A stupid fucking analogy for stupid fucking people

[john9blue]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

[The Bison King]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

[nietzsche]

Cut the crap BBS

A wise person is wise because can track what's valuable at some point of time, among other things. Good luck trying to make a moral computer. Admitedly even the wisest can't take the best decision all the time, that's why it's hard, and why we are talking about it, but it would be the best choice.

A wise man taking our decisions it's even better than direct representation, let's admit it we want something good in the next month.

Of course we don't know what the ultimate truth is, we will never know, yet we make decisions today. Or should we wait until we know whats really really correct?

Some will say that since life is struggle, we would be better off not have been born at all, then a wise man would decide to nuke the earth? No.

We keep on going, we take decisions every day to the best of our knowledge. Many great men have told us that the best way to take decisions is to gather all the possible information on the subject before the decision has to be made, study it, considere it, take a the decison, follow the plan and don't look back except at points of time when the plan indicates that's time to evaluate.

But in fact, wise men are so wise that they stay away from politics. SO we're stuck with politicians instead of statemen.

[BigBallinStalin]

there's a difference between wisdom being "subjective" and wisdom being "too complex for any person to understand"

What is wisdom, john?

I generally associate it with "excellent decision-making" plus "keen foresight." In that sense, being wise depends on the subject matter with which one is interacting. So, wisdom is subjective since it derives from the individual and is in relation to whatever that individual is controlling, managing, or interacting with. Wisdom is "too complex for any person to understand" because wisdom is subjective--it depends on what the subject matter.

If you can find one is wise on everything or numerous issues, then please let me know.

Wisdom requires knowledge, and since knowledge is asymmetric, or dispersed across many individuals in varying amounts and is contradictory at times, then wisdom (as a whole, i.e. encompassing all subject matter) must be too complex for any one person to understand.

BBS,

You are talking about specialized knoledge. Wise people can delegate, listen to all accounts and make decisions. People not so wise can be easily fooled by one of the parts. I was merely trying to point out that Polarized thought is part of the problem. Candidates use that speech to get to a base of voters, but as election approaches, they move to center. That is just politics is.

With certain policies, there is no absolutely correct choice with outcomes that will be felt by everyone to varying degrees. You can be deemed "wise," but the constrained ability to foresee outcomes and overcome systemic problems with a government are unavoidable. So, appealing to wise people to solve these political problems is not the correct approach. Besides, if they're so wise, they'll take it upon themselves to decide for everyone. That'll be fun.

If it's just politics, then get politics out of these decisions.

I'm not talking about only specialized knowledge. See my previous post with john. Note the parts on imperfect knowledge and the inaccessibility of future knowledge. These are basic constraints on policy-making. No amount of wisdom can overcome that, so having all those who are wise in such positions of power can still lead to government failure.

Read about spontaneous order and here, if you're interested. Spontaneous order is social order resulting from human action but not of human design. In other words, no Philosopher Kings required.

It's not that saving is good in itself, neither spending. Sometimes it's wise to save, sometimes it's wise to spend. Decisions have to be made to try and go to the best possible future. If you have a right wing idiot he might always take the side of saving, and he might be taking the wrong path. But you elected him, so you have to wait 4 years of that.

The decision to save is largely determined by the interest rates set by the Federal Reserve which implements a policy that is similar across both political parties. Decisions to save and spend in certain proportions are best left to the individuals within the market.

Also, democracy has its value, some say there's wisdom in the masses. Might be true. We will never now really, but if you ask me, I'd rather trust a wise man. Wise men are rarely crooks, they know better.

I'd posit that there's wisdom made available through markets.

How do you determine who is a wise man?




EDIT: fixed quotes

[BigBallinStalin]

Cut the crap BBS

A wise person is wise because can track what's valuable at some point of time, among other things. Good luck trying to make a moral computer. Admitedly even the wisest can't take the best decision all the time, that's why it's hard, and why we are talking about it, but it would be the best choice.

Judging from the statement "Good luck trying to make a moral computer," you're not paying close enough attention to my posts. That's never been my position. So, perhaps you could try again?

"A wise person is wise because [he] can track what's valuable at some point of time, among other things." So, a person is wise if he can track the value of cars across time, among other things like human trafficking, the price of an AK-47 in Chad, and what not? Why is knowledge of market prices across time (even the future?) a good enough criterion for determining wisdom?

And what about the untractable, like love, compassion, or cultural attitudes? How do these matters fall into the realm of being wise?

A wise man taking our decisions it's even better than direct representation, let's admit it we want something good in the next month.

Excellent. What does it mean to be a "wise" man? And how would this be better than "direct representation"? And, why is direct representation the second-best alternative to (a)political decision-making?

Of course we don't know what the ultimate truth is, we will never know, yet we make decisions today. Or should we wait until we know whats really really correct?

Some will say that since life is struggle, we would be better off not have been born at all, then a wise man would decide to nuke the earth? No.

