials and opportunities as well as standardised examination methods. In this case, it would be highly prudent to ensure a method of examination that is public and open to cross-examination (certainly by ensuring that complaints and ambiguities in either examination methods or marks are dealt with openly [publicly] and in a non-secretive way). Clearly repeat examinations are less likely to misrepresent mathematical abilities.

So, my questions are:

(1) Did you or anyone else you know have a discussion of mathematical knowledge in a math class with respect to where mathematics theories come from? When I sat in math class, we did not discuss European or non-European contributions to math. We learned math.
(2) Were racial stereotypes abundant when communicating expectations for students in math classes in your schools? I don't ever remember any stereotypes in my math classes.
(3) What cultural or racial biases exist in math textbooks? Are there not enough dark-skinned faces in the pictures? Are peoples' names too Anglicanized in word problems?

So, those are my questions. It is ridiculous that someone should even have to comment on this. Racial/gender/ethnic biases in history? Yeah, I can see that. English/literature? Sure. Math? Come the f*ck on. Just... you know... I just hate this shit. I just hate it. Teach the goddamn math and shut the f*ck up. Learn the goddamn math and shut the f*ck up.

[SultanOfSurreal]

Okay, so I have to admit... I read the OP and I read the linkey. I read the first two or three posts after the OP and then ignored the rest (figured it was more of the same). However, this from the link:

Discussion of the mathematical knowledge of ancient civilizations outside of Europe, and non-European contributions to mathematical knowledge and discovery.
The avoidance of racial stereotyping when forming and communicating expectations of pupils' attainments in mathematics.
The avoidance of racial stereotypes or cultural bias in classroom materials, textbooks, coursework topics and examination questions.
Effective and unprejudiced methods of distinguishing between the merits of individuals. In particular, by ensuring equal exposure to examinable learning materials and opportunities as well as standardised examination methods. In this case, it would be highly prudent to ensure a method of examination that is public and open to cross-examination (certainly by ensuring that complaints and ambiguities in either examination methods or marks are dealt with openly [publicly] and in a non-secretive way). Clearly repeat examinations are less likely to misrepresent mathematical abilities.

So, my questions are:

(1) Did you or anyone else you know have a discussion of mathematical knowledge in a math class with respect to where mathematics theories come from? When I sat in math class, we did not discuss European or non-European contributions to math. We learned math.
(2) Were racial stereotypes abundant when communicating expectations for students in math classes in your schools? I don't ever remember any stereotypes in my math classes.
(3) What cultural or racial biases exist in math textbooks? Are there not enough dark-skinned faces in the pictures? Are peoples' names too Anglicanized in word problems?

So, those are my questions. It is ridiculous that someone should even have to comment on this. Racial/gender/ethnic biases in history? Yeah, I can see that. English/literature? Sure. Math? Come the f*ck on. Just... you know... I just hate this shit. I just hate it. Teach the goddamn math and shut the f*ck up. Learn the goddamn math and shut the f*ck up.

from what i understand the point is to raise awareness of the largely tacit and unspoken biases that teachers themselves have. and it's not just about race. if you're not a white male, teachers will tend to have lower expectations for your performance in math. this is especially true in elementary, where the most vital foundations of mathematical knowledge are cemented. these are the years where students should be learning basic concepts that will allow them higher success in secondary education, but teachers often "go easy" on girls and minorities, assigning them less difficult tasks and not helping them with more advanced concepts in the same way they would for the white males.

this phenomena is very well documented and it is a serious problem. more than most other disciplines, math builds on previous knowledge, so if you lose these formative years and fall behind, you're pretty much screwed and you will never be able to catch up. so the point of anti-racist math is to encourage teachers to abandon these ingrained prejudices so as to lower the pervasive systemic bias towards white males in mathematics education.

[thegreekdog]

So, it's not anti-racist math... it's anti-racist teaching (or, more appropriately, teaching while avoiding stereotyping).

So, let's not call it anti-racist math please. Let's call it this - "How a Teacher Should Treat Children While Teaching." And I'm pretty sure that goes for all subjects.

