Matrix Mafia Endgame, Town and Survivors win!

[jak111]

That's why we can get info, if their active, they'll speak >:)

State the obvious. Anyhow, not all those who are on 'no vote' are inactive (like freezie said). So, what was this post trying to accomplish?

It wasn't trying to accomplish anything, it's just a list of people who aren't voting atm so whom are free to put their vote on someone for pressuring. If you read too far into me you'll land in a paradox loop o.O

[SPARTACUS1974]

so jak wants us to vote just for the fun of it ?

if he read my post its says that i am still unsure of neb but as yet there is no need to use my vote he is at l3 so there is still enough preasure there.

ok off to sea will post again tonight

[betiko]

i personally think it's possible that tank could be a vt. saf could have only chosen regular humans fighting the matrix to be vt. I know it doesn't mean much but that's my second game moded by saf and last time there were a lot of vts out of a 16 player game.
Last time he gave fakeclaims to mafia, so it could be an official fakeclaim character as well.
My vote stays on IB because I think he is over defensive; but at least he's in the game now.

[Leehar]

So go back to page 22 and recheck my list IB before trying to say that I didn't mention Spartacus in my list.

I stand corrected. I am sorry I have not lived up to your expectations. I didn't realize I was playing against a pro such as yourself.

I'm always looking for pointers from vets such as yourself so I look forward to your future posts.[/quote]
not sure if it was sarcasm, but he's not a vet

Vote Count

Neb(6)- Skillfu, eldario, everywhere, cm5, mob, edoc
betiko(1)- cowboyz
dazza(1)- freezie
eldario(2)- Neb, yoshi
hippo(2)- sound, jonty
IB(1)- betiko
MoB(1)- hippo

With 24 alive, it takes 13 to lynch.

Deadline is midnight May 1st, PST. If no lynch is decided by then, the day will end in a no lynch.

3. jak111
5. Iron Butterfly
8. Leehar
9. skillfusniper33
12. Eldario
13. SPARTACUS1974
14. Djfireside
15. dazza2008
19. Roussallier replaced by Some7hingClever
21. shieldgenerator7
22. thechuck51
23. ghostly447

12 people not voting... Hmm, anyone think we should squeeze out one or two information spoils? I'd go with IB, Dazza, Betiko, or Eldario if anyone agrees on one of them to squeeze some info out, hmm?

It'd be great if you'd get your numbers to balance...
and then you go out of your way to mention betiko when he's not in your list at all (voting IB) and input Eldario on the list and your mentions as well when he's in the vote count on Neb?

Nice putting yourself into the list, was that supposed to be a testament to your honesty or did you want to undermine what you were saying from the beginning?

[Nebuchadnezer]

All 4 people that are 'not voting' are actually speaking and voicing their thoughts. I see no reason to pressure them for 'not voting' when they are contributing. Especially since dazza clearly posted her itentions...

But I am still waiting on Neb's answer to my question, before I take another route.

What questions were you waiting for me to answer freezie?

Just out of the blue..this post strikes me as odd..You vote yourself to get activity, and, I beleive, hope to catch someone on your bandwaggon..And when everyone votes you for your strange behavious, you ask other people to makes cases?

I mean, you're not completly wrong. But most of these people have a reason to vote you. Jak more or less does to my eyes, but you're still trying to place the pressure you got yourself on other people.

If your reasons to vote yourself are what I think them to be, why don't you create something, instead of waiting for others to do it?

Are these your questions? Okay, I'll give them a shot...

1. Well, without bandwagons, you don't have any history of people voting. Which means you can't pressure anyone, or make a case on them. I got the bandwagon going. Why would I be the only one to make a case? Of course I expect that others will make a case and get discussion going. That was the whole point of my shenanigans...get people talking.
2. I will make a case. However, I'm not sure what you think my reasons were for voting myself were. And really, I'm not going to create anything. I will make a case based on facts, when the time is right. So, tell me, why do you think I voted myself?

Does that answer your questions? If not, please let me know what they are.

