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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:07 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:How the hell can you infer all that from me pointing out that you misinterpreted this article?


This has been your argument through the whole, long history of this thread. People who support Obamacare support the Obamacare promise of pauper's hospitals for the poor, and Cadillac hospitals for the rich. (Not too much unlike the plot in Elysium, where the poor have their tired, broken bones mended in waiting queues at dirty, overcrowded hospitals far away from them while the rich all have healing beds in their homes.) This article underscores this dystopian reality of the heartless Obamacare factory system and you have become enraged and furious. I wish you would have more empathy for the very real suffering of sick and dying people instead of simply using them as props in some sociopathic, intellectual exercise.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby Metsfanmax on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:10 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:How the hell can you infer all that from me pointing out that you misinterpreted this article?


This has been your argument through the whole, long history of this thread. People who support Obamacare support the Obamacare promise of pauper's hospitals for the poor, and Cadillac hospitals for the rich. (Not too much unlike the plot in Elysium, where the poor have their tired, broken bones mended in waiting queues at dirty, overcrowded hospitals far away from them while the rich all have healing beds in their homes.) This article underscores this dystopian reality of the heartless Obamacare factory system and you have become enraged and furious. I wish you would have more empathy for the very real suffering of sick and dying people instead of simply using them as props in some sociopathic, intellectual exercise.


Meanwhile, you support the communist dream of excellent and free healthcare for everyone, yes? Definitely not an intellectual exercise.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:12 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:How the hell can you infer all that from me pointing out that you misinterpreted this article?


This has been your argument through the whole, long history of this thread. People who support Obamacare support the Obamacare promise of pauper's hospitals for the poor, and Cadillac hospitals for the rich. (Not too much unlike the plot in Elysium, where the poor have their tired, broken bones mended in waiting queues at dirty, overcrowded hospitals far away from them while the rich all have healing beds in their homes.) This article underscores this dystopian reality of the heartless Obamacare factory system and you have become enraged and furious. I wish you would have more empathy for the very real suffering of sick and dying people instead of simply using them as props in some sociopathic, intellectual exercise.


Meanwhile, you support the communist dream of excellent and free healthcare for everyone, yes?


I support free and accessible healthcare for everyone, similar to the system proposed by Brian Schweitzer.

I oppose your preferred system in which the level or quality of healthcare you can access is tied to your caste.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby Metsfanmax on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:14 pm

saxitoxin wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:How the hell can you infer all that from me pointing out that you misinterpreted this article?


This has been your argument through the whole, long history of this thread. People who support Obamacare support the Obamacare promise of pauper's hospitals for the poor, and Cadillac hospitals for the rich. (Not too much unlike the plot in Elysium, where the poor have their tired, broken bones mended in waiting queues at dirty, overcrowded hospitals far away from them while the rich all have healing beds in their homes.) This article underscores this dystopian reality of the heartless Obamacare factory system and you have become enraged and furious. I wish you would have more empathy for the very real suffering of sick and dying people instead of simply using them as props in some sociopathic, intellectual exercise.


Meanwhile, you support the communist dream of excellent and free healthcare for everyone, yes?


I support free and accessible healthcare for everyone, similar to the system proposed by Brian Schweitzer.

I oppose your preferred system in which the level or quality of healthcare you can access is tied to your caste.


It is not my preferred system. Single payer sounds great to me. But I also live in the realm of political reality, and single-payer was not a political reality in 2010.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:19 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:How the hell can you infer all that from me pointing out that you misinterpreted this article?


This has been your argument through the whole, long history of this thread. People who support Obamacare support the Obamacare promise of pauper's hospitals for the poor, and Cadillac hospitals for the rich. (Not too much unlike the plot in Elysium, where the poor have their tired, broken bones mended in waiting queues at dirty, overcrowded hospitals far away from them while the rich all have healing beds in their homes.) This article underscores this dystopian reality of the heartless Obamacare factory system and you have become enraged and furious. I wish you would have more empathy for the very real suffering of sick and dying people instead of simply using them as props in some sociopathic, intellectual exercise.


Meanwhile, you support the communist dream of excellent and free healthcare for everyone, yes?


