[Official] Breaking Bad Mafia 4/18 Blue. Town&DEA+rug win

by **StorrZerg** on Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:27 pm

As far as what happened to me at night, we will see the iac flip.

I have presented cases, people are welcome to talk about them. If we do want to use the time we can. I will be around to answer questions and do what ever.
FP
fp by betiko

ok! thx

by **Iron Butterfly** on Fri Mar 14, 2014 10:35 pm

Rodion wrote:Unvote.

Wow, people really seem to have missed what I said.
No. Your post was very clear.

Again, in bullet points.

1 - I don't think Stor was targeted for a NK.If Stor was targeted it was by Rugbirn. It has been pointed out that a mafia watcher would be a waste with a mafia nk. Rugbirn could also be a 3rd party faction as well.
2 - Rugbirn thinks Stor was targeted for a NK. he would know this how?
3 - I was using that thought from Rugbirn to explain to everyone why Rugbirn softclaimed a protective role (because if he didn't protect Stor, it would be absurd to say Caffeine tried to kill him, since Stor is alive).

Here's the problem I have with three and your initial post. You are assigning logical motives to someone who has played completely oblivious to the dynamics of how roles work and interact with each other. Remember this is someone who suggested a VT would somehow know neb was a Doc. You have been following the game so surely this behavior could not be missed. It has most certainly has not been overlooked by the majority of players. Yet here you are acting like Rugbirn softclaimed something because he offers an opinion that he can not prove and which defies logic

Tell me Rodion what protective role do you believe he may be as you directed him to protect the cop? It certianly does not make sense to ask someone to do something unless they have an idea of what they can do.

by **TheForgivenOne** on Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:14 pm

Iron Butterfly wrote:
Rodion wrote:Unvote.

Wow, people really seem to have missed what I said.
No. Your post was very clear.

Again, in bullet points.

1 - I don't think Stor was targeted for a NK.If Stor was targeted it was by Rugbirn. It has been pointed out that a mafia watcher would be a waste with a mafia nk. Rugbirn could also be a 3rd party faction as well.
2 - Rugbirn thinks Stor was targeted for a NK. he would know this how?
3 - I was using that thought from Rugbirn to explain to everyone why Rugbirn softclaimed a protective role (because if he didn't protect Stor, it would be absurd to say Caffeine tried to kill him, since Stor is alive).

Here's the problem I have with three and your initial post. You are assigning logical motives to someone who has played completely oblivious to the dynamics of how roles work and interact with each other. Remember this is someone who suggested a VT would somehow know neb was a Doc. You have been following the game so surely this behavior could not be missed. It has most certainly has not been overlooked by the majority of players. Yet here you are acting like Rugbirn softclaimed something because he offers an opinion that he can not prove and which defies logic

Tell me Rodion what protective role do you believe he may be as you directed him to protect the cop? It certianly does not make sense to ask someone to do something unless they have an idea of what they can do.

I have to agree here.

I think you are reading too far into an obvious newbie who really doesn't know what's he's doing nor posting (I'm sure you've seen most of his posts, they aren't that productive). Also, why would he willingly go out of his way to soft claim a protective role? On D2? That just seems... really really stupid. Then again... he never really denied it.

@Stor. Do you want my opinion on the Keener case now, or once I have my brain functioning at 100%? (I'm still sicker than hell, but I finally have medication that seems to be working).

by **StorrZerg** on Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:26 pm

Sure, be sure to read his response as well as mets.
Also tfo, if you had a choice to vote today, who would it be on. Why?

by **StorrZerg** on Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:34 pm

TheForgivenOne wrote:Not much more detail I can go into. No, I didn't have a choice to take the meth. If you want to know the action, i'm going to hold onto it, as the result(s) I got aren't of any use at the moment.

Just want to bring this quote up (the end quote of a few regarding TFO and his meth in the night)

He hints that he has used the action. He also hints that the result or RESULTS. So this lines up with his claim after. Also lines up with "are not of any use at the moment" since he got a check on an alive, and everyone who visited Myself was still alive. This makes me feel better, cause i had originally thought he said he had NOT used it.

