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Postby Guiscard on Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:02 am

Fo Sho wrote:No Safer? I doubt any person on Earth would argue with the fact that since Saddam Hussein is dead, not only are the people of Iraq safer but so is the rest of the world. And political gain?

Bush had nothing to gain politically by going into this war. You could argue wrongly that we would get economic gain from the oil there. But politcal gain makes no sense. And yes it is a lot of money, but you are thinking from your own individual small perspective. In the grand scheme of things, and also compared to any of the previous wars we've had, this amount, while definitely not small, is also just as definitely not huge.


Oh come on. Think about it a little...

No safer? This is the videotaped statement given by one of the suicide bombers (who, incidentally, came from Leeds, the city where I live, not Afghanistan or Iraq):

What you have witnessed now is only the beginning of a series of attacks which will intensify and continue to until you pull all your troops out of Afghanistan and Iraq.

Would that attack have happened in the UK if we were not supporting American foreign policy in Iraq and Afghanistan? No. It wouldn't. Neither would the Madrid bombings in Spain. I'm not even gonna attempt to convey the loss of life in Iraq either, because others have done it as wel as I could.

Ok your second point... Bush (and America as a whole) has EVERYTHING to gain politically from this war. You'd be completely ignorant to deny there was at least the hope of political gain in Iraq, and you'd be hard pressed to find a political scholar or commentator who disagreed with me. Every war is for political gain to one degree or another.

You obviously aren't gonna believe the arguments, but at least accept that the reason we went to war (to get rid of WMDs) was a misconception, and has been certified so by official governmental reports of both the US and the UK (I've supplied those before in this thread so I'm not going to now).

We changed the motivation to war to be 'freeing the Iraqi people from a dictator' after we had invaded. Now lets assess this claim. Pakistan has a dictator AND nuclear weapons... Should we not invade them? Robert Mugabe in Zimbabwe is perhaps the worst dictator after Stalin and Hitler, and has committed numerous genocidal atrocities, but we don't invade Zimbabwe... So why invade Iraq? If we trust our leaders when they say they wanted to get rid of a genocidal dictator then there must be some other factor that influenced their choice.

Those factors include:

Oil - The second or third largest reserves in the world at the moment, and just before the invasion Saddam changed the currency of oil exchange to the Euro, taking a lot of trading power away from the US. A US-backed regime in Iraq would move back to the dollar and supply lucrative contracts for US companies. These companies and oil barons are George Bush's prime supporters. They're his friends, his family and his source of electoral funds. I in no way think this is the SOLE cause of the Iraq war but I just want you to see political benefits Bush has gained from invasion, even if we do take the given reasons for war to be true.

American Hegemony - Israel is awfully isolated isn't it? Iran seems to be in the process of developing Nukes, and is gradually becoming a very major player in the Middle East. The US needs to do more than just keep pumping arms into Israel to ensure it has political influence in the Middle East. A US-backed democratic state would work wonders! Whatever state Iraq ends up in, there WILL be an extensive US military presence in the Middle East indefinitely. They can site missiles, build airbases... All in reach of Iran and Syria, the main aggressive states. Thats a political advantage. The US military will now have a significant force in the region to almost work as a 'tag-team' with the Israeli military should anything 'kick off', as it were.

Political gains make a lot of sense. And I'm discounting the attempted (but not achieved) political gains of coming out looking like a strong war President (and PM in the UK, which is one of the few gains we'd share over here), and also the fact that if a democratic state HAD been created with ease then it most likely would spread to other Middle Eastern countries thoruhg people saying 'hey, those guys over there have a McDonalds but we're not allowed one... dissent dissent dissent.'
qwert wrote:Can i ask you something?What is porpose for you to open these Political topic in ConquerClub? Why you mix politic with Risk? Why you not open topic like HOT AND SEXY,or something like that.
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Postby Iz Man on Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:25 am

Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "I'm sorry sir, did I offend you in some way?"

Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "Please sir, I'm sorry I have offended you. Is there a way you could help me understand why you have all this hate for me?"

Mugger: *punches Guis twice in the face and laughs at him*

Guis: "I really believe we can reach some common ground here. I just want to be freinds. Perhaps I should give you some of my money."

Mugger: *punches Guis 3 times & kicks him in the forehead*

Guis: "OK, that's starting to hurt. I really would prefer that you stop hurting me. I just want to understand you; I really really want to be your friend. Can we maybe go over there under that tree, sip some tea, and peruse my Thesaurus? I use it all the time when I post on the web"

Mugger: *Beats Guis to a oozing blob of sobbing pulp to the ground*

:lol: :lol: :lol:
It's just so fitting..... :P
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Postby alex_white101 on Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:32 am

^^^^^ you sir, are a jackass. i hope you are eaten by a rampaging pack of wild dogs.
''Many a true word is spoken in jest''
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Postby Iz Man on Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:52 am

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Postby Guiscard on Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:01 am

Iz Man wrote:Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "I'm sorry sir, did I offend you in some way?"

Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "Please sir, I'm sorry I have offended you. Is there a way you could help me understand why you have all this hate for me?"

Mugger: *punches Guis twice in the face and laughs at him*

Guis: "I really believe we can reach some common ground here. I just want to be freinds. Perhaps I should give you some of my money."

Mugger: *punches Guis 3 times & kicks him in the forehead*

Guis: "OK, that's starting to hurt. I really would prefer that you stop hurting me. I just want to understand you; I really really want to be your friend. Can we maybe go over there under that tree, sip some tea, and peruse my Thesaurus? I use it all the time when I post on the web"

Mugger: *Beats Guis to a oozing blob of sobbing pulp to the ground*

:lol: :lol: :lol:
It's just so fitting..... :P


Nice response. I'm really getting to you aren't I...
qwert wrote:Can i ask you something?What is porpose for you to open these Political topic in ConquerClub? Why you mix politic with Risk? Why you not open topic like HOT AND SEXY,or something like that.
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Postby Backglass on Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:40 am

Fo Sho wrote:God, not only are some of you people anti-american, it seems like you are pro-terrorism. You cowards.


Well it seems to me that "some of you people" are arrogant, bible-thumping "pro-war" xenophobes who have never met a Muslim or been outside the US (except to Cancun for spring break) and think everything outside the borders of our fine country is a barren wasteland full of idiots. You ignorant rednecks.
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Postby The1exile on Tue Apr 24, 2007 1:36 pm

Backglass wrote:Well it seems to me that "some of you people" are arrogant, bible-thumping "pro-war" xenophobes who have never met a Muslim or been outside the US (except to Cancun for spring break) and think everything outside the borders of our fine country is a barren wasteland full of idiots. You ignorant rednecks.


*Looks outside his window at the barren wasteland of England... or is that th 51st state?*
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Postby Anony#1 on Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:05 pm

I tried to read from where I left off (somewhere around page 64ish), but the amount of brain cells that I would have to surrender was too great, in my opinion. SO, I will spam instead.

Spam spam spam. america rules spam spam spam

the rest are just fools
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Postby Guiscard on Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:18 pm

Anony#1 wrote:I tried to read from where I left off (somewhere around page 64ish), but the amount of brain cells that I would have to surrender was too great, in my opinion. SO, I will spam instead.

Spam spam spam. america rules spam spam spam

the rest are just fools


Don't worry. All rational debate from the more conservative side dissolved into mindless childish insults about page 65.
qwert wrote:Can i ask you something?What is porpose for you to open these Political topic in ConquerClub? Why you mix politic with Risk? Why you not open topic like HOT AND SEXY,or something like that.
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Postby Iz Man on Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:24 pm

Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "I'm sorry sir, did I offend you in some way?"

Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "Please sir, I'm sorry I have offended you. Is there a way you could help me understand why you have all this hate for me?"