[safariguy5]

Vote Count

Neb(5)- Skillfu, everywhere, cm5, mob, edoc
betiko(1)- cowboyz
dazza(1)- freezie
eldario(2)- Neb, yoshi
hippo(2)- sound, jonty
IB(1)- betiko
MoB(1)- hippo

With 24 alive, it takes 13 to lynch.

Deadline is midnight May 1st, PST. If no lynch is decided by then, the day will end in a no lynch.

[cowboyz]

Headed to work, I have like 7 pages to catch up on. Will do later on.
unvote

[ghostly447]

I am sorry guys, I havent been able to keep up with this game. I will make 1 more attempt tonight and into tomorrow, but if I cannot keep up, I am not doing town any good and will have to ask to be replaced to allow for a better game experience for everyone else.

Adam

[jak111]

Yes Leehar, I missed a single voter, what are you going to do? Burn me to the stake for missing a single name? Like I said it was just a simple list so we knew who was able to put their votes somewhere without having to take their votes away from another source.
If I must explain why I picked the four that I did, then I challenge you to do the same thing every time you place your vote on someone.

I put IB on the list because he/she is active yes, but I haven't played with this person and he/she has only really picked up the pace when I called him/her out on it. It could be said about a few people here but I'm interested in learning IB's tactics quickly.

I put Dazza on the list because he's... on and off this game, so far I usually see him getting in someones face, so either he's trying to lay low this time or he doesn't have a major role, either way it's useful perhaps getting info on him.

This is my second game with Betiko, again I'd like to learn his/her playing strategies. If he/she is scum it'd be useful catching him/her in a lie. Or if he/she is town it'd be useful getting aid into him/her.

Finally Eldario... This is another player I haven't played with before. Seems to be an agreeable target a while back.

I mean if you'd like I could change my list to Leehar, Leehar, Leehar, and what do you know... Leehar.

None of the people I mentioned do I wish to be lynched, I simply am looking for info for today to go on tonight.

[Leehar]

Yes Leehar, I missed a single voter

Again, you seem to have an amazing means to miss the obvious, I'm questioning is whether it's by error or by intent.

show: For those interested+Jak

Moving along now, the tank = vt claim has promise?
Lets disect it:

I'm not a vt
saf seems unlikely to put vt's into his games (confirmation dubious)
Claimed character has slim vt flavour relation (confirmation subjective)

Thus, claim has insufficient basis, argument fail

Anything else?

[Iron Butterfly]

So you made your list not for the common good of catching scum but in learning tactic of players you are playing? You make no mention of pressuring scum behavior. In essence you are creating a list that fits to your criteria and not anyone else.

What you seem to be saying is that you want others to pressure me to claim not because I have done anything wrong but because I would suit your agenda. You want to learn my tactics, whatever that means. You also seem to believe that you are the reason I am now posting actively. Having a child and family, job and real life drama combined with a useless joke vote phase AND other Mafia games couldn't possibly been the reason. In your eyes, because you got me playing that now entitles you to put me on a list to be pressured to claim?

At the end you seem to imply you don't want us lynched you just want information to take into the evening, which implies you would be happy with a no lynch as well.

[Iron Butterfly]

So you made your list not for the common good of catching scum but in learning tactic of players you are playing? You make no mention of pressuring scum behavior. In essence you are creating a list that fits to your criteria and not anyone else.

What you seem to be saying is that you want others to pressure me to claim not because I have done anything wrong but because I would suit your agenda. You want to learn my tactics, whatever that means. You also seem to believe that you are the reason I am now posting actively. Having a child and family, job and real life drama combined with a useless joke vote phase AND other Mafia games couldn't possibly been the reason. In your eyes, because you got me playing that now entitles you to put me on a list to be pressured to claim?

At the end you seem to imply you don't want us lynched you just want information to take into the evening, which implies you would be happy with a no lynch as well.

The statement was addressed to jak as Leehar had fastposted ahead of me.

[dazza2008]

Vote Jak.

