Romeo and Juliet Mafia - Capulet Victory. +Paris+John

[Leehar]

Thats possible. But wouldn't the friar or whoever wanting to keep Juliet and Romeo to get married and run away to live happily ever after make sense?

[TheGeneral2112]

I am staying on no vote. I think that general and co have duped us. Why would the general be needed alive? It makes no sense, you are lying. The only reason people believe it is because the mods words have been twisted.

You clearly have your own agenda and that is Romeo and Juliet must survive and nothing else. There WC as either peace as they say, or survival for Romeo and Juliet which thegeneral just confirmed.

By the way the remaining Capulets are Peter and Lord Capulet, lets stop chap from claiming as now it is pointless. He will claim one of these names and then we will have no idea whether he is telling the truth because the Capulets are removing support from r&j and co. Instead I offer everyone else a truce, until we get rid of romeo and juliet. Remember montegues that the apothecary is still out there and could kill, this means that you have not necessarily lost which is definitely true if you play along to the Green factions plans. Think about it, this is a game of deceit why would your stated WC not be your actual WC?

1) I'm drunk so this may not be coherent.
2) This is part of my win condition. Juliet, Romeo, and Brother Lorenzo must be alive. I think I am included because in the play, I am the narrator and stay alive to the very end.
3) The mods words have not been twisted. The mod has confirmed there is an alternate ending. One that my faction is assigned. We are to convince you of some fucked up shit in order to allow most players to win.
4) Our win condition is not just that R&J survive as you stated. It is a fucked up win condition that requires both families to work together. This is THE HARDEST win condition ever in that we need to convince people to work together to achieve a common goal that requires lynching one of each party. This is not easy, but it stops the fighting and provides peace.
5) The remaining Capulets are NOT Peter and Lord Capulet. They are Lord Capulet, Capulet's wife, and Tybalt. I have 2 players that are Capulet out of these 3 names, I just don't know who is who. There is no Peter.
6) I don't real have a number six, but since I am drunk I decided to add another number.

[zimmah]

There is a ton of catching up to do for anyone joining...my pending case which seems to be gaining little or no traction is against No Survivors. It seems especially scummy to me for him to disappear at the exact juncture a case was made against him.

I want to start with third party id's...

First let me state what we know...based on mod reveals:

General=friar lawerence
edoc=montegue alligned (but not montegue family character)
Prince Escalus=eldoradio (learned through his death)
No survivors is a third party, non-affiliated character with the role of modified bus-driver

Second, let me state what I feel can be safely deduced from what has been revealed:

there ought to be a capulet alligned (but not capulet family character)
Dazza has claimed Friar John, and has given every indication thus far of indeed being friar john...and has not been counter claimed.

My personal deductive reasoning from a wikipedia list of romeo and juliet characters (accompanied by my reading of the actual play):

No survivors, being third party, and not being a friar, mercutio, parris, or the prince...has to be the apothecary.

Why should this matter...or why is this a threat?

The apothecary character in the play is responsible for the poisoning of Romeo...which leads to the death of Juliet. Leehar has argued that he had no intention of killing Romeo...but in a play about the inevitability of fate...intentions play little role. No apothecary...no death of romeo and juliet.
It is believable to me that the friar's would have a win condition based on the survival of a collection of characters. Conversely, for the apothecary to have fulfilled his role in the play, a killing of certain players (particularly romeo and juliet) would have to carried out. The apothecary is therefore a threat to both families.

What do I think we should do?

I strongly believe we should lynch the apothecary and eliminate this threat to both families. Benvolio (Montegue) has been killed, but there are still 9 family members left. This is more than enough to lynch the apothecary if we work together. I don't know anything about edoc or the general's win conditions...but they have both hinted strongly that everyone working together helps them. That seems to me like a lot folks who could benefit from this lynch...but probably more than anyone would be Romeo and Juliet.

How much are you willing to bet that No survivors was the apothecary?

I will claim my character and role if I'm wrong on this one. If I'm wrong it hurts me, if i'm right...it helps a bunch of folks sleep better at night.


