Higher Ranks protecting There Position

[Pedronicus]

I appears that the point system was OK when the higher ranking players were getting the big wins. Now that they have more to lose they want to change it. Just doesn't seem right to me.

I've not been moaning about things. In fact I want to keep the current scoring system and wasn't happy when making general was lowered from 4000 points to 3000.

[Evil Semp]

I didn't me you. It was just a generalization.

[HotShot53]

I just read this thread, and I have a different kind of hybrid system that might solve both the suicide/aliance problem of variable points, and the killing a bunch of weak players for points of the fixed point system...

What would happen if the points you gained/lost was based on the people playing the game, and not on who won the game? Like everyone puts points in based on the other players' ranks, and then the winner takes all. Then it wouldn't matter who you lost to, cause the amount of points you lose is fixed, but beating a bunch of weaker players wouldn't gain you much and you'd still be risking a lot if you lost.

(I'm new here, so this may already have been discussed before... but if not, what do you think?)

[tals]

I think the idea is that as you get higher up in the ranks it naturally becomes harder to get more points without playing like people. So when you get to the heady heights of general you really have to struggle to eek those points. This stops players playing noobs totally and getting a high rank from that.

Unfortunately whilst your points system would address players ganging up on lower levels it doesn't address the issue of points being appropriate to the rank. The more I think about it the more I like the current system (thanks ped for making me see the light). Human nature means some players will use that to their advantage - if they do, and i'll highlight DC out for special mention then they cannot truly say they are the best - which is what they are trying to achieve in the first place

Tals

[HotShot53]

with the system I just proposed you would still have to play harder people to get points... if a general plays some privates he'd have to put in a ton of points, while the privates would put hardly any points into the pool... while if a couple generals played each other they'd put the same amount of points in as would a couple new people just playing each other. So basically it takes the average playing level of everyone in the game to determine the points, I guess similar to the way doubles and triple points are calculated now.

[Pedronicus]

I glad to report that tals score is on the up.

[Freetymes]

I have been playing this game for many years as a kid, in college, and beyond. We used to call Risk, "Daily Hate" because no matter how good a friend or lover when you played Risk it caused arguments. It is the nature of the beast; you are trying to wipe out everyone else. Playing around a board makes the fights happen at the moment here it makes the fights later in the forum yet they are fights none the less. You can fix the reason for this argument but it will be replaced right away by another. No matter why or whom you attack they will think you should have attacked another.

This is a game thus no matter how you score it there will be losers thus there will be people trying to say that somehow they lost due to ANY other force besides themselves...

Let’s see....

Bad dice?
Bad randomizer?
Un-spoken alliance?
spoken alliance?
multi?
friends?
room mate?
Bad scoring system?
abuse of scoring system?
noob baiting?
unfair distribution?
multiplied forts' from a missed turn?
Dozens of excuses!

What’s yours?

The bottom line is that we all play under the same situations so it is inherently fair as the same thing happens to all of us. Don't get me wrong I agree that there is always room for improvement in any situation. However the fact that people use the rules to their advantage should be applauded and not used as another excuse for failure or feeling like you are a victim.

My golf coach in high school made this very good point. Always know and play by the rules as they help you more often then they hinder you!

The next tournament I had an impossible shot buried in the face of a sand trap. I knew the rules and used them to gain a much better lie, likely saving 2 or 3 shots. This was not cheating it was within the rules and knowing them became my advantage.

IMHO... Don't change the rules to ease victim mentality rather find a way to get the rules in front of the community and help them understand the importance and benefit of playing within them.

[tals]

I don't think you understood the post

A player purposely destroyed himself to ensure that the next player could be taken which gave him the cards, allowing him to wipe the other player and then my turn followed. If he had protected himself as any normal player would have done wanting to win the game then it is likely/possible I may or maynot have been able to defeat him. Either way he lost the game and purposely ensured I wouldn't for 10 points. I kept the game going for some time but ultimately with most of the map gone it was done.