I don't think he answered what I asked earlier and his play here has been strange. His reasons for the players on his list to be pressured are weak. He is not scum hunting just wanting to pressure players to learn tactics or because I am not "in someone's face".

His whole play here looks like scum trying to look town.

[jak111]

Vote Jak.

I don't think he answered what I asked earlier and his play here has been strange. His reasons for the players on his list to be pressured are weak. He is not scum hunting just wanting to pressure players to learn tactics or because I am not "in someone's face".

His whole play here looks like scum trying to look town.

What did you ask earlier?

Yes Dazza, you're usually in someones face about things. This game you seem to lay back a bit more than usual.

Also, I seem to have ruffled IB's feathers a bit. If I'm wrong, sorry, but it does go a bit together for you to get a bit more active in this game.

Yes Leehar, I missed a person, I never bothered doing the math of each voter, I just looked at the voters and deleted their name from a full list of all the players (Hence the numbers from the first page beside them). I'm shaping my playing style, making sure I am not.. predictable to the scummies. If you do not believe me on that, believe me when I say.... I want to be, the very best. Like no one ever was ♫ x3. But seriously, I want to be feared by any scum player. Which one day I shall make that happen. For now, yes, I'd like some info, see what we can prove and disprove, while learning how they think and where they cast their powers toward, hmm?

[Iron Butterfly]

Vote Jak.

I don't think he answered what I asked earlier and his play here has been strange. His reasons for the players on his list to be pressured are weak. He is not scum hunting just wanting to pressure players to learn tactics or because I am not "in someone's face".

His whole play here looks like scum trying to look town.

What did you ask earlier?

Yes Dazza, you're usually in someones face about things. This game you seem to lay back a bit more than usual.

Also, I seem to have ruffled IB's feathers a bit. If I'm wrong, sorry, but it does go a bit together for you to get a bit more active in this game.

Yes Leehar, I missed a person, I never bothered doing the math of each voter, I just looked at the voters and deleted their name from a full list of all the players (Hence the numbers from the first page beside them). I'm shaping my playing style, making sure I am not.. predictable to the scummies. If you do not believe me on that, believe me when I say.... I want to be, the very best. Like no one ever was ♫ x3. But seriously, I want to be feared by any scum player. Which one day I shall make that happen. For now, yes, I'd like some info, see what we can prove and disprove, while learning how they think and where they cast their powers toward, hmm?

No need to apologise as we are playing mafia. You do however seem to confuse "ruffling my feathers" with me presenting a counter argument your perception and logic. Dazza also brings up an interesting point of you perhaps being scum acting like Town. I can't disagree with him. We have more then a week till deadline and yet you act as if we need to vote now instead of letting the game develope organicly. You forcing the issue makes me a tad suspicous.

That combined with the fact that you havn't mentioned looking for scum. You seem more interested in getting people to claim so you can go into night with information suggesting to me you seem more interested in a No Lynch with several peole claiming.

Bad Math does not show people you are unpredictable it shows you are either bad at math or have an ulterior motive.

Vote Jak111

[jak111]

Once again, it's not bad math, I did not bother using math, I simply deleted the names from the list as I looked at the voters, I overlooked a single person, whoopie.

Also, it may just be me, I mean I am a bit mentally insane, but we have a week. With not many people really active daily we need 3-4 days just to make a bandwagon. Let alone a lynch? I'm not a big fan of D1 lynches, never have been because we're truly blind unless someone slips or goes inactive completely. No, I do not WANT a no lynch but for now I'd like some info to be able to judge on who we try for today. Would you prefer us to bandwagon someone randomly, and once they claim F them, they're chosen to die anyhow. I'm not as one track minded as that, so sorry for the inconvenience of not being so easy to manipulate. You see, my thought train has many tracks and sometimes it splits midway through to be on two tracks at once. Right now it's on the track of information, I want info before I blindly lynch a useful player. It seem more scummy to me, WANTING to lynch without getting the info first. Anyone else agree?

[jak111]

Also, forgot to note before I clicked submit.