If IAC flips and he is scum and not a watcher of sorts, Then we might have some issues with TFO imo.

Generally, are there roles that can change the death of someone? or are flips 100% always? Just wondering how much to be paranoid.

by **Rodion** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 12:33 am

There are Death Millers, but I think only mods like Fircoal would use them, so you can consider the flip to be 100% here.

On Rugbirn, ok guys, I think we've said all that had to be said. I just hope I put too much unwarranted stock on his sayings (if I'm right, though, I'll be sure to rub it in your faces).

by **jonty125** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 5:05 am

Okay here it is why I don't agree with the superkeener case.

First point, the noisy point.
In short, superkeener said that after 3 pages, X-Stor-X became "noise", X-Stor-X says this is a cop out & super is scummy through not having anything new to bring to the table. I can perfectly understand superkeener's position, I myself find that cases not regarding myself can become "noise", especially cases on D1 which have little substance blown out of proportion. And I can also understand superkeener having nothing new to bring to the table, it's D1 for goodness sake, not a lot has happened, most cases are clutching at straws on a good day!!

Second Point, Was Nark A Dead Man?
Previously in Breaking Bad Mafia, Nark claimed VT under no pressure, superkeener says Nark is a dead man and shows apathy towards Nark's life, X-Stor-X, says Nark could still live, and you showing apathy, shows you're just scum. Once again, I can understand the position of superkeener. Nark, claiming like that under no pressure was a hideous mistake and quite rightly he was lynched for it, I don't think X-Stor-X realises how much an early claim is frowned upon on these forums, but Nark claimed @ L-6 or something ridiculous like that, he was always going to die.

Thirdly, was Nark really a badger?
The answer to question is no, unless you're on meth. But anyhow, jokes aside. I find superkeener's lack of belief of Nark's claim more as, wait, you're claiming VT now at L-6, am I missing the joke, as if it isn't Nark's a dead man, rather than Nark, Badger, nope he can't be that role look at these posts, which is what X-Stor-X I believe is implying but if we refer back to point two I feel that it's once again X-Stor-X been new here is the "issue".

Anyhow, they are the main points I disagree on, I also think it seems to be a difference in playstyles is a factor in this argument, X-Stor-X, very much, attacking player, everyone is guilty till proven innocent. Superkeener, that moves causes doubt in my mind but that doesn't immediately make such abody scum.

by **StorrZerg** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:15 am

good take a stance! Ill insert my comments in green

jonty125 wrote:Okay here it is why I don't agree with the superkeener case.

First point, the noisy point.
In short, superkeener said that after 3 pages, X-Stor-X became "noise", X-Stor-X says this is a cop out & super is scummy through not having anything new to bring to the table. I can perfectly understand superkeener's position, I myself find that cases not regarding myself can become "noise", especially cases on D1 which have little substance blown out of proportion. And I can also understand superkeener having nothing new to bring to the table, it's D1 for goodness sake, not a lot has happened, most cases are clutching at straws on a good day!!

Yes it is day 1, it is also interesting that you bring it up as a main point to defend him. The issue with supers comment was he didn't have to make it. He went out of his way to post on day 1, saying he read 3 pages and nothing happened. Deal is stuff happened, he chose to not contribute. Hence this was a building block on his play style, avoid giving reads unless its something "big" or if someone voted him. Also, defending someone with "most cases are clutching at straws" that is a poor comment. There is no follow up to this. Yes day 1 can be hard, doesn't mean you can dismiss what is happening around you cause all cases day 1 are clutching. You can still read into the cases that are made, specially as the days go on.

Second Point, Was Nark A Dead Man?
Previously in Breaking Bad Mafia, Nark claimed VT under no pressure, superkeener says Nark is a dead man and shows apathy towards Nark's life, X-Stor-X, says Nark could still live, and you showing apathy, shows you're just scum. Once again, I can understand the position of superkeener. Nark, claiming like that under no pressure was a hideous mistake and quite rightly he was lynched for it, I don't think X-Stor-X realises how much an early claim is frowned upon on these forums, but Nark claimed @ L-6 or something ridiculous like that, he was always going to die.

