GODFATHER MAFIA - FINALLY OVER! CORLEONES WIN!!!

[Selin]

Come on everybody! Just think a little bit clearer!

As / knew exactly what Fircoal does and his name, what can be the possibilities for / ?

1) / is a pro-town cop
2) / is a scum cop

Why should a scum cop target Fircoal revealing his identity? Why? I can't find a logical answer to that. / is even not sure about Fircoal's fraction, why should he reveal his identity as scum cop? A scum cop is too valuable to be revealed on day 1 where we started with 35 players! That would be the most stupid thing to do for scum. That's for me the main criteria and unless I get a convincing answer to that, I will assume that / is pro town cop.

A general remark for all of us:
If you try to read in too much in depth every word we use in our posts, there is a high potential danger of getting misleaded, as most of the time townies doesn't care about every single word they post. On the contrary, most of the time they are experienced scum players, who care a lot not to give a hint in their posts.

I usually use the top down approach to understand the motives behind such cases and believe me it's working much better than analyzing every word in detail.

.

[diddle]

Unvote

Selin, you seem to be pulling out all the stops to defend '/'. Is there any reason for this? Because if he turns out to be scum, then its not gonna look good for you.

[diddle]

Unvote

Selin, you seem to be pulling out all the stops to defend '/'. Is there any reason for this? Because if he turns out to be scum, then its not gonna look good for you.

EBWOP

[lord voldemort]

Come on everybody! Just think a little bit clearer!

As / knew exactly what Fircoal does and his name, what can be the possibilities for / ?

1) / is a pro-town cop
2) / is a scum cop

Why should a scum cop target Fircoal revealing his identity? Why? I can't find a logical answer to that. / is even not sure about Fircoal's fraction, why should he reveal his identity as scum cop? A scum cop is too valuable to be revealed on day 1 where we started with 35 players! That would be the most stupid thing to do for scum. That's for me the main criteria and unless I get a convincing answer to that, I will assume that / is pro town cop.

A general remark for all of us:
If you try to read in too much in depth every word we use in our posts, there is a high potential danger of getting misleaded, as most of the time townies doesn't care about every single word they post. On the contrary, most of the time they are experienced scum players, who care a lot not to give a hint in their posts.

I usually use the top down approach to understand the motives behind such cases and believe me it's working much better than analyzing every word in detail.

.

why is a scum cop too valuable....
he can establish himself early in the game as a cop and can ensue that a) he himself isnt investigated. b) doc wastes his protection on him c) everyone can think he is town.

to meta game frenchie did it perfectly in stargate mafia. he fake claimed tracker i think. ousted the godfather (he was an usurper) and then played a pro town tracker the rest of the game. scum won that game quite easily from his early claim.

[Kernal_Kronic]

Wow, i've actually got a headache from reading all of that...and i'm confused as hell

1st off unvote

Concerning the "slip" by / with the day kills, i think people are reading too much into that, the fact that people tried to turn it into a giant scum tell is suspicious.

If fir is currently a good cop who will turn bad, it shouldn't happen in the next say day or two so if he stays alive we can get some info off him & then we can lynch him at anytime.

Is there a time limit to the day?

[lord voldemort]

no limit atm

[Neutrino]

It's truly amazing the amount of general scummyness all this debate has been evoking. I think I must have picked up at least a dozen low-level scumtells in the last 20 pages.
Unfortunately, all this rampant low-level scummyness has made it rather difficult to definitively decide on a target for today.

Fircoal has been claimed against, and AD has put some decent movie-based evidence against him. However, I'm still a tad suspicious of AD for his changing interpretations of the guilt of "crooked" characters (P.S. You never really answered my question, AD. ~30 pages ago you were treating the Corleone's as town, but somehow managed to do an abrupt and unnoticed about-face on that...).

The evidence against "/" is a bit better, I think. Lynching Fircoal from "you don't trust your Captain" is a little extreme, methinks. Plus all the other stuff and he does appear a more than average target. However, I just can't escape a feeling that this is all just a huge, noobish mistake. Roleclaiming on Day 1, without any pressure whatsoever, and without any real evidence really doesn't strike me as a wise move for scum to make. Of course, noobishness isn't solely confined to the town...

As a provisional vote Vote: "/". Not 100% sure on that, and it is liable to change with the addition of further information, but he does seem like the best target for now.

[Selin]

Unvote

Selin, you seem to be pulling out all the stops to defend '/'. Is there any reason for this? Because if he turns out to be scum, then its not gonna look good for you.

I know this and I'm well aware of the risks of pushing hard, but I can't just sit and wait fearing it may look like me and / are aligned or I won't be looking goood, if... and and and...

I try to make logical assumptions in order to come to conclusions. We have a lot of inactive or less active players, being passive won't help us. This way, at least we will have some issues to discuss.

.