As ped said - with his help i'm almost a captain and I still don't give a sh&* about the scores when it comes to the end game position - I more applaud the better player when they manage to defeat me.

Tals

p.s btw Ped and I are undefeated as a pair if anyone fancies a challenge

[AAFitz]

the only thing that the scoring makes hard is playing with all players

my dad has a thousand points usually less, i cringe at the thought of playing him, which i still do from time to time, but losing 40 points or more is tough, if i can only win 8 or 9....if he closed his eyes and played...which i sometimes think he does...sorry dad....he will still be ahead in points at the end of any significant number of games....

now the points arent the only reason to play here, but it does take some work to get them if you want them, and i do find it unfortunate that i have to donate points necessarily to play him....this doesnt make me a very good son, but it is the only reason i think the system is just a little off...maybe just a little extreme....

and we all know theres a few guys out there deadbeating in many games, losing others, on purpose, so they can be risk terrorists and swipe 100 points at a time

a flat system would be equally unfair, because noob hunting season would be open day one, and they would be hunted into extinction

i do also agree with freetimes, that there will always be complaints about it no matter what, but it would be cool to play with my dad...

(oh and i know everyones gonna ask me why we dont play doubles....dont bother)

what actually might be cool is a area we could play practice games where points didnt matter...i can play 30 games with my dad...i my rank doesnt change, either way, no benefit, no harm....just fun

[Freetymes]

I don't think you understood the post

I think I did and yes I see your point however this persons actions are not all that different than if he had suicided out by attacking another. In the end he is trying to decide the game even though he has no chance of winning. It is like the wounded soldier pulling the pin on a grenade and clenching it in his fist so the spoon is still in place. no matter who is the person to move his body later, friend or foe, they will get killed too. It is his last means of control.

In your case he did it in an attempt to save points. I agree completely with you that this is something less than honorable but I do not agree that it is tantamount too cheating or a premeditated alliance. Further I do not believe that you can mold the rules in any form too avoid people trying to minimize their losses as long as there is something to lose e.g. a points system. (maybe a pre-defined number of "Practice" games could be installed by Lack but hundreds?)

I also agree that your situation sucked and it would piss me off to have it happen to me. Luckily you are not so worried about your points and understand that this guy has lost his perspective or maybe all he has in his life to be proud of is his CC rank... His Karma will make him pay!

p.s. Congrats on your record with Pedro!

[Zackismet]

that definatly happened in a game with Matt2006 and deguu-
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=117825

deguu sacrificed himself when i was going to kick their butts just so he would lose some like 20 points instead of 30.

it's pathetic. People that wont let someone win a game, who deserves it, just because they will lose 10 more points... I was going to leave negetive feedback just for deguu (since matt didn't pull any crap like that)- but because of the blatent abuse of feedback i was too afraid to, so i just left a neutral...

[Sargentgeneral]

This is just more evidence that we need a change in the scoring system. This shouldnt be able to happen. If the points are affecting the way we play, then there needs to be a different system. I would do the same thing all these other guys are doing, they are just looking out for their best interests so you cant fault them for that.

[tals]

that definatly happened in a game with Matt2006 and deguu-
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=117825

deguu sacrificed himself when i was going to kick their butts just so he would lose some like 20 points instead of 30.

it's pathetic. People that wont let someone win a game, who deserves it, just because they will lose 10 more points... I was going to leave negetive feedback just for deguu (since matt didn't pull any crap like that)- but because of the blatent abuse of feedback i was too afraid to, so i just left a neutral...

Agreed I should have left negative feedback in mine - but I don't like leaving neg. feedback tbh - must be an age thing

Tals

[qeee1]

Too lazy to read thread, just gonna add:

High ranking players are also targeted more in games, at least in my experience, because people are more cautious of them. It makes it damn hard to pull off sly moves.

[osujacket]

My thoughts,

If you dont wanna play where someone targets the lower ranked player play terminator.

Get in there with a higher ranked player and see how many points you can take from him.

Solves the problems of the suicides.

If not people are going to use the system to maximize thier points