Matrix mafia Day 3 - no-one died? [Abandoned]

[edocsil]

Flow, why would he lose his investigative powers? He just said he couldn't be lynched NKed or recruited. If he is telling the truth we will get a confirmed townie who is unimaginably overpowered. good to have on your side. If he is lying, well then it is LaL anyways. What have we got to lose?

You have not given any hits as to your role only to why you think your right in choosing others. Vote Edocsil

I have. A good player would be able to guys my alignment looking at my play. You also are not supposed to claim in order to place a vote. Your accusations and arguments against me are non-existent, and are likely only done in a transparent attempt to divert attention from Sax.

[strike wolf]

And you have xuereb? Edoc is right you don't usually hint purposely at your role unless you have reason to especially if you have a good role. Vanilla townies will sometimes hint at being power roles to mislead mafia but you don't hint at your role unless you have reason to or you actually want to direct people's actions toward you.

[TheSaxlad]

Flow, why would he lose his investigative powers? He just said he couldn't be lynched NKed or recruited. If he is telling the truth we will get a confirmed townie who is unimaginably overpowered. good to have on your side. If he is lying, well then it is LaL anyways. What have we got to lose?

You have not given any hits as to your role only to why you think your right in choosing others. Vote Edocsil

I have. A good player would be able to guys my alignment looking at my play. You also are not supposed to claim in order to place a vote. Your accusations and arguments against me are non-existent, and are likely only done in a transparent attempt to divert attention from Sax.

And looking at your play. Trying to lynch a known townie, The oracle for gods sake with your sum mate strike wolf who also seems out to get me in not playing to the towns strengths now is it?

vote edocsil

[TheSaxlad]

I thought you two were good enough not to let us all know that you two are allianced in some way?

[safariguy5]

I think what TheSaxlad says makes sense.
In the movie the Oracle was protected by seraph, so it would make sense for her to be unlynchable/bullet proof till seraph dies.
I think it is not worth testing the lynch if it is going to take away the oracle's investigative powers.
Seriously, everyone should unvote TheSaxlad.

25th of January. There will be a lynching on that day. Probably in the evening, CC time.

Lynch deadline is coming soon and whoever has the most votes is going to get the lynch.

My money is currently on Edocsil as scum. Vote Edocsil

Flow, why would he lose his investigative powers? He just said he couldn't be lynched NKed or recruited. If he is telling the truth we will get a confirmed townie who is unimaginably overpowered. good to have on your side. If he is lying, well then it is LaL anyways. What have we got to lose?

Confirm.

Anyways, if he is Oracle, then a close viewing of The Matrix is going to disprove a lot of his claim. The idea that he can't be recruited is false. Agent Smith was able to do that easily. Even Seraph was unable to stop that. And more importantly, the Oracle retained her investigative powers even after being taken over. That's how she was able to forsee her victory against Neo in Revolutions. If this is a game that follows the characters faithfully, then this is not a 100% correct role for the Oracle.

[TheSaxlad]

Yes but that was when smith actually got his powers, at this point we can be pretty sure hes just a normal agent.

[safariguy5]

Yes but that was when smith actually got his powers, at this point we can be pretty sure hes just a normal agent.

But Smith was destroyed at the end of the first Matrix and got he replication powers during Reloaded. The Oracle program as shown at then end of Revolutions retained her abilities but Smith was able to use them when he replicated over her.

[TheSaxlad]

and the oracle got a facelift at the end of the second one but i sure as hell aint having surgery.

[strike wolf]

Yes but that was when smith actually got his powers, at this point we can be pretty sure hes just a normal agent.

If you look aage said this game is mostly based off of the sequels probably so that him being a recruiter made sense without him having to be destroyed by Neo first.

[VioIet]

I am a tracker and a investigator 2 in one. however I can only use my powers on one person per night.

at the mo im on l-1 by my count so if someone could unvote me that would be quite nice please.

Don't worry, my vote is on commander.

But okay, just trying to make sure I understand. So Sax, you can investigate and track, but only on one person?

Lets say you choose commander for instance.

So you could both track and investigate him one night. But you couldn't investigate him and track someone else. Both powers have to be used on the same person?

And btw all, I have never seen the movie, don't really know anything about it or the characters in it- so this thread is very hard for me to follow. Maybe I should be replaced for that very reason.

