Osama bin Laden claims victory over US

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Woodruff
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Re: Osama bin Laden claims victory over US

Post by Woodruff »

stahrgazer wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
thegreekdog wrote:
InkL0sed wrote:Probably at least partially because of our support of dictators there (and our support of Israel).
Okay, so in their minds, because we allegedly supported dictators in the Middle East and because we think that the Israelis shouldn't be pushed out into the ocean, it's understandable to want to kill a few thousand Americans.
I think it has far more to do with our having infidel military personnel in their holy lands. And if you think about that for a moment, that's some pretty strong justification for a lot of things (even to my non-religious mind). And using Saudi Arabia's willingness to have us there as rationale isn't particularly useful since the Saudi royal family is pretty roundly despised even by their own people.

I should also point out that I'm certainly not excusing what they did nor what they continue to try to do and I absolutely support our continued actions against al Qaida. While I'm personally very pleased to see this happen, from a "justice served, mixed with revenge" perspective...I unfortunately don't believe it will have any actual negative impact on al Qaeda. I think the largest value from it is that it does show that we will doggedly pursue you until we get you if you bloody our nose in the manner that he did, and that is valuable to a degree. But typically, terrorists (even those at the top of the food chain) aren't particularly concerned about that.

I certainly have the highest respect for those military members carrying out the operation, though. Very impressive not to lose a casualty.

Our only real method of eliminating the majority of terrorism is, as many others have already stated, to improve their quality of life. Give them something that ISN'T so damn easy to throw away. This absolutely at the very least should be done in conjunction with our military actions. Sadly, we don't seem to be too interested in that particular fix. I had a lot of hope at the beginning that this was precisely what we would be doing PARTICULARLY in Afghanistan, but also in Iraq (we broke it, we bought it).
I'd agree with these theories except, the US didn't enter the middle east until after other countries had first, and requested our support. Those other countries primarily backed away, not because they don't support the premise, but because the US, having "won the cold war" was the biggest guy on the block.
So what? None of that is particularly relevant, I don't imagine. Those other countries are not there. We are.
stahrgazer wrote:As for Iraq, remember the shouting "yay America" in the streets when we first "broke it."
That's when they thought we were actually there to help them. Sadly, we weren't...and they soon realized that.
stahrgazer wrote:I also surmise that if it weren't for all those insurgents who are forcing us to the choice of withdraw or shoot back, we would just be there to help the next government improve the people's quality of life.
Bullshit, that's just an excuse. The situation in Iraq is not such that we must choose between those two alternatives, and has not been for some time now.
stahrgazer wrote:Nostradamus predicted that WWIII would come from someone in a turban in the middle east; I'd say, we're in the middle of WWIII right now.
I wouldn't.
stahrgazer wrote:And the Saddams of the area make us wonder, whom do we trust to establish a peaceful government that helps its population improve their quality of life rather than take advantage of additional munitions, money, and support to form new dictatorships and harbor zealots whose chief aim is, by their own admission, to cut the legs off the United States and any countries that support our principles?
Our first step could be in NOT CREATING THEM. We CREATED Osama bin Ladin. Not by supporting him against the Russians. But by taking other plodding, disjointed, actions that had the foresight of a 3-year-old with ADHD. We need to stop thinking short-term and start thinking long-term.
...I prefer a man who will burn the flag and then wrap himself in the Constitution to a man who will burn the Constitution and then wrap himself in the flag.
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saxitoxin
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Re: Osama bin Laden claims victory over US

Post by saxitoxin »

Nola_Lifer wrote:5 Reasons why we entered WWII
1)Germans sinking US merchant ships taking supplies to England
2)Japan's unreasonable demands on the United States (re- instating oil sales and dropping support of the Philipeenes and China)
3)German submarines beginning to shoot at US war ships
4)England and France are typically our allies so we were going to enter the war eventually anyway
5)Pearl Harbor was obviously why we entered the war. Anytime we are attacked we are going to go to war; howeve,r realize that we declared war on Japan and three days later Germany declared war on us so we were not looking for a fight by any means.
READ NUMBER 5

5 Reasons why we enter Iraq or Libya
1)Oil
2)Oil
3)Vendetta between Presidents of the U.S. and Iraq's and Libya's leaders
4)The rare Islamic extremist
5)Oil
Who-ho-ho ... I agree with with 5 Reasons Why We Enter Iraq or Libya, however, I'm not aware of Germany attacking any U.S. merchant ships prior to the entry of the U.S. into war. In fact, there are ample examples of flagrant violations of U.S. neutrality by the Roosevelt regime, any one of which would have excused an Axis attack on the U.S.

While the U.S. was "neutral" -
- Germans who escaped Canadian POW camps to the U.S. were repatriated to Canada instead of re-interred in the U.S. as the laws of war would demand.
- U.S. Navy ships regularly radioed the coordinates and movement of Kriegsmarine ships and German merchantmen to the Royal Navy in violation of neutrality.
- OSS operatives were active in Serbia training partisans fighting the Italian Army in violation of neturality.
- The U.S. Navy, on several separate occasions, blockaded German merchantmen in Mexican ports until the Royal Navy could arrive.

WWII was a struggle between nationalism and internationalism, however, the world capitalist classes intervened and defeated both sides. Even Hitler agreed!
Hitler wrote:As a member of the privileged class, Roosevelt experienced the World War in a position under Wilson's shadow as an Assistant Secretary. As a result he only knew of the agreeable consequences of war in which some survived and others perished. During this same time I lived very differently. I was not one of those who made decisions or profits, but one who carried-out orders. I returned from the war just as poor as when I entered in 1914. I, thus, shared my fate with millions of others while Mr. Roosevelt shared his fate with the upper one-percent. After the war, while Mr. Roosevelt tested his skills in stock market speculation to enrich himself, I lay in a hospital with many others. Financially secure and enjoying the patronage of his class, Mr. Roosevelt then chose a career in politics. I struggled as an unknown man.

Two different paths in life: Roosevelt, the candidate of the capitalist party and those who serve it. Me, the leader of a national movement I created myself.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

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saxitoxin
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Re: Osama bin Laden claims victory over US

Post by saxitoxin »

So, it turns out this famous photo ...

Image

... is just a PR photo opp.

Live video feed from the raid on the compound was "mysteriously cut-off" for the crucial 25 minutes.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... pound.html
The Telegraph wrote:The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.
If the CIA publicly acknowledges this, what aren't they acknowledging? Were Obama and the gang all watching Global Hawk video? That idear should be suspect. Everything should be suspect given that the story changes 3 times a day.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

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