I support free and accessible healthcare for everyone, similar to the system proposed by Brian Schweitzer.

I oppose your preferred system in which the level or quality of healthcare you can access is tied to your caste.


It is not my preferred system. Single payer sounds great to me. But I also live in the realm of political reality, and single-payer was not a political reality in 2010.


A false choice the apologists proffer to excuse this boondoggle.

You live in the realm of greed and hatred in which the poor are used as cheap, flesh props to score political points to boost your self-esteem. You are unwilling to acknowledge the consensus view that Obamacare is a fraud system designed fill a vacuum, play on people's desperation for anything, but ultimately line the pockets of Big O and a small coterie of corrupt billionaires, that in doing so it has actually made things worse for the most vulnerable members of our society, whom you happily write-off as collateral damage. Fortunately you're one of the last members of the Greed Team still supporting this boondoggle -

"I suppose I’m a Democrat, and I ought to roll over like a fat dog and get scratched by the pharmaceutical and insurance companies because, gee, we have to apologize for so-called Obamacare. I’m not going to apologize a damn bit.”
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby Metsfanmax on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:29 pm

saxitoxin wrote:You live in the realm of greed and hatred in which the poor are used as cheap, flesh props to score political points to boost your self-esteem. You are unwilling to acknowledge the consensus view that Obamacare is a fraud system designed fill a vacuum, play on people's desperation for anything, but ultimately line the pockets of Big O and a small coterie of corrupt billionaires, that in doing so it has actually made things worse for the most vulnerable members of our society, whom you happily write-off as collateral damage. Fortunately you're one of the last members of the Greed Team still supporting this boondoggle -


Yes, I completely agree that Brian Schweitzer's view is the consensus one and this is why he's such a popular candidate for the 2016 election.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:33 pm

Man with Obamacare owes $407,000 in Medical Bills for care received since he started paying Obama

The hospital bills are hitting Larry Basich’s mailbox. That would be OK if Basich had health insurance. But he doesn’t. Thing is, he should be covered. Basich, 62, bought a plan through the state’s Nevada Health Link insurance exchange in the fall. He’s been paying monthly premiums since November. Yet the Las Vegan is stranded in a no-man’s-land where no carrier claims him, and his tab is mounting: Basich owes $407,000 for care received in January and February, when his policy was supposed to be in effect. Instead, he’s covered only for March and beyond.

Basich has begged for weeks for help from the exchange and its contractor, Xerox. But Basich’s insurance broker said Xerox seems more interested in lawyering up and covering its hide than in working out Basich’s problems. Nor is Basich the only client facing plan-selection errors through the exchange, she added.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/obama ... ctor-bills
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:35 pm

Metsfanmax wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:You live in the realm of greed and hatred in which the poor are used as cheap, flesh props to score political points to boost your self-esteem. You are unwilling to acknowledge the consensus view that Obamacare is a fraud system designed fill a vacuum, play on people's desperation for anything, but ultimately line the pockets of Big O and a small coterie of corrupt billionaires, that in doing so it has actually made things worse for the most vulnerable members of our society, whom you happily write-off as collateral damage. Fortunately you're one of the last members of the Greed Team still supporting this boondoggle -


Yes, I completely agree that Brian Schweitzer's view is the consensus one and this is why he's such a popular candidate for the 2016 election.


He's not getting more traction because he doesn't have millions in corporate backing from Aetna and UHC like Elvira. As a card-carrying member of Team Greed, you already know that, of course. Money, money, money. If you don't got it - you don't deserve healthcare, you don't deserve to be president. "Die quietly!" you say.
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:38 pm

Sonora Man in Pain, Agony after Being Denied Urgently Needed Back Surgery

Another CBS13 viewer says she’s being denied health care, because her insurance is through Covered California.

On Tuesday, we told you about a Sonora man with the same problem—unable to find a surgeon to provide a desperately needed operation on his back.
After that story, we had responses from across the country. One viewer said she did months of research before picking the plan that Blue Cross recommended. But it’s still been a nightmare.