[TheSaxlad]

Yes but that was when smith actually got his powers, at this point we can be pretty sure hes just a normal agent.

If you look aage said this game is mostly based off of the sequels probably so that him being a recruiter made sense without him having to be destroyed by Neo first.

well why not. why shouldnt there be a condition he is only allowed to recruit if he is lynched or night killed?

[TheSaxlad]

I am a tracker and a investigator 2 in one. however I can only use my powers on one person per night.

at the mo im on l-1 by my count so if someone could unvote me that would be quite nice please.

Don't worry, my vote is on commander.

But okay, just trying to make sure I understand. So Sax, you can investigate and track, but only on one person?

Lets say you choose commander for instance.

So you could both track and investigate him one night. But you couldn't investigate him and track someone else. Both powers have to be used on the same person?

And btw all, I have never seen the movie, don't really know anything about it or the characters in it- so this thread is very hard for me to follow. Maybe I should be replaced for that very reason.

That is perfectly correct vioiet.

Im not sure commander is the best person to have a vote placed on though.

[strike wolf]

complicated mechanic mostly. Doing too much weird stuff with roles makes the game harder to predict balance. It's a good thing if players can't predict how the game should work out balance wise it's good for making the game interesting and unpredictable but it's bad if the mod can't. But mainly when I read back and saw that the mod said it's based primarily off the latter two movies I took that to refer mainly to Agent Smith as he was the only character who was really different in the 2nd and 3rd movies than in the first. The others were either mostly the same (except for an arguable case about Neo) or weren't in the first one. I could be wrong and I'm not an expert on the Matrix movies so if you have reasons based on the movies to assume I am wrong than please let me know but that's the way I read it.

[edocsil]

Flow, why would he lose his investigative powers? He just said he couldn't be lynched NKed or recruited. If he is telling the truth we will get a confirmed townie who is unimaginably overpowered. good to have on your side. If he is lying, well then it is LaL anyways. What have we got to lose?

You have not given any hits as to your role only to why you think your right in choosing others. Vote Edocsil

I have. A good player would be able to guys my alignment looking at my play. You also are not supposed to claim in order to place a vote. Your accusations and arguments against me are non-existent, and are likely only done in a transparent attempt to divert attention from Sax.

And looking at your play. Trying to lynch a known townie, The oracle for gods sake with your sum mate strike wolf who also seems out to get me in not playing to the towns strengths now is it?

vote edocsil

You had just gotten finished say you were three things, bulletproof, unlynchable, and unrecruitable. with a claim like that why the f*ck wouldn't we lynch you? We would know for certain that you were town and all of those things you had previously said. That would have been the proper time to say that lynching would cost you your vote. If you are telling the truth you are an idiot who didn't analyze the consequences of your actions, and if you are lying you are doing a piss poor job of it. Then, before saying there were ANY consequences to you lynch you get all defensive and OMGUS those who follow the simple logic behind attempting to lynch you.

So now I call you out as a liar. If you were not bluffing you would not have done things the way you had, you are better then that. I don't know what parts are wrong but your whole claim stinks and I desire to see the truth.

[Mr. Squirrel]

replacing freezie. I'm gonna read and post sometime this week. We will see how it goes

[/]

Yes, I believe we could use an extension to sort this out, considering the presumed "cult recruit" theme of this game, I may be able to see how a tracker/cop could be a possible role, think about it.
sax investigates smith, result scum, targeted 00icon, this way the role could effectively see the the scum and the person recruited. now on the other hand this type of role indeed seems like a game breaker.... I can also understand the doubt of it's legitimacy. hmmmm, on one hand I still suspect edo, but the claim really does seem overpowered for a small game, it almost seems like something scum might say to bait a crucial role into counterclaiming.
I think I'll unvote for now so we don't rush into a lynch too fast.

[Flow520]

Flow, why would he lose his investigative powers? He just said he couldn't be lynched NKed or recruited. If he is telling the truth we will get a confirmed townie who is unimaginably overpowered. good to have on your side. If he is lying, well then it is LaL anyways. What have we got to lose?

You have not given any hits as to your role only to why you think your right in choosing others. Vote Edocsil

I have. A good player would be able to guys my alignment looking at my play. You also are not supposed to claim in order to place a vote. Your accusations and arguments against me are non-existent, and are likely only done in a transparent attempt to divert attention from Sax.

