rMoney commits felony

[Symmetry]

ITT, Scotty and NS do their very best to stop anyone talking about Romney.

and....a lie is a lie

Thanks for getting back on topic- I agree that Romney clearly lied, and it's kind of frustrating that NS is holding out on accepting that too. It's possible for him to support a candidate who ain't a saint, but like you said,

a lie is a lie.

You're delusional.

I clearly posted articles from liberal sources that debunked these accusations. You have yet to rationally disagree with those sources.

Whether the sources are liberal, or conservative has little relevance to me outside of their truth. I've posted a conservative link that you've not responded to, and seem to be doing your best to ignore.

I'm sorry that you seem to consider ":lol: You're delusional." as rational disagreement, or that you consider the issue as being liberal vs conservative on a potentially criminal matter, but that says more about your attitude to this issue than it does about me.

[Phatscotty]

ITT, Scotty and NS do their very best to stop anyone talking about Romney.

and....a lie is a lie

Thanks for getting back on topic- I agree that Romney clearly lied, and it's kind of frustrating that NS is holding out on accepting that too. It's possible for him to support a candidate who ain't a saint, but like you said,

a lie is a lie.

and...... a troll is a troll! Romney even has Democrats backing him on this, and it's a lot more than just a few. This issue is not about taking sides, or trolls trying to paint pictures that do not exist. This issue is about the truth.

My respect goes to all the Democrats of honor, for doing the right thing, and for rising above the opportunity to throw mud and enable, aid, and create an environment of slime. Obama's campaign calling Mitt Romney a felon is just the start of Obama Inc.

Obama will prove to be the dirtiest player in the game, and this attack from Obama Inc. is piss poor pathetic. What a deusche

[Symmetry]

Future ITT prediction:

Nightstrike will attempt to rationalise his two radically conflicting viewpoints that this is both old news from 2002 not worth discsussing, and also a recent smear campaign by Obama in 2012.

Whatever gets the job done, I guess.

[Phatscotty]

Future ITT prediction:

Nightstrike will attempt to rationalise his two radically conflicting viewpoints that this is both old news from 2002 not worth discsussing, and also a recent smear campaign by Obama in 2012.

Whatever gets the job done, I guess.

there aren't radically conflicting viewpoints. There are Republicans and Democrats coming together to speak the truth, that Romney took over the Olympics in 1999, which is a fact.

Obama's and your side is not a conflicting view, they are just a bunch of lying cheaters.

[Juan_Bottom]

Just curious to those liberals who want to keep pushing this "story", considering this was originally published by the Boston Globe (the ones who "broke" it this week) in 2002, why was it never brought up in the primary? We saw Gingrich putting up some extremely harsh and low attacks on Romney during the campaign, but none of this was never mentioned. It would have been plastered everywhere during the primary if there was truth to it.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/07/13 ... -a-felony/

“Ten years ago, when I ran against Mitt Romney for Governor, my campaign was attacked for misstating the truth about Romney’s tenure at Bain Capital. Massachusetts voters were told that Romney was absolutely not the leader of Bain at a time when bankruptcies and layoffs were devastating workers at companies in their portfolio,” [Shannon] O’Brien told HuffPost in an email. “Recent news stories now present clear evidence that Mitt Romney didn’t tell the truth to Massachusetts when he ran for Governor in 2002 and he’s not telling the truth to the American people today.”

^^^This is the answer to your question I think. It's because last time this came up in a race, it backfired. And it didn't backfire because O'Brien was wrong.

New Document:

But in his 2002 disclosure statement, he provided a different answer, listing himself as “Executive” of Bain Capital Inc. and Bain Capital LLC, with a gross income of more than $100,000.

[Phatscotty]

The deal is Mitt Romney was a minority owner of Bain until 2002, and that's why Obama Inc. thinks they can get away with this, because, if spun right, it could be perceived to have an ounce of truthiness. Romney still held a shit load of stock in Bain, which makes him part owner.

