Classic alternatives discussion/suggestions

[premio53]

If Kaplowitz gave his permission would anyone be interested in working on and imprving this map? To me it has the same feel as the original Classic but with more territories. I really don't think there would by any copyright issues here.

unfortunately the additional locations were used by hasbro as optional extras on the computer game Risk II

But could it not be revised to the point that there would be no problems?

[3mp3r0r]

tbh i dont know -you'd need to wait for mrbenn or someone to tell ya that

[jiminski]

Click image to enlarge.

This is a map of the world where each countries size is represented by the number of emigrants that leave that country. The World Bank has released a major report on the effects of migration on developing economies.

[delahoc]

This is a map of the world where each countries size is represented by the number of emigrants that leave that country. The World Bank has released a major report on the effects of migration on developing economies.

I notice that Australia is almost non-existent in that map! We're so good no one wants to leave here!

[jiminski]

This is a map of the world where each countries size is represented by the number of emigrants that leave that country. The World Bank has released a major report on the effects of migration on developing economies.

I notice that Australia is almost non-existent in that map! We're so good no one wants to leave here!

it's true, i noticed the same with GB too .. i found that very surprising.

[mightyleemoon]

why not just swap country names about?

like all of australian countries swap with SA countries; peru becomes eastern australia, and that sort of thing

Or we could really screw up the names of the countries like this map:

Click image to enlarge.

Holy crap that is awesome!

I'd play that!

[jiminski]

Given the choice between that and the other 2 atrocities we have masquerading as Classic!? Every single one of us, perhaps with the exception of the odd contrary-toss-pot, would go for that!

[ignatious]

why not just swap country names about?

like all of australian countries swap with SA countries; peru becomes eastern australia, and that sort of thing

Or we could really screw up the names of the countries like this map:

Click image to enlarge.

This is a clever idea. Although we should be able to keep the amount of territories and borders the same as they were (they are currently the same on the revised classic map).

[SuicidalSnowman]

3mp3r0r, if you named the territories on that map, you, sir, are a genius.

[DaGip]

I know jimi is calling the present "classic" maps atrocities, I would like to beg to differ. At first I was appalled, and was even banned that day from the forums because I was so pissed about the change; but after I simmered down (thanks to Twill's little "Ban the DaGip" finger) I am actually starting to grow quite fond of the simple map that is masquerading around as our now new "classic" map.

Keep in mind that you can change the countries around and add attacking positions and so on and so forth, but the point is that none of those maps will suffice to replace the original "classic" style map. The "Lucky Charms" doppelganger is the closest that we have come to really capturing the true movement of the "classic" map.

I like the previous idea (I don't remember who came up with it) to include a map overlay option for the "classic" style map, so that we can choose individually what our "classic" map will look like. You can keep the A10 and E4's...you don't even have to name the country's! Surely having a "virtual" map that can be changed to fit personal preferences wouldn't be stepping on any copyrighting toes.

You could do the same thing with Center Scape as well.

I am for the idea of having optional overlay's that the players can choose on their classic style games.

[mpjh]

Yes, I think that is a good idea. I have tried to create and example of two, but I don't have the necessary skill with illustrator. I will keep trying.

[w3a2]

my 2 cents on this whole stupid classic map saga:

1. the word 'CLASSIC' refers to something pre-existing that we want to resemble - so let's drop it and call it EARTH or WORLD 1
2. it needs to be a layout similar to EARTH - silly shapes and battleship codes are great for an interim solution, and the artists one is a little better, but i'll be damned if i'm attacking Pollock from Ernst or A10-A12.
3. new names of territories and continents or whatever they are called now (zones and regions?) need to be sensible enough so you know where you are attacking easily to and from. (sorry, 'assaulting'). same goes for fort... reinforcements. Why? because moving names around so it doesn't resemble the world, or stretching and distorting and making up names is only making it look stupid, and when it looks stupid it plays stupid. anyone who disagrees is either lying or retarded.
(edit: I meant to add, the map on the firs page is perfect if we adjusted the country names to, for example, nearest CAPITAL CITY NAMES,)
4. i only joined this site to play a 'RISK' styled game online and i wanted the Classic map. these other maps which are interesting and abstract might be fun to make and discuss but i see no appeal to them. I may be delusional (see point 3), but i would expect that the greater population of players here want and love classic as it was.
5. All lists have 5 items.

until I see a decent, world-resembling map, I am going to boycott classic and play something else like Alexander or Ancient Greece.

I honestly hope common sense prevails, but we all know that Hope Floats, and so does shit.