And looking at your play. Trying to lynch a known townie, The oracle for gods sake with your sum mate strike wolf who also seems out to get me in not playing to the towns strengths now is it?

vote edocsil

You had just gotten finished say you were three things, bulletproof, unlynchable, and unrecruitable. with a claim like that why the f*ck wouldn't we lynch you? We would know for certain that you were town and all of those things you had previously said. That would have been the proper time to say that lynching would cost you your vote. If you are telling the truth you are an idiot who didn't analyze the consequences of your actions, and if you are lying you are doing a piss poor job of it. Then, before saying there were ANY consequences to you lynch you get all defensive and OMGUS those who follow the simple logic behind attempting to lynch you.

So now I call you out as a liar. If you were not bluffing you would not have done things the way you had, you are better then that. I don't know what parts are wrong but your whole claim stinks and I desire to see the truth.

This has already been addressed edoc. Turning a deaf ear and restating the same argument just makes you look scummy because your desire to nerf a town power-role becomes strikingly apparent...

[edocsil]

This has already been addressed edoc. Turning a deaf ear and restating the same argument just makes you look scummy because your desire to nerf a town power-role becomes strikingly apparent...

Your right, it has been addressed by me and ignored by you and sax.

[Flow520]

This has already been addressed edoc. Turning a deaf ear and restating the same argument just makes you look scummy because your desire to nerf a town power-role becomes strikingly apparent...

Your right, it has been addressed by me and ignored by you and sax.

That's not true at all. Secondly, if we keep re-posting things instead of having the patience to read back a few pages, this thread is going to get awfully long and confusing...

[safariguy5]

I'd like to put in a word about relative power here. If the Oracle is this powerful, and granted she is pretty strong, how strong would Neo be? And Smith would be damn near indestructible. To be clear here, the Oracle has no real fighting or toughness power. Her power derives from her ability to see into the choices we will make. But even that power has limits. It seems to me that her role would be an investigative one, but without any sort of protection. So intrinsically, the Oracle is not a physically strong character. Certainly, Seraph could be helping her, and Flow is giving me a pretty strong impression that he may be Seraph because he seems to be the only one strongly defending Sax, but I don't see how unlynchable would be part of Oracle's role, especially since we already had an unlynchable townie. Unless this is some blanket role where all programs are unlynchable, which would make coming to a lynch really difficult in this game and may break the mechanic given that Smith is technically a program too.

On a side note, brilliant mafia theme here aage. Major props for that.

[edocsil]

This has already been addressed edoc. Turning a deaf ear and restating the same argument just makes you look scummy because your desire to nerf a town power-role becomes strikingly apparent...

Your right, it has been addressed by me and ignored by you and sax.

That's not true at all. Secondly, if we keep re-posting things instead of having the patience to read back a few pages, this thread is going to get awfully long and confusing...

Hey you know what? why don't you go back to page 25 and read to here, I think it would be informative.

TLDR version

1. PG 26 We go to lynch sax because his huge ass analysis sucked and we considered it rampant disinformation
2. PG 26 At ~ L-6 he claims unlynchable
3. PG 26 He claims bulletproof until someone dies (the seraph but we don't know this yet)
4. PG 26 I state my desire to attempt to lynch him to test his unlynchability
5. PG 27 Sax says something about a cookie, if you have seen the movies you immediately know he is the Oracle
6. PG 27 Claims That it is likely he cannot be recruited for now
7. PG 27 Flow says that Icon lost his voting power. Icon had been unclear on this IMO Says there could be consequences for a lynch
8. PG 27 Currently Sax is at 5 votes, depending on how Icon's vote counts L-2 or 3
9. PG 27 Sax says "Guys if you lynch me then you lose both the investigative role and a tracker." This is odd as he is unlynchable
10. PG 28 We discus the plausibility of an invulnerable cop/tracker
11. PG 29 He finally claims that he loses his vote after an attempted lynch.
12. I get wagoned for wanting to go for a lynch that appears to have not consequences besides proving the truth. I state my opinions Pages 26-28 before he claims his loss of power.