I think he says in 2002 is when he cut all ties, sold his stock, finalized a benefits package etc. I don't take him at his word, but it makes sense. I think it also makes sense the Mitt Romney could not run the Olympics and be the CEO of Bain at the same time.

I mean really, is there anyone here who does think Romney was running the Olympics and Bain at the same time, for 3 years? Have you guys even asked yourselves this question?

[GreecePwns]

Executive and minority owner are two waaaaaaaay different things.

Executives execute things.
Owners own things.

Like everything he has said in this campaign, we will never know what actually is the truth, because depending on the circumstance, Mitt will say what he has to for his personal gain and write what on forms what he has to for his personal gain.

Given the direct quotes, however, I believe Mitt had a role in decision making, albeit a minor one, at Bain even while running the Olympics.

[Juan_Bottom]

I can't agree with any of you; I'm the super liberal character now.

[Phatscotty]

Executive and minority owner are two waaaaaaaay different things.

Executives execute things.
Owners own things.

So do you think Romney was calling the shots at Bain the entire 3 years he was calling the shots at the Olympics?

[Night Strike]

From the Washington Post link I posted earlier:

The "new version" of the Boston Globe story hinges on the comments from an SEC official who regularly donates to Democrats.

Boston Globe reporters previously wrote a book about Romney that talked about how Bain nearly collapsed when Romney left, indicating he wasn't actively managing.

Citing FactCheck:

We have never disputed that Romney remained the owner of Bain while he was running the Olympics committee. The issue always has been, who was running Bain? Nothing in the SEC documents contradicts what Romney has certified as true.

On that point, the Obama campaign cites snippets of a few news clippings to make a case that Romney was still a part-time manager of Bain after he left to run the Olympics. But a close reading shows these news accounts don’t contradict Romney either.

Citing Fortune:

The part about lying to the SEC is absurd, since the SEC doesn’t require an owner to be the operational decision-maker (Romney delegated such responsibilities, as is his right).

And Fortune has also obtained internal documents from Bain itself from that time showing that Romney was not listed among the managing investors during the time of running the Olympics: http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2012/07/12/mitt-romney-bain-exit/


Conclusion: As more and more people begin actually looking to the claims of the Obama administration/campaign, they're finding the attacks completely trumped-up and bogus. The CC community should as well.

[The Bison King]

I bet campaigns would be less nasty if candidates were less shitbags.

[Phatscotty]

I bet campaigns would be less nasty if candidates were less shitbags.

Incumbents as well

[whitestazn88]

I bet campaigns would be less nasty if candidates were less shitbags.

Incumbents as well

TIL that once voted into public office, you are never again considered a candidate, and any record of such is removed. from then on, you are simply known as incumbent.

[Phatscotty]

I bet campaigns would be less nasty if candidates were less shitbags.

Incumbents as well

TIL that once voted into public office, you are never again considered a candidate, and any record of such is removed. from then on, you are simply known as incumbent.

Obama is going down.

[Juan_Bottom]

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2 ... -to-forget

"I was in Utah full time. I had no responsibility for management at Bain Capital."

"[T]here were a number of social trips and business trips that brought me back to Massachusetts, board meetings, Thanksgiving and so forth,"

[Phatscotty]

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/07/13/12720853-the-testimony-romney-prefers-to-forget

"I was in Utah full time. I had no responsibility for management at Bain Capital."

"[T]here were a number of social trips and business trips that brought me back to Massachusetts, board meetings, Thanksgiving and so forth,"

[Juan_Bottom]

Obama is going down.

Took me forever to find this.


http://samuel-warde.com/2012/07/obama-w ... s-7-for-7/

“Even if I am being conservative, I don’t see how Obama can lose,” says Lichtman, the brains behind The Keys to the White House. Professor Lichtman has successfully picked ever winner beginning with Reagan’s re-election bid of 1984.