[diddle]

Unvote

Selin, you seem to be pulling out all the stops to defend '/'. Is there any reason for this? Because if he turns out to be scum, then its not gonna look good for you.

I know this and I'm well aware of the risks of pushing hard, but I can't just sit and wait fearing it may look like me and / are aligned or I won't be looking goood, if... and and and...

I try to make logical assumptions in order to come to conclusions. We have a lot of inactive or less active players, being passive won't help us. This way, at least we will have some issues to discuss.

.

I know what you mean, you're in an unfortunate situation. If "/" does turn out scum, you will be the prime suspect. You've made your points, be be careful not to argue for him. He seems capable enough to do that himself.

[LSU Tiger Josh]

I have stated it before and will state it again. This early in a game it isn't worth killing the two "claimed" cops. Sooner or later one of the scum groups will most likely hit them or they will get daykilled. As such, why don't we try to use them as much as we can. If they refuse to give us info that is helping us aka clearing someone or getting someone as scum then we can lynch them. Besides the fact that upon their death we should be able to find out what type of cop if any they were.

[kalishnikov]

.....

We should get a lynch today, don't mistake my words, I just really don't think it should be Fir so no vote from me there.

Unvote, vote: Selin, one of the smarter players I've ever played this game with. I'd say that you're playing the perfect scum at the moment.

I just quoted you, because I liked the blue bolded part so much.

I read it many times with a smile on my face. Thanks for making me happy.

.

No problem, and I speak the truth. When you're around you've always got good theories/contributions that are usually spot-on.

[kalishnikov]

I don't have a name to my role, I'm just "Inquisitive deputy".

/, if you're a deputy, wouldn't that mean you don't have any investigations unless the cop above you dies? The fact that you're "inquisitvie" would explain how you knew who Fircoal is, but you say you can investigate Fircoal during night 1, but how can you do that if you're a deputy?

Also /, or anyone else who may know, how experienced are you in playing mafia games?

I know for sure he's played at least a few other games and I'm currently in 2 or 3 ongoing one's with /. Just answering the question, dunno if that helps or not.

[MountainLion]

I know what you mean, you're in an unfortunate situation. If "/" does turn out scum, you will be the prime suspect. You've made your points, be be careful not to argue for him. He seems capable enough to do that himself.

I don't think that's entirely fair, diddle. Selin is stating his opinion on this whole situation, and he's not the only one who thinks / is likely town. I, for one agree. Why would you put a single target on Selin? and I suppose now that I'm "defending Selin," you will make me a "prime target" as well?

In past games I've decided for myself and stated in the game that I thought there were situations where if this person comes up town or scum, then this other person must be town or scum, but I'm realizing that's not always the case.

Anyway, your statement quoted above sounds scummy to me as it sounds you're making a very concrete decision, when if you were truly town, you can't really assume anything.

FOS diddle

This day will never end if we can't either decide on this whole / and Fircoal situation, or move to another direction. It would seem another direction is unlikely. Let's get a vote count and try to get everyone to state some kind of opinion on this.

[kalishnikov]

I have stated it before and will state it again. This early in a game it isn't worth killing the two "claimed" cops. Sooner or later one of the scum groups will most likely hit them or they will get daykilled. As such, why don't we try to use them as much as we can. If they refuse to give us info that is helping us aka clearing someone or getting someone as scum then we can lynch them. Besides the fact that upon their death we should be able to find out what type of cop if any they were.

Unvote

EXACTLY. I tried arguing this point for something like 30 pages and no one cared so I gave up and joined the stupid bandwagon but I lack conviction so I'm out.

But, in my opinion, this is the only theory (along with Selin's) that make any sense, relevant to the Fir/'/' situation, but I've given up saying my piece on that.

At this point I just want to see this day end, granted it has been productive and we've gotten a number of superb leads/scummy details out of it but anything more then what we already have would be almost too much. There are so many things that need worked out and looked at that if we keep this going to long the info will be a waste because by the time we check out our leads things will have changed/people will have died.

Fir is not out best option for a lynch today, neither is /. These 2 will 'take care of themselves' as already pointed out and I don't wanna lynch a town cop day 1; do you, scum?

We have so many good choice for a lynch tonight, why not chose one that's not Fir or / and see what they give us tomorrow?

[diddle]

Unfortunately, I'm speaking from experience. If I've ever taken to arguing someone else point, I've often been dragged down with them. Its the way it works here. I was just giving some friendly advice...

[wicked]

I like Kalish's proposal. So Ice was on the chopping block (I think, is this the right game?), but said something cryptic about being unlynchable. Do we have any other leads?

[LSU Tiger Josh]

I for one would be willing to test out his hint at being unlynchable b/c he sure isn't helping in any fashion.

