The Hobbit Mafia [Town win]

[Kamikaze Jawa]

@Samlen, would you say that the mason talk is a night ability?

Skoffin, Kili, a Mason allied with Thorin’s Company has been killed.

Abilities
Vote: During the day, you may use your vote to aid in lynching a player.
Mason: Each night you may communicate with your mason partner(s).

Says pretty clearly it's a night ability. I'm curious why you're so intent on believing that MM and Skoff couldn't communicate? The roleclaim from MM seems believable given Skoff's defense of MM, what are your reasons for thinking otherwise?

QFT but i am against unjustified role claiming, seriously ppl stop with the fishing, it only help scum at

I didn't ask for his role, I asked him what his reasons were to believe that MM was lying. He said there was no way that MM and Skoff could have communicated, but hasn't explained why he said that. That was my question.

[ZaBeast]

thb, I'd be more ready to believe scum targetted IP's former role rather than thor. His death would have given no info and potentially shortened the day. Incidentally, due to his role, he wouldn't have died (N1 is even). But the likeliest option is probably that a doc/roleblocker/jailor got lucky that night.

@Rags, I'm not going to take your word for it, though I don't think now's the time for you to claim, if the only info you have is about MM. I don't see how any night ability would prevent masons from talking to each other, like I don't think any night ability prevents scum from talking to each other (and anyways, let's say you have an ability that lets you do that. What makes you think they couldn't have talked before you sent it in?) With the setup it doesn't make much sense to have one non-town mason. And if there is one, that must be skoffin. I mean, his name is in red.
But if you do claim, I'd like you to explain this post from D1.

I just think that there are clues in my role pm that there will be (a) third part(y)ies in this game.

I didn't want to ask for it earlier because IMO, people who read special stuff in their role pm usually have a power role.

Not sure if we should go on a sideways third-party hunt though. If it happens (if we lynch a third party), it happens, but it doesn't look like there are evil third-parties in the setup (cult, SK). Worst case could be a lyncher. I don't see why a possible survivor shouldn't be left alone.

Now I'd like to see some people vote more. Especially from sam, who always appears as not voting in LoVo's vote counts on D2 and was for a no lynch on D1. FOS Sam

[Ragian]

It's either taking my word for it or me claiming. The clues would be in every town players PM, but it might just be a standard phrase. Also, I don't think now is the time to hunt for third party players. We don't seem to have any evil ones.

[Ragian]

Abandon ship! I've just gotten confirmation that mason talk is a passive ability that can't be tampered with. unvote MM.

So... Yeah... Don't mind me.

[Minister Masket]

Abandon ship! I've just gotten confirmation that mason talk is a passive ability that can't be tampered with. unvote MM.

So... Yeah... Don't mind me.

Even if you did 'just learn that', you've been voting me before you knew I was a mason, which means your Unvote here doesn't make sense.
Either you had a genuine reason for thinking I was scum (of which there are none), or you're trying to get rid of a town player.

Gee I wonder which one it is...?

[Ragian]

Indeed I did. D1 and D2. Now, not so much. Don't take it personal, son. Also, don't waste your vote on me because you feel hard done by. Vote for me if you genuinely think that I'm scum.

[Skoffin]

Hey since I'm dead. LoVo I can do daily vote counts for you if you want.

[Kamikaze Jawa]

Hey since I'm dead. LoVo I can do daily vote counts for you if you want.

Okay, who used the Ouija board?

[ZaBeast]

Well, I'm still waiting on mitch to explain his post where he explicitly says he's afraid of dying if he hammered dakky if he never thought dakky was a bomb.

