Tournament Creation Limits? [Poll Added By NS]

[Bones2484]

I think if an organizer has demonstrated responsibility, he or she can have like 15 tourneys ongoing, however, I would suggest that there is NOT 15 all created at the same time on same day, if fills the forum on creating tourneys too much. So, perhaps something like a max of creating 2 to 5 per day, then if they all fill, go ahead and create another 2 to 5. This may help both sides of the argument and perhaps have a happy medium.

I think this is a great idea. Again, I have no problem with people running many tournaments. If they are capable of doing so, more power to them! I just don't think it's fair to other organizers to flood the create/join forum.

[Blitzaholic]

I think if an organizer has demonstrated responsibility, he or she can have like 15 tourneys ongoing, however, I would suggest that there is NOT 15 all created at the same time on same day, if fills the forum on creating tourneys too much. So, perhaps something like a max of creating 2 to 5 per day, then if they all fill, go ahead and create another 2 to 5. This may help both sides of the argument and perhaps have a happy medium.

I think this is a great idea. Again, I have no problem with people running many tournaments. If they are capable of doing so, more power to them! I just don't think it's fair to other organizers to flood the create/join forum.

I 100% agree with you bones. Perhaps, there could be a poll maybe on the maximum, 1-3 per day, 2-5 per day, 5-7 per day and cannot create no more until all are filled and moved to ongoing, not sure if a poll would work or not, but, I think 2-5 at one time is reasonable only if the T.O. has demonstrated responsibility from past experiences, if a T.O. has had a tourney abandoned, then they should not have the 2-5 per day, they would only be able to create one and wait til that is filled before creating another. Just my 2 cents.

[b00060]

Bones, 15-20? Back up your statement with the 15-20 tournaments I currently have posted in the join thread.

Also see below in one of my tournaments that just ended TODAY. I'll be sure to let the winner know that he should not in fact enjoy the tournament and there will never be another one. What everyone seems to be forgetting is that tourney organizers do not get paid! Its so easy to say when a tourney fills, create another one, well guess what, it is not that easy. Tournaments need to be created when the organizer has time and myself along with other organizers like HA prefer to send them out in batches. An assembly line technique is much more efficient. But whatever, like I said, I thought I was enhancing other players experience here at CC, but I guess all it did was piss of other organizers, so I will focus on rescuing abandoned tournamnets that happen every month.


viewtopic.php?f=92&t=103435&view=unread#unread

[Bones2484]

Bones, 15-20? Back up your statement with the 15-20 tournaments I currently have posted in the join thread.

I'm sorry, but I haven't used names this entire time. But if you'd like me to...

Three days ago when I first noticed this I counted 34 tournaments waiting for players between you and HA. Thirty four. The two of you had more tournaments waiting for players than 95% of other organizers had ever created. In what world does that not seem excessive?

No one is asking you to quit or saying that your tournaments aren't enjoyable and meaningful. YOU are the one taking this discussion that way. The sooner you can act mature and become a part of the discussion to figure out a solution, as opposed to a child stomping their foot, the better.

[b00060]

Telling someone to act mature, nice. I ask again, where are the tournamnets that I have in the thread that accumulate to 15-20, because I have less than 10, and I only have 5 active tournaments. I didn't realize that this site was built for you and you alone. Since you would like to dictate when people have time to create tournaments, would you also like to dictate how many active games they have? I am sure that I have joined a few games that someone else would have liked to have joined. Should I forward you all of the PMs I get about missing out on a filled up tournament or possibly reserving that I receive? Apparently you have all the answers.

[barterer2002]

Really I think what we're doing here is establish some etiquette for the TO forums. When you go play golf there is an etiquette that is generally followed. You don't drive into the group ahead of you, you don't talk during someones backswing. You don't walk between a ball and the hole on the green. When we go to a restaurant there is etiquette, we don't stand on the tables, we don't start shouting at people across the restaurant, we don't wash our hands in our water glasses. All of these things are things that we do not because there are rules in place, not because we can't do it, after all, we're the paying customer on either a golf course or at a restaurant, but because we function together as a society through etiquette.

What we're trying to do here is establish what is the etiquette going forward for tournaments. Part of that is understanding how that etiquette is communicated. How do we know not to dance on the table at a restaurant-because someone taught us, how do we know not to talk during a backswing-because someone taught us. In CC we don't have a mentor system for new tournament creation and I'm not suggesting that we should but maybe we should have a posting of etiquette to read where things like number of games in the Create/Join forum can be listed-whatever is decided.