[whitestazn88]

I bet campaigns would be less nasty if candidates were less shitbags.

Incumbents as well

TIL that once voted into public office, you are never again considered a candidate, and any record of such is removed. from then on, you are simply known as incumbent.

Obama is going down.

I don't know what this has to do with what I posted. Granted, this thread is probably an election 2012 trollfest, but I just wanted to point out that the use of incumbents was extraneous, as they are candidates during the campaign regardless, unless they are in their last term, in which case, they wouldn't be as much involved in the mudslinging of the "nasty" campaigns that TBK was trying to discuss.

[Woodruff]

I bet campaigns would be less nasty if candidates were less shitbags.

Incumbents as well

TIL that once voted into public office, you are never again considered a candidate, and any record of such is removed. from then on, you are simply known as incumbent.

Obama is going down.

I don't know what this has to do with what I posted. Granted, this thread is probably an election 2012 trollfest, but I just wanted to point out that the use of incumbents was extraneous, as they are candidates during the campaign regardless, unless they are in their last term, in which case, they wouldn't be as much involved in the mudslinging of the "nasty" campaigns that TBK was trying to discuss.

It's just another example of Phatscotty trying to pretend he didn't say something stupid.

[bedub1]

I don't understand why this is so difficult for some of you to comprehend. We aren't talking about opinions, or things that might happen in the future. We are talking about government paperwork, and the past. Facts.

Bain Capital's SEC filings show Mitt Romney remained the firm’s "sole stockholder, chairman of the board, chief executive officer, and president" up until 2002.

In 2011, Romney, as a presidential candidate, filed a public financial disclosure form, under pain of perjury, that stated: “Mr. Romney retired from Bain Capital on February 11, 1999 to head the Salt Lake Organizing Committee. Since February 11, 1999, Mr. Romney has not had any active role with any Bain Capital entity and has not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way.”

You can see Romney’s signature, on the first page. If Romney lied on this form, that would be a felony.

These two statements contradict each other, thus he has commented a felony.

Now if you want to discuss to what degree of a role Romney had in Bain Capital between 1999 and 2002, that can be discussed. He was obviously busy with the olympics, but did travel back to Massachusetts, did sign Bain Capital paperwork. As the sole stockholder, chairman of the board, CEO, and President, I feel that he is still responsible for the actions of his company, even if he wasn't involved in the day to day operations of the firm.

[BigBallinStalin]

I don't understand why this is so difficult for some of you to comprehend. We aren't talking about opinions, or things that might happen in the future. We are talking about government paperwork, and the past. Facts.

Bain Capital's SEC filings show Mitt Romney remained the firm’s "sole stockholder, chairman of the board, chief executive officer, and president" up until 2002.

In 2011, Romney, as a presidential candidate, filed a public financial disclosure form, under pain of perjury, that stated: “Mr. Romney retired from Bain Capital on February 11, 1999 to head the Salt Lake Organizing Committee. Since February 11, 1999, Mr. Romney has not had any active role with any Bain Capital entity and has not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way.”

You can see Romney’s signature, on the first page. If Romney lied on this form, that would be a felony.

These two statements contradict each other, thus he has commented a felony.

Now if you want to discuss to what degree of a role Romney had in Bain Capital between 1999 and 2002, that can be discussed. He was obviously busy with the olympics, but did travel back to Massachusetts, did sign Bain Capital paperwork. As the sole stockholder, chairman of the board, CEO, and President, I feel that he is still responsible for the actions of his company, even if he wasn't involved in the day to day operations of the firm.

Bain Capital's SEC filings show Mitt Romney remained the firm’s "sole stockholder, chairman of the board, chief executive officer, and president" up until 2002.

1. Were the SEC filings accurate? As in, could it be possible that Bain Capital didn't update its files regarding Romney until 2002? This does happen. So, if that's the case, then the following statement is true: "since February 11, 1999, Mr. Romney has not had any active role with any Bain Capital entity and has not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way."