Can we also get some votes going? Getting imposed a deadline and speed lynching someone is not a good plan, I think we're far better starting early. And as I said, I expect people to vote more, especially Sam, from whom we have no voting information.
Unofficial vote count
pika(1)<-- Flores
Flores(1)<--BuJ
Ragian(1)<---MM
mitch(2)<--ZaBeast, pika
Not voting (7): MudPuppy, Hotshot53, Ragian, Kamikaze Jawa, madmitch, Samlem, Thornthoth
(7 needed to lynch)

I was looking back at mitch's posts and I found this:

Wow what a lucky night for us especially Thort, Dakky asking about actions does sound scummy but I think he might be on to something. Do we start all over with new suspects or should we be like Rags and stick to our D1 favorites and push them harder? I was suspicious of Thort until he was proven town and then Ifollowed Skoffin lead on Hot Shot but basically the vote was split and time ran out so there was not much pressure put on the suspects we had,right now I am thinking either MM or HS ,they seemed to be the popular ones at the moment

Am I wrong in thinking this post is particularly fishy?
- especially Thort --->why did he think thor was lucky to have gotten through the night? Did he have reason to believe he was supposed to be night killed? I mean, I wouldn't think thor was the most likely NK target, since he didn't seemed very helpful to town on D1, even as a confirmed townie.
- but I think [dakky] might be on to something-->pushing for a role claim as well.
With this in mind, I will unvote vote mitch

That's actually the most convincing argument I've seen all day. At least better than the one to lynch dakky. I think i'll wait for a response from mitch but I doubt it'll change my mind.

Also, what's up with that? Saying it's the best argument you've seen all day, but not acting up on it. And mitch never explained the role fishing part either... hmmm you're next in line if mitch flips scum.

My naughty list (getting charcoal at christmas)
1- madmitch
2- Samlem (esp. if mitch flips scum)
3- mudpuppy

[Kamikaze Jawa]

Can we also get some votes going? Getting imposed a deadline and speed lynching someone is not a good plan, I think we're far better starting early. And as I said, I expect people to vote more, especially Sam, from whom we have no voting information.
Unofficial vote count
pika(1)<-- Flores
Flores(1)<--BuJ
Ragian(1)<---MM
mitch(2)<--ZaBeast, pika
Not voting (7): MudPuppy, Hotshot53, Ragian, Kamikaze Jawa, madmitch, Samlem, Thornthoth
(7 needed to lynch)

I voted mitch at the start of the day

[ZaBeast]

Unofficial vote count
pika(1)<-- Flores
Flores(1)<--BuJ
Ragian(1)<---MM
mitch(3)<--ZaBeast, pika, Kamikaze Jawa
Not voting (6): MudPuppy, Hotshot53, Ragian, madmitch, Samlem, Thornthoth
(7 needed to lynch)

Thanks for pointing it out

[madmitch]

I said Dakky was a bomb,I said I did not want to hammer him for (a) I was catching shit for hammering to many times, some I did not even notice because of the votes kept going on and off, and (b) Dakky for some reasons likes to kill me early, so I was trying to stay of his radar.Also I was never role fishing ,and yes I thought someone would of killed Thoth because he was to damn annoying and ignorant.Kill me if you must but I could be very important for town

[lord voldemort]

Hey since I'm dead. LoVo I can do daily vote counts for you if you want.

Whilst I'm not opposed to it. I hadn't actually done one as there has only been 4-5 votes. I much prefer to stay passive and less hands on. I'm here to guide gently. Not to force info down the players throats.

[Samlen]

Now I'd like to see some people vote more. Especially from sam, who always appears as not voting in LoVo's vote counts on D2 and was for a no lynch on D1. FOS Sam

Yeah i tend to be more passive/indecisive when it comes to actually voting. And I still stand by that day one's should typically be no lynches. I'll reread some stuff and try to come up with a vote and reasoning within this post or the next one\o/

I'll start with looking at the lynch from yesterday

Dakky21 (8): Thorthoth, FloresDelMal, Kamikaze Jawa, Hotshot53, madmitch, DirtyDishSoap, BuJaber, ZaBeast
Madmitch (1): dakky21
MudPuppy (1): skoffin
Hotshot53 (1): Minister Masket, MudPuppy
DirtyDishSoap (1): Pikanchion