Mugger: *punches Guis twice in the face and laughs at him*

Guis: "I really believe we can reach some common ground here. I just want to be freinds. Perhaps I should give you some of my money."

Mugger: *punches Guis 3 times & kicks him in the forehead*

Guis: "OK, that's starting to hurt. I really would prefer that you stop hurting me. I just want to understand you; I really really want to be your friend. Can we maybe go over there under that tree, sip some tea, and peruse my Thesaurus? I use it all the time when I post on the web"

Mugger: *Beats Guis to a oozing blob of sobbing pulp to the ground*
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Postby Titanic on Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:34 pm

Iz Man wrote:Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "I'm sorry sir, did I offend you in some way?"

Mugger: *punches Guis in face*

Guis: "Please sir, I'm sorry I have offended you. Is there a way you could help me understand why you have all this hate for me?"

Mugger: *punches Guis twice in the face and laughs at him*

Guis: "I really believe we can reach some common ground here. I just want to be freinds. Perhaps I should give you some of my money."

Mugger: *punches Guis 3 times & kicks him in the forehead*

Guis: "OK, that's starting to hurt. I really would prefer that you stop hurting me. I just want to understand you; I really really want to be your friend. Can we maybe go over there under that tree, sip some tea, and peruse my Thesaurus? I use it all the time when I post on the web"

Mugger: *Beats Guis to a oozing blob of sobbing pulp to the ground*


When this is your only comeback, you know you are truly beaten. I think this is the fifth time that this topic has "ended", but I'm sure another patrioticly blind idiot will come along...
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Postby Anony#1 on Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:34 pm

Guiscard wrote:
Anony#1 wrote:I tried to read from where I left off (somewhere around page 64ish), but the amount of brain cells that I would have to surrender was too great, in my opinion. SO, I will spam instead.

Spam spam spam. america rules spam spam spam

the rest are just fools


Don't worry. All rational debate from the more conservative side dissolved into mindless childish insults about page 65.


I'm a conservative, phoo'. You shouldn't lump all of the cons together, numb nuts. Der be neocons about!
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Postby genius6 on Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:09 pm

Anony#1 wrote:
Guiscard wrote:
Anony#1 wrote:I tried to read from where I left off (somewhere around page 64ish), but the amount of brain cells that I would have to surrender was too great, in my opinion. SO, I will spam instead.

Spam spam spam. america rules spam spam spam

the rest are just fools


Don't worry. All rational debate from the more conservative side dissolved into mindless childish insults about page 65.


I'm a conservative, phoo'. You shouldn't lump all of the cons together, numb nuts. Der be neocons about!


Yes, neocons deserve a nice padded cell all to themselves.
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Postby Fo Sho on Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:09 pm

genius6 wrote:
Anony#1 wrote:
Guiscard wrote:
Anony#1 wrote:I tried to read from where I left off (somewhere around page 64ish), but the amount of brain cells that I would have to surrender was too great, in my opinion. SO, I will spam instead.

Spam spam spam. america rules spam spam spam

the rest are just fools


Don't worry. All rational debate from the more conservative side dissolved into mindless childish insults about page 65.


I'm a conservative, phoo'. You shouldn't lump all of the cons together, numb nuts. Der be neocons about!


Yes, neocons deserve a nice padded cell all to themselves.


liberals need to stop sucking so much dick
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Postby Guiscard on Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:13 pm

Iz Man wrote:Mugger: *punches Guis twice in the face and laughs at him*


Fo Sho wrote:liberals need to stop sucking so much dick


You're really making some great points here guys... the Oxford University Debating Society awaits... :D
qwert wrote:Can i ask you something?What is porpose for you to open these Political topic in ConquerClub? Why you mix politic with Risk? Why you not open topic like HOT AND SEXY,or something like that.
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Postby Backglass on Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:19 pm

Fo Sho wrote:liberals need to stop sucking so much dick


Ah geez, I'm sorry. I didn't know you were 16 and just parroting daddy...I actually though you were trying to have an adult conversation. That certainly explains a lot.