“It’s just not right,” she said. “It does make you feel like you’re a second-class citizen.”

http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2014/02/ ... rnia-plan/
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:47 pm

Backlash against Obamacare Growing in Colorado Most Rapidly Among Hispanic-Americans

In Colorado, opposition has surged most heavily among Hispanic-Americans (Question 20). Prior to the law's implementation 35% opposed it and 60% supported it. Now, 57% of Hispanic-Americans oppose it and only 36% still support it. A growing majority of all races are also uniting in opposition to Obamacare; a money grab by mega-rich millionaires like Mark Bertolini and Stephen Hemsley that uses a legal version of the classic pump-and-dump scheme.

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/ ... CO_318.pdf
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby Phatscotty on Fri Mar 21, 2014 12:25 am

saxitoxin wrote:Backlash against Obamacare Growing in Colorado Most Rapidly Among Hispanic-Americans

In Colorado, opposition has surged most heavily among Hispanic-Americans (Question 20). Prior to the law's implementation 35% opposed it and 60% supported it. Now, 57% of Hispanic-Americans oppose it and only 36% still support it. A growing majority of all races are also uniting in opposition to Obamacare; a money grab by mega-rich millionaires like Mark Bertolini and Stephen Hemsley that uses a legal version of the classic pump-and-dump scheme.

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/ ... CO_318.pdf


putting my Progressive hat on: "they're just to stupid to know what is good for them. What they think doesn't matter, IT IS A GOOD THING with good intentions"
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby saxitoxin on Fri Mar 21, 2014 12:27 am

Image
Stephen Hemsley is CEO of United HealthCare insurance mega-corporation and a major Obama donor. Hemsley has an annual salary of $14,000,000 (on top of tens of millions he also earns for serving on a half-a-dozen different boards). Since the candidate he bought, Obama, was elected, he has raked in an extra $40 million in stock options thanks to the jump in UHC stock price since Obamacare went into effect and Obama ordered millions of people to begin giving Stephen Hemsley their money. Just like in feudal times, the King appoints a Lord of the Manor who can seize a percent of the peasants crops to fill the table at his feasts and pay his concubines.

Hemsley is also chairman of the board of directors of American Public Media, which produces National Petroleum Radio's morning and afternoon news programs - Marketplace and All Things Considered. As progressive media across the spectrum - CounterPunch, Pacifica Radio, and so forth - have been surgical in detailing the horrors of Obamacare, NPR continues to tow the sunshine line, pounding out cotton candy report after report to make sure Hemsley's toy, Obama, keeps enough of a small island of support that he can continue to press ahead with the money grab.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby Metsfanmax on Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:40 am

Phatscotty wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:Backlash against Obamacare Growing in Colorado Most Rapidly Among Hispanic-Americans

In Colorado, opposition has surged most heavily among Hispanic-Americans (Question 20). Prior to the law's implementation 35% opposed it and 60% supported it. Now, 57% of Hispanic-Americans oppose it and only 36% still support it. A growing majority of all races are also uniting in opposition to Obamacare; a money grab by mega-rich millionaires like Mark Bertolini and Stephen Hemsley that uses a legal version of the classic pump-and-dump scheme.

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/ ... CO_318.pdf


putting my Progressive hat on: "they're just to stupid to know what is good for them. What they think doesn't matter, IT IS A GOOD THING with good intentions"


Progressive hat? If I may quote from another thread:

tzor wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:What fraction of people do you think are too stupid to meaningfully participate in a democracy?


When you factor the intelligent people who deliberately choose to be stupid ... I would say over 50% :twisted:

And I'm deadly serious about this. They can be found on both sides of the spectrum.

And boy can they be played.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby macbone on Fri Mar 21, 2014 8:57 am

Good lord, I'm glad I live in Hong Kong. The US healthcare system sounds like a nightmare now.

A friend retired last year and is considering moving back to the US, but the state of healthcare has him a bit nervous. I can't say that I blame him.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby notyou2 on Fri Mar 21, 2014 6:24 pm

Give up your health not to get it.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby AndyDufresne on Fri Mar 21, 2014 6:36 pm

I don't need healthcare. I invested in q-tips in the 90's, and ever since then I've been rich and had clean ears.