-------------------EDIT---------------------------
HERE'S A ROUGH GO AT NEW PLACE NAMES BASED ON EITHER CAPITAL, OR LARGEST CITY:
NTH AMERICA:

ALASKA JUNEAU
NORTHWEST TERRITORY YELLOWKNIFE
GREENLAND NUUK
ALBERTA CALGARY
ONTARIO TORONTO
QUEBEC MONTREAL
WESTERN US LOS ANGELES
EASTERN US NEW YORK
CENTRAL AMERICA MEXICO, OR MEXICO CITY

STH AMERICA:

VENEZUELA CARACAS
BRAZIL BRASILIA, SAO PAULO, OR RIO DE JANERO
PERU LIMA
ARGENTINA BUENOS AIRES

EUROPE:

ICELAND REYKJAVIK
GREAT BRITAIN LONDON
SCANDINAVIA OSLO, STOCKHOLM, COPENHAGEN, OR HELSINKI
UKRAINE KIEV
WESTERN EUROPE PARIS?
NORTHERN EUROPE MOSCOW?
SOUTHERN EUROPE ROME?

AFRICA:

NORTH AFRICA
EGYPT CAIRO
CONGO
EAST AFRICA
SOUTH AFRICA JOHANNESBURG
MADAGASCAR

ASIA:

URAL
SIBERIA
YAKUTSK
KAMCHATKA
AFGHANISTAN KABUL
MONGOLIA
IRKUTSK
MIDDLE EAST JERUSALEM?
INDIA NEW DHELI, OR MUMBAI
CHINA BEIJING
SIAM

OCEANIA:

INDONESIA JAKARTA
NEW GUINEA PORT MORESBY
WESTERN AUSTRALIA PERTH
EASTERN AUSTRALIA SYDNEY
-------------END----EDIT-------------------------

also,

Given the choice between that and the other 2 atrocities we have masquerading as Classic!? Every single one of us, perhaps with the exception of the odd contrary-toss-pot, would go for that!

Hey, that's me!

[DaGip]

Okay, listen very, very closely:

CC can not use a global map for their "Classic" map because it resembles the original "Risk" board (go get a "Risk" game board and pull up CC "Classic" and compare...there is no difference between the two, other than board color and some helicopters and jet planes). However, it seems that CC can still maintain the basic strategic attacking points, as long as there is NO global map to convey any similarity to the original "Risk board, in which you have stashed away in your closet.

The absolute best that CC can do, because of this quite flagrant copyright issue, is to make maps that do not convey the similarity of playing on an actual "Risk" board; in addition, to satisfy the CC members who want to be able to play strategically the same as on an actual "Risk" board game, CC was forced to come up with the current "Lucky Charms" version.

You can go ahead and make other global maps with different names and attacking points, but those will not ever be the "Classic" map. They will be in their own right, their own style of map, and therefore considered a NEW MAP and not the "Classic" map.

This is my basic understanding of what is taking place, and I would not get my hopes up for a return of a global map using the same attacking points as what "Risk" and CC "Classic"have or had...even if you changed the names of all the countries, the similarity would still be there, and therefore threaten the integrity of "Risk".

CC offers more variety than just the "Classic" map, so I am comfortable with the present solution that Lack had to undertake (albeit a little suddenly unloaded upon the community).

Eventually, we as a community will have to begin to accept this change and move along. I don't plan on giving up my premium yet, as there are lots of real cool maps to choose from. I must say that out of all the "Risk" style sites (including online "Risk" itself), this site rules all! It is well put together and deserving of more praise than what is being given at the moment.

Don't you all remember the feeling of wanting to play a good game of "Risk" with some friends, just like the good ol' days in college? Don't you remember trying online "Risk" and saying to yourself,"Man, this really sucks big fat donkey dicks!"? And then while surfing the net, or an old friend from a long time ago, hooks you to this site and you read the intro, and you see that you can play for free and you do? Then you realize how addicted you are to this freakin' game site that you decide to pay the premium, and after that you are in "Risk" style heaven (or hell)?

After much thought over this issue, I have decided that Conquer Club is much more than just one or two maps (heck, I hardly play that many games anymore, I am mostly hooked onto the forums to the dismay of many a CC poster and mod) and I am willing to just forget about the whole "Classic" global map issue. I am 100% okay with the "Lucky Charms" version as long as CC doesn't have to close down their site.

Let's just knock off the rant about "how sucky the classic map is now" bs. It is all water under the bridge. Now we need to focus on how we can make this site even better. What ideas do we need? What types of global maps are needed to fill the "Classic" void, but yet remain their own map?

The community isn't divided, in my opinion, it is pulling together out of the chaos of what happened last week; and I only see good things for this site in the future. I see pages and pages of new, brilliant maps being created by new map makers that have heard the call for something new over this whole issue.

I would say instead of berating the site and threatening CC with boycotts, you should instead find that creative little mapmaker inside all of us and begin the creative process to really make Conquer Club that one place that even "Online Risk" cannot--nor ever can--compete with!

[Snively_Sneed]

3 Words....

SURFACE OF MARS

It's been made very clear that a global map of the Earth is out of the question... Nowhere has it been been put out of the question that a global map of Mars could be used...

If we use the topography of Mars, keep the same number of territories, and the same attack routes, I really don't see how the gameplay would change...

Additionally, I can't imagine Hasbro getting all pissy about a map of Mars... And I have never in my existence seen a board game using the Martian surface as it's playing field...