We keep on going, we take decisions every day to the best of our knowledge. Many great men have told us that the best way to take decisions is to gather all the possible information on the subject before the decision has to be made, study it, considere it, take a the decison, follow the plan and don't look back except at points of time when the plan indicates that's time to evaluate.

But in fact, wise men are so wise that they stay away from politics. SO we're stuck with politicians instead of statemen.

You're pushing political decision-making into a conversation I was having with john on the topic of wisdom itself. You should probably restate your arguments, so that they're more relevant.

[BigBallinStalin]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

I'm an honest guy, and I try not to claim ideas that aren't mine. And, perhaps, others would be interested in these ideas, so why not provide the sauce?

Judging from your posts, you seem to be a bitter guy. Why is that?

[Haggis_McMutton]

Marking this so I remember about it later.

[The Bison King]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

I'm an honest guy, and I try not to claim ideas that aren't mine. And, perhaps, others would be interested in these ideas, so why not provide the sauce?

Judging from your posts, you seem to be a bitter guy. Why is that?

I'm not bitter, I'm just annoyed with this forum, and the types of political discussions I hear on the radio and TV. I'm annoyed with people who have completely in-movable ideals that can not be swayed. Yet it's these same people who try to convince everyone else to think their way. If you won't open up your mind to another persons way of thinking why should they for you?

I've actually been enjoying the discussion this has turned into, I just didn't have anything to contribute so I didn't post.

[Lootifer]

What does parsley and pubic hair have in common?

You push both to the side and keep on eating.

[Army of GOD]

I mostly just consider wisdom to be experience, not necessarily intelligence.

[BigBallinStalin]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

I'm an honest guy, and I try not to claim ideas that aren't mine. And, perhaps, others would be interested in these ideas, so why not provide the sauce?

Judging from your posts, you seem to be a bitter guy. Why is that?

I'm not bitter, I'm just annoyed with this forum, and the types of political discussions I hear on the radio and TV. I'm annoyed with people who have completely in-movable ideals that can not be swayed. Yet it's these same people who try to convince everyone else to think their way. If you won't open up your mind to another persons way of thinking why should they for you?

If you're referring to me, I'm open to debate, and I don't see what's wrong with trying to convince people that one's position is correct or that one disagrees with a few points by the other debater. In order to debate, I have to "open up my mind to their way of thinking" (but more importantly their argument, as it is difficult to mind-read); otherwise, I wouldn't know what I'm responding to... so I guess this question wasn't leveled at me?

[BigBallinStalin]

What does parsley and pubic hair have in common?

You push both to the side and keep on eating.

Do you push aside your parsley like the Late and Great Moses did with the Red Sea, or Dead Sea?

Or do you give your parsley a comb-over and continue eating?

[Woodruff]

I mostly just consider wisdom to be experience, not necessarily intelligence.

It's definitely not the same as intelligence, but it's just as definitely not the same as experience.

[tkr4lf]

I mostly just consider wisdom to be experience, not necessarily intelligence.

It's definitely not the same as intelligence, but it's just as definitely not the same as experience.

I would consider it sort of a mixture of the two.

[Phatscotty]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

I'm an honest guy, and I try not to claim ideas that aren't mine. And, perhaps, others would be interested in these ideas, so why not provide the sauce?

Judging from your posts, you seem to be a bitter guy. Why is that?

I'm not bitter, I'm just annoyed with this forum, and the types of political discussions I hear on the radio and TV. I'm annoyed with people who have completely in-movable ideals that can not be swayed. Yet it's these same people who try to convince everyone else to think their way. If you won't open up your mind to another persons way of thinking why should they for you?

I've actually been enjoying the discussion this has turned into, I just didn't have anything to contribute so I didn't post.

thats because there actually is a right and a wrong answer.

Too much debt, to much borrowing, too much spending is our problem, and it's killing us. The answer is to cut debt, cut borrowing, cut spending.

[PLAYER57832]

there's a difference between wisdom being "subjective" and wisdom being "too complex for any person to understand"

No, most people actually recognize real wisdom. Its just we so seldom really hear it, except accidentally voiced by children, which is not quite the same thing.

[PLAYER57832]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

I'm an honest guy, and I try not to claim ideas that aren't mine. And, perhaps, others would be interested in these ideas, so why not provide the sauce?

Judging from your posts, you seem to be a bitter guy. Why is that?

I'm not bitter, I'm just annoyed with this forum, and the types of political discussions I hear on the radio and TV. I'm annoyed with people who have completely in-movable ideals that can not be swayed. Yet it's these same people who try to convince everyone else to think their way. If you won't open up your mind to another persons way of thinking why should they for you?

I've actually been enjoying the discussion this has turned into, I just didn't have anything to contribute so I didn't post.

thats because there actually is a right and a wrong answer.

Too much debt, to much borrowing, too much spending is our problem, and it's killing us. The answer is to cut debt, cut borrowing, cut spending.