Remember, we all have to live here and we're all volunteers, it behooves us to have some thoughts on how to get together to think not only of the tournament players but also of our fellow TOs. I also believe that what is past is past and that what we're discussing is how to handle things in the future.

[redtide]

I would think people would only join tournaments that look fun to them. This is a stupid thread.

[alster]

I just wanted to see if anyone out there may agree with me or not as I find it fairly ridiculous that about 30 tournaments listed in the first page of "Create/Join a Tournament" are being run by two organizers.

Is there any chance we can limit the number of tournaments each organizer can have waiting for participants so that we stop getting flooded with new ones? Most, if not all, of the tournaments I'm referring to are simple "4-round, win 4 games total" tournaments as well, so we've lost ANY creativity in the structure too.

Please note that I'm not suggesting any limits on how many active tournaments someone can have, only a limit on ones waiting for players. It's no wonder some original tournaments struggle to get members when we have way too many (uncreative) options out there at once.

I agree. Tourneys should be created and treated like fancy Swiss watches, not like cheap copied Chinese crap watches.

[TheMissionary]

I voted for other. I feel that if an organizer can handle running that many tournaments at the same time, more power to them. The problem I see is so many tournaments of the same type for the most part. If they are going to host so many tournaments, maybe make them more diverse.

[Woodruff]

As someone who has organized only a few tournaments myself, I have always greatly appreciated that there are so many tournaments available. I have never felt like they "drowned out" my tournaments. If an organizer has a great idea, it won't get drowned out. As long as these highly-motivated organizers are able to keep up with the many tournaments they run, what really IS the harm?

Please allow these great organizers to continue their great work for the site. They are absolutely a plus for you, whether you want to acknowledge it or not.

[pissedoffsol]

IMO, so long as they are keeping up with creating games/updating scores/etc, it should be a non-issue.


I'm still waiting for round2 of a tourney i won round 1 in back in september or novemeber... i don't even remember.... and it was by a no-name. so, i'd rather have the guys who make the efforts to make these fun and keep up with the rounds the freedom to make any tourney they want.

[downfall]

this should be real simple. if you don't like the tournament then don't join.
if you like the tournament then join.
i for one think these tourneys make cc more fun. keep up the games and thanks for all the work that you guys do.

[johnkelly00]

echoing what a few others have said...

If someone is going to spend their free time creating and managing a tournament for the enjoyment of others, I think the only restriction should be that they do a good job of it.

I have only been in a handful of tourneys and I have found that some are done top-notch and others seem to be chaotic.

My biggest problem is that I have a hard-time remembering who did a great job (and I want to keep joining their tourneys whether they are running 1 or 100) and who did a piss-poor job (and I don't want to join their tourneys even if they only have one).

So... maybe their should be a more structure approach to ranking the tourney organizers because I think that would help self-regulate the whole situation.

[anthroguy]

I really like having many tournaments to choose from and I'm grateful that some players are generous enough with their time to provide this website with them. I'd much rather spend a bit of time scanning through the create/join pages to find a good tournament than visit that forum only to find there are very few tournaments to join. Seriously, if you are so busy that you can't spend 10 minutes looking through the forum, then how do you have to time to devote to CC at all?

[scottp]

If you don't like a setting, avoid it, if you don't like a map, avoid it, if you don't like a tournament avoid it! Just because it isn't for you doesn't mean it isn't the ONLY reason that other members enjoy CC.

this

+1

I find it ironic that the only real complaint here that i can find is "too many". Why is "too many" bad? If someone wants to join a tourney that's different from what HA and B6 are offering, it isn't THAT hard to find them.

Seems like a bunch of ingrates complaining that someone is giving them too many choices.

Leave them alone. THey're starting GOOD tourneys that A LOT of folks have gained enjoyment from, and they FINISH their tournaments. THat should be the only criteria considered.

TO who start tourneys and don't finish them should be criticized.

HA and B should be THANKED, not attacked.

The sense of entitlement and "authority" the mods and staff on this website have is astonishing. Simply amazing.

[jricart]

This is ridiculous guys! We dont get paid to create tournaments and people complaining about it?

Come on! we create tourneys because we have the time and the commitment to run them. I max out my tournament contribution medals, same as HA, Bart and B00060, and we keep creating them for the fun of the players. We are not doing this for the medals.

I decided this year to focus on create more tournaments for the spanish speaking community in CC, and also keep running my Formula 1 and other General tournaments.

Lets think about this:

What would happen if B00060, HighlanderAttack, Bart and me decide not to run anymore tourneys? You will have 10 open tourneys in half a page Bones! Do you really want that?