[SultanOfSurreal]

So, it's not anti-racist math... it's anti-racist teaching (or, more appropriately, teaching while avoiding stereotyping).

So, let's not call it anti-racist math please. Let's call it this - "How a Teacher Should Treat Children While Teaching." And I'm pretty sure that goes for all subjects.

it's a PR campaign. sort of like those PSAs at the end of an episode of gi joe. there's nothing wrong with it, and if does a little good, all the better. it's obviously not a panacea though

[72o]

I don't consider myself racist, but I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of African Americans can kick my ass at basketball. Sure, there will be exceptions, but African Americans as a group generally have a higher aptitude for sports than non-African Americans. Look at any professional sport for evidence. I don't think that's a cultural thing. African-Americans aren't playing basketball 24/7 from the time they are children.

I think some groups of people are genetically predisposed to be better at certain things than others. I don't see how that makes a person racist. It's a simple observation.

[thegreekdog]

So, it's not anti-racist math... it's anti-racist teaching (or, more appropriately, teaching while avoiding stereotyping).

So, let's not call it anti-racist math please. Let's call it this - "How a Teacher Should Treat Children While Teaching." And I'm pretty sure that goes for all subjects.

it's a PR campaign. sort of like those PSAs at the end of an episode of gi joe. there's nothing wrong with it, and if does a little good, all the better. it's obviously not a panacea though

It's not a good PR campaign if it makes rich white people angry (per the wiki entry). I'm a middle class white person and I'm angry, if only because for some reason the wiki entry notes that math books are racially insensitive and math classes don't teach that math comes from Africa as much as Europe. Because, really, math books aren't racially insensitive and math classes don't teach where math comes from at all.

[SultanOfSurreal]

I'm a middle class white person and I'm angry

well there's a fucking shocker

[thegreekdog]

I'm a middle class white person and I'm angry

well there's a fucking shocker

(sorry... but I did)

In my defense, you're also a middle class (actually you might be rich) white person and you're angry too.

[SultanOfSurreal]

I'm a middle class white person and I'm angry

well there's a fucking shocker

(sorry... but I did)

In my defense, you're also a middle class (actually you might be rich) white person and you're angry too.

i live well below the poverty line brosef

[thegreekdog]

I'm a middle class white person and I'm angry

well there's a fucking shocker

(sorry... but I did)

In my defense, you're also a middle class (actually you might be rich) white person and you're angry too.

i live well below the poverty line brosef

You do? What the f*ck. How does someone as well-educated and articulate as you live well below the poverty line?

The poverty guideline for a one person family is $10,830.

[SultanOfSurreal]

You do? What the f*ck. How does someone as well-educated and articulate as you live well below the poverty line?

The poverty guideline for a one person family is $10,830.

i have a disabled mother and an unemployed father. i work to support them and put myself through college.

[thegreekdog]

You do? What the f*ck. How does someone as well-educated and articulate as you live well below the poverty line?

The poverty guideline for a one person family is $10,830.

i have a disabled mother and an unemployed father. i work to support them and put myself through college.

That's noble of you. Good luck.

[bedub1]

I've said this in the past. Pie being equal to 3.14...... is so totally unfair to the unintelligent and dumb. Soon the democrats will pass legislation making pie equal to 3. This will be much easier for everybody, and not so racist/discriminatory.

[hecter]

I've said this in the past. Pie being equal to 3.14...... is so totally unfair to the unintelligent and dumb. Soon the democrats will pass legislation making pie equal to 3. This will be much easier for everybody, and not so racist/discriminatory.

Why do you fail all the time? That shit is SO fucking old. For the record, it's the more Biblical value of 3.0, not the "non-racist" value of 3.0.
http://www.snopes.com/religion/pi.asp
Contains a nice little and complete article.

[SultanOfSurreal]

Pie being equal to 3.14

i'd like to believe even you're not this stupid but i have my doubts

[BigBallinStalin]

I don't consider myself racist, but I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of African Americans can kick my ass at basketball. Sure, there will be exceptions, but African Americans as a group generally have a higher aptitude for sports than non-African Americans. Look at any professional sport for evidence. I don't think that's a cultural thing. African-Americans aren't playing basketball 24/7 from the time they are children.