Closing thoughts

Ghostly has claimed montegue
jgordon has claimed montegue
victor sullivan is mod confirmed capulet

8 people's id's and affiliations are unknown...7 or those are going to be family members (montegue's and capulets). The one non-family member not accounted for as yet is Count Paris (likely affiliated with the Capulet's counter to Edoc's role). Count Paris logically also has an interest in Juliet's survival, so I don't see where anyone voting for the apothecary would be at risk of revealing information about themselves...but I might be wrong about this last part...that's just my own logic working.

I have already voted No Survivors...a bunch of folks said they wanted to hear from him before doing the same...and then he vanished. I say the time is now to act. Don't let him protect his role and whoever or whatever he was working with or for by running out on the game. Finish No Survivors and let's be rid of the apothecary.

please don't use red except for voting, votecount is being worked on.

[TheGeneral2112]

Thanks, zimmah.

[zimmah]

Vote count

[1] TheGeneral2112 - SPARTACUS1974, (L-7)
[1] edocsil - ghostly, (L-7)
[1] nosurvivors safariguy - alt1978, (L-7)
[5] chapcrap - leehar, sg7, edoc, general, jgor, (L-3)

[all those guys below have 0 votes but can be voted]
Victor Sullivan pmchugh
JGordon
Shieldgenerator7
dazza2008
new guy1
ghostly447
Bleed_Green
Leehar
SPARTACUS1974

there's 14 alive so 8 votes are needed for a lynch

[edocsil]

I am staying on no vote. I think that general and co have duped us. Why would the general be needed alive? It makes no sense, you are lying. The only reason people believe it is because the mods words have been twisted.

You clearly have your own agenda and that is Romeo and Juliet must survive and nothing else. There WC as either peace as they say, or survival for Romeo and Juliet which thegeneral just confirmed.

By the way the remaining Capulets are Peter and Lord Capulet, lets stop chap from claiming as now it is pointless. He will claim one of these names and then we will have no idea whether he is telling the truth because the Capulets are removing support from r&j and co. Instead I offer everyone else a truce, until we get rid of romeo and juliet. Remember montegues that the apothecary is still out there and could kill, this means that you have not necessarily lost which is definitely true if you play along to the Green factions plans. Think about it, this is a game of deceit why would your stated WC not be your actual WC?

Our WC is insane. I have really had no hope of winning this game from the onset. If any of the three of us die its a big puddle of suicide and general will be endgamed. Or he dies and Juliet and I just lose. If it was just survive I would be fine, but it isn't. We have to convince you to stop fighting as well.

[pmchugh]

I am staying on no vote. I think that general and co have duped us. Why would the general be needed alive? It makes no sense, you are lying. The only reason people believe it is because the mods words have been twisted.

You clearly have your own agenda and that is Romeo and Juliet must survive and nothing else. There WC as either peace as they say, or survival for Romeo and Juliet which thegeneral just confirmed.

By the way the remaining Capulets are Peter and Lord Capulet, lets stop chap from claiming as now it is pointless. He will claim one of these names and then we will have no idea whether he is telling the truth because the Capulets are removing support from r&j and co. Instead I offer everyone else a truce, until we get rid of romeo and juliet. Remember montegues that the apothecary is still out there and could kill, this means that you have not necessarily lost which is definitely true if you play along to the Green factions plans. Think about it, this is a game of deceit why would your stated WC not be your actual WC?

Our WC is insane. I have really had no hope of winning this game from the onset. If any of the three of us die its a big puddle of suicide and general will be endgamed. Or he dies and Juliet and I just lose. If it was just survive I would be fine, but it isn't. We have to convince you to stop fighting as well.

What you are claiming just doesn't make sense. In the play it is the death of Romeo and Juliet that leads to peace, not their survival.

[edocsil]

Don't look at me. All I know is that I am allied with Juliet, who I knew, and Brother Lorenzo, who I didn't know. If any of them are dead I cannot win. After vigs are dead a NL day results in victory.