That is called policy, policy is a great way for mafia to hide. 'well he did x, so we can just policy lynch him" Heck that's sort of why i am having a hard time reading the votes on anark. I can't fault many people voting for anark because of how he acted. The omgus nature of his counter attacks. How ever no single person made it their only point that "well he claimed early policy lynch" Again Super was closer to a lynch than anark at a point, nearly everyone made an opinion about anarks actions being scummy besides you. You stated policy. You never once commented on a read he gave, or added anything else. That is scummy.

Thirdly, was Nark really a badger?
The answer to question is no, unless you're on meth. But anyhow, jokes aside. I find superkeener's lack of belief of Nark's claim more as, wait, you're claiming VT now at L-6, am I missing the joke, as if it isn't Nark's a dead man, rather than Nark, Badger, nope he can't be that role look at these posts, which is what X-Stor-X I believe is implying but if we refer back to point two I feel that it's once again X-Stor-X been new here is the "issue".

This is wrong. Supers comments regarding multiple different people for anark to be was well after l-6. Because a full claim was all ready in effect. It was not at 2 and talking before anark made his full claim. (if super had made this comments before anark made a full claim sure, looks way different) It was well after when he specifically stated "I AM WHO I AM" At this point supers comments look like filler (hell super even quotes anarks claim and responds with "can i believe this?" in the same post where he talks about possible town people anark could be). As if he is trying to force some weird perspective on the situation. If super thought anark was town, then there doesn't seem to be any reason to dive into anarks claim and question if he is a different town person. When Super was asked to remove the claim and give a read on anark, his read was neutral.

Anyhow, they are the main points I disagree on, I also think it seems to be a difference in playstyles is a factor in this argument, X-Stor-X, very much, attacking player, everyone is guilty till proven innocent. Superkeener, that moves causes doubt in my mind but that doesn't immediately make such abody scum.

You are correct in my play style that everyone is guilty till proven innocent. Why did you avoid talk about Supers position on lynches? His move onto IAC? His Vote on day 1? what actions has he done that make you think he is town?

by **StorrZerg** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:25 am

unvote
Vote iamcaffeine

Still need 1 more person to vote after i do to end the day.

by **rishaed** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 2:22 pm

I too am ready to end the day. vote IamCaffiene. Also, make sure we have a protective on Cooldeals tonight, no use letting the claimed cop get killed N2 right after the doc got killed N1.

by **strike wolf** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 2:51 pm

Official Vote Count

iAmCaffeine (8)-Mob Deadly, Gregwolf, Cooldeals, Iron buttefly, superkeener, Rugbirn, x-stor-x, rishaed
Rishaed (1)-Virus90
Gregwolf121
Cooldeals
Superkeener
Theforgivenone (1)-Jonty125
mob deadly
betiko (1)-Rodion
x-stor-x
metsfanmax
rodion
virus90
iron butterfly
Rugbirn (1)-iAmCaffeine
Jonty125

With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch. That is a lynch. Scene should be up within the hour.

by **StorrZerg** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 2:51 pm

my vote on gregwolf should be removed

by **strike wolf** on Sat Mar 15, 2014 3:12 pm

Day 2 End Scene

Day breaks over the town. Having woken to find the body of a drug trader and a civilian, the people of Albuquerque had mixed feelings. Some cheered the dead mafia while others mourned the loss of a mother. Her family in particular were hit hard. Still they did not have much time to rest as another individual was found to look guilty and the town quickly surrounded the man and began asking questions.

Vanco stood up and explained his case but it only seemed to confuse people worse and he could feel the figurative noose get closer. Finally he stated that he was the Town Watcher Agent Vanco. The town was confused by the weak claim but seemed to back off when his claimed action checked out. That was until one stepped forward.

"Wait a second. I don't remember Vanco being bald."