Not Voting (2): Samlen, Ragian,

Dakky brought a lot of scummy attention to himself. I already said how I thought it highly unlikely a scum would go for an attempt against a proven town so brazenly. Given dakky's history of stubborness i'm more inclined he just got that thought in his head and just charged forward instead of trying to sacrifice himself for a random shot. His team, however, should've noticed fairly quickly the hole dakky was digging himself into and probably at least 2 of his scummates would've jumped on the chance to grab easy town cred. I think his teammates are either on his bandwagon or trying not to be noticed. I know there were a couple people off this wagon that were on it at some point or claimed they would vote and I think those people are not as likely on his team since there wasn't another person to easily drag a bandwagon to by that point, making their position potentially dangerous if dakky got lynched and they were seen wavering.

Thor-Confirmed town by mod. Not much to say
Flores - Nothing screams town or scum. Has some nice points
Kamikaze - Not much to say.
Hotshot - People found him scummy for lurking but it never went anywhere. I remember someone mentioning when thor got confirmed dakky seemed annoyed since next lynch candidate seemed to be hotshot. Wouldn't count it as concrete evidence but it stuck with me for whatever reason.
Madmitch - Quite polarized against dakky in terms of arguing and I honestly can't see mitch doing that to a scumteammate. Don't think he's mafia but could be town or 3p.
dds- ded
Buj- Didn't like his immediate fishing for other masons. imo we should've not had mm claim or bring any attention to possible masons since bringing in a confirmed towny later in the game would've been better.
zabeast - posting a decent amount and generating discussion. Seems to be taking over the game which would be worrisome if he's not town. No strong tells either way.

If I were looking for a scum player confident in their abilities, I think they would be closer to the front of the wagon whereas I would expect a less confident scum player to be near the end.
Looking back on this my gut says bujaber or hotshot. Maybe both.

[lord voldemort]

Vote Count 3.1


madmitch (3): Pikanchion, Kamikaze Jawa, ZaBeast
Pikanchion (1): FloresDelMal
FloresDelMal (1): BuJaber
Ragian (1): Minister Masket

Not Voting (6): Thorthoth, Hotshot53, madmitch, MudPuppy, Samlen, Ragian



With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.
There is no deadline currently in place

[madmitch]

I said Dakky was a bomb,I said I did not want to hammer him for (a) I was catching shit for hammering to many times, some I did not even notice because of the votes kept going on and off, and (b) Dakky for some reasons likes to kill me early, so I was trying to stay of his radar.Also I was never role fishing ,and yes I thought someone would of killed Thoth because he was to damn annoying and ignorant.Kill me if you must but I could be very important for town

I meant to say I never said

[madmitch]

@ Sam interesting post, did you happen to notice that Pika was on the wagon then he got of then he voted for DDS, funny how after he did that Dakky killed DDS , makes you wonder doesn't it

[BuJaber]

I am inclined to believe that Ragian misunderstood his PM and went of on a tangential thought to nowhere. So I'm back to leaning town for him.

FOS list more or less the same:

Flores, MudPuppy, Pikanchion, MM.

FP'd by mitch.
I hope it isn't just a coincidence because that is an amazing catch.

Pika moves up above MP, right after flores for lynch.

[Pikanchion]

@ Sam interesting post, did you happen to notice that Pika was on the wagon then he got of then he voted for DDS, funny how after he did that Dakky killed DDS , makes you wonder doesn't it :-k

Ah, so you admit to trying to frame me that way then? ;)

[Ragian]

I am inclined to believe that Ragian misunderstood his PM and went of on a tangential thought to nowhere. So I'm back to leaning town for him.

FOS list more or less the same:

Flores, MudPuppy, Pikanchion, MM.

FP'd by mitch.
I hope it isn't just a coincidence because that is an amazing catch.

Pika moves up above MP, right after flores for lynch.

I understood my role PM perfectly. I was too thick to understand the game mechanics, though

Funny how Sam left me out. Did he leave out others?

[ZaBeast]

Dakky asking about actions does sound scummy but I think he might be on to something.

What's that if it's not role fishing?

