Mitsuko - IT abuse and racism [Cleared]

[DJPatrick]

Replace or delete any xxxxxxx with the appropriate information.
Delete any accusations or entries which do not apply.

Be sure before you accuse someone!
</DELETE ME>

Accused: Mitsuko




The accused are suspected of:


Other: Suspected Racism and then somehow entering game chat and deleting all his comments



Game number(s):

6008056



Comments: this player (not at start of game) started leaving comments in Japanese and another player asked him to explain but he did not and continued to leave messages which both the other player and myself explained were not able to be understood...this in itself is a give or take...cld just ignore and move on but the little bit of Japanese I do know made it appear they were derogratory remarks against non-Japanese so I confronted hinm and asked him to explain...
His/her English was perfectly fluent when (it) started telling two other players to f*ck themselves etc...
He/she then joined another game with me hoping to continue the abuse...WTF you say, foe and move on...I did and have BUT...
I then got a couple of private messages, very polite, trying to placate the situation and explaining there was no rude involved...I went back to the game and check this players input into game chat and found it has ALL been "disappearred"...this worries me greatly coz if it's easy for someone like him it can't be long before game chat history is being re-written each time there is a complaint.
Maybe by now it has even been "written back" into the game chat but suggest you check with other players about what really happenned.
Maybe I've just been lucky and haven't struck too many aggressive idiots in my time on here (many questionable strategists but you get theat) but this guys, a fairly new player is a powder keg waiting to expolde using his ethnicity and IT skills to screw something basically good...
Waiting ...

[Mitsuko]

Please post my "racist" comments here on this board, copy them. Because the truth of the matter is, if you insult some one then can't handle it when they tell you to f*ck off. Cry about your lack of intelligence and call it racism somewhere else.

[40kguy]

Accused: Mitsuko




The accused are suspected of:


Other: Suspected Racism and then somehow entering game chat and deleting all his comments



Game number(s):

Game 6008056



Comments: this player (not at start of game) started leaving comments in Japanese and another player asked him to explain but he did not and continued to leave messages which both the other player and myself explained were not able to be understood...this in itself is a give or take...cld just ignore and move on but the little bit of Japanese I do know made it appear they were derogratory remarks against non-Japanese so I confronted hinm and asked him to explain...
His/her English was perfectly fluent when (it) started telling two other players to f*ck themselves etc...
He/she then joined another game with me hoping to continue the abuse...WTF you say, foe and move on...I did and have BUT...
I then got a couple of private messages, very polite, trying to placate the situation and explaining there was no rude involved...I went back to the game and check this players input into game chat and found it has ALL been "disappearred"...this worries me greatly coz if it's easy for someone like him it can't be long before game chat history is being re-written each time there is a complaint.
Maybe by now it has even been "written back" into the game chat but suggest you check with other players about what really happenned.
Maybe I've just been lucky and haven't struck too many aggressive idiots in my time on here (many questionable strategists but you get theat) but this guys, a fairly new player is a powder keg waiting to expolde using his ethnicity and IT skills to screw something basically good...
Waiting ...

added links

[Mitsuko]

By the way ignorant idiot.

Rule #2: No secret diplomacy
Any form of diplomatic discussion between opponents must be posted in the game chat in English or in a language that all opponents understand. Diplomacy includes, but is not limited to: proposing truces, negotiating alliances, and coordinating assaults. Secret diplomacy can be hard to prove, but if you suspect it you should leave the players in question appropriate ratings. If you feel certain about players engaging in secret diplomacy consider reporting them in the Cheating & Abuse Reports forum by posting a new topic.


Why don't you read a rule and understand it before you accuse some one of breaking it.

[DJPatrick]

okay mods B4 this degenerates too far (like my wall from this person) pls check the game chat...there is NOTHING posted by this person...check the other players posts...they directly relate to what Mitsuko has just then posted and also contain what he said in Japanese,,,this has all been removed...pls consider how he did this to maintain some integrity..
thnx

[jefjef]

okay mods B4 this degenerates too far (like my wall from this person) pls check the game chat...there is NOTHING posted by this person...check the other players posts...they directly relate to what Mitsuko has just then posted and also contain what he said in Japanese,,,this has all been removed...pls consider how he did this to maintain some integrity..
thnx

hahaha.. did you happen to foe him? If so that's why you no longer see his chat. It's there.

[Mitsuko]

I understand you're a complete idiot. But when you "foe" some one it keeps them from seeing their chat. You are a simpleton. If you're going to stand on a soap box and insult and point blame at some one, please at least do so with some medium of intelligent thought.

