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Not Extending Premium

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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby jiminski on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:28 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:With any service, there will always be a group of users who are unsatisfied with the service to some varying degrees. I think, however, Conquer Club has a larger number of users satisified with the service, than those unsatisified, and the rate of satisifaction (for instance Premium Purchases, or sticking around the website as a free user) doesn't seem to be losing to dissatisfaction.


--Andy



so we are collateral Damage.. nice.

i am drawn to vocalise my fury about the sites handling of one thing: your deletion and the style of the deletion of flamewars!
bloody hell i did not even go there any longer but you got rid of all the back posts which i liked to re-visit! worse, you insulted me by making it a joke!
This is an issue the site handled with appalling petulance. The rest just adds to the fire.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby Woodruff on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:31 pm

jiminski wrote:
AndyDufresne wrote:With any service, there will always be a group of users who are unsatisfied with the service to some varying degrees. I think, however, Conquer Club has a larger number of users satisified with the service, than those unsatisified, and the rate of satisifaction (for instance Premium Purchases, or sticking around the website as a free user) doesn't seem to be losing to dissatisfaction.


so we are collateral Damage.. nice.


Won't there ALWAYS be "collateral damage" (those who are unsatisfied)? It's impossible to keep everyone happy on a site such as this, I think.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby jiminski on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:33 pm

Woodruff wrote:
jiminski wrote:
AndyDufresne wrote:With any service, there will always be a group of users who are unsatisfied with the service to some varying degrees. I think, however, Conquer Club has a larger number of users satisified with the service, than those unsatisified, and the rate of satisifaction (for instance Premium Purchases, or sticking around the website as a free user) doesn't seem to be losing to dissatisfaction.


so we are collateral Damage.. nice.


.... I think.



shhh Wood, i'm talking to Andy. ;)

and please stop quoting tiny fragments of my posts and often the least important bit! .. i do put time in to all of the words.


I also said

jiminski wrote:.....

i am drawn to vocalise my fury about the sites handling of one thing: your deletion and the style of the deletion of flamewars!
bloody hell i did not even go there any longer but you got rid of all the back posts which i liked to re-visit! worse, you insulted me by making it a joke!
This is an issue the site handled with appalling petulance. The rest just adds to the fire.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby AndyDufresne on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:40 pm

Unfortunately at the time of Flame Wars, I was not Chief Moderator, Jiminski.

I know you like debate, discussion, etc, jiminski, I remember well your posts throughout Conquer Club's history. :):D

======================

If you think about, Conquer Club's business model is probably one of the more difficult ones to master, let alone manage effectively.

Company A provides a service, say Internet Connections. That is the extent of contact between Customer and and Company.

Company B provides a service, say a group that facilitates user interaction in community events, protests, celebrations. The extent of their contact between Customer and Company is much more face to face (in the sense of not simply providing a service for a fee). This may not be the best example, but I think you get the idea.

Conquer Club, for good or for worse, falls somewhere in between, with an AB Service. We provide a service similar to Company A---World Domination.

Additionally, we provide a service similar Company B---the Forums, where "face to face" contact occurs more regularly.

Now, exclusively Service A or exclusively Service B---is usually enough for any one Company to handle, due to the nature of service and the types of dedicated contact that go along with each service.

But when Conquer Club was launched by Lackattack in 2006, he opted for Service AB. It is surely probably one of the more demanding services, both in terms of retaining users and keeping them happy, and in gaining new users, but it is what we've got.

I don't think Team CC claims to be an expert in providing Service AB---aside from a few people, Team CC is all volunteer based. The best we can do is listen, and try to forge ahead with that we see as the correct path down Service AB's lane.


--Andy
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby Woodruff on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:44 pm

jiminski wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
jiminski wrote:
AndyDufresne wrote:With any service, there will always be a group of users who are unsatisfied with the service to some varying degrees. I think, however, Conquer Club has a larger number of users satisified with the service, than those unsatisified, and the rate of satisifaction (for instance Premium Purchases, or sticking around the website as a free user) doesn't seem to be losing to dissatisfaction.


so we are collateral Damage.. nice.


.... I think.


shhh Wood, i'm talking to Andy. ;)


No good answer to it, I guess?

jiminski wrote:and please stop quoting tiny fragments of my posts and often the least important bit! .. i do put time in to all of the words.