Like I said with Sym, job titles are one thing, but job descriptions are another. It could be the case that Romney really didn't do much, even if he held all those job titles (assuming that's even true) up to 2002.


"As the sole stockholder, chairman of the board, CEO, and President, I feel that he is still responsible for the actions of his company, even if he wasn't involved in the day to day operations of the firm."

2. What's he responsible for? Has his firm committed some crime?

[bedub1]

1. Were the SEC filings accurate? As in, could it be possible that Bain Capital didn't update its files regarding Romney until 2002? This does happen. So, if that's the case, then the following statement is true: "since February 11, 1999, Mr. Romney has not had any active role with any Bain Capital entity and has not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way."

Like I said with Sym, job titles are one thing, but job descriptions are another. It could be the case that Romney really didn't do much, even if he held all those job titles (assuming that's even true) up to 2002.


"As the sole stockholder, chairman of the board, CEO, and President, I feel that he is still responsible for the actions of his company, even if he wasn't involved in the day to day operations of the firm."

2. What's he responsible for? Has his firm committed some crime?

1. I don't think you understand. It's not Bain submitting documents about Romney. It's Romney submitting documents about Romney and Bain. "Between 1999 and 2001, Mitt Romney, then the CEO of Bain Capital, signed at least six documents that Bain filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission."
He clearly held these 4 positions.

2. He is responsible for everything the company did. I don't know of any crime committed by the firm, unless you realize that he was the firm, and so it was he that committed the crime.

This might actually make it to a felony charge. And it's just the silly paperwork sort of thing to take him down. I understand what he's saying, that "he was just the owner etc on paperwork but the other guys did everything cause he was too busy". But when it comes down to government paperwork, you have to do whats correct on paper. So even though he wasn't in charge of day to day operations, when bain's lawyer drew up bains sec filings, it listed romney, and romney had to sign it. So when he submitted his 2011 election filing, he can't state he retired from bain on feb 11, 1999, when he was still the ceo up till 2002. You dig? He should get a felony charge for bad paperwork. He should have stated on his 2011 election filing that he retired from Bain in 2002.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/1 ... 71819.html

Edit: The reason why he's lying on the paperwork and claiming he left in 1999 instead of 2002, is as follows:

The documents place Romney in charge of Bain from 1999 to 2001, a period in which the company outsourced jobs and ran companies that fell into bankruptcy. Romney has tried to distance himself from this period in Bain's history, saying on financial disclosure forms he had no active role in Bain as of February 1999.

But at least three times since then, Bain listed Romney as the company's "controlling person," as well as its "sole shareholder, sole director, chief executive officer and president." And one of those documents — as late as February 2001 — lists Romney's "principal occupation" as Bain's managing director.

Also Bain in 1999 invested $75 million in Stericycle, a medical-waste disposal firm that has been attacked by anti-abortion groups for disposing aborted fetuses collected from family planning clinics.
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/P ... 708322.php

This stuff looks bad for Romney, so to distance himself from it he lies on government forms, committing a felony. lol. Al Capone got taken down for Tax Evasion. Funny Romney will get taken down for felony filing of paperwork. Hopefully he drops out soon so we can get a new candidate. I really don't want to vote for Obama, but there's no way I can vote for Romney.

[Phatscotty]

Okay....so papers say that romney was calling the shots at Bain Capital at the same time he was calling the shots at the Olympics......

Question: Is that possible for Romney to run Bain and the Olympics, at the same time, for 3 years?

[bedub1]

Okay....so papers say that romney was calling the shots at Bain Capital at the same time he was calling the shots at the Olympics......

Question: Is that possible for Romney to run Bain and the Olympics, at the same time, for 3 years?

Yes. He was the sole stockholder, held the top 3 positions, and signed at least 6 documents. It is totally possible to do that and "run the Olympics" as you state at the same time.