[shieldgenerator7]

I can believe in the alternate WC, although my role PM doesn't say anything abput it either.

of course now that we have romeo exposed we have to get vig out today unless we can count on montague doc to protect edoc

otherwise our said WC will have to take place. oh wow... this is so intense

-SG7 ( )

[pmchugh]

I can believe in the alternate WC, although my role PM doesn't say anything abput it either.

of course now that we have romeo exposed we have to get vig out today unless we can count on montague doc to protect edoc

otherwise our said WC will have to take place. oh wow... this is so intense

-SG7 ( )

Haha I like it. I don't know whether or not to trust them. The thing is we know we can win if we kill the other family, we don't know we can win if we kill the vig. What are the montegue's thoughts on this?

[SPARTACUS1974]

Confirm!

I believe people wanted my name and alignment.

I am Count Paris, Survivor. I redirect targets, so sort of like a one-way busdriver. I could ask the mod for my night actions if you guys would like.

And now it all falls together. Spartacus is the Apothecary. We will take care of this tomorrow.

Also, night actions would be useful in seeing if Dazza's results were affected or if a vig kill was changed.

general look into this a little more insted of guessing first i was a count now i am a apothecary who will i be later today lol, again i am neither and yes i am a family member

I had no idea what you were until now, spartacus. Now I know. I was just baiting you into giving me more information.

lol its not hard to work out i was not 3rd party with the players who have claimed already

[jgordon1111]

Well my role is lord montague, as I first stated My original intent was to kill capulets including juliet,then after rereading zimmahs scenes and scenario's I changed up.

Here is why Romeo is a montague,but he doesnt win If all capulets are eliminated.

When I thought about that and the timing of the game and zimmah saying see if we can rewrite history, I changed my mind and decided killing the vigs was the best plan,just in case there is a WC zimmah kept from us,to see if romeo and juliet could convince everyone to stop killing each other

[pmchugh]

Well my role is lord montague, as I first stated My original intent was to kill capulets including juliet,then after rereading zimmahs scenes and scenario's I changed up.

Here is why Romeo is a montague,but he doesnt win If all capulets are eliminated.

When I thought about that and the timing of the game and zimmah saying see if we can rewrite history, I changed my mind and decided killing the vigs was the best plan,just in case there is a WC zimmah kept from us,to see if romeo and juliet could convince everyone to stop killing each other

Hmm the thing that worries me is that it is edoc and thegeneral who are playing this role which is why they might be more persuasive than a couple of noobs.

Thegeneral did you say there are 5 people in each family? It seems there are a lot of people presumed to be family members. I have 11 suspected family members, which obviously doesn't work.

[SPARTACUS1974]

well i said about 6 pages ago i thought that there was 6 in each family or aligned with 4 left for 3rd party just trying to work out who with who

[pmchugh]

well i said about 6 pages ago i thought that there was 6 in each family or aligned with 4 left for 3rd party just trying to work out who with who

If that is the case then I have everyone pegged as I can slot someone who I thought was third party into the montegues.

Currently we need 8 to lynch with 6 alive capulets, if dazza and sarifguy are willing to to vote with us we have a guaranteed win. If you guys are really survivors then it doesn't matter who wins to you guys. Also we have a monopoly on killing roles. This is how we win.

What do you say dazza and sarifguy?

[pmchugh]

Actually never mind I counted Juliet as a capulet, we don't have the numbers.

[edocsil]

well i said about 6 pages ago i thought that there was 6 in each family or aligned with 4 left for 3rd party just trying to work out who with who

If that is the case then I have everyone pegged as I can slot someone who I thought was third party into the montegues.

Currently we need 8 to lynch with 6 alive capulets, if dazza and sarifguy are willing to to vote with us we have a guaranteed win. If you guys are really survivors then it doesn't matter who wins to you guys. Also we have a monopoly on killing roles. This is how we win.

What do you say dazza and sarifguy?

4-5 Capulets. Juliet is with me, not you.

[pmchugh]

well i said about 6 pages ago i thought that there was 6 in each family or aligned with 4 left for 3rd party just trying to work out who with who

If that is the case then I have everyone pegged as I can slot someone who I thought was third party into the montegues.