I quote only those parts relevant to my response.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby xelabale on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:50 pm

lord voldemort wrote:tbh i almost guarantee that a boycott will not change anything...you are definately going about it the wrong way. The right way i dont know what it is...the forum users make up a minority of users on this site. And those who want to boycott to get changes are even less.
now i am in the group who doesnt really care.. i just renewed my premium. only thing that upsets me is that people i enjoy playing with are considering not playing anymore....

Forum users may be a minority of people on the site, but they make up 100% of the people who use the forums, thus have a right to talk about what happens on the forums. No one's asking for anything that affects the people who don't come here. For the people who do, it's plain to see a lot of people are disgruntled. Should this be ignored or dealt with?
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby AndyDufresne on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:52 pm

xelabale wrote:
lord voldemort wrote:tbh i almost guarantee that a boycott will not change anything...you are definately going about it the wrong way. The right way i dont know what it is...the forum users make up a minority of users on this site. And those who want to boycott to get changes are even less.
now i am in the group who doesnt really care.. i just renewed my premium. only thing that upsets me is that people i enjoy playing with are considering not playing anymore....

Forum users may be a minority of people on the site, but they make up 100% of the people who use the forums, thus have a right to talk about what happens on the forums. No one's asking for anything that affects the people who don't come here. For the people who do, it's plain to see a lot of people are disgruntled. Should this be ignored or dealt with?

I'm not sure "a lot" is a fair statement. Out of all the Forums users, those that have posted in the recent topics have been a minimum.


--Andy
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby jiminski on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:57 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:Unfortunately at the time of Flame Wars, I was not Chief Moderator, Jiminski.

I know you like debate, discussion, etc, jiminski, I remember well your posts throughout Conquer Club's history. :):D

======================...


--Andy



in the spirit of only reading the first section of my posts which you and Wood seem to have in common ;)
(i will digest the body of your analogy later)

Indeed i do like to debate.. but i am genuinely upset about stuff i've been a part of being wiped.

I agree that you were not in charge Andy and i doubt you would have handled it so badly ...
I take the fact that you are putting distance between you and the action to indicate your belief that it was handled badly.

How i see it was:
You were always going to be Chief Mod, Lack created a User called Hyrassi (he has the technology you know ;) ) to take all the sins of the deletion upon his shoulders (I believe Twill was actually doing the cameo role .. i could be wrong on that detail)
Hyrassi could do it brutally and callously and then you would come in, Dirty deed done, with a clean slate and a breath of fresh-air!. Hyrassi leaves and with him all the backlash, as no one else could be blamed!

That's clever, (and if it is pure 'conspiracy-theory' well it is how it worked out anyway ;0 ) ..... and it being done as a joke on April fools was really cute .. but i hate being mocked when i lose something. It's like dropping my mobile phone in the sea and some tit laughing at me ...
worse in fact - it's like some tit throwing my mobile phone in the sea and then laughing at me.


I honestly think you are great Andy, a good soul and perfect for the job!... and if my dander were not so up at this disrespectful episode, i would be working with you! but i am not and that is a real shame...

... And still all we get is the company line in answer .. No apology, as the Hyrassi-multi is to blame, just a bitter taste in the mouth which will not go away.

Jiminski
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby xelabale on Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:05 pm

I ask this sincerely - do you care? Or will you stick to your plan regardless? Because I'd venture to say there are some people who rightly or wrongly are feeling disenfranchised. If this is part of a bigger plan then tell us now - the people who are posting in these topics now (on both sides of the argument) ARE to a large part the community - people have strong feelings, which shows how important cc is to them.

It's like a standard sequential game - you need conflict, you need movement or the game will become stale and boring. But if it tips too far one way you'll end up with one player getting a massive bonus and eating everyone else up. It's a difficult balancing act, but it's the game itself that provides the enjoyment - an emphatic victory is fun today, but if that's it why start another 10 games?

So if it's just the win you're after, you have the multi-colour set and more troops - don't mess around, finish the game off. If it's the game itself you want, engage in it with us.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby jbrettlip on Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:29 pm

Ok, Optimus and Andy, I have read through the thread, and the same point seems to be always coming to the forefront: If a user doesn't like it they can leave. Everyone knows premium is an annual renewal. It is pretty damn hard to correllate when people leave with actions of the site admins. I honestly wasn't renewing until the stellar job Andy did on the bigotry debate and guidelines.