My mistake. :roll:
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Postby 2dimes on Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:25 pm

I just can't get my head around anyone trying to reduce the "sucking of dick."

Even if you are not going to utilize the service why shut it down for the people that are.

Where does it end, what's next?

No no no no no, there won't be any giving away pizzas here. Not on my watch.

Sorry we're shuting down the lotto, you need to stop handing out money.
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Postby Anony#1 on Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:40 pm

Guiscard wrote:
Iz Man wrote:Mugger: *punches Guis twice in the face and laughs at him*


Fo Sho wrote:liberals need to stop sucking so much dick


You're really making some great points here guys... the Oxford University Debating Society awaits... :D


*punches Guis in the face, and steals his lunch money*

Thanks, guss. Way to take the piss outta everything.

In other words, there's nothing wrong with conservatives, really. There are con-repubs, con-dems, neocons, and even liberal cons. So many cons!

Where are all the pros?
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Postby Fo Sho on Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:16 pm

I said that liberals need to stop sucking so much dick in response to the fact that neocons need to be put in a padded cell. Which in my opinion is an equally pointless post. But of course all you liberals decide to ignore that. I happen to be a poli sci major at a fairly prominent university... After spending all day hearing lectures from some of the "great liberal" professors and politcal thinkers of our time it's fun to come here and vent some steam by using stupid pointless profanities. I argue and debate daily with in some of the greatest political arenas of today's time. Why should I waste my time on you clowns??? So I return to my original post.... STOP SUCKING SO MUCH DICK. You fucking pillow biters.
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Postby Anony#1 on Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:29 pm

I happen to be a poli sci major at a fairly prominent university


whoa

dudes, we better watch ourselves cuz dis guyz getting a political science major. like, dude.

whoa
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Postby GustavusAdolphus on Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:34 pm

Anony#1 wrote:
I happen to be a poli sci major at a fairly prominent university


whoa

dudes, we better watch ourselves cuz dis guyz getting a political science major. like, dude.

whoa


NO SHIT?!? A POLI SCI major? At a FAIRLY PROMINENT university? There are hardly any poli sci majors, and even less fairly prominent universities. Damn. I feel my confidence draining away in the presence of this demi-god.
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Postby Fo Sho on Tue Apr 24, 2007 10:04 pm

lmao.... wow, those two posts were the only ones I've read ever that have actually make me physically laugh out loud. That's right mere mortals... quiver in fear. No, but seriously I go to George Washington University, and the courses I take are pretty fucking tough. All I'm saying is after having to use my brain all day. It's fun to come back and sling some crude, unintelligent, semi-politcal insults around. Guys who take these posts too seriously crack me up. I mean it's an online game... And a very, very small portion of the people who play actually post... What you say here doesn't matter. Despite how some people treat this website like it was real life it isn't. *cough* (guiscard, titanic, hecter, etc.)
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Postby Anony#1 on Tue Apr 24, 2007 10:13 pm

hurhurhur

Indeed, Fo Shizzle, indeed.

note: i've only played a single game, thus far, that i didn't even finish! love the game, but i don't play it on the net; no time; don't care to.
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Postby GustavusAdolphus on Tue Apr 24, 2007 10:19 pm

Yeah, when you actually do go to a good university, you might as well tell people what it is. Good to see someone who can take a joke.
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Postby Guiscard on Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:35 am

Fo Sho wrote:I argue and debate daily with in some of the greatest political arenas of today's time. Why should I waste my time on you clowns???


You think your the only one at university currently studying politics?

I just don't feel the need to drag 'credentials' into it. I'd rather let arguments speak for themselves.

And I'm sure some of your 'great liberal professors' would love to hear the response 'stop sucking so much dick' :D
qwert wrote:Can i ask you something?What is porpose for you to open these Political topic in ConquerClub? Why you mix politic with Risk? Why you not open topic like HOT AND SEXY,or something like that.
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