Moderator: Cartographers
chapcrap wrote:I voted for version 2.
I also notice on your new updates and versions that the latitude/longitude lines are no longer numbered.
AndyDufresne wrote:A good step in the right direction I think, in terms of the background. Thumbs up.
AndyDufresne wrote:On the small map, the text in the legend boxes could maybe use bold to be a little more prominent.
--Andy
nolefan5311 wrote:Is there any way you can have the latitude/longitude lines run behind the playable area? It's distracting that they run over the playable area.
nolefan5311 wrote:The legends could be a little clearer and need some grammatical changes...what do you think about the suggestions below?
Czech Republic Box
Kraj = Region and 2 towns inside it's border
+4 for every TWO kraje
Praha is not included in town or Kraj bonus (I don't see the need to designate it as the capital since the word "capital" isn't used in any other explanation)
+1 with every THREE towns in CR
-1 with each Kraj in SR
SR Box
Kraj = Region and 3 towns inside it's border
+2 for each Kraj
Bratislava is not included in town or Kraj bonus (again, don't see the need to use the word capital)
+1 with every THREE towns in SR
-2 with every kraje in CR
nolefan5311 wrote:Town/Region box
Regions attack bordering regions and towns inside their border.
Towns ONLY attack other towns inside their Kraj and the region they're located in (except via highways).
Highways connect adjacent towns.
koontz1973 wrote:First off, I am having trouble reading any of the small maps text. It has the room to go bigger.
koontz1973 wrote:It is not clear which of the boxes belong to which region. Can you swap them around as the Slovak on is closer to Czechoslovakia one, and vice versa. This will cause confusion with player.
koontz1973 wrote:Highways connect towns so can Poprad attack Zilina?
Oneyed wrote:koontz1973 wrote:Highways connect towns so can Poprad attack Zilina?
correct. the Highway is more important in Slovak Republic, because this is the second way how to go from VSK (ot towns inside) to west. without Highway there will be just one way - from VSK to SSK.
Oneyed
koontz1973 wrote:But then you only have one way in or out (SCK, JCK, VCK, SMK).
koontz1973 wrote:These regions have the same amount of towns as the others but with the same bonus.
koontz1973 wrote:From what I am reading, you are giving for the Czech rep a +4 bonus for 3 territories that only have one way in or out. Thats a tad steep? Even for the same with 2 borders, it seems steep.
koontz1973 wrote:For the slovak side of things, you only give +2 for 4 territories with 2 borders. This seems lopsided.
koontz1973 wrote:This in my opinion will cause confusion for anyone who has never played the map.
koontz1973 wrote:Also, with the highways, you are giving the same bonus for a region that has 6 territs and 2 borders and 6 territs and 4 borders.
koontz1973 wrote:Some random thoughts.
With the 2 capitals, unless I deploy Stck or ZSK, they will be very hard to grab. In small games with there good bonus, they will be grabbed quickly as they can be defended very easily.
koontz1973 wrote:Lose the capital bonus completely and place a +1 auto deploy instead. In chained and adjacent games, this will negate any benefit they give at the start of games. Makes room elsewhere and seems a more sensible bonus style for a capital.
koontz1973 wrote:The bonus in the south (+2) is for 4 territs and 2 borders, it is the same for all 3 kraj. In the north it is (+4) for 6 territs with 2,3 or 4 borders. This alone causes unbalanced games depending on the drop, and this is my main concern with games.
koontz1973 wrote:One solution would be to drop the town and region bonuses as they are completely for the map. You already have a mini map in the boxes and would be very easy to put bonus numbers into this. It would clear confusion between the two sides, allow bonuses to go up or down depending on the region, highways etc. You get to keep your highways, towns, regions without any changes, the only thing that would change is by making the mini map areas simpler to understand and allow bonuses to be adjusted for each region.
koontz1973 wrote:At the end of this, you can programme in positions and some neutrals to stop bonus drops happening in small games. You can speak to the gameplay mods to see if they has any ideas on how to do positions for this type of game.
koontz1973 wrote:EDIT: Another way to balance the game and keep everything you have now, just add another highway to the kraj that do not have one.
nolefan5311 wrote:The capital bonuses probably could be dropped, but then I wonder whats the significance of having the capitals there at all?
nolefan5311 wrote:As is now, its impossible to drop those bonuses because both capitals start as neutrals, and they each have three regions that can attack them (Praha - StCK, Benesov, Plzen & Bratis - ZSK, Trencin, Brno). I don't feel this is too much of a bottleneck.
nolefan5311 wrote:And with the negative bonuses taken into effect I think it balances out pretty well. Every town on the map can be assaulted by at least 2 regions.
nolefan5311 wrote:As far as the different bonus structures for the Slovak and Czech side, I think the legend clearly indicates that you need to hold 2 kraje in Czech to trigger the bonus, and 1 on the Slovak side to trigger the bonus. There are quite a bit of maps out there with significantly more complex bonus systems. I personally don't like the suggestion of making them identical, and altering the XML so that the Czech side is coded that a certain amount of territories begin neutral. WIth a map this small, I think the more regions in play the better.
nolefan5311 wrote:Dropping the distributed territories to just 31 (its currently at 33) means that in 7 and 8 player games players will be dropped 3 regions. If you're ok with this Oneyed, then that's fine, but I think it will get a lot more play on larger games if players start with 4 like they do now.
nolefan5311 wrote:You might think about putting some sort of bold line between the Czech and Slovak sides to better distinguish them, because it is slightly hard to read from the minimaps. I didn't have a problem, but I could see where it might cause issues for others.
nolefan5311 wrote:As far as the Slovak side is concerned, the only bonus below the suggested value is VSK, but that's a 1.75 suggested bonus, only .25 below the 2 bonus it now has. We've let maps with a .25 differential pass through, so I think it's good. But just to be on the safe side, perhaps you might want to start the road in Lucenec and have it go through Poprad and then on to Zilina. There still would be only two defend points, but adding the extra attacking region would increase the suggested bonus to 1.92, .08 below the 2 it currently gets. That's miniscule.
nolefan5311 wrote:Let me know what you'd like to do Oneyed.
nolefan5311 wrote:And thanks koontz for bringing this to my attention. Not sure how it got overlooked the first time.
koontz1973 wrote:Not good IMO. Now VSK and SSK have 3 open territs to attack to and from.
koontz1973 wrote:Keep the current one as it (either a highway or railway).
Add a new one running from Labem - Pardubice - Tabor & Olomouc.
koontz1973 wrote:This would then mean that every kraj has 2 ways in and out. It might be good to increase the bonus on the czech side to 5 as well.
nolefan5311 wrote:koontz1973 wrote:Not good IMO. Now VSK and SSK have 3 open territs to attack to and from.
Why is this a problem?
nolefan5311 wrote:koontz1973 wrote:Keep the current one as it (either a highway or railway).
Add a new one running from Labem - Pardubice - Tabor & Olomouc.
A separate highway crisscrossing the previous one? You don't think that will overclutter it and lead to confusion?
[/quote]nolefan5311 wrote:koontz1973 wrote:This would then mean that every kraj has 2 ways in and out. It might be good to increase the bonus on the czech side to 5 as well.
From what I can see, every Kraj on the Slovak side has 3 ways in (including Bratislava for ZSK), and every Kraj on the Czech side has 2 ways in. And I disagree about increasing the bonus on the Czech side.
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