Currently we need 8 to lynch with 6 alive capulets, if dazza and sarifguy are willing to to vote with us we have a guaranteed win. If you guys are really survivors then it doesn't matter who wins to you guys. Also we have a monopoly on killing roles. This is how we win.

What do you say dazza and sarifguy?

4-5 Capulets. Juliet is with me, not you.

Ya I realise that now.

It looks like:
5 caps
5 monts
4 team r&j
2 survivers

Leaving alive:
5 caps
4 monts
3 team r&j
2 survivers

I originally thought it would be a kind of 4 factions thing with 5-5-4-4.

Can we get a deadline and some prods (blood green for instance) to get things going?

[SPARTACUS1974]

as it stands i think we gotta trust the other wc

[SPARTACUS1974]

sorry for double post
unvote

[alt1978]

I would like to go back to the claim by safari guy about being Count Paris. That is not at all who I had down for likely being Count Paris, nor is it who General had pegged as Count Paris. The modified bus-driver role doesn't make any sense for Count Paris...and if dazza had not gotten the role I think this would have slipped by me.

Let me go back for a second to night one scene...in that scene the presence of a doctor is clearly alluded to.

If the Family has 5 members...which I think I've been screaming but seems to have been going in and out of favor as people dig through this game...that leaves...

2 Masons (ghostly confirmed this when he outed the montegue vig and counter claimed)
1 vig
1 Romeo/Juliet whose roll we don't yet know
1 Role Blocker (jgordon confirmed this role)

There is no doc in this list. No doc or body guard. Yet this covers the roles of the five family members. The only person left to be a doc or body guard for the family (and it fits with the play) is for Mercutio and Paris to have the body guard/doc role.

There is not way in my mind that Safari Guy (formerly No Survivors) would have a modified bus-driver role as that character.

Look at what the apothecary does in the play. his poison redirects a death from it's intednded home. Is that not more set up perfectly to be a modified busdriver of some sorts.

Dazza, I know I've been angling against you from time to time so far but I think you came through with some huge info with the role, and I appreciate you sharing it.

No Survivors was...Safari guy is the apothecary.

There was no one else for him to claim, the role doesn't make sense with his claimed character...and I'm not going to step down off of my soap-box. He made a great claim coming in...but we had no survivors dead to rights and under the pressure of being found out he ran to try and save his team. There's no reason as I've stated before not to work together to make this lynch.

Unvote nosurvivors...Vote Safari Guy (but it's really the same vote because of the switch in players)

Also...my apologies for using red earlier...didn't realize but now know.

[shieldgenerator7]

Ok, alt, from my role I know a few things you said are incorrect but I can't tell you which parts without revealing my role...

I don't hear a counterclaim, so I'm assuming saf was telling the truth when he said he's Count Paris and will continue to believe this until I hear a counterclaim.

-SG7 ( )

[pmchugh]

Hmm, is there room for an apothecary in this game? Who is more likely, the apothecary or Count Paris?

Unlike alt I think there are 6 on each side, including r&j. Then you have the two brothers and the prince. This leaves space for only one more character and that character is sarifguy.

[zimmah]

Can we get a deadline and some prods (blood green for instance) to get things going?

deadline about 12:00 pm (noon) CET wednesday, which would be like 14 hours from now.

bleed green has posted on the previous page.

[edocsil]

Hmm, is there room for an apothecary in this game? Who is more likely, the apothecary or Count Paris?

Unlike alt I think there are 6 on each side, including r&j. Then you have the two brothers and the prince. This leaves space for only one more character and that character is sarifguy.

Had to consider this for a bit. Safari is a liar.

Paris exists, his WC is my death.

Either he is Paris and he is faking his survivor claim or he is not Paris and he is lying about his character. I find the WC lie to be far more plausible.

With his busdriver role claimed (and verified) this could be serious for me. He could easily remove me from protection and he is a formidable enough player to accurately throw me in harms way to kill me.

Unvote Vote Safari.