[BigBallinStalin]

1. Were the SEC filings accurate? As in, could it be possible that Bain Capital didn't update its files regarding Romney until 2002? This does happen. So, if that's the case, then the following statement is true: "since February 11, 1999, Mr. Romney has not had any active role with any Bain Capital entity and has not been involved in the operations of any Bain Capital entity in any way."

Like I said with Sym, job titles are one thing, but job descriptions are another. It could be the case that Romney really didn't do much, even if he held all those job titles (assuming that's even true) up to 2002.


"As the sole stockholder, chairman of the board, CEO, and President, I feel that he is still responsible for the actions of his company, even if he wasn't involved in the day to day operations of the firm."

2. What's he responsible for? Has his firm committed some crime?

1. I don't think you understand. It's not Bain submitting documents about Romney. It's Romney submitting documents about Romney and Bain. "Between 1999 and 2001, Mitt Romney, then the CEO of Bain Capital, signed at least six documents that Bain filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission."
He clearly held these 4 positions.

2. He is responsible for everything the company did. I don't know of any crime committed by the firm, unless you realize that he was the firm, and so it was he that committed the crime.

This might actually make it to a felony charge. And it's just the silly paperwork sort of thing to take him down. I understand what he's saying, that "he was just the owner etc on paperwork but the other guys did everything cause he was too busy". But when it comes down to government paperwork, you have to do whats correct on paper. So even though he wasn't in charge of day to day operations, when bain's lawyer drew up bains sec filings, it listed romney, and romney had to sign it. So when he submitted his 2011 election filing, he can't state he retired from bain on feb 11, 1999, when he was still the ceo up till 2002. You dig? He should get a felony charge for bad paperwork. He should have stated on his 2011 election filing that he retired from Bain in 2002.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/1 ... 71819.html

Edit: The reason why he's lying on the paperwork and claiming he left in 1999 instead of 2002, is as follows:

The documents place Romney in charge of Bain from 1999 to 2001, a period in which the company outsourced jobs and ran companies that fell into bankruptcy. Romney has tried to distance himself from this period in Bain's history, saying on financial disclosure forms he had no active role in Bain as of February 1999.

So, he was off by 3 years? What's the impact of that error, if it's true?

I know people are jumping the gun about CRIMINAL FELONY FOR NOT FILLING OUT GOVERNMENT PAPERWORK EXACTLY AS REQUIRED, but seriously? That's the issue?

Why isn't any president charged for killing innocent civilians? Or executing an American citizen with no trial? Or bombing the shit out of Libya because uhh... no good reason? Why won't future policymakers and presidents be held responsible for supplying anti-Qaddafi terrorists (or "rebels") in Libya?

I'm not taking a contrarian position because I like Romney. I do this because it's interesting to see how blind some people are. They accuse someone of a crime with seemingly no consequences, while completely ignoring the blatant and devastating crimes committed by others. This may not include you, bedub, but it definitely applies to most Obama supporters or anyone who gobbles up this Romney-felony story like a pig.

But at least three times since then, Bain listed Romney as the company's "controlling person," as well as its "sole shareholder, sole director, chief executive officer and president." And one of those documents — as late as February 2001 — lists Romney's "principal occupation" as Bain's managing director.

Also Bain in 1999 invested $75 million in Stericycle, a medical-waste disposal firm that has been attacked by anti-abortion groups for disposing aborted fetuses collected from family planning clinics.
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/P ... 708322.php

This stuff looks bad for Romney, so to distance himself from it he lies on government forms, committing a felony. lol. Al Capone got taken down for Tax Evasion. Funny Romney will get taken down for felony filing of paperwork. Hopefully he drops out soon so we can get a new candidate. I really don't want to vote for Obama, but there's no way I can vote for Romney.[/quote]

Again, job title != job description. That's pretty much all we know at this point.

Sure, it looks bad, and I recognize his incentive for distancing himself from Bain's policies.