Everyone turned their attention back to Vanco but no one was quite ready to arrest him yet. They tried to get names and find out who and where the drug dealers were located. Finally satisfied, the DEA took the man claiming to be Vanco back to his cell, knowing they were right. Vanco wasn't bald.

iAmCaffeine-Mike Ehrmantraut-Mafia Watcher has been lynched.

It is now Night 2. You have 72 hours to send in night actions.

by **iAmCaffeine** on Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:54 am

Oh well, enjoy the rest of the game guys. I have comments for strike but I won't say them now at risk of giving away information.

by **strike wolf** on Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:03 pm

Only waiting for one more action. Since I am going to be mostly absent tomorrow, if I get it early, I will probably start the day early.

by **strike wolf** on Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:22 pm

All actions are in. Scene will be in just a few hours.

by **strike wolf** on Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:34 pm

Night 2 End Scene

The town toasted their victory over the day while the mafia retreated to lick its wounds. Two down so early, they had not anticipated this happening so quickly. Yet the game was still young and everyone was about figure out just how much could happen in one night.

As the drinks went down, a few of the men their only tasted bitter sorrow. Excusing himself from the festivities earlier, he got in the cab with the driver who had brought him there to take off. Before the night was through, he planned to go out for some quick "business". As the cab turned right, one of the revelers was there, the man in back had to focus but he quickly recognized this man as the DEA agent who had brought in Mike the night before.

Outside the cab, Hank toasted his victory with his fellow agents, the captain even mentioned a possible promotions for the big bust. Hank excused himself from the group to go look for his wife, separated from the rest, he did not notice as the cab came barreling down on him until he was flipping over it's front window. Everyone turned to get to the body as the cab sped off but it was too late for Hank.

Cooldeals-Hank Schrader-DEA Cop has been killed.

Unfortunately for everyone, the night was only just beginning. Elsewhere, a teenage boy on crutches was drinking non-alcoholic champagne to celebrate the occasion. He never noticed as the poison tablet had been slipped into one of the glasses. As he began to feel sick, he staggered to the bathroom but only made it half way at first. Thinking he had just stumbled a party goer went to pick him up but backed up when they saw the dead look in his eyes.

x-stor-x-Walter "Flynn" White Jr-Town Tracker (and yes Mets, I'm aware this one doesn't make much flavor sense

).

Meanwhile, back in a Mexican villa, a drug lord was sipping on tequila when he had heard the news of the death. Feeling content, he went out for a leisurely walk when he noticed a car in the driveway. He was curious at first but his curiosity turned to fear as the man rushed him. He attempted to flee and call for guards but he tripped and was quickly pummeled to death by the assailant.

Superkeener-Don Eladio-Cartel Godfather has been killed.

The town surveyed the damage, three dead in total and one a definitive enemy. How will they react?

It is now Day 3. With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Deadline will be Friday the 28th.

by **StorrZerg** on Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:40 pm

ggs town gl

by **strike wolf** on Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:43 pm

I'd just like to say my favorite two character are now officially dead (Mike and Hank)

by **rishaed** on Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:57 pm

How bout those breaks.... wonder how they got through the protection on CD.... Cop/Doc/Tracker all killed in two nights. Also note that CD lied about alignment, which isn't entirely unexpected, however 3 kills is completely unexpected (2 Mafia/ 1 vig?) Seeing as we still have two mafia factions I assume that both are/were at 3 to give even chances? :\ At that point with DEA 3rd party, id have to say the last is a vig... it has to be or else town doesn't have a chance....

by **Rodion** on Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:03 am

Interesting: 2 mafias AND confirmed 3rd-party.

