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And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby joecoolfrog on Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:08 am

jay_a2j wrote:
Juan_Bottom wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:Aaaah, that makes two annoyances that I no longer have to tolerate. =D>


How come you're on-line now Jay? Don't you have to sell dope to some inmates :lol:? Or do you work a later shift? My experiences in county tell me you should be on morning walk right now.




I don't sell drugs to inmates. (or anyone else for that matter) I have the day off. I found some interesting info. online last night and was up far past the sun reading up on the info.


I dont know why you get so excited by your imaginary next life,clearly you are having a great time here and now :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby jay_a2j on Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:32 am

I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.
THE DEBATE IS OVER...
PLAYER57832 wrote:Too many of those who claim they don't believe global warming are really "end-timer" Christians.

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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby jonesthecurl on Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:49 am

jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


More people listen to Player. Effin ell, YOU get more attention than that guy.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby jay_a2j on Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:52 am

jonesthecurl wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


More people listen to Player. Effin ell, YOU get more attention than that guy.



More people listen to David Letterman, your point? :P
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PLAYER57832 wrote:Too many of those who claim they don't believe global warming are really "end-timer" Christians.

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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby InkL0sed on Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:55 am

jay_a2j wrote:
jonesthecurl wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


More people listen to Player. Effin ell, YOU get more attention than that guy.



More people listen to David Letterman, your point? :P


David Letterman is cool.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby InkL0sed on Wed Jul 30, 2008 10:57 am

jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


Funny, I thought of you. And I know exactly why...
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby jay_a2j on Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:14 am

InkL0sed wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


Funny, I thought of you. And I know exactly why...



Yeah there was some similarity there, with the facts he was presenting and all. ;)
THE DEBATE IS OVER...
PLAYER57832 wrote:Too many of those who claim they don't believe global warming are really "end-timer" Christians.

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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby jonesthecurl on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:15 pm

At one point, he claims that God designed the horse so that Man could sit on it.
Does he not know about the centuries of selective breeding by man to make a variety of horses fit a number of purposes? just like dogs?
You might as well say that God designed the bicycle.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby InkL0sed on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:18 pm

jonesthecurl wrote:At one point, he claims that God designed the horse so that Man could sit on it.
Does he not know about the centuries of selective breeding by man to make a variety of horses fit a number of purposes? just like dogs?
You might as well say that God designed the bicycle.


It's the same thing with bananas.

And with all the fruit we eat for that matter.

And a lot of things, for that matter.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby Backglass on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:22 pm

InkL0sed wrote:It's the same thing with bananas.


Wait...is this the "Bananas were designed by gods for mens hands" loony?

If so...I still wonder if he eats Pineapples.

Obviously a satanic fruit by his logic. :lol:
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby hecter on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:28 pm

jay_a2j wrote:
InkL0sed wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


Funny, I thought of you. And I know exactly why...



Yeah there was some similarity there, with the facts he was presenting and all. ;)

Those weren't facts.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=UIijwkaqKzY
This guy talks about creationism and transitional fossils.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby InkL0sed on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:31 pm

hecter wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:
InkL0sed wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


Funny, I thought of you. And I know exactly why...



Yeah there was some similarity there, with the facts he was presenting and all. ;)

Those weren't facts.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=UIijwkaqKzY
This guy talks about creationism and transitional fossils.


I can barely understand that guy's accent...
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby PLAYER57832 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:36 pm

hecter wrote:
Iliad wrote:
Can someone help me out here? When was hte last time jay's type of thinking stagnated culture for a long amount and science did not progress and actually decreased?

Dark ages, also known as the middle ages. Bubonic plague, art taking massive steps backwards, scientists being heathens for going against gods will, book burnings, the usual.


Ironically, if you went to the time of Christ, the Jews and Christians of the day were much more liberal in that regard. They did not believe they understood precisely how God created the universe, for the most part. They just knew God did it ... and that was the important issue.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby hecter on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:39 pm

InkL0sed wrote:
hecter wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:
InkL0sed wrote:
jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


Funny, I thought of you. And I know exactly why...