A guess all of us cant leave without tourneys! I dont join all of HA and B tournaments, because there are some maps that Im not good at, so why bother!

i dont see any Tournament Contribution made by you Bones, so why you dont spend some time trying to help us creating new tournament with brilliant ideas as you mention? I guess is because you dont have the commitment to!

Nothing personal, but if you dont like the tournaments they create, dont join them, and spend a couple of minutes scrolling thru the pages to find the ones that fit on you.

[jpcloet]

I voted other and failed to read most of this thread. HA, there are a few of us here that can do bigger and better things and I challenge you to do something bigger and better than 16 player events. I generally do tournaments once in a while when I feel that the same old same old is happening. Be innovative and set a new standard, I know you can do it. Step up to your massive potential.....

[Dako]

Ok, the problem that tournaments are not creative and boring. Most of them are - random map (or one map) and best of 4 (7) singles games, 16 players. What are you competing over in such tourneys? King of the trash can who won one of 11 same tournaments he signed in?

No offense, but it is really hard to find good tournament to sign up for (like team games or league with many maps). So what I see here is few options, I will try to describe all of them properly:

1. Limit number of pending tournaments to 3 max per creator.
   This will just slow down the way the tournaments are played but nothing will change all together - same cheap random 1v1 tourneys.
2. Strict medals to award only distinguished tournaments.
   I mean it is ok to award the guy who did his first tournament with 16 players, but when he made more than 30 of such tournaments - what is the point of awarding there? Restriction can apply to the variety of tournaments or to the number of players/rounds/games. Will force TO to create more interesting tournaments or that last over 2 weeks. But still, most of them don't do that for medals. People join for medals.
3. Divide tournaments forum into 2 categories.
   Team/singles or short/long term or anything else. Will not change anything, but will ease the browsing of the tournaments forum. Also, will keep the good amount of tournaments for everyone here with any taste.
4. Limit the pending number of similar tournaments.
   Will slow down most of the uncreative TO and will force them to really choose the setting and prove that their tournament is interesting and is not only liked by the crowd but also brings the quality to CC.

So my major point - what is the reason to create many similar tournaments over and over again? Why don't you start something really hard to manage (try to handle TLO, heh) if you have so much time to create small tournaments?

Try to be creative.
One map for the whole tour - 0 creativity.
Random maps for the whole tour - 0 creativity.
Always the same brackets - 0 creativity.
Always the same scoring - 0 creativity.
Always the same TO - 0 creativity .

What I really want to see in CC - not the numbers ("ohhh, i have 100+ tournaments", or "ohhh, I created over 1k 1v1 tournament games"), but the quality of the tournaments, their diversity, the real challenge, not just the dice throwing.

Good tournaments attract good players/teams - that is the real purpose of a tournament - struggle with the best rivals to reach the top to see who is the best. Clearly, the best.

And I don't try to flame o attack HA or B - they are good guys, but they are doing the same job over and over again... that is just boring. Why not start something new? I know that people like to play 1v1 random - because it is easy to win and earn a shiny medal. But that is unacceptable. Where is the honor in that? I don't see any.

Hope you read that and considered.
Cheers,
Dako.

[Johnny Rockets]

The quality of the tourny depends on the organizer.

The cream rises to the top, gentlemen. If your tourny isn't filling up then perhaps it sucks,
Or your previous efforts were found wanting.

The members will decide whose they wish to play in by the quality of design and promptness of execution.
Serious tourney players will take the moment to scan a few pages of what sounds interesting.
Any interference is Fucking Stupid, and an insult to those that spend a great deal of time and effort to bring a positive experience to the paying members that fund your ass.

Leave it Alone.

Johnny Rockets

[HighlanderAttack]

I voted other and failed to read most of this thread. HA, there are a few of us here that can do bigger and better things and I challenge you to do something bigger and better than 16 player events. I generally do tournaments once in a while when I feel that the same old same old is happening. Be innovative and set a new standard, I know you can do it. Step up to your massive potential.....

Maybe you need to check out my tourneys I have ran:

Around All CC's Maps: Caribbean Islands
Around All CC's Maps: CCU
Around All CC's Maps: Centerscape
CC DYNASTY LEAGUE SEASON 1
Around All CC's Maps: Chinese Checkers
Around All CC's Maps: Charleston
Around All CC's Maps: Circus Maximus
Around All CC's Maps: City Mogul
Around All CC's Maps: The Citadel
Around All CC's Maps: Conquer 4
Around All CC's Maps: Conquer Man
HA's Saint Patricks Day Tourney
Around All CC's Maps: Crossword
Around All CC's Maps: D-Day: Omaha Beach!
Around All CC's Maps: Doodle Earth
Around All CC's Maps: Discworld
Around All CC's Maps: Draknor - Level 1
HA's Arms Race Addiction
HA's April Fools Day Tourney
HA's Easter Tourney-TWO
HA's Easter Tourney-ONE
Around All CC's Maps: Draknor - Level 1-TWO
HA's Tax Day Tourney-ONE
HA's Tax Day Tourney-Two
HA's Round Robin Series-Classic Shapes
HA's Round Robin Series-Classic Art
HA's Round Robin Series-Classic Shapes-TWO
Around All CC's Maps: Egypt: Upper
Around All CC's Maps: Egypt: Valley Of The Kings
HA's Round Robin Series-Africa
Ha's-4-3-2-1-Classic Art
Ha's-4-3-2-1-Age of Merchants
HA's Arms Race Addiction-TWO
HA's Memorial Day Tourney
Ha's Cinco de Mayo
HA's Random 1v1 Major+
HA's Random 1v1 Major+ TWO
HA's Arms Race B-Day
HA's Labor Day Tourney
HA's Random 1v1 Major+THREE
In Memory of 911
HA'S MANUAL CLASSIC
HA'S BIG MANUAL CLASSIC
HA's Classic Dubs Major+ONE
HA's Columbus Day Tourney
HA's Halloween Horror
HA's Random 1v1 Major+ FOUR
Around All CC's Maps: Europe
Around All CC's Maps: Europe 1914
HA's Foggy/Sunny-ONE
HA's Random 1v1 Major+ FIVE
HA's P-I-G-ONE
HA's Classic Dubs Major+TWO
HA's Random 1v1 Major+ SIX
HA's Round Robin Series-Luxembourg
HA'S MANUAL CLASSIC-TWO
HA's Foggy/Sunny-TWO
HA's Veterans Day Tourney
HA's Don't Blink-Classic Art
HA's Don't Blink-Classic Shapes
HA's Don't Blink-8 Thoughts
HA's Don't Blink-Africa
HA's Don't Blink-Age of Merchants
HA's Thanksgiving Day Tourney
HA's Don't Blink-Age Of Realms 1
HA's Don't Blink-Age Of Realms 2
HA's Don't Blink-Age Of Realms 3
HA's Classic Dubs Major+THREE
HA's Don't Blink-Alexander's Empire
HA's Don't Blink-American Civil War
HA's Don't Blink-Ancient Greece
HA's Don't Blink-Archipelago
HA's Don't Blink-Arctic
HA's Don't Blink-Arms Race
HA's Don't Blink-Asia
HA's Don't Blink-Australia
HA's Don't Blink-Austerlitz
HA's Don't Blink-Bamboo Jack
HA's Don't Blink-Battle For Iraq!
HA's Don't Blink-Battle Of Actium
HA's Don't Blink-BeNeLux
HA's Don't Blink-Berlin 1961
HA's Don't Blink-Brazil
HA's Don't Blink-British Isles
HA's Don't Blink-Cairns Coral Coast
HA's Don't Blink-Cairns Metro
HA's Don't Blink-Canada
HA's Don't Blink-Caribbean Islands
HA's Don't Blink-Castle Lands
HA's Don't Blink-CCU
HA's Don't Blink-Charleston
HA's Don't Blink-Chinese Checkers
HA's Don't Blink-Circus Maximus
HA's Don't Blink-City Mogul
HA's Don't Blink-Classic
HA's Don't Blink-Conquer 4
HA's Don't Blink-Conquer Man
HA's Random 1v1 Triples-ONE
HA's Random 1v1 Triples-TWO
Around All CC's Maps: Feudal War
Around All CC's Maps: Extreme Global Warming
HA's Happy New Year Tourney
HA's Christmas Gifts
HA's Classic Dubs-ONE
HA's 105th Tourney
HA's Nuclear Random just win one


The Don't Blink is a new series and I want to complete it on every map.

AACM had all kinds of different formats

My 105th tourney looks like it will have 200+ players in it

Christmas has 138

Most are 1v1 but that is what I like to run but I also had a 125 multi player tourney and I have dubs and a 1v1 Trips. I have so many variations it is hard to list them so come on.

I can go on and on about all the different types and amount of players I have done.

All this thread does is want me to say F-this and move on to something else.