I think some groups of people are genetically predisposed to be better at certain things than others. I don't see how that makes a person racist. It's a simple observation.

There are cultural factors at work, and you've made a mistake. It's not African Americans that have some kind of genetic advantage, but the players that make it tend to have the genetic advantage (regardless of skin color, or race).

Some people are talented, and some aren't. That has nothing to do with race. You're only making the mistake that it does.


To explain why there are more blacks in American professional sports than other people of different skin colors, one would have to look into the environment in which these players grow, as well as other cultural factors. Like reinforced biases and so on. Also, you're ignoring other professional sports. I mean, what about golf? I guess, going by your logic, that white guys are predisposed to perform better than everyone else at golf due to their genes (which is also pure nonsense). It depends on the culture in which one develops.

If this is still bugging you, go pick up a book on it, or read a few science articles, or something. I don't know enough background information, nor do I have enough time to care to prove to you that I'm right.

[thegreekdog]

I don't consider myself racist, but I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of African Americans can kick my ass at basketball. Sure, there will be exceptions, but African Americans as a group generally have a higher aptitude for sports than non-African Americans. Look at any professional sport for evidence. I don't think that's a cultural thing. African-Americans aren't playing basketball 24/7 from the time they are children.

I think some groups of people are genetically predisposed to be better at certain things than others. I don't see how that makes a person racist. It's a simple observation.

There are cultural factors at work, and you've made a mistake. It's not African Americans that have some kind of genetic advantage, but the players that make it tend to have the genetic advantage (regardless of skin color, or race).

Some people are talented, and some aren't. That has nothing to do with race. You're only making the mistake that it does.


To explain why there are more blacks in American professional sports than other people of different skin colors, one would have to look into the environment in which these players grow, as well as other cultural factors. Like reinforced biases and so on. Also, you're ignoring other professional sports. I mean, what about golf? I guess, going by your logic, that white guys are predisposed to perform better than everyone else at golf due to their genes (which is also pure nonsense). It depends on the culture in which one develops.

If this is still bugging you, go pick up a book on it, or read a few science articles, or something. I don't know enough background information, nor do I have enough time to care to prove to you that I'm right.

So BBS, this begs the question of whether we should have anti-racist basketball?

Now before youse all get hot and bothered over this, please keep in mind that we have a subject being taught in school called "anti-racist math" and that anti-racist basketball is simply a corrallary. Here's what anti-racist basketball coaches believe:

Anti-racist basketball is primarily concerned with the way basketball is taught, although it also examines the contents of the coaching in as much as this might reasonably differ from universally acceptable basketball coaching. An anti-racist approach to mathematics education could include any or all of the following:

- Discussion of the history of basketball of both white and non-white players.
- The avoidance of racial stereotyping when selecting young children for basketball teams.
- The avoidance of racial stereotyping when selecting young children as starters or bench players.
- Effective and unprejudiced methods of distinguishing between the merits of the individuals. In particular, equal exposure for all races to basketball coaching and opportunities to play.

Proponents of anti-racist basketball believe that anti-racist basketball programs have the potential to correct imbalances and to have beneficial results in the overall quality of the sport in some majority groups.

[72o]

I don't consider myself racist, but I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of African Americans can kick my ass at basketball. Sure, there will be exceptions, but African Americans as a group generally have a higher aptitude for sports than non-African Americans. Look at any professional sport for evidence. I don't think that's a cultural thing. African-Americans aren't playing basketball 24/7 from the time they are children.

I think some groups of people are genetically predisposed to be better at certain things than others. I don't see how that makes a person racist. It's a simple observation.

There are cultural factors at work, and you've made a mistake. It's not African Americans that have some kind of genetic advantage, but the players that make it tend to have the genetic advantage (regardless of skin color, or race).

Some people are talented, and some aren't. That has nothing to do with race. You're only making the mistake that it does.