Debt does tend to go up when you cut income, but don't reduce the needs you have.

[BigBallinStalin]

Ladies and gentlemen, wisdom has left this thread. Please reach below your seats and don your tin foil hats. It's time to get serious.

[WILLIAMS5232]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

I'm an honest guy, and I try not to claim ideas that aren't mine. And, perhaps, others would be interested in these ideas, so why not provide the sauce?

Judging from your posts, you seem to be a bitter guy. Why is that?

I'm not bitter, I'm just annoyed with this forum, and the types of political discussions I hear on the radio and TV. I'm annoyed with people who have completely in-movable ideals that can not be swayed. Yet it's these same people who try to convince everyone else to think their way. If you won't open up your mind to another persons way of thinking why should they for you?

I've actually been enjoying the discussion this has turned into, I just didn't have anything to contribute so I didn't post.

thats because there actually is a right and a wrong answer.

Too much debt, to much borrowing, too much spending is our problem, and it's killing us. The answer is to cut debt, cut borrowing, cut spending.

Debt does tend to go up when you cut income, but don't reduce the needs you have.

needs?

personally all i need is for the govt to pay it's bills and quit wasting money. anyone that thinks that every dollar is spent wisely, or even the majority of the dollors let's say, is just living in a shoe. and these same shoe-dwellers that think that all these "services" really go to people that seriously need them are just pathetic. i know i could live on rice and canned tuna. and maybe even a six pack of bananas if i pinch my pennies close enough. i live in houston, and i've purposely not ran my a/c at all this year. just to see what it's like. i work outside in the heat all day ( construction ) and come home to a box fan sucking cool night air into my garage apt all night and i'm just fine. i can't stand watching all these pathetic news shows patronizing these "poor" people that get all these govt benefits and city services when i'm doing just fine living a "worse" life than they are. i spend 26 dollars a week on groceries. i've done this now for 3 months. i know it's possible. maybe i'm just tough i guess. if that's the case i sure wish i didn't live in a country full of Puzzies. seriously, i just wish the govt would shut the f up and quit trying to make everyone happy. it's impossible. just realize, that some one will get voted no matter what. so just give up trying to act nice, i can't stand watching that president up there fu@@ing just blah.. blah... blah... i don't see how there are so many idiots that sit there and believe that shit he spouts. same with romney. this country is just fu@@ed. and it ain't coming back.

so i'm just ranting....
i read these forums alot but hardly ever respond. because this is about all i'd ever have to say. it makes me sick to listen to you folks sit here and act like you got all the answers. i think you're each just trying to look the smartest personally, but it is entertaining sometimes.

anyway... carry on.

[squishyg]

Well, it's official. WILLIAMS5232 would definitely win the CC Hunger Games.

[Phatscotty]

Player, OP, in 2019, the interest on our debt will cost more than our military....

We can't go in 2 directions at the same time. 1 direction is more debt, 1 direction is less debt.

Choose wisely

[InkL0sed]

TED Talks video on the subject of wisdom.

http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/en/barry_ ... isdom.html

[Woodruff]

man, i was just about to go to bed lol... taking a little road trip tomorrow

i'll respond to that behemoth when i have the time

Yeah man... he has a Bibliography. I mean... f*ck.

I'm an honest guy, and I try not to claim ideas that aren't mine. And, perhaps, others would be interested in these ideas, so why not provide the sauce?

Judging from your posts, you seem to be a bitter guy. Why is that?

I'm not bitter, I'm just annoyed with this forum, and the types of political discussions I hear on the radio and TV. I'm annoyed with people who have completely in-movable ideals that can not be swayed. Yet it's these same people who try to convince everyone else to think their way. If you won't open up your mind to another persons way of thinking why should they for you?

I've actually been enjoying the discussion this has turned into, I just didn't have anything to contribute so I didn't post.

thats because there actually is a right and a wrong answer.

Too much debt, to much borrowing, too much spending is our problem, and it's killing us. The answer is to cut debt, cut borrowing, cut spending.

And spend it on drug testing!

[tkr4lf]

i live in houston, and i've purposely not ran my a/c at all this year. just to see what it's like. i work outside in the heat all day ( construction ) and come home to a box fan sucking cool night air into my garage apt all night and i'm just fine.

Wow, that's seriously impressive. More power to you. I'm in Austin, and it's already been up to 105 degrees here. I honestly can't imagine not running the a/c at all or working outside all day in that kind of heat.

[TA1LGUNN3R]

i live in houston, and i've purposely not ran my a/c at all this year. just to see what it's like. i work outside in the heat all day ( construction ) and come home to a box fan sucking cool night air into my garage apt all night and i'm just fine.

Wow, that's seriously impressive. More power to you. I'm in Austin, and it's already been up to 105 degrees here. I honestly can't imagine not running the a/c at all or working outside all day in that kind of heat.

It's about 75 and raining in my area...

-TG