--Andy
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby notyou2 on Fri Mar 21, 2014 6:47 pm

Q Tips is a good stock investment. A US healthcare provider charged over $1500.00 for one.

http://www.lawyersandsettlements.com/articles/emergency-room-cost-hospital-overcharging-lawsuit/interview-emergency-room-charges-cost-7-19009.html

See the comment under the article from Dave.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby BigBallinStalin on Sat Mar 22, 2014 4:06 am

saxitoxin wrote:Image
Stephen Hemsley is CEO of United HealthCare insurance mega-corporation and a major Obama donor. Hemsley has an annual salary of $14,000,000 (on top of tens of millions he also earns for serving on a half-a-dozen different boards). Since the candidate he bought, Obama, was elected, he has raked in an extra $40 million in stock options thanks to the jump in UHC stock price since Obamacare went into effect and Obama ordered millions of people to begin giving Stephen Hemsley their money. Just like in feudal times, the King appoints a Lord of the Manor who can seize a percent of the peasants crops to fill the table at his feasts and pay his concubines.

Hemsley is also chairman of the board of directors of American Public Media, which produces National Petroleum Radio's morning and afternoon news programs - Marketplace and All Things Considered. As progressive media across the spectrum - CounterPunch, Pacifica Radio, and so forth - have been surgical in detailing the horrors of Obamacare, NPR continues to tow the sunshine line, pounding out cotton candy report after report to make sure Hemsley's toy, Obama, keeps enough of a small island of support that he can continue to press ahead with the money grab.


At least he's being consistent.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby PLAYER57832 on Sun Mar 23, 2014 10:15 am

OF COURSE Obamacare is an insurance grab, a way for insurance to make more money.

BUT.. for all those who crtiize, how about admitting YOUR Part in the mess.

#1. All the claims about dropping coverage, high prices, etc -- ALL of those issues existed long before the Affordable Care Act was passed. The Act did not fully fix those issues, but it did not, as the opponents like to claim create those problems.

#2. DITTO all claims about the Act causing insurance to limit networks, etc. Those things were already happening. Ironically, in many cases these limited networks are actually creating some positive solution -- they are allowing far more people to obtain cheaper coverage. Granted its nice to pretend that our former system offered unlimited access to the most skilled people in the country for everyone, but the reality was never that. That reality may not be nice, but at least now we are beginning to deal with truth instead of fiction.

#3. Talk of being "forced to pay for other people's coverage" , "being forced to pay for procedures against an individual's religion", etc, etc. ALL ignore that this IS the current system we have if you get employer based insurance. The only change was to those not having employer based insurance. Basically, for all the rhetoric, the exchanges simply

#4.The opponents like to point out that some individual policies are being cancelled.. but they ignore that insurers could simply refuse to cover ANYONE with a "pre-existing" condition, once they had even a day's gap in coverage AND they were able to deny coverage fully to anyone who had reached their lifetime limit... that, by-the-way included a LOT of disabled kids.

#5. Policies are going up in price, BUT... that was happenign before as well. At least now, people can be secure in knowing that they will get coverage if they pay. Prior, insurance companies often took payment only to deny treatements and cancel policies retro-actively for seemingly spurious reasons. AND, there is a tangible limit to the prices insurance can charge. Most of the payments must go to health care, not just to administrative costs and stockholder bonuses.

#6. The current opponents are the ones who made the REAL solutions -- true universal, single-payor systems, limits based fully on data, tackling very hard isses at the beginning and end of life - impossible. At some point, even Tea Partiers have to face the fact that healthcare is not unlimited... AND that you cannot BOTH claim the right to dictate the care other people obtain AND refuse to pay for that care. No one likes the discussion of when a child is so highly disabled their life is just not tenable. No one likes deciding that it really is time to just pull the plug on Grandma... BUT, in today's techological world, those issues have to be tackled and not just by the most extreme relitious positions. Saying "all life is sacred" sounds great, but when you face current realities of spending billions of dollars to keep non-functioning kids merely alive while denying dental care (and even college educations) to millions of healthy kids, not to mention pending realities (now sci-fi, but not that far off) of clones, cyborgs, artificial wombs, etc..... well, God did not create that system. As far as I am concerned the only ones who can legitimately "opt out" are those holding to Christian Scientist type ideas that God decides ALL. You are free to declare God decides when you truly LET God decide, not when you want to only take what you like and not what you dislike. God allowed death (to claim otherwise is to claim God is not in control of our Earth), pretending its our job to deny death is ignorance, not faith.