Also you kinda said he would kill the hammer, implying he would be a bomb

I find it very strange that BuJaber and Pika are i n such a rush to hang Dakky, scum mates maybe ? Well I am not going to hammer than get killed if he is killing the hammer, so if you two think it is scummy to want to stay alive to bad,I don't trust either of you now, just trying to figure which one is scummier than I will place a vote on one of you

And what's that with FOSing dakky and rag, then saying BuJ and Pika are scum for trying to get him lynched?

Madmitch - Quite polarized against dakky in terms of arguing and I honestly can't see mitch doing that to a scumteammate. Don't think he's mafia but could be town or 3p.

I don't really see where mitch hasn't followed dakky. I'd say it's probably the opposite though. dakky did vote on him, but it could well enough have been a way to distanciate himself from mitch. mitch on the other hand hasn't built a case on D2 and had about the same positions as dakky. He did FOS dakky, but never acted on it.

fp'ed by Rag, he was just talking about those voting dakky. So he left out all the others.

[ZaBeast]

His team, however, should've noticed fairly quickly the hole dakky was digging himself into and probably at least 2 of his scummates would've jumped on the chance to grab easy town cred.

btw, what makes you so sure there's 4 scums (or more)? Skoff said scums in LoVo's games usually all had a power role, so I wouldn't be surprised if there were only 3, all with powers, given how town doesn't seem to have that many either

[FloresDelMal]

Hey since I'm dead. LoVo I can do daily vote counts for you if you want.

Okay, who used the Ouija board?

Now we are getting in the mood for hollows eve

Dakky brought a lot of scummy attention to himself. I already said how I thought it highly unlikely a scum would go for an attempt against a proven town so brazenly. Given dakky's history of stubborness i'm more inclined he just got that thought in his head and just charged forward instead of trying to sacrifice himself for a random shot. 1. His team, however, should've noticed fairly quickly the hole dakky was digging himself into and probably at least 2 of his scummates would've jumped on the chance to grab easy town cred. I think his teammates are either on his bandwagon or trying not to be noticed.2. I know there were a couple people off this wagon that were on it at some point or claimed they would vote and I think those people are not as likely on his team since there wasn't another person to easily drag a bandwagon to by that point, making their position potentially dangerous if dakky got lynched and they were seen wavering.

I think this post is quite interesting, i do agree with the first point that i highlighted in you quote, but i could like you to elaborate more on the second part, what is your logic to give a free pass to the people who could have gained town credibility by attacking dakky but didn't commit to his lynch?

Also this games revolves around the voting process, the discussion and reactions that it generates, so you might want to check on your passivity because you have just proven that you can bring interesting arguments, could be a shame to keep them to yourself

His team, however, should've noticed fairly quickly the hole dakky was digging himself into and probably at least 2 of his scummates would've jumped on the chance to grab easy town cred.

btw, what makes you so sure there's 4 scums (or more)? Skoff said scums in LoVo's games usually all had a power role, so I wouldn't be surprised if there were only 3, all with powers, given how town doesn't seem to have that many either

mmh you got a point here, i don't really have experience with LoVo's preferences on set up, but the roles we have come to see now didn't strike me as terribly powerful, but i didn't realize that Sam seems pretty confident about his knowledge of the scum team, a bit too confident for comfort, as far as i know i have never encountered an investigative role which could get as a result the size of any given faction, so the other option is to actually be part of the team, because scum not unlike masons know who they are, i do find this fishy and i could like to hear what Sam's got to say about it FOS Sam

[Samlen]

@ Sam interesting post, did you happen to notice that Pika was on the wagon then he got of then he voted for DDS, funny how after he did that Dakky killed DDS , makes you wonder doesn't it

I didn't notice that but that's definitely interesting. I remember reading someone theorizing that scum had a role cop and that was why dakky hit dds, but excluding day chat, the only way a mafia role cop could've told dakky who to hit woulda been with a mention in their first post or a vote. I had initially looked to see if anyone had mentioned dds early on the day but I either didn't find anything or forgot. This catch puts my list of candidates i wouldn't mind lynching up to 3.