Yeah there was some similarity there, with the facts he was presenting and all. ;)

Those weren't facts.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=UIijwkaqKzY
This guy talks about creationism and transitional fossils.


I can barely understand that guy's accent...

Bet he still makes more sense then the guy in jay's video though, doesn't he?
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby Backglass on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:41 pm

The Creationist Scientific Process.

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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby InkL0sed on Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:45 pm

hecter wrote:Bet he still makes more sense then the guy in jay's video though, doesn't he?


I automatically assume anybody with a thick accent is a lunatic.


And yet he still seemed to make more sense than jay.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby joecoolfrog on Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:00 pm

It seems a crying shame that all these loonies are wasting valuable time and resources making and watching these rather silly amatuer videos ( charity work would be a good alternative) when God could presumeably prove his existence in one second flat if he wanted. Oh I know all the excuses trotted out as to why he doesnt but so why dont his disciples get the message and spend their time on something productive, if they are trying to earn brownie pounts then they are making a horse's arse of the job thats for sure :lol:

Scene from an Italian restaurant;

Customer; '' A bottle of Chianti, some breadsticks and a video camera please.''
Waiter; '' What you wanna make some more God exists and this proves it videos ''
Customer ; " well gotta take the pressure off da man, hes been busy the last 2000 years ( :^o "
Waiter ; '' Yeh and I heard he had a cold back in the Middle Ages, you want the clams or the meatballs ? ''
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby jonesthecurl on Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:00 pm


I can barely understand that guy's accent...

Bet he still makes more sense then the guy in jay's video though, doesn't he?[/quote]

My daughter's gerbil makes more sense than the guy in the video and jay added together.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby PLAYER57832 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:47 pm

jay_a2j wrote:I don't know why, but when I saw this video CLICK HERE I thought of PLAYER.


Maybe because he goes far to prove MY POINTS and not yours?

Specifically, you can have what opinion you wish about Genesis.    You can deny that ancient Jews thought like I do or simply claim they were wrong, but to  say that this video somehow supports Creationism in an intelligent way means either you did not view it or (more likely) you continue to ignore anything to do with REAL evolutionary theory.

To begin, his whole approach is idiotic.  That is, he states, basically, that evolution is a theory .... therefore you should believe Creation.Come on!  These are three differant issues.   Evolution is a theory and it is quite likely that we will never be able to 100% prove each and every aspect of evolution. BUT, saying that you don't have 100% solid proof (and may never) is QUITE differant from saying that Evolution has no evidence to support it .  That, in turn is QUITE differant from saying you actually HAVE EVIDENCE to disprove it.  PROVING that your view of Creationism is correct is yet another issue.So, yes, the first is true ... NO ONE denys that. Evolution IS a theory. 

The second statement he made, though, is FALSE.  There IS lots of evidence supporting Evolution, which is why so very many scientists believe it, INCLUDING CHRISTAN who are SCIENTISTS.  Despite what the Creation Institute would like you to believe (and yes, even a few athiests here), Science is not out to disprove Christianity. Individuals certain try ... and fail.   BUT, far more scientists see their work as confirming God's majesty and wonder. 

 SPECIFICALLY, that guy's  statement that transitional fossils do not exist is JUST PLAIN FALSE.  They DO exist .. .MANY OF THEM.  There are gaps, yes, but they are NOT everywhere.    More transitional fossils are found every day.   In many cases, these transitional fossils told us that original ideas of how species evolved were wrong.  That modifies the exact way we see Evolution as occuring, BUT IT DOES NOT DISPROVE THE WHOLE IDEA OF EVOLUTION. 

The most recent examples are fossils that bridge the transition for dinosaur to birds  OR, more correctly certain dinosaurs.   Even so, that particular is not 100% complete, BUT in many other instances ... particularly fish (which is MY FIELD OF EXPERTISE) they are fully evident.  This is not cooincidental since sandstone, where many fossils (not all, but a large number) tends to form in areas covered in water.    (and NOTE: the process by which sandstone is formed is FACT it can even be replicated in a laboratory).