#7. for all its faults (and yes, there ARE many), it STILL offers improvement over what we had before.

Not everyone can get the policies they like... but that was true before as well.
Some policies are too expensive... again, true before as well. Opponents say that now those "choosing" not to be covered have to pay a penalty. However, part of the issue here is that some states, including Pennsylvania, have governors that refused to expand Medicaid, which was supposed to pick up some of those mostly single, working individuals.

AGAIN.. the real answer is a true universal system, the very type of system that opponents of the Affordable Care act pushed to make sure was NOT part of the act.

AND, with a universal care system comes the need to really look at ways to cut costs. Thankfully, some of these are being implemented, albiet by the insurance companies. (who at least now DO have to pass on some of their savings to people, cannot just raise rates without limits). Approaches are varied, but they include limiting networks, looking more clearly at effectiveness of treatments. Giving patients more choice in end of life decisions.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby patches70 on Sun Mar 23, 2014 12:04 pm

Obama pushes Obamacare on Titanfall. This one is pretty damn good. You will laugh.

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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby BigBallinStalin on Mon Mar 24, 2014 1:32 am

PLAYER57832 wrote:OF COURSE Obamacare is an insurance grab, a way for insurance to make more money.

BUT.. for all those who crtiize, how about admitting YOUR Part in the mess.

#1. All the claims about dropping coverage, high prices, etc -- ALL of those issues existed long before the Affordable Care Act was passed. The Act did not fully fix those issues, but it did not, as the opponents like to claim create those problems.

#2. DITTO all claims about the Act causing insurance to limit networks, etc. Those things were already happening. Ironically, in many cases these limited networks are actually creating some positive solution -- they are allowing far more people to obtain cheaper coverage. Granted its nice to pretend that our former system offered unlimited access to the most skilled people in the country for everyone, but the reality was never that. That reality may not be nice, but at least now we are beginning to deal with truth instead of fiction.

#3. Talk of being "forced to pay for other people's coverage" , "being forced to pay for procedures against an individual's religion", etc, etc. ALL ignore that this IS the current system we have if you get employer based insurance. The only change was to those not having employer based insurance. Basically, for all the rhetoric, the exchanges simply

#4.The opponents like to point out that some individual policies are being cancelled.. but they ignore that insurers could simply refuse to cover ANYONE with a "pre-existing" condition, once they had even a day's gap in coverage AND they were able to deny coverage fully to anyone who had reached their lifetime limit... that, by-the-way included a LOT of disabled kids.

#5. Policies are going up in price, BUT... that was happenign before as well. At least now, people can be secure in knowing that they will get coverage if they pay. Prior, insurance companies often took payment only to deny treatements and cancel policies retro-actively for seemingly spurious reasons. AND, there is a tangible limit to the prices insurance can charge. Most of the payments must go to health care, not just to administrative costs and stockholder bonuses.

#6. The current opponents are the ones who made the REAL solutions -- true universal, single-payor systems, limits based fully on data, tackling very hard isses at the beginning and end of life - impossible. At some point, even Tea Partiers have to face the fact that healthcare is not unlimited... AND that you cannot BOTH claim the right to dictate the care other people obtain AND refuse to pay for that care. No one likes the discussion of when a child is so highly disabled their life is just not tenable. No one likes deciding that it really is time to just pull the plug on Grandma... BUT, in today's techological world, those issues have to be tackled and not just by the most extreme relitious positions. Saying "all life is sacred" sounds great, but when you face current realities of spending billions of dollars to keep non-functioning kids merely alive while denying dental care (and even college educations) to millions of healthy kids, not to mention pending realities (now sci-fi, but not that far off) of clones, cyborgs, artificial wombs, etc..... well, God did not create that system. As far as I am concerned the only ones who can legitimately "opt out" are those holding to Christian Scientist type ideas that God decides ALL. You are free to declare God decides when you truly LET God decide, not when you want to only take what you like and not what you dislike. God allowed death (to claim otherwise is to claim God is not in control of our Earth), pretending its our job to deny death is ignorance, not faith.