Does anyone else get that atm the only people voting for me were on my list of four? Either their afraid I'm out to rip them limb form limb or they're very self defensive for some reason about my list. Is not all lists somewhat random? Is it odd to find yourself on such a list?

[betiko]

i think jak is playing with a different gameplay from our last game were he was a vt. and you don't try to be feared by scum, that s a good strategy if you want to be night killed (unless you are bomb or bulletproof..)
and i think we obviously need a day 1 lynch, it's the town's only weapon. for all these reasons, will jump on this bandwagon as well.

unvote, vote jak

fastposed

[jak111]

If you must pursue me, then at least stop at L-2 so I can defend myself.

[Iron Butterfly]

Also, forgot to note before I clicked submit.

Does anyone else get that atm the only people voting for me were on my list of four? Either their afraid I'm out to rip them limb form limb or they're very self defensive for some reason about my list. Is not all lists somewhat random? Is it odd to find yourself on such a list?

Your saying your list is "somewhat random"
Is that like saying the dice here at CC are "somewhat random"?
Either your list is random or it is not.

If your list is random that implies that there was no pre existing criteria for that list, which is obviously not the case.

So your list is not random. I can only speak for myself but other then the fact that you felt you had to nudge me to comment in game and you wanted to learn my tactics you have no real reason to pressure me. You have made a list of several people you are telling players to pressure including myself. I on the other only have a list of one and that is you.

Unlike you I have a list of why I believe you are acting scummy.
1) You are acting extremely impatient to pressure players and don't seem to care about the reasons.
2) You implied that you only care about gathering information going into night without mentioning you are trying to target scum.
3) You create a mathematical list to prove a point only to be shown it is meaningless yet you want to use it as valid information to pressure players.
4) Your overzealous nature draws concern that you could be Mafia acting as Town.

Finally you raise the "Doesn't anyone find it suspicious that everyone on my list is voting against me?" defense, which suggests to me that you are the one defensive. Void of sound argument you imply that we all must be mafia because we stood up to you.
What are the odds that all of us are Mafia and because of your expertise you would be able to sniff us all out?

Nope! This player reserves his right to argue right back into your face when he feels the arguments presented are void of substance and yet are being used as a valid reason to be pressured or lynched. In fact I use the power of my vote to make my point.

[jak111]

Well besides you being 10 of my posts back, most of your points aren't really valid.
3.) I ALREADY STATED IT'S JUST A LIST OF NON-VOTERS, NOTHING MORE. Anything more and it is what your mind thinks I was saying.
2.) I've stated that I want info before I say "Oh this guy's scum, this one over here is DEFINITELY scum' yadda yadda yadda.
4.) That is pretty much my style every game. I like to be.. pro-active ;o X3
1.) I care for the reasons, I'm digging for more reasons however. With info comes a bit more knowledge (it also makes counter claims possible)

So unlike you, I am not beating a dead horse. I am looking for new horses to make nay

[Nebuchadnezer]

Well, I had this all put together yesterday, but sat on it, while I thought about it. It seems others are feeling like I am…so, I’ll post this now…it basically goes along with what others have posted, but I’m using his posts as reference…

Okay, I'm going to put this together, and it’s quite long…please read it all, and bear with me. Something bothers me about jak111. So, I'll go over his posts and see if there is anything there or not.

Hmm, who's up for weeding the inactives out?

This was early on in joke voting, so no big deal here. However, I think he shows a pattern here that bothers me.

While IB should've attempted to at least speak in the first few Real Life days of this game, he/she has began posting finally, though I must say that Neb is OMGUS'ing so badly this game for some reason. Also he is avoiding speaking up when so near a lynch, bad choice and scummy mate.

Unvote, Vote Neb

Again, where was my OMGUS? I think OMGUS implies that I’m voting someone just because they voted me. I did point out some things that were odd to me…does that make every point I’m making in this post an OMGUS, because you voted for me?