It is also no wonder that so many fossils are missing when you look at what has actually happened geologically.  That video did not address the geologic layers issue, but Creation "scientists"  like to say that these layers do not exist, that there is no proof of this.  First, you can go to the San Andreas Fault and see the shifts ... as well as many other places in CA.  That is, shifts that have occured in our lifetimes.  Then you compare what happens there to what has happened in near history and you begin to see very clear patterns.   The deeper you go, the more complex.  In the Marble Mountains, it is very, very complex (there is a Book, The Klamath Knot not really a science book, but a decent and relatively easy to understand explanation).   In some cases, they confirmed that certain rock layers now seperated (say on opposit sides of a valley  or mountain) have the exact same chemical composition.   That is, they were once part of the same formation.   

Contrast this with what would have happened had all these fossils been disbursed in Noah's flood (to name another popular Creationist idea ...though I don't know if you believe that one or not) and you see that the patterns of placement and so forth are very, very differant.  That is, some fossiles WERE spread by small floods .. particularly associated with rivers and such.  BUT not all!   AND we know this because we KNOW what happens in floods ... even very large floods, in modern times.   In fact, there IS evidence of post glaciation flooding in the central US and other areas.   BUT, this is just not the entire picture.   AND, those floods occured over long stretches of time for differant reasons.

Let me clarify, I absolutely believe Noah's flood happened ... but the "proof" the Creation Science Institute puts forward is just plain baloney.

AGAIN, all I ask is that you actually read what REAL EVOLUTIONARY theory actually says.  Because you just make yourself look like an idiot when you persist in putting forward these completely off base assertions.  If you don't wish to believe ... fine.  Go out and disprove it!   BUT, know what you are trying to disprove, don't waste your time with the garbage the Institute for Creation Science puts out ... it is NOT REAL!  (it is possible they might accidently insert some real truth ... but all I have ever seen are distortions, misunderstandings and plain outright lies!)

Think about it.   Transition fossils DO exit!   Geologic layers DO Exist!  There IS lots of evidence supporting Evolution and there is absolute proof that evolution (small e .. that is the general process of things changing over time, rather than the specific theory).   These things ARE facts!  WHY WOULD THE CREATION SCIENCE INSTITUTE LIE?  

They HAVE ... check the facts yourself and you will SEE their lies!  They tell you not to because they don't want you to get the real information

Contrast that with the rest of us. WE don't object to our kids hearing about Creationism theories.   BUT, we DO object to their being told that these things are true, when they are not ... and DENIED the chance to learn real Evolutionary theory AND the evidence that supports it!

Understand, there absolutely ARE individual scientists who think that science IS out to disprove God.  There are athiests, as you have seen here, who will roundly proclaim that science proves God can't exist, etc.  BUT, there are far, far more scientists who believe that science confirms God's existance and creation.   It is a belief, it is not something that can be proven through science, (yet  ;) ).  

In one small issue, I did partially agree with the video guy.  I certainly see evidence of a creator, as do many scientists, in the sheer majesty of his creation. I don't see it in comparing a banana to a bottle, but I do see it when I look at the flowers in my garden, my children, or even strands of DNA. We scientists who are Christian see much "confirmation" (that is, it convinces us we are correct, but we don't confuse it with empirical scientific evidence) that God created it all. We just don't presume to limit him to 7 revolutions of our earth.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby Backglass on Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:04 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:AGAIN, all I ask is that you actually read what REAL EVOLUTIONARY theory actually says. Because you just make yourself look like an idiot when you persist in putting forward these completely off base assertions. If you don't wish to believe ... fine. Go out and disprove it! BUT, know what you are trying to disprove, don't waste your time with the garbage the Institute for Creation Science puts out ... it is NOT REAL! (it is possible they might accidently insert some real truth ... but all I have ever seen are distortions, misunderstandings and plain outright lies!)


You mean like this? :lol:

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Good Luck. We have been saying these very things to Jay for years, but he just puts his fingers in his ears and prays louder to drown out the logic. #-o

His house of cards is very fragile. Admitting to Evolution would cause it all to come tumbling down.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby PLAYER57832 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:18 pm

The trouble is that his ideas are being allowed to pervade our schools, because not enough people know enough about science or care enough to stand up to them .... and, I have to say, too often those who do get into the "God doesn't exist" ..."Oh yes he does" argument, which is completly counter productive.