[freakns]

first of all, this is just simply ridiculous discussion. i have played many tournaments organized by many people, and i found out this:
-there is one thing i truly hate... i hate when tournament organizer go behind his schedule. this is the thing that pisses me off the most. i dont give a shit if he went visiting his grandmother on moon, or he is on a break of discovering perpetuum mobile, or his net provider went to jail so he has lost internet access... or whatever other stupid thing people can think of. he made commitment, stick with it. end of discussion. (and for those who have life so it usually stops them from running tournaments on time... then fucking dont run them). and as far as i know, people that running most tournaments(HA, blitz and b00060) finished all their tournaments, always been on time, and when started they tend to keep them alive. so i really dont see a problem if someone is making 65 tournaments at once if he is able to keep the pace. i found boring to play all those 1 vs 1 tournaments, so i stop playing them. simple as that. but that doesnt mean they shouldnt be organized. even 65 of them in same minute. if people enjoy playing them, who the f*ck cares how many of them are running?!?

anyhow, my support goes to tournament organizers. keep up a good work lads

[phantomzero]

Wow, this is a crazy thread. Almost wish I hadn't opened it!

To say that people like HA shouldn't create a bunch of tournaments that people JOIN and play and enjoy is absolutely crazy. What the f*ck do we have tournaments for?

Some people, myself included, don't have time to play in many season long tournaments as I can't guarantee my time commitment 6 months in the future.

I've also ran two 16 player tournaments that filled in 2 days. I didn't have a problem filling the positions. The reason people like smaller tournaments is that they are done quickly and aren't a huge time burden.

Maybe CC should just get rid of all tournaments? That would make people really happy!

phantomzero

[b00060]

HighlanderAttack wrote: All this thread does is want me to say F-this and move on to something else.

Exactly!

[denominator]

I'm torn on this one.

There are currently only 4 "rules" for running tournaments, and while this is not the time or the place to discuss that, I would like to point out that all of the tournaments in question do fall into those rules.

The second thing that I would like to point out is that if you're going to call people out by saying something along the lines of "certain people have too many tournaments at once", you might as well actually call the people out. I personally find it way more offensive to hint at someone doing something wrong than straight up telling them and having a mature discussion about it.

As for the actual issue, I think bart's dead on with it - it's a matter of etiquette more than a matter of rules needing to be instituted. I, as a premium player, prefer the tournaments with more depth - tournaments like NFL Season 1v1, The Legend of Tor Na'mit, or GameZZone: Starcraft, where you have to put in some effort both inside and outside of the games to succeed in the tournament. However, I often join the quick hitting 1v1, 4-rounders or the 16>4>1 bracket tournaments as they're easy and they put me in games I wouldn't otherwise be playing. I especially see this for freemium players who only have up to 4 games to commit to tournament (at most), and would prefer to play the shorter quicker tournaments so they can play more.

However, we all have to understand that there are limits. This is especially clear in the tournament section, where your pool of freemium players can only physically play in up to 4 tournaments. Premium players are also limited, as I (considering myself an average tourney player here) manage about 80 games at a time - of which 40-60 are tournament games. By creating so many tournaments at once the pool gets very diluted - to the point that I physically cannot join all the tournaments that I would like.

While I understand this is not an issue for organizers like b0060 or HA or Blitz as their tournaments are small, it does create major issues for other organizers trying to fill out larger tournaments with higher player involvement.

It all boils down to being aware of what the Create/Join a Tournament forum looks like. The only reason we should limit an organizer to the number of tournaments s/he can run - if they are unable to handle running the number they are trying to run. If an organizer can run 5, 10, 20, or even 100 tournaments at a time effectively, let them. Just be aware when doing this that creating a pile of tournaments at once is disrespectful to the other organizers out there, and to the players. As a player, I want to know that the organizer is going to put some effort into the tourney I joined to make it work, and seeing a long list of tournaments that are all the same makes me question that.

[JOHNNYROCKET24]

I just wanted to see if anyone out there may agree with me or not as I find it fairly ridiculous that about 30 tournaments listed in the first page of "Create/Join a Tournament" are being run by two organizers.

Is there any chance we can limit the number of tournaments each organizer can have waiting for participants so that we stop getting flooded with new ones? Most, if not all, of the tournaments I'm referring to are simple "4-round, win 4 games total" tournaments as well, so we've lost ANY creativity in the structure too.

Please note that I'm not suggesting any limits on how many active tournaments someone can have, only a limit on ones waiting for players. It's no wonder some original tournaments struggle to get members when we have way too many (uncreative) options out there at once.

players are going to join whatever tourney they feel like joining. The amount of "unoriginal" tourneys ( whatever that might be ) doesnt make a difference. Thats one good feature about this site. The privlidge to pick and choose what you want to play. If someone wants to spend all their time hosting tourneys instead of playing games than they should be permitted to do so. They paid the 25 bucks for the entertainment. I say let them do what they want. Whats next? Dictating how many games we can play ?

also, 50% already voted not to cap the amount of tournies.