So I propose that Lack offer prorated refunds to ANY user who wants their money back. See how the recent moderation has affected the site morale. I would give up my unlimited games, because I don't like how I have received trivial bans, when other users run rampant throughout the forums.

I think that when Lack starts to see numerous requests from long time users asking for refunds, maybe he will realize that perhaps his minions aren't working in his best financial interest.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby oVo on Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:49 pm

Sorry... I don't see OP's remarks as arrogant or bitter,
pretty much just stating the obvious.

I'm a current freemium mostly to curb my own addiction to this game
and have no problem with the forum clean up.

There are CCers clever enough to make their point without getting banned
and I'm fine with that too.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby owenshooter on Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:26 pm

oVo wrote:There are CCers clever enough to make their point without getting banned
and I'm fine with that too.

that is the problem. part of DM's ban was for "skirting" the rules. so now, you can be banned for not really breaking any rules, but just "skirting" them... it is beyond ridiculous.-0
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby mibi on Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:37 pm

recent moderator actions or how the forums are run will likely have a negligible impact on re-subscription rates. I suspect the largest single impact on re-subscription rates doesn't have anything to do with the site at all, as they say, it's the economy, stupid.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby azezzo on Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:15 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:I certainly know Premium Members are a large portion of the Communities, as I mentioned. However, there are equally if not larger numbers of Users, Premium and Freemium alike, who are not apart of the Forum Community who additionally drive Conquer Club's Gaming Community.

It is most certainly a balancing act, as pointed out, to make both groups of people satisified with our service.


--Andy



if the majority of c.c. users do not visit the forums, then whats the big deal about making the minority happy and fix the forums, ease up on the bannings, allow flame wars, allow a more liberal stance on whats permitted in the forums, like it used to be.

if the majority do not read the forums, then whos offended? not the minority, they know what to expect when entering the forums, well they used to know what to expect b4 the the big crack down.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby Scott-Land on Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:13 pm

mibi wrote:recent moderator actions or how the forums are run will likely have a negligible impact on re-subscription rates. I suspect the largest single impact on re-subscription rates doesn't have anything to do with the site at all, as they say, it's the economy, stupid.



Considering the average life span of a CC player is less than 2-3 years ( a guess ) .... I could see why the threat of non-renewal by these veteran players wouldn't have an impact on the site.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby 4myGod on Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:11 am

demonfork wrote:None of this matters... what is your alternative? Is there a another site that you can go to that can offer you what cc has to offer?

Nope

CC has no legitimate competition, therefore they are like an 800 pound gorilla, they can sleep where ever they want to.


for now...
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby ViperOverLord on Thu Jul 23, 2009 1:39 am

I have not dealt with mods here and have pretty well avoided it. Because my experience in other site forums is that some mods are fair and serviceable. But then there are others that do it because they are loners that want some sense of importance in their lives, even if that means having random net users under there thumbs.

I'll give you a for instance. I used to post on realgm.com in the NBA forums. Last year when Shaq called Bosh, the Rupaul of Big Men I posted it in the Raptors forum. The mods there would delete that and other Toronto relevant threads, basically as an act of unnecessary censorship. Even the NBA would not police their forum fans like that. When I complained, the blocked me. The same thing happened in the Suns and general NBA forums.

I did not appreciate the unnecessary censorship as I was not being defamatory and I was talking about relevant issues. But in all the cases the mods villinized me and in no time at all RealGM banned my IP address. No suspension, no warning. They just did it.

I don't know of anyone at CC that has been banned. I hope that if that is happening that due care would be given. Because quite frankly it should take a lot for that to happen. For instance evilweasel messaged me and used a lot of gross profanity against me. When I fired profanities back, he threatened to report me and get me banned. Naturally he was lying. But I would hope that CC is careful and not empower the idiots of the world to be able to bait people into bans.

CC is a great value at $25 per year. But as good of a value as it is, then I will move on really fast when they start bullying me or get on their soap boxes. I don't need that kind of stress from a game site, just as I didn't need realgm.com to f me over either.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby lgoasklucyl on Thu Jul 23, 2009 1:44 am

4myGod wrote:
demonfork wrote:None of this matters... what is your alternative? Is there a another site that you can go to that can offer you what cc has to offer?