Also, I don’t know how you can say I avoided speaking up when I was near a lynch?
I claimed at L-2. What else did you want me to do?

uh i voted him as well so i think you put him at l-1 jak

Hmm, must've miscounted I thought he was still at L-3. Unvote, though if 3 more townies agree with me to vote you Neb, I'm putting you back on the edge. We want to start getting some info to go off of and you seem to be the target today for said info.

Here is another example of jak’s pattern. He’ll vote me if 3 more townies agree to vote me? What does that even mean? If 3 more had voted me, I would have been lynched. Why are you seeking the approval of other townies before you’ll act? And, don’t you think the bandwagon on me provided as much info as a lynch? All you were missing was the hammer and mafia isn’t hammering if they’re smart. I think that’s a good amount of info…but still you seem keen on killing me…for the sake of getting “info.”

uh i voted him as well so i think you put him at l-1 jak

Hmm, must've miscounted I thought he was still at L-3. Unvote, though if 3 more townies agree with me to vote you Neb, I'm putting you back on the edge. We want to start getting some info to go off of and you seem to be the target today for said info.

Understood. I am the easy out for a lazy town lynch.

Who do you think we should pressure? We gotta start with someone and you seem to be our target for today for info. So get to speaking before two other people beat me to lynching you.

Again the push for me to say more…wanting someone else to lead the charge…all while wrapping it up with a threat that he’ll lynch me.

lol...in my zeal to get activity, all I did was put the target squarely on myself. My big bluster allowed everyone to pile on me without suspicion, or to stay away from with the same result. i screwed myself. I was hoping someone else would pick up on something, while I was in the midst of my rambling...and now you expect me to come up with something? I was the bull in a china shop...everyone else should be watching what comes out of the mess I made.

So...jak111...why don't you come out of your safe place and perhaps name someone you'd like to go after? haven't I caused enough distraction? you really think anyone will follow what I say now?

Iron Butterfly
Cowboyz (Never said anything since two days ago and that was in the joke vote stage)
Crazymilkshake (Never posted much of import besides joking around or voting band wagon votes with NO explanation)
Eldario (made 3 posts, 1 to join, 1 to confirm, and one to vote Neb)
Ghostly (made 3 posts, 1 to join, 1 to confirm, and one to say he was reading up on the game 3 days ago)
Soundman (For only joke voting, making himself lay low and seem active every 2 days)
Spartacus (Only joke voting so far, also hasn't posted in 3 days)

These are the “mini cases” jak has referred to making. These are not cases. This is a statistical regurgitation of what has happened up until now. What I’m doing here…this is a case.

Well, if neb IS a vanilla townie lynching him at this stage won't hurt. If he isn't: BONUS! We still have time on the deadline though so unvote. I like to prolong the day and watch the scum stew.

+1

I'm trying to bring a few cases forward though I strongly believe Neb dug his own grave.

As I pointed out, those weren’t cases. Jak continues to try to prove that he’s working for town…yet again the reference to my inevitable lynch.

For people questioning if I'm skimming. The post above me explains it a bit.

ok for now unvote i was only joke voting .

been looking up and im still a little unsure that tanks would be a vt it just doe's not seem to fit but heyho the last couple of roles ive had, did not really fit .

i see the hippo is still jumping around with his votes i know he does this in his games but his votes seem to be moving about alot quicker in this game or is this just me ?

im gonna have a proper read through to see what else pops up

fastposted by soundman

I find it highly unlikely that he's just a simple VT. So yes, there is info still lurking around him. Otherwise, for people questioning if I skim, you are skimming yourself when I helped Neb out with making a list of smallish cases. Unlike most of you I'm keeping tabs on everyone. Checking their recent activities and checking their posts. So please, stop skimming over my posts too quickly and setting up an OMGUS vote (which is not only used for when a person votes for the person who voted them but also can generally be used when the person just makes a hypocritical post or just a case that sucks in general, which a lot of you seem to be going the first and a few the second).

Furthermore, I've stated that I will not vote for Neb unless I see more town wanting to pressure him further, please refrain from taking my cases and voting out of context people. Any of you who have played with me before know how quickly I can turn those around against the skimmer him/herself.