[mpjh]

good idea. Infact each of the old territories could be a different planet with features of that planet as the sub-territories.

[oaktown]

The community isn't divided, in my opinion, it is pulling together out of the chaos of what happened last week; and I only see good things for this site in the future. I see pages and pages of new, brilliant maps being created by new map makers that have heard the call for something new over this whole issue.

It's nice to see that somebody has this outlook on the situation, DaGip. I have found the reaction to the pulling of Classic to be, on the whole, pretty constructive. Nobody is happy about the situation, but I think that the majority of CC users realize that it doesn't have to be the end of the site.

This thread - and others - have come up with some very good ideas. The question still remains: what can we do, and what can't we do? Until we know the answer all of this talk is just conjecture, as folks make educated - but uninformed - guesses about what kind of maps we can get away with making. At some point the dust will settle and we will be given some concrete guidance as to what kind of classic-style map we can creat, but until then we can and should continue to play games and make new and inventive maps.

[w3a2]

DaGip are you referring to me in your post? Because I don't want new big bright maps. I want Classic, and a couple of others that are easy to use, look good and are uncomplicated.

[gannable]

what about one similar to the Classic Art map but with great rock n roll bands?
i'll pick the bands if someone designs the map

[blue sam3]

Take a look at my '1984 - George Orwell' map in the Drafting room, as that's a fictional version of the world, something along those lines may escape copyright.

[jiminski]

OK i had an idea!

So imagine the below image filled up with the avatars of notable figures in the community. the Map behind would obviously be deleted once all attacking areas have been filled by a replacement avatar picture:





So for example we have Lackistan in the centre there, Jeff over in the far North East.
In South America we have SergentBeana and Tiltilia.
In North America we have .. Twill and neighbour Clappecois . (Twills name reamins unchanged as a mark of respect.. and so the gamelog can say: "Jiminski assaulted Twill ..." )

anyway, i left it unfinished in case others had some interesting and loosely linked reasons for certain members (past or present) taking one of the remaining territories.

(also other thoughts were perhaps Delia as Kumchatya! and NorseWest Territory edit now included)
(further edit: United Jimdom)

[mandyb]

OK i had an idea!

So imagine the below image filled up with the avatars of notable figures in the community. the Map behind would obviously be deleted once all attacking areas have be filled by a replacement avatar picture:





So for example we have Lackistan in the centre there, Jeff over in the far North East.
In South America we have SergentBeanor and Tiltilia.
In North America we have .. Twill and neighbour Clappecois . (Twill keeps his name, largely so the gamelog can say: "Jiminski assaulted Twill ..." )

anyway, i left it unfinished in case others had some interesting and loosely linked reasons for certain members taking one of the remaining territories.

(also other thoughts were perhaps Delia as Cumchatya!, NorseWest Territory)

I love this idea!
It's also something that everyone can participate in - perhaps some kind of name suggestion thread and eventual poll for the final names.
A huge thumbs up!
I especially love NorseWest Territory, as I'm sure would Norse.

[jiminski]

OK i had an idea!

So imagine the below image filled up with the avatars of notable figures in the community. the Map behind would obviously be deleted once all attacking areas have be filled by a replacement avatar picture:





So for example we have Lackistan in the centre there, Jeff over in the far North East.
In South America we have SergentBeanor and Tiltilia.
In North America we have .. Twill and neighbour Clappecois . (Twill keeps his name, largely so the gamelog can say: "Jiminski assaulted Twill ..." )

anyway, i left it unfinished in case others had some interesting and loosely linked reasons for certain members taking one of the remaining territories.

(also other thoughts were perhaps Delia as Cumchatya!, NorseWest Territory)

I love this idea!
It's also something that everyone can participate in - perhaps some kind of name suggestion thread and eventual poll for the final names.
A huge thumbs up!
I especially love NorseWest Territory, as I'm sure would Norse.

heh i have also now included: United Jimdom ; ) because frankly it tickled my chestnuts.. and that sits next to Mandipravia

[mandyb]

'New Jimmy' would be good also...but only if you were prepared to turn over a new leaf.

[jiminski]

'New Jimmy' would be good also...but only if you were prepared to turn over a new leaf.

sorry i can't help ... you are in there now though! perhaps that will keep you quiet for a bit... ; ) (jimdoneasia would've been nice too.)

I was also toying with Youpain / Upain for Whump perhaps?

DaGypt?
OwenDonesia?

Pooh Guinea would've been nice too but he took the cow down.

[petek66]

OK, what if we take the old classic map and add some new territories
in each ocean. Call them "islands". For example, capturing an Island
in the Indian Ocean gives you a connection between Western Australia
and Madagascar. Islands are not part of any continent. NOW, at the start
of the game, each island is assigned neutral ownership and starts with
TWO HUNDRED TROOPS on it. Lotsa luck in capturing one.

So we have differences in the map, differences in gameplay, and the islands
are so difficult to conquer, you basically have classic gameplay. Problem?