Notice how quickly he by passes my claims to Christianity or denies knowing how many Christian churches support Evolution? He has been taught that folks like I are just minor aborrations, that the real force behind Evolution are the athiests. Historically, though it is the Judeo Christians who have truly been the greatest supporters of Evolution. Granted, some athiests agree, but among other issues, the numbers of Jews and Christians in and outside the scientific community have far outnumbered athiests.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby Backglass on Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:29 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:The trouble is that his ideas are being allowed to pervade our schools, because not enough people know enough about science or care enough to stand up to them .... and, I have to say, too often those who do get into the "God doesn't exist" ..."Oh yes he does" argument, which is completly counter productive.


Player57832.

Do me (and you) a favor and go to THIS SITE and listen to the PodCast at the top by Robert Krulwich. He recently gave the commencement speech at CalTech about the very topic you hit on...how to explain Science to the average Joe. He specifically talks to the young scientists in the crowd. I know you will love it.

FYI...if any of you are into listening to Podcasts, the Radio Lab series is top notch.
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby PLAYER57832 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:37 pm

jay_a2j wrote:... this sick world? I give Him props for having patience. Because man keeps on trying to figure out how we got here. (because as we all know God doesn't exist and could not have anything to do with it)[/url]


Persist in saying that only non Christians believe in Evolution and you persist in showing your absolute ignorance of the world around you and what people really think. (and trying to claim that a CC poll in a Fundamentalist Christian specific forum ... would have been quite humerous if it were not so obvious you actually thought you were proving something :roll: )


BUT, here is the thing. The churches are in decline, but not because of science. They are in decline because they have not done enough to meet people's needs. AND because we have been too complacent in allowing extremists such as you persist in putting forward your ideas as "real Christianity".

Christ proclaims truth. The proclaimers of lies are not representatives of Christ. I am not lying, those telling you there IS evidence for evolution are not lying. BUT Creationists insist on proclaiming that we are. They do NOT REFUTE the evidence, they DENY it. THAT is the problem. NOTE, we Evolutionists (that is, the scientists ... some in the "public" may well say so incorrectly) never say Evolution is completely proven, just that there exists evidence that is extremely hard to refute. WE also point out again and again and again that EVERYTHING put forward by Creation "scientists" is incorrect. BUT, as was pointed out in the response video posted right after yours you said reminded you of me, instead of honest rebuttal, they either make claims that boil down to saying "there is no proof, so that means it did not happen" (very false logic ... lack of proof proves NOTHING); change the definitions (by claiming, for example, that to be a transitional fossil, you have to see vestigile parts and so forth); by claiming that there "should" be more evidence if something happened (the general lack of fossils, for example, but the process of creating fossils only happens very rarely and under certain conditions. Most remains are simply destroyed. OR by plain mistating or misunderstanding theories, facts. (such as claims that because our appendix is now considered useful that means evolution did not happen)
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby mandalorian2298 on Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:53 pm

joecoolfrog wrote:It seems a crying shame that all these loonies are wasting valuable time and resources making and watching these rather silly amatuer videos ( charity work would be a good alternative) when God could presumeably prove his existence in one second flat if he wanted. Oh I know all the excuses trotted out as to why he doesnt but so why dont his disciples get the message and spend their time on something productive, if they are trying to earn brownie pounts then they are making a horse's arse of the job thats for sure :lol:

Scene from an Italian restaurant;

Customer; '' A bottle of Chianti, some breadsticks and a video camera please.''
Waiter; '' What you wanna make some more God exists and this proves it videos ''
Customer ; " well gotta take the pressure off da man, hes been busy the last 2000 years ( :^o "
Waiter ; '' Yeh and I heard he had a cold back in the Middle Ages, you want the clams or the meatballs ? ''


:lol:
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Re: And you wonder why God is going to destroy.....

Postby Gregrios on Wed Jul 30, 2008 3:25 pm

Isn't the basis for evolution that we evolved from apes or is that just the watered down version? :D

....because I've heard that some experts can tie together both evolution and creation into one theory. I fail to see how this is possible. Do you? :shock:
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