Nope

CC has no legitimate competition, therefore they are like an 800 pound gorilla, they can sleep where ever they want to.


for now...


One could only hope an alternative emerges so we could leave and pursue a community not so fucking wound up.

Hell, I would pay more than $25/year for a similar concept (even lacking a good number of the features available here at CC) if it meant different (respectable) moderation.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby StiffMittens on Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:14 am

lgoasklucyl wrote:
4myGod wrote:
demonfork wrote:None of this matters... what is your alternative? Is there a another site that you can go to that can offer you what cc has to offer?

Nope

CC has no legitimate competition, therefore they are like an 800 pound gorilla, they can sleep where ever they want to.


for now...


One could only hope an alternative emerges so we could leave and pursue a community not so fucking wound up.

Hell, I would pay more than $25/year for a similar concept (even lacking a good number of the features available here at CC) if it meant different (respectable) moderation.

Hmmm... How would you feel about investing a little more money and having a direct say in how such a site might be developed? ;)
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby 4myGod on Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:15 am

StiffMittens wrote:
lgoasklucyl wrote:
4myGod wrote:
demonfork wrote:None of this matters... what is your alternative? Is there a another site that you can go to that can offer you what cc has to offer?

Nope

CC has no legitimate competition, therefore they are like an 800 pound gorilla, they can sleep where ever they want to.


for now...


One could only hope an alternative emerges so we could leave and pursue a community not so fucking wound up.

Hell, I would pay more than $25/year for a similar concept (even lacking a good number of the features available here at CC) if it meant different (respectable) moderation.

Hmmm... How would you feel about investing a little more money and having a direct say in how such a site might be developed? ;)


Quite easily actually, the concept isn't that difficult. The only thing CC has going for them is the strong user base, which it slowly bans.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby jbrettlip on Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:19 am

I have a few extra $$ sitting around that I would invest. Better to throw them away on an internet site, then let Comrade Obama take them.
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby Johnny Rockets on Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:40 pm

That's sooooooooo rich.

A wack of malcontents are going to pool their cash to set up a C.C. clone?

And the fact that it would cost thousands and thousands and the time commitment vast does not give you pause?
OR the fact that you ....other than this site.... in general don't even personally know each other...but you'll trust one of you with handling the finances of a 10000 + project?


Do you have any Idea WHY the mods and admin can get away with their arrogance?

They have you in a can. Your not going anywhere. Your not developing anything.
Your not going to drop your premium. And eventually your going to conform.

This is not to mean I agree with how the mods and the admin run the show.
But it's a monopoly situation with a very good product and the hook is in your bag, my friend.

There is no "methadone" out there that will get you off Conquer Smack.

Give it up already,

Johnny Rockets
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby juventino on Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:49 pm

I payed premium for 2 years. Then i didnt. I only played. Then I didnt. I am off this site for now. The mods and admins and generall feeling in the forum is reason enough. The small things that made me laugh before, the mods, the admins, (not all, there are some great ones too), the "a mapmaker gives CC the right to the maps forever and ever and ever-agreement", the bans, the warning, the chaos, they dont make me smile anymore. That is why I am off.

I have told alot of friends to join CC, then i started to tell fewer friends, now, I dont tell my friends to join CC. It makes me sad since it once was fun here.

Well. I am off and see i hope to see you in the future when the joy has returned!
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby Mr Changsha on Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:52 pm

Johnny Rockets wrote:That's sooooooooo rich.

A wack of malcontents are going to pool their cash to set up a C.C. clone?

And the fact that it would cost thousands and thousands and the time commitment vast does not give you pause?
OR the fact that you ....other than this site.... in general don't even personally know each other...but you'll trust one of you with handling the finances of a 10000 + project?


Do you have any Idea WHY the mods and admin can get away with their arrogance?

They have you in a can. Your not going anywhere. Your not developing anything.
Your not going to drop your premium. And eventually your going to conform.

This is not to mean I agree with how the mods and the admin run the show.
But it's a monopoly situation with a very good product and the hook is in your bag, my friend.

There is no "methadone" out there that will get you off Conquer Smack.

Give it up already,

Johnny Rockets


*injects needle full of landgrab into penis*
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Re: Not Extending Premium

Postby King Berzerker on Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:54 pm

Mr Changsha wrote:*injects needle full of landgrab into penis*


lolz... sounds like its hurting...
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