Is anyone going to claim having received meth last night? If the meth giver is town, I think mafia would be too afraid to try and kill CD, since we don't yet know whether he is a watcher-giver or a random-giver. I see several possibilities as of now:
a) meth-giver is mafia, so mafia was not afraid to off CD
b) meth-giver is town and gave the "watch" to mafia, so mafia was not afraid to off CD (but they can be held accountable for their misuse of the gifted action)
c) meth-giver is not necessarily a watcher-giver. Mafia knew that because either "a" or they got a meth-action (with loss of vote) that was different from a watch and implied that was the same as TFO's
d) mafia managed to kill CD (in spite of my requests to have all protection tilted towards him - sigh) by having a busdriver swap him with someone unlikely and kill the unlikely person to reach CD (a watcher report on CD should hint us to the busdriver, though)

We might have to delve deeper into this today.

by **Iron Butterfly** on Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:24 am

Rodion wrote:Interesting: 2 mafias AND confirmed 3rd-party.

Is anyone going to claim having received meth last night? If the meth giver is town, I think mafia would be too afraid to try and kill CD, since we don't yet know whether he is a watcher-giver or a random-giver. I see several possibilities as of now:
a) meth-giver is mafia, so mafia was not afraid to off CD
b) meth-giver is town and gave the "watch" to mafia, so mafia was not afraid to off CD (but they can be held accountable for their misuse of the gifted action)
c) meth-giver is not necessarily a watcher-giver. Mafia knew that because either "a" or they got a meth-action (with loss of vote) that was different from a watch and implied that was the same as TFO's
d) mafia managed to kill CD (in spite of my requests to have all protection tilted towards him - sigh) by having a busdriver swap him with someone unlikely and kill the unlikely person to reach CD (a watcher report on CD should hint us to the busdriver, though)

We might have to delve deeper into this today.

With all that being said I would think Rugbirn would be the best place to start. You felt strongly he was a protective role and should protect CD, even going so far as to direct his actions. We know he visited stor and accused Caff of trying to kill Stor. So while he was not the same faction as store that does not rule him out as a rival faction.

While the meth giver is important we have a name to work with.

by **Rodion** on Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:35 am

Red highlights = IB

Iron Butterfly wrote:
Rodion wrote:*Sighs* This keeps getting worse.

Guys, Rugbirn softclaimed a protective role. He did no such thing. Even a dim bulb like me can figure out that with two watchers and no death Rugbirn was not trying to kill. That does not however make him a protective role. He could be any number of mafia/third party roles as well. He will protect CD tonight.Doing what?

Can you reconcile the apparent 180º?

by **Iron Butterfly** on Tue Mar 18, 2014 1:58 am

Not a 180.

First a protective role in my eyes is someone who can prevent a kill. With several factions now proven Rugbirn can be anything. He could have been an investigative, blocker or any number of roles for his faction checking to see what Stor was or preventing him from doing his job. he may have not been out to kill but that certainly does not rule out other options.

We know for a fact that Rigbirn visited Stor.
We know he accused Caff of trying to kill Stor.
We know that Caff was mafia red, which means that it is unlikely Rigbirn is Red BUT
We know he was not a Doc.

Now given that Rigbirn stated that Caff was there to kill...why would he do so? You stated you believed he was a protective role. You knew he could not be a doc. Why would you direct him? What role do you believ he was if doc was dead? You have not answered this question.

By my count we have 4 factions at work. Rigbirn could be the other mafia faction as well.

In my eyes asking who got Meth is reverse role fishing depending on the faction. We have four factions. Each person who admits to having meth rules them out as the meth maker/giver.

So with all that said I think it best to wait to see what information comes in from the night before we split hairs further Rodion.

by **betiko** on Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:36 am

ok so I see I was wrong... there are 2 mafia factions and I don't really know how it works in those cases to tell the truth. Oh and super... I have to admit I didn't see it coming I had quite a neutral read on him; I guess xstor was right. We aren't doing that bad, 3 anti town killed to start day 3...
Question: can the busdrive be a mafia busdrive to kill CD?

ok, so do you guys think that PCM got killed by the cartel on night 1? sounds like the most probable explanation.

also, how many mafia left? could there be 3 per faction? so let's say 18 players; 3 mafia, 3 cartel... 3ish third party and 9 town? would that sound about right?

let's see if some frensh info shows up, but for now my case of the day is greg. I thought he looked a bit nervous when he got pressured yesterday.

vote gregwolf