[Jace22]

I believe the reason you can't see his/her game chat is because you have the accused foed.
@ Mitsuko: no need to flame anymore than you possibly have

[Mitsuko]

Well then admit I'm being rude, not racist. I'm not going to be polite to some one who insults my nationality, calls me a racists, and has a severe lack of intellect.

[DJPatrick]

Ha, bloody, ha...okay point taken and am glad this players remarks are now there for all to see...read them and translate them and consider...

[colton24]

By the way ignorant idiot.

Rule #2: No secret diplomacy
Any form of diplomatic discussion between opponents must be posted in the game chat in English or in a language that all opponents understand. Diplomacy includes, but is not limited to: proposing truces, negotiating alliances, and coordinating assaults. Secret diplomacy can be hard to prove, but if you suspect it you should leave the players in question appropriate ratings. If you feel certain about players engaging in secret diplomacy consider reporting them in the Cheating & Abuse Reports forum by posting a new topic.


Why don't you read a rule and understand it before you accuse some one of breaking it.

All people didn't understand and he is accusing you of racism. It should be bigotry. Oh and:

Chats of Games you are not in

It is typically advised to not post in the chats of games you are not playing. If you do wish to post in another player's game, please keep your comments limited to a Good Luck comment or a quick question. Spamming or trolling other player's games is not allowed.

Note: When writing a message in a game that you are not playing, the "Note to Self" button does not keep the message private.

AND

What is not allowed is any form of bigotry or other flames as outlined in the Forum Guidelines. Please report any such comments that you find offensive.

[Mitsuko]

Why don't you go read the chat log of that game before making another idiotic post.

An idiot, is an idiot, and another idiot comes to that idiot's defense.

[colton24]

Why don't you go read the chat log of that game before making another idiotic post.

An idiot, is an idiot, and another idiot comes to that idiot's defense.

I don't read Japanese.

[Woodruff]

Well then admit I'm being rude, not racist. I'm not going to be polite to some one who insults my nationality, calls me a racists, and has a severe lack of intellect.

So you have no self-control?

By the way ignorant idiot.
Rule #2: No secret diplomacy
Any form of diplomatic discussion between opponents must be posted in the game chat in English or in a language that all opponents understand. Diplomacy includes, but is not limited to: proposing truces, negotiating alliances, and coordinating assaults. Secret diplomacy can be hard to prove, but if you suspect it you should leave the players in question appropriate ratings. If you feel certain about players engaging in secret diplomacy consider reporting them in the Cheating & Abuse Reports forum by posting a new topic.
Why don't you read a rule and understand it before you accuse some one of breaking it.

By this quote, you did potentially engage in secret diplomacy, as not all opponents understood what you were saying.

[colton24]

Well then admit I'm being rude, not racist. I'm not going to be polite to some one who insults my nationality, calls me a racists, and has a severe lack of intellect.

So you have no self-control?

He probably doesn't. He hasn't openly flamed in this thread and the game chat.

[nippersean]

DJ - I read this thread and the game chat and I'm just not clear what the complaint is. Could you make it clearer please?

[king sam]

I'm not quite sure what the complaint is against him either. Unless you think the text in Japanese was bigotry in nature.

And yes as already stated the game chat disappeared because you had him on Foe.

If their are other games where he has posted in that didn't contain him in it or where he posted offensive material please site them, i will go to the translator and translate his comments in this game to determine if what he said is above and beyond what is allowed by us in game chat.

As for him posting in a different language in the game chat he is right, nothing says you cant post in a different language, just that you cant have diplomatic discussions in a language that all cant read or English.So he isn't engaging in secret diplomacy by posting in Japanese in this game.

However Mitsuko your getting pretty close to flaming in here, I suggest you temper it down a bit.

Marking this pending until I can translate it fully and waiting more evidence to come to light here.

King Sam

[Woodruff]

I'm not quite sure what the complaint is against him either. Unless you think the text in Japanese was bigotry in nature.

Isn't using a language other than English considered secret diplomacy when someone else in the game doesn't understand the language being used? Someone shouldn't have to go online to use a language translater when the rule is pretty clear.

[king sam]

The rule states:

Rule #2: No secret diplomacy
Any form of diplomatic discussion between opponents must be posted in the game chat in English or in a language that all opponents understand. Diplomacy includes, but is not limited to: proposing truces, negotiating alliances, and coordinating assaults. Secret diplomacy can be hard to prove, but if you suspect it you should leave the players in question appropriate ratings.