To explain why there are more blacks in American professional sports than other people of different skin colors, one would have to look into the environment in which these players grow, as well as other cultural factors. Like reinforced biases and so on. Also, you're ignoring other professional sports. I mean, what about golf? I guess, going by your logic, that white guys are predisposed to perform better than everyone else at golf due to their genes (which is also pure nonsense). It depends on the culture in which one develops.

If this is still bugging you, go pick up a book on it, or read a few science articles, or something. I don't know enough background information, nor do I have enough time to care to prove to you that I'm right.

Blacks as a group are good at every sport. Sure, there are some nerdy, unathletic African Americans, but as a group, they statistically excel in sports more than whites. Just compare the percentage of blacks in the NBA or NFL with the percentage of the US population that is black. It's statistically significant.

Again, this is not due to cultural differences. Whites play sports as children just as much as blacks. I would argue more so, as whites as a group have a higher standard of living and therefore more access to club teams, gyms, equipment, etc. The only reason blacks don't already dominate golf is that it's a sport that has only recently (within the last 50 years) been open to their play. It's a very expensive undertaking, and until recently country clubs were the only place to play, and many didn't or still don't allow black members. That doesn't mean that blacks aren't as good at whites at golf, just that they haven't been able to completely overtake the PGA like they have the NBA or NFL yet.

[V.I.]

My black dog's cock is much bigger than my white dog's. I'm talking serious girth here, check it out:

http://tiny.cc/2iern

[BigBallinStalin]

I don't consider myself racist, but I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of African Americans can kick my ass at basketball. Sure, there will be exceptions, but African Americans as a group generally have a higher aptitude for sports than non-African Americans. Look at any professional sport for evidence. I don't think that's a cultural thing. African-Americans aren't playing basketball 24/7 from the time they are children.

I think some groups of people are genetically predisposed to be better at certain things than others. I don't see how that makes a person racist. It's a simple observation.

There are cultural factors at work, and you've made a mistake. It's not African Americans that have some kind of genetic advantage, but the players that make it tend to have the genetic advantage (regardless of skin color, or race).

Some people are talented, and some aren't. That has nothing to do with race. You're only making the mistake that it does.


To explain why there are more blacks in American professional sports than other people of different skin colors, one would have to look into the environment in which these players grow, as well as other cultural factors. Like reinforced biases and so on. Also, you're ignoring other professional sports. I mean, what about golf? I guess, going by your logic, that white guys are predisposed to perform better than everyone else at golf due to their genes (which is also pure nonsense). It depends on the culture in which one develops.

If this is still bugging you, go pick up a book on it, or read a few science articles, or something. I don't know enough background information, nor do I have enough time to care to prove to you that I'm right.

Blacks as a group are good at every sport. Sure, there are some nerdy, unathletic African Americans, but as a group, they statistically excel in sports more than whites. Just compare the percentage of blacks in the NBA or NFL with the percentage of the US population that is black. It's statistically significant.

Again, this is not due to cultural differences. Whites play sports as children just as much as blacks. I would argue more so, as whites as a group have a higher standard of living and therefore more access to club teams, gyms, equipment, etc. The only reason blacks don't already dominate golf is that it's a sport that has only recently (within the last 50 years) been open to their play. It's a very expensive undertaking, and until recently country clubs were the only place to play, and many didn't or still don't allow black members. That doesn't mean that blacks aren't as good at whites at golf, just that they haven't been able to completely overtake the PGA like they have the NBA or NFL yet.

Monsieur, the statistics you mentioned for "blacks as a group are good at every sport" are insufficient to defend your assertion since you only use two sports. Only two. When one then compares those with the sports found in the Olympics and all across the world, you see that blacks are not dominating in every sport. For your claim to be true, then all of the nations of Africa should be dominating in soccer.

You can argue all you like, but your only chance of learning something is not through an exchange of keyboard barrages back and forth with me. My friend, there's already been this debate before, and I do not wish to see a repeat. The journey to dispel your ignorance can only start with you, so go educate yourself on the matter from more credible sources.