#7. for all its faults (and yes, there ARE many), it STILL offers improvement over what we had before.

Not everyone can get the policies they like... but that was true before as well.
Some policies are too expensive... again, true before as well. Opponents say that now those "choosing" not to be covered have to pay a penalty. However, part of the issue here is that some states, including Pennsylvania, have governors that refused to expand Medicaid, which was supposed to pick up some of those mostly single, working individuals.

AGAIN.. the real answer is a true universal system, the very type of system that opponents of the Affordable Care act pushed to make sure was NOT part of the act.

AND, with a universal care system comes the need to really look at ways to cut costs. Thankfully, some of these are being implemented, albiet by the insurance companies. (who at least now DO have to pass on some of their savings to people, cannot just raise rates without limits). Approaches are varied, but they include limiting networks, looking more clearly at effectiveness of treatments. Giving patients more choice in end of life decisions.


Whatever helps you sleep at night.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby Phatscotty on Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:49 pm

perfect example of how whatever the government touches explodes it's price/destroys it's market.

Hospitals Plot the End of Insurance Companies

The problems with the implementation of the Affordable Care Act may be masking another major change in the way health care is delivered to U.S. consumers, experts believe.

At The Atlantic's Health Care Forum in Washington on Thursday, health care and business professionals said that there’s an increasing trend in the industry toward cutting insurance companies out of the process entirely, as large, regional hospital systems move into the insurance business.

Related: Obamacare - Taxpayers in the Hole for $1.5 Trillion

Dr. Kenneth L. Davis, CEO and president of Mount Sinai Health System, the largest health care provider in the state of New York, said that starting next year, Mt. Sinai will begin offering its own Medicare Advantage plan. It will look for other opportunities to bring premium payments directly into the hospital system, rather than filtering them through insurance companies.

Davis said he expects organizations similar to his to move in the same direction. “Inevitably the large systems are going to move to take part of the premium dollar,” he said.

For both non-profit systems like Mt. Sinai and for-profit systems, he said, retaining more and more of the health care premiums paid by consumers is essential to providing a full spectrum of care. He said that his system’s St. Luke’s Hospital in New York runs a psychiatric program that loses $14 million per year.

It’s “not sustainable,” he said, so the system needs to cross-subsidize the money-losing services that it nonetheless must continue to provide, with income from more profitable services, such as orthopedic surgery.

Related: White House Ramps Up Final Obamacare Push

The industry, he said, is facing “an entire reformulation of how we pay for services.” The point is not to squeeze more profit out of the system, but to preserve the system’s ability to provide care. “If we don’t put those dollars back into the underpaid discipline, you just end up with underpaid disciplines that can’t be cross-subsidized.”

Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel, chairman of the Department of Medical Ethics and Health Policy at the University of Pennsylvania and one of the architects of the Affordable Care Act, agreed, saying that we’re beginning to see what he called the “Kaiserification” of our health care system.

He was referring to the Kaiser Permanente health care consortium, which combines a health insurance company with subsidiary hospitals and medical practices to create a fully integrated health care delivery system. He noted that large insurer Wellpoint recently completed the acquisition of a health care company in California, apparently with an eye toward replicating the Kaiser model in some form.

Emanuel said we’re witnessing “the end of insurance companies as we know them” and that if they want to survive, they “will have to get into the business of providing care.”

He predicted that in the world of health care, “the wave of the future is integrated delivery systems – integrating insurance with delivery function.”


- See more at: http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/Articles/ ... cAPX7.dpuf
Last edited by Phatscotty on Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ObamaCare - "Give up your phone to get it!!!"

Postby thegreekdog on Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:51 pm

Let's see how long it takes for the issue of nonprofit hospitals getting special/advantageous tax treatment to come up.
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