Here’s where jak starts to get muddled. 1. He’s again questioning my claim…trying to keep the doubt fresh in everyone’s mind about my claim. 2. He refers to his “cases”…which I pointed out are NOT cases. 3. Again, he’s waiting for town to take action against me…

Finally, he starts another pattern…the reference to himself as the next coming of the greatest mafia player ever. Please note, he refers to himself this way.

I mentioned Spartacus, so I have a question for you. Are you going to make any cases? Are you going to point more things out that I haven't mentioned earlier? I haven't played with you before IB, so I do hope you try to make a good first impression, because so far you're doing worse than my first games with CLEVER. Mind you Clever didn't do so bad, but me and him were new players to this forum around the same time, and he's made scum slips when he's been town o.O...

So go back to page 22 and recheck my list IB before trying to say that I didn't mention Spartacus in my list.

This is where he continue to emit his attitude of greatness. “IB better get in line or the great jak111 will take him down.” Granted, IB was wrong with his info…it’s the almighty attitude that jak111 takes that bothers me.

Vote Count

Neb(6)- Skillfu, eldario, everywhere, cm5, mob, edoc
betiko(1)- cowboyz
dazza(1)- freezie
eldario(2)- Neb, yoshi
hippo(2)- sound, jonty
IB(1)- betiko
MoB(1)- hippo

With 24 alive, it takes 13 to lynch.

Deadline is midnight May 1st, PST. If no lynch is decided by then, the day will end in a no lynch.

3. jak111
5. Iron Butterfly
8. Leehar
9. skillfusniper33
12. Eldario
13. SPARTACUS1974
14. Djfireside
15. dazza2008
19. Roussallier replaced by Some7hingClever
21. shieldgenerator7
22. thechuck51
23. ghostly447

12 people not voting... Hmm, anyone think we should squeeze out one or two information spoils? I'd go with IB, Dazza, Betiko, or Eldario if anyone agrees on one of them to squeeze some info out, hmm?

And this post. Again he’s asking town what to do. Jak111, make a case. If town agrees with you, you’ll get plenty of votes.

What did you ask earlier?

Yes Dazza, you're usually in someones face about things. This game you seem to lay back a bit more than usual.

Also, I seem to have ruffled IB's feathers a bit. If I'm wrong, sorry, but it does go a bit together for you to get a bit more active in this game.

Yes Leehar, I missed a person, I never bothered doing the math of each voter, I just looked at the voters and deleted their name from a full list of all the players (Hence the numbers from the first page beside them). I'm shaping my playing style, making sure I am not.. predictable to the scummies. If you do not believe me on that, believe me when I say.... I want to be, the very best. Like no one ever was ♫ x3. But seriously, I want to be feared by any scum player. Which one day I shall make that happen. For now, yes, I'd like some info, see what we can prove and disprove, while learning how they think and where they cast their powers toward, hmm?

I guess this is the epitomy of jaks play this game. It’s a bit selfish. He wants to be the super-ultimate-mafia-hunter, and town be dammed how he gets there.

Once again, it's not bad math, I did not bother using math, I simply deleted the names from the list as I looked at the voters, I overlooked a single person, whoopie.

Also, it may just be me, I mean I am a bit mentally insane, but we have a week. With not many people really active daily we need 3-4 days just to make a bandwagon. Let alone a lynch? I'm not a big fan of D1 lynches, never have been because we're truly blind unless someone slips or goes inactive completely. No, I do not WANT a no lynch but for now I'd like some info to be able to judge on who we try for today. Would you prefer us to bandwagon someone randomly, and once they claim F them, they're chosen to die anyhow. I'm not as one track minded as that, so sorry for the inconvenience of not being so easy to manipulate. You see, my thought train has many tracks and sometimes it splits midway through to be on two tracks at once. Right now it's on the track of information, I want info before I blindly lynch a useful player. It seem more scummy to me, WANTING to lynch without getting the info first. Anyone else agree?

Now jak is changing his tune from earlier in the day. Previously, it was “Neb, don’t push me or I’ll lynch you.” Now it’s, “we don’t need a lynch today.” Make up your mind jak.