[rebelman]

unvote vote ice

i think this is my third/fourth time moving my vote back onto ice like kal i too said 30 or so pages ago i think killingeither cop on day 1 is bad news - the odds on it being a townie cop that's killed are very high, the case aganst ice is weak but as i think it was selin pointed at least 20 of us have sounded somewhat scummy at this stage - actually you could probably find a convincing argument over the last 60 pages that any one of the 30 odd players is scummy !! as i have said several times the case against ice is weak but if we leave the cops alone as i think we should he is the best of a bad bunch.

[wicked]

Well we're already at 60 pages. And while talking is good for the town, I'd hate to ramp up the votes on Ice, then have him be unlynchable and be back to square 1. Don't read into this as me protecting him... I voted him earlier. I just don't want to keep going in circles.

[MountainLion]

I don't remember anything about Ice saying he was unlynchable...where was that?

If he is, then I suggest we go with someone who's voted /, because to me he seems more likely town than Fircoal. I'll have to look back...

[wicked]

I don't remember anything about Ice saying he was unlynchable...where was that?

If he is, then I suggest we go with someone who's voted /, because to me he seems more likely town than Fircoal. I'll have to look back...

Well how about we ask him. IceIceBaby... you hinted at being unlynchable.. are you?

And I think the opposite ML... / appears FAR more scummy than fircola at this point, just based on their actions and not reading anything into names (since Nag specifically warned against this).

[MountainLion]

Coming back to Fircoal's issue:

Following Ga7's logic I now agree not to lynch him. If he is pro town on day 1 (I'm sure that he will work for Solozzo's later in the game, if he is not already working for them) he will be the target of mafia anyway tonight. Don't forget that Fircoal's character working for Sollozzo is also a big thread to carleone's, so he will be for sure the target of carloene family. Carleone's won't risk to leave him alive, otherwise he may share some valuable information with solozzo's after his investigation tonight.

So, why should we waste our day 1 lynch, even if Fircoal is already working for a mafia family. Let the other mafia family kill him.

Any other ideas?

.

This post really made me think that Selin is scum. He's basically saying that fricoal is in his scum group so we shouldn't worry about lynching scum. this post reeks of evil intentions so:

unvote vote selin

This is QUITE a stretch for a vote, gimpy. Plus you say it "reeks of evil intentions" which I don't see at all...that is too strong to say. Could you be skimming in the sense that you didn't bother to find stronger evidence on anyone?

Does anyone else agree?

[Selin]

Coming back to Fircoal's issue:

Following Ga7's logic I now agree not to lynch him. If he is pro town on day 1 (I'm sure that he will work for Solozzo's later in the game, if he is not already working for them) he will be the target of mafia anyway tonight. Don't forget that Fircoal's character working for Sollozzo is also a big thread to carleone's, so he will be for sure the target of carloene family. Carleone's won't risk to leave him alive, otherwise he may share some valuable information with solozzo's after his investigation tonight.

So, why should we waste our day 1 lynch, even if Fircoal is already working for a mafia family. Let the other mafia family kill him.

Any other ideas?

.

This post really made me think that Selin is scum. He's basically saying that fricoal is in his scum group so we shouldn't worry about lynching scum. this post reeks of evil intentions so:

unvote vote selin

This is QUITE a stretch for a vote, gimpy. Plus you say it "reeks of evil intentions" which I don't see at all...that is too strong to say. Could you be skimming in the sense that you didn't bother to find stronger evidence on anyone?

Does anyone else agree?

me

.

[Anarkistsdream]

Fircoal has been claimed against, and AD has put some decent movie-based evidence against him. However, I'm still a tad suspicious of AD for his changing interpretations of the guilt of "crooked" characters (P.S. You never really answered my question, AD. ~30 pages ago you were treating the Corleone's as town, but somehow managed to do an abrupt and unnoticed about-face on that...).

Actually, I have clarified my reasoning for that repeatedly.

I said that not all of the Corleones were scum. Not even all of them were part of the 'mafia' that the Corleones had. Look at many of the characters, such as Appalonia and Michael's wife, played by Diane Keaton. They both have a Corleone name, but aren't necessarily scum. The same with the children. Some grew up rotten and some grew up to be honest, hard-working townsfolk. As we already know that there are kids in this game, we know that they have Corleone names. But are they scum? Not all, I guarantee.

Admittedly, all of my assumptions are based on the number of times I have seen the movies, and Nag may have changed things. But I highly doubt he changed things like McClusky being a crooked cop or the fact that not everyone in the Corleones was evil.

[Anarkistsdream]

Also, where has Fircoal gone since this whole thing has started? He has been AWFULLY quiet after saying he was McClusky but he was town. Then... *poof*

So, why is he not here? Makes me even more suspicious.

Several people have managed to submarine or not contribute much at all, too. In a game as big as this, it is easy to disappear for awhile, and that in iteself is dangerous.

1. GimpyTheWonder
2. Fircoal
7. The1Exile
15. Skoffin
16. Spurgistan
22. Clive
30. Militant
34. Dustn x