The translation is probably off a bit, but from what I got it was this:

iiya hayai shiai tameni omaesan

"good luck in the match for you"

tonda ichinan burei gaijin

"absolutely not foreigner" in response to his text being offensive in nature

So he wasn't engaging in diplomatic discussions in a different language that all couldn't understand. I get the point that you shouldn't have to go to a online translator to verify if it is or isn't diplomatic discussions and secret diplomacy going on but no one in the game appeared to understand what he was saying.

And the others in the game were in doubt and posted it in here to get looked at. Unless there is other evidence of game chat abuse or other infractions that get sited then the case will be closed, and he will be Cleared of wrong doing.

[Woodruff]

The rule states:

Rule #2: No secret diplomacy
Any form of diplomatic discussion between opponents must be posted in the game chat in English or in a language that all opponents understand. Diplomacy includes, but is not limited to: proposing truces, negotiating alliances, and coordinating assaults. Secret diplomacy can be hard to prove, but if you suspect it you should leave the players in question appropriate ratings.

The translation is probably off a bit, but from what I got it was this:

iiya hayai shiai tameni omaesan

"good luck in the match for you"

tonda ichinan burei gaijin

"absolutely not foreigner" in response to his text being offensive in nature

So he wasn't engaging in diplomatic discussions in a different language that all couldn't understand.

This is not the way this rule has been interpreted in the past.

[jefjef]

Woody. It was translated and shown to not be diplomatic conversation. Pretty clear no rules violation.

[the.killing.44]

Woody. It was translated and shown to not be diplomatic conversation. Pretty clear no rules violation.

There has been a precedent set that you cannot say "use Google to translate" to cover up posting in game chat in a language not ALL users understand.

[DJPatrick]

Interesting the way that guideline is being interpreted now given the precedents..
.
Also very interesting that Mitusko should know it so well given that at the time of game he had been on here for less than a week...
During that times he also:
threatens others with C&A reports 4 times from 26 games
breaks fog twice
ironically, lectures two others on use of proper English
has no problems using his favourite English terms ie dumb f*ck, f*ck yuo, no talent f*ck, moronic incompetent and stupid retard on numerous occasions...
has never used Japanese language posts in any other game so is perfectly able to post a translation when asked civily...

GAMES;
5987588
5993287
5993412
5993439
6008077
6008734
6008788

Yes, dumb of me not to understand that FOE removes sight of game chat but after more than 1000 games, I have foed someone maybe two or three times so I usually just take it and move on...
I have also only placed one previous C&A report in 18mnths at CC so feel the intense pattern of abuse in such a short time frame should be examined closely...maybe his original post was not translated to be abusive but his lack of clarification and subsequent were with malicious intent..
I the Mods allow this clear time-bomb to continue without at least a warning then maybe Mitsuko is right and I am an idiot for bringing this up and ex[pecting a result...

BTW: suggest some further research on "geijan"...while it is most often translated as "foreigner", it can be used as "less than human"...

[jefjef]

Woody. It was translated and shown to not be diplomatic conversation. Pretty clear no rules violation.

There has been a precedent set that you cannot say "use Google to translate" to cover up posting in game chat in a language not ALL users understand.

Well where is that precedent? The rules state clearly as it pertains to diplomacy.

[king sam]

Aright DJPatrick,
If you want to accuse him of being a multi based off the evidence that you wrote in your last post then state that. But given the information in your claim it sounded to me and probably others that you were accusing him of using bigotry and possible secret alliance's given the fact that he was using a different language in the game chat then all the players knew/spoke.

Given the way I interpreted it, seeing as no post was made on your part to clarify it up till now I looked at it as such.

And I translated his text the best I could, there are many ways to translate words, and even if he was saying "sub human" it still wouldn't be above and beyond what is allowed in game chat. Go back and re-read the community guidelines and you will see that we take a liberal stance, and tend to not step in unless we need to. Which those times are usually when racism, threats, or other serious offenses arise. Sub human does not qualify as those.

Also given the catch 22 situation, I read rule 2 as it states. You can talk in a different language in game chat, of course if you do others will get uneasy and most likely your name will end up in C&A for the fear of conducting diplomatic discussions and being in violation of rule 2. The way this read to me was a player coming in and wishing pleasantries in a different tongue, and immediately being put on the defensive for it. He then started down that road that is all to frequent to others when in that position which include him calling people "foreigners or sub human".

Just in case I am conversing with other mods to determine the way we are going with talking in game chat in a different language, even when not doing diplomatic discussions. I never said this case was closed, I said it would be had no more evidence come up. And also given the fact that their is reason to believe this player may be a multi I will put in for an IP check as well.

Still pending those 2 results.