Funny how Sam left me out. Did he leave out others?

Like zabeast said I was just looking at those that were voting dakky by the end of the day.

Madmitch - Quite polarized against dakky in terms of arguing and I honestly can't see mitch doing that to a scumteammate. Don't think he's mafia but could be town or 3p.

I don't really see where mitch hasn't followed dakky. I'd say it's probably the opposite though. dakky did vote on him, but it could well enough have been a way to distanciate himself from mitch. mitch on the other hand hasn't built a case on D2 and had about the same positions as dakky. He did FOS dakky, but never acted on it.

Just the vibe I got from mitch. I feel like he would've slipped more if they really were both on the same team and going after each other. I'm also really bad at reading mitch so take it with a grain of salt.

His team, however, should've noticed fairly quickly the hole dakky was digging himself into and probably at least 2 of his scummates would've jumped on the chance to grab easy town cred.

btw, what makes you so sure there's 4 scums (or more)? Skoff said scums in LoVo's games usually all had a power role, so I wouldn't be surprised if there were only 3, all with powers, given how town doesn't seem to have that many either

Just basic assumption from numbers. Besides, even if each of the roles we've seen so far have all been low-mid range power, that's normal for a mafia game with a decent amount of vanilla townies, and we haven't had an indicator that there are a decent amount of said vanilla townies. If, say, half of the town had some sort of power within the range of mason to even-night commuting, then the mafia would probably need 4 memebers with powers to have a fighting chance. Besides, a 3-man mafia where one of their powers is to get lynched? The other two would have to be quite powerful to make up for the low numbers and dakky's power being activated upon being lynched.

Dakky brought a lot of scummy attention to himself. I already said how I thought it highly unlikely a scum would go for an attempt against a proven town so brazenly. Given dakky's history of stubborness i'm more inclined he just got that thought in his head and just charged forward instead of trying to sacrifice himself for a random shot. 1. His team, however, should've noticed fairly quickly the hole dakky was digging himself into and probably at least 2 of his scummates would've jumped on the chance to grab easy town cred. I think his teammates are either on his bandwagon or trying not to be noticed.2. I know there were a couple people off this wagon that were on it at some point or claimed they would vote and I think those people are not as likely on his team since there wasn't another person to easily drag a bandwagon to by that point, making their position potentially dangerous if dakky got lynched and they were seen wavering.

I think this post is quite interesting, i do agree with the first point that i highlighted in you quote, but i could like you to elaborate more on the second part, what is your logic to give a free pass to the people who could have gained town credibility by attacking dakky but didn't commit to his lynch?

I looked at it if I were scum in the same position: Dakky was pretty obviously going to be lynched unless some large piece of evidence showed up, so attacking dakky without committing would be seen as sitting on the fence and up for scrutiny(especially if it was a player not normally on the fence). That said, I should have clarified I was giving a temporary free pass. More of a "I can't read anything significant on them yet so I will ignore them for until I can find something else"(like that catch by mitch. I usually see pika as a more confident player with their vote but ducking off and possibly showing dakky who to vote? definitely worth looking into)

His team, however, should've noticed fairly quickly the hole dakky was digging himself into and probably at least 2 of his scummates would've jumped on the chance to grab easy town cred.

btw, what makes you so sure there's 4 scums (or more)? Skoff said scums in LoVo's games usually all had a power role, so I wouldn't be surprised if there were only 3, all with powers, given how town doesn't seem to have that many either

mmh you got a point here, i don't really have experience with LoVo's preferences on set up, but the roles we have come to see now didn't strike me as terribly powerful, but i didn't realize that Sam seems pretty confident about his knowledge of the scum team, a bit too confident for comfort, as far as i know i have never encountered an investigative role which could get as a result the size of any given faction, so the other option is to actually be part of the team, because scum not unlike masons know who they are, i do find this fishy and i could like to hear what Sam's got to say about it FOS Sam

See answer in reply to zabeast^^^

[Ragian]

Right. Christ... I'll need to regroup. Not making anyone too proud this weekend.