That little synopsis is why I think this stinks. It doesn't make sense. How would I have know that Sax would lose his vote? And that makes me scummy how? I think Sax is pulling a fast one because of how defensive he and flow got.

One other thing, I would like Icon to vote for someone, myself if no one else, I want to see if he has a vote or not. I would also like and official statement for how many it take to lynch right now.

[safariguy5]

really! You couldn't have voted for Sax then? honestly ppl. it's a shame for your day one votes to go to waste.
aage if you please:

Uhoh, this sounds bad.

It's not that bad.


1. Tailgunner
2. Edoc 5 ( Freezie, 00iCon, strike wolf)
3. VioIet 1 saxlad,
4. Haggis
5. Freezie
6. Strike Wolf
7. TheSaxlad 1 ()
8. Commander9 1 (vioIet (no they don't stack))
9. 00iCon 7 (edoc, Chu, xuereb, tails, /, Saxlad, Haggis)
10. Flow520
11. xuereb
12. / 1 ()
13. Chu
14. Flores

I'd like to take the "L-1" statement from two pages ago back... I missed Edoc'sil's unvote. For some reason I mixed him and Saxlad up and thought he was unvoting vioIet :s

Anyway, since this day is dragging too long anyway and everyone was expecting a lynch, I think it's best to throw one.


It's a good day. The weather is just perfect, the sun is shining, a few of the most beautiful clouds slowly pass by. Sati opens the window to get a better look at them.
"Hello, there," she says to the birds flying around.
"How are you?" she asks the cat that lazily lies in the sun.
"Who are you?" asks a woman behind her.
Sati turns around. Several men in suits and long coats come walking in.
"Ah, the last exile," says one of them, "we found her."
"You'll have to come with us," says another.
Sati doesn't find them very friendly, but she comes with them allright. What could possibly happen?

00iCon - Sati - Innocent Child (unlynchable towny) has been lynched!

"Where are we going?" Sati asks. The men do not answer. Sati looks up at the sky again; she sees a few birds flying around happily, as if playing a tag game. She smiles. Although artificial, the Matrix is a beautiful place.
The car stops. The men bring Sati into some shabby storage house. In there, several other people are waiting. The building looks menacing. Sati isn't as happy as she was ten minutes ago. The building scares her, and the men now do, too.
"So, you found the suspect?" a loud voice asks. The men answer in short nods.
"Suspect?" Sati asks. "What do you suspect me from?"
A man walks up to him. "Stop playing games, now. We suspect you're in liege with the Agents of the System. It wouldn't surprise me, since all programs have some weakness for these three."
A woman behind him coughs.
"Roland..."
The man turns around. "What?"
"I don't think this girl is one of them."
The man looks at the girl again. "She doesn't look like one, that's true... But they all work for them. All of them."
"If she would," the woman continued, "don't you think they'd have found us by now?"
The man couldn't retord.



Day 1 continue. Since you guys managed to lynch the guy that would drag the day on even longer, I'll give you a deadline.


25th of January. There will be a lynching on that day. Probably in the evening, CC time.

Ok, this scene is important in that it implies that there may have been only 1 unlynchable. Which makes Sax lying about being unlynchable. Which means he's scum.

vote Saxland

[VioIet]

That is perfectly correct vioiet.

Im not sure commander is the best person to have a vote placed on though.

Why do you think it is wrong? Do you know something about his alignment that I don't. Besides the fact that he knew 00icon's alignment before anyone else did?

[00iCon]

fine, you want me to prove my lack of voting powers, vote: edocsil.

ebwop, commander could be morpheus or oracle.

he may have been trying to avoid mafia knowing he was oracle, or he could be lying now.
But i really doubt mafia would come out and try to direct the game as much as he has.

[TheSaxlad]

fine, you want me to prove my lack of voting powers, vote: edocsil.

ebwop, commander could be morpheus or oracle.

he may have been trying to avoid mafia knowing he was oracle, or he could be lying now.
But i really doubt mafia would come out and try to direct the game as much as he has.

TBH edoc has been the one dictating the game to everyone else...

vote for this person, i dont like the look of it vote for that person...

Correct me if im wrong but he was behind both mine and ooicons lynch.

If I am to die today, then I believe that there are at least 3 scum. Edocsil, Strike Wolf and Safariguy.

I hope that if I die they will be the subject of whatever powers you have left.