Also, forgot to note before I clicked submit.

Does anyone else get that atm the only people voting for me were on my list of four? Either their afraid I'm out to rip them limb form limb or they're very self defensive for some reason about my list. Is not all lists somewhat random? Is it odd to find yourself on such a list?

And again, he pulls out the veiled threats/I’m-so-good-you-shouldn’t-kill-me talk again.

Summary:

1. jak111 is constantly saying he’ll go this way or that way, depending on what town wants to do. Keeping himself in the light as a pro-town player, yet not quite taking the lead on one single case.
2. He keeps bringing up his doubts about my claim, and the inevitability that I will have to be lynched. He treats it like there is no other choice.
3. His attitude that he is the best player and can hunt down scum better than anyone. Like town would be lost without him. And he’s so smart that we should do what he says…only problem is, he isn’t saying anything worthwhile. He isn’t leading anything.
4. His only attempt at anything was to “ruffle the feathers” of Iron…which I think failed miserably.

So, there’s my case. Basically, like others have pointed out something is rubbing me wrong about jak’s play.

VOTE jak111

[DoomYoshi]

Yea, he can be a jerk. Pretty regular play from what I have seen of jak though.

[freezie]

1. Well, without bandwagons, you don't have any history of people voting. Which means you can't pressure anyone, or make a case on them. I got the bandwagon going. Why would I be the only one to make a case? Of course I expect that others will make a case and get discussion going. That was the whole point of my shenanigans...get people talking.

Don't get me wrong, I completly understand that trying to spring some conversation is good, and that was your wish. However, I don't like your '' I got the bandwaggon going on me. Now you guys can finish what I started'' attitude. I mean, if you're really town, you'll still try to make a case of the BW you got. Unless you don't mind dropping the scumhunt. If others seem other stuff, they'll start a case on their own.

2. I will make a case. However, I'm not sure what you think my reasons were for voting myself were. And really, I'm not going to create anything. I will make a case based on facts, when the time is right. So, tell me, why do you think I voted myself?

And here you contradicted yourself, saying you will make a case, althought you clearly stated your itentions of letting other people make a case.

Does that answer your questions? If not, please let me know what they are.

Yup, that was the questions.




Although, for now, the case on Jak is a lot better. At least in my oppinion.

[Nebuchadnezer]

1. Well, without bandwagons, you don't have any history of people voting. Which means you can't pressure anyone, or make a case on them. I got the bandwagon going. Why would I be the only one to make a case? Of course I expect that others will make a case and get discussion going. That was the whole point of my shenanigans...get people talking.

Don't get me wrong, I completly understand that trying to spring some conversation is good, and that was your wish. However, I don't like your '' I got the bandwaggon going on me. Now you guys can finish what I started'' attitude. I mean, if you're really town, you'll still try to make a case of the BW you got. Unless you don't mind dropping the scumhunt. If others seem other stuff, they'll start a case on their own.

Are you reading this, or just trying to paint me in a bad light? "Why would I be the only one to make a case?" This clearly means I will make cases. However, I also expect others to make cases as well. There is no attitude of having everyone else do the casework for me. I can post my own cases. I just want others to do the same.

2. I will make a case. However, I'm not sure what you think my reasons were for voting myself were. And really, I'm not going to create anything. I will make a case based on facts, when the time is right. So, tell me, why do you think I voted myself?

And here you contradicted yourself, saying you will make a case, althought you clearly stated your itentions of letting other people make a case.

Read my previous comment. There is clearly no contradiction. I question both your logic and your motives in this post. You seem to be coming out of nowhere with you conclusions, just to try to make me look shady. Why is that?

Does that answer your questions? If not, please let me know what they are.

Yup, that was the questions.

Although, for now, the case on Jak is a lot better. At least in my oppinion.

Please note...a lot of people made a case on jak111...as well as me. This would be what I was referring to...everyone making cases. This one just happens to